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Killzone: Shadow Fall Multiplayer Discussion
- Thread starter KilgoreTrout
- Start date
Fermbiz
Gold Member
Good job! Also on the lamest map.
Really? Thats one of my favorite maps..
Anyhoo.... Spawn camping in TDM is pretty bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sok2GXebtJw
I totally agree... It sucks not being able to chat with your teammates. Again, I barely have any friends on PSN and none of them play Killzone.
BlackGhost
Banned
Haha seriously, hopfully it gets patched in soon.
ZealousMonkey
Banned
Really? Thats one of my favorite maps..
Anyhoo.... Spawn camping in TDM is pretty bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sok2GXebtJw
I totally agree... It sucks not being able to chat with your teammates. Again, I barely have any friends on PSN and none of them play Killzone.
If anybody wants to know TDM is where you see the KDR whores curb stomping the noobs with their 3 KDRs. It gets really bad and REALLY boring. I could easily have a 3 KDR or near that if I played it all day but Warzone craps on that mode in the face despite the lack of spawn beacon players like myself.
Also, people, KZ games have legs. They are not as front loaded as the other FPSs. Let the sales happen, new maps, new modes, chat, etc. The people will come. The game is too good this time. A diamond in the mud atm. SO much better than 3 in every single way.
Kind of sucks for people who get into this game late though. The unlock system is geared almost entirely toward giving the advantage to people with the highest playtime. Have fun getting stun blasted every ten seconds, newbies.
Fermbiz
Gold Member
OMG I was so close to getting 15 kill streak. I want that 15 killing spree playercard now.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=91495189
Question to those who check out the Whats New feed. Are you able to see screenshots of what your friends post? When I click on their post, nothing shows up.
MagicWithEarvin
Member
GAF night tonight?! Let's welcome our European brethren.
ZealousMonkey
Banned
I am slightly disappointed in the community at this point. People are very unwilling to sac KDR for the team. It's bothering me I cannot yell at people. Warhawk this is not.
They really need to start getting stuff in gear here with chat and mics and that is on Sony most of all.
Stun and turrets and all the other stuff becomes a little annoying for new players but the problem is we can't talk to these dudes and we cannot teach them anything. They just run around in warzone getting blown to bits.
And let me set the record straight: to hell with KDR. Mine is like 2.8 in TDM and I hardly play the mode anymore. It is just bad for the most part when spawn rape happens.
Warzone I level down to about 1.5 or 1.6. Seems to stay there maybe getting a little higher. It is really tough tanking for a team and trying to make it work but I wouldn't have it any other way. Some people play games to max KDR and run in 'impossible to beat for randoms curb stomp teams'. Ran a few myself but good god does it get BORING in any mode like this against randoms.
I love playing with randoms and leading them to victory, just like Warhawk. To hell with big parties this game is more suited to having 2 or 3 person parties so as not to upset balance IMO.
The old KZ2 audience is slightly terrible though. Guys just constantly live in the past. All those weird xReDmPtOinx names give me shivers man. People were so stupid back then with PSN names LOL. I honestly cannot even friend a dude with a name like that no matter how good he is.
Right now the main argument on the forums is point shooting (or what some call hipfire) and the lack of it.
I say people should not be able to point shoot for distance unless they are crouched and burst fire for accuracy more like KZ2 but only within 10ft. Some people want that 50ft hipfire/PS headshot bullshit from KZ2 to return. That just can't happen imo. As a modern military shooter ADS is first and foremost how you should be aiming guns in 95% of encounters.
Anyway you have it the game is very balanced imo even at this stage. Surprising actually and one reason I don't want GG making any crazy changes to point shoot tactics. I find it works fine up close with most weapons. Thing is most of the people complaining are vets with like 2-3 KDRs lol. I just don't get it. It's like if these people don't see 5 KDR on their screen they can't play.
They really need to start getting stuff in gear here with chat and mics and that is on Sony most of all.
Stun and turrets and all the other stuff becomes a little annoying for new players but the problem is we can't talk to these dudes and we cannot teach them anything. They just run around in warzone getting blown to bits.
And let me set the record straight: to hell with KDR. Mine is like 2.8 in TDM and I hardly play the mode anymore. It is just bad for the most part when spawn rape happens.
Warzone I level down to about 1.5 or 1.6. Seems to stay there maybe getting a little higher. It is really tough tanking for a team and trying to make it work but I wouldn't have it any other way. Some people play games to max KDR and run in 'impossible to beat for randoms curb stomp teams'. Ran a few myself but good god does it get BORING in any mode like this against randoms.
I love playing with randoms and leading them to victory, just like Warhawk. To hell with big parties this game is more suited to having 2 or 3 person parties so as not to upset balance IMO.
The old KZ2 audience is slightly terrible though. Guys just constantly live in the past. All those weird xReDmPtOinx names give me shivers man. People were so stupid back then with PSN names LOL. I honestly cannot even friend a dude with a name like that no matter how good he is.
Right now the main argument on the forums is point shooting (or what some call hipfire) and the lack of it.
I say people should not be able to point shoot for distance unless they are crouched and burst fire for accuracy more like KZ2 but only within 10ft. Some people want that 50ft hipfire/PS headshot bullshit from KZ2 to return. That just can't happen imo. As a modern military shooter ADS is first and foremost how you should be aiming guns in 95% of encounters.
Anyway you have it the game is very balanced imo even at this stage. Surprising actually and one reason I don't want GG making any crazy changes to point shoot tactics. I find it works fine up close with most weapons. Thing is most of the people complaining are vets with like 2-3 KDRs lol. I just don't get it. It's like if these people don't see 5 KDR on their screen they can't play.
Grinchy
Banned
But the party system works really well. You're in a party, everyone in your party goes into matchmaking with you, you end up on the same team. What else are you looking for?
BF4 is such an embarrassment in comparison.
Q&A from GG on Killzone shadowfall
Some highlights:
Q: "Is in game voice chat coming and when?"
A: We couldn't get everything we wanted in right away. Originally we were only going to allow people to chat with your group but the community pointed out it make team work difficult. We're going to add that and we're going to have an update soon..
Q: "When is clan support going to be available and what will it be?"
A: We always wanted clans. We're going to bring it out in stages at first it will be very basic but then we will expand it to make it more exciting. We're hoping for early next year and hope it will improve tactical organization and how you play the game.
Q: Can you add a ranking system?
A: We don't have an XP system so we're looking into adding rank names that let you progress through the system instead of just a number
Q: Will there be double XP weekend?
A: We don't have an XP system so that won't work. We will be adding new warzones. On the 28th and 29th there will be a free multiplayer weekend. Anyone who hasn't bought killzone can play the multiplayer free to get a taste.
Q: Can we format the scoring screen? to display KDR etc
A: it is set up to emphasize team work not individual scores:
Q: Can we get a sniper friendly map?
A: We're making one now it will be one of the first DLCs called the hanger. It is open and great for sniping. That will be coming in one of the first map packs that will be completely free.
Q: Will we see any weapon customization?
A: We can't give too much away but will making an announcement in 3-4 weeks at a live event.
Q: Can we play as Helgast in Co-op mode?
A: You won't be helgast fighting against ISA but there are characters. You will be fighting Helgast in co-op mode
Q: How are you dealing with overpowered drones and inaccurate hipfire?
A: We're gathering data and listening to feedback. We don't want to react too fast and unbalance things in the opposite direction.
Q: Will Ammo Boxes ever be in multiplayer maps?
A: No. Support class can place them. We are aware they are hard to find so we're looking at ways to make it more obvious.
Some highlights:
Q: "Is in game voice chat coming and when?"
A: We couldn't get everything we wanted in right away. Originally we were only going to allow people to chat with your group but the community pointed out it make team work difficult. We're going to add that and we're going to have an update soon..
Q: "When is clan support going to be available and what will it be?"
A: We always wanted clans. We're going to bring it out in stages at first it will be very basic but then we will expand it to make it more exciting. We're hoping for early next year and hope it will improve tactical organization and how you play the game.
Q: Can you add a ranking system?
A: We don't have an XP system so we're looking into adding rank names that let you progress through the system instead of just a number
Q: Will there be double XP weekend?
A: We don't have an XP system so that won't work. We will be adding new warzones. On the 28th and 29th there will be a free multiplayer weekend. Anyone who hasn't bought killzone can play the multiplayer free to get a taste.
Q: Can we format the scoring screen? to display KDR etc
A: it is set up to emphasize team work not individual scores:
Q: Can we get a sniper friendly map?
A: We're making one now it will be one of the first DLCs called the hanger. It is open and great for sniping. That will be coming in one of the first map packs that will be completely free.
Q: Will we see any weapon customization?
A: We can't give too much away but will making an announcement in 3-4 weeks at a live event.
Q: Can we play as Helgast in Co-op mode?
A: You won't be helgast fighting against ISA but there are characters. You will be fighting Helgast in co-op mode
Q: How are you dealing with overpowered drones and inaccurate hipfire?
A: We're gathering data and listening to feedback. We don't want to react too fast and unbalance things in the opposite direction.
Q: Will Ammo Boxes ever be in multiplayer maps?
A: No. Support class can place them. We are aware they are hard to find so we're looking at ways to make it more obvious.
Dreams-Visions
Member
yea, Q&A was good. the game needs all of those things (except the XP stuff)>
None of the questions they read asked and they didn't go into improving technical performance.
TimeEffect
Member
Terrible teammates drive me up the wall. How hard is it to prioritize reviving and dropping beacons? It really ticks me off that I'm reviving effortlessly like a madman, only to have people feet away from me ignore me.
Played against a solid team who mowed us down with spawn beacons and annoying air turrets. They had their shit together.
Played against a solid team who mowed us down with spawn beacons and annoying air turrets. They had their shit together.
BattleMonkey
Member
Good, there was lot of stupid crap in KZ2
NullPointer
Member
Seriously, fuck KDR. Its there in the career stats anyway.
I prefer Killzone's focus on team stats rather than individual.
So, they couldn't get everything they wanted into the game, but just to be sure they never wanted team chat. What an answer ;P
Good to see that it is coming though.
KilgoreTrout
Banned
Getting a party going.
kilgoreisdead is my PSN I'd if you wanna add me, and join.
1 spot left.
kilgoreisdead is my PSN I'd if you wanna add me, and join.
1 spot left.
TimeEffect
Member
Nvm*
Might give this another try. Played a couple matches and it seemed kind of janky. I got pretty annoyed when I got killed by an OWL randomly. I decided to play BF4 instead. Still, it sure is a pretty game and I would like for it to be good. I'll have to put some more time in before I make a final judgement.
I do like how the guns don't have that much aim-assist.
I do like how the guns don't have that much aim-assist.
I've found that 24 player Warzone tends to be better with that.
Are you all out of room?
Dr. Giggles
Member
Anyone and everyone add if you want to party up.
PSN: IamMcLovin_94
PSN: IamMcLovin_94
super-famicom
Member
My replacement PS4 arrives in a few days! Looking forward to playing with you guys. While waiting, I've been playing Killzone Mercenary. Just beat the campaign, now onto the different contracts!
ZealousMonkey
Banned
I'm on the officials talking with a lot of people trying to sort out the hipfire/point shooting debate. Most of us do NOT want KZ2s crazy ass point shooting headshot stuff from 60 feet away happening ever again lol. Translating a super laggy game that ran at 20-30FPS is just not possible anymore but people seem to think it is. And really it is a very small minority tbh. Those few KZ2 diehards who just won't let it go. I can see that perhaps some things could be changed as the more neutral of posters have suggested. In the 10ft range. But nothing past that. It would make things utter havoc in Warzone if people could just aim without sights beyond 10ft IMHO.
Pointshooting itself is also a very advanced tactic. It is often confused with videogame lingo like hipfire, which is almost non-existent in real life. People don't fire from their hip very often or at all unless they have no choice. They point shoot. Big difference. And that is what KZ2 amounts to: point shooting. It's like everyone being a trained marksman who barely needs the scope. Slight crouching is often involved. And we know KZ has a crouch mechanic as it did in KZ2, it is just that the reticule is a little crazy when trying to use it even at very close ranges. BUT at this point in time I am not ready to change anything either. There is nothing worse than changing major mechanics in games before people know what is what. The weird thing is most of these guys who want longer range point shooting mechanics like KZ2 are the ones with the highest KDRs who run in groups baseraping all day!
Fact is point shooting if done wrong would ruin the whole game. Not only would noobs cannibalize noobs the vets would go back to their nutty tap tap headshots without aiming and it would more than likely kill the game as the vets dominate even more. GG is very smart to lay low on this for a while. Some people though man.... Possibly near illiterate based on their names and sentence structure. Kind of like the Uncharted forums when that was going strong.
Anyway, if you are playing single and trying to lead your team there is nothing worse than not being able to talk to noobs. You have to. I mean, think of a game like Warhawk. If I could have never talked/yelled in that game I would have slit my wrists. Same thing here. We absolutely need to be able to suggest loadouts to people spawning in when you are dying or in trouble or simply cannot switch classes.
Beyond that the core game is really great. It needs more maps, players, and modes and maybe one performance patch. What I want to reiterate to people is don't be afraid to lead your team if you are a decent player. KDR in Warzone is never going to be like KDR in TDM and this is amplified when you run in groups in this game because some of the newer players are really bad.
You can easily have a 2-3 KDR in TDM if you are good. In Warzone hell no. I am tethered to spawns for half the match every single game bar none. It's fine I am used to it but would like some extra help now and then. Just please peoples don't focus on KDR when you play Warzone as long as you are around 1 or better. If you are .5 KDR I would advice going to TDM to practice or playing campaign on hard. Here is hoping this game finds its audience. It deserves it. Best MP FPS this gen so far by a mile.
Pointshooting itself is also a very advanced tactic. It is often confused with videogame lingo like hipfire, which is almost non-existent in real life. People don't fire from their hip very often or at all unless they have no choice. They point shoot. Big difference. And that is what KZ2 amounts to: point shooting. It's like everyone being a trained marksman who barely needs the scope. Slight crouching is often involved. And we know KZ has a crouch mechanic as it did in KZ2, it is just that the reticule is a little crazy when trying to use it even at very close ranges. BUT at this point in time I am not ready to change anything either. There is nothing worse than changing major mechanics in games before people know what is what. The weird thing is most of these guys who want longer range point shooting mechanics like KZ2 are the ones with the highest KDRs who run in groups baseraping all day!
Fact is point shooting if done wrong would ruin the whole game. Not only would noobs cannibalize noobs the vets would go back to their nutty tap tap headshots without aiming and it would more than likely kill the game as the vets dominate even more. GG is very smart to lay low on this for a while. Some people though man.... Possibly near illiterate based on their names and sentence structure. Kind of like the Uncharted forums when that was going strong.
Anyway, if you are playing single and trying to lead your team there is nothing worse than not being able to talk to noobs. You have to. I mean, think of a game like Warhawk. If I could have never talked/yelled in that game I would have slit my wrists. Same thing here. We absolutely need to be able to suggest loadouts to people spawning in when you are dying or in trouble or simply cannot switch classes.
Beyond that the core game is really great. It needs more maps, players, and modes and maybe one performance patch. What I want to reiterate to people is don't be afraid to lead your team if you are a decent player. KDR in Warzone is never going to be like KDR in TDM and this is amplified when you run in groups in this game because some of the newer players are really bad.
You can easily have a 2-3 KDR in TDM if you are good. In Warzone hell no. I am tethered to spawns for half the match every single game bar none. It's fine I am used to it but would like some extra help now and then. Just please peoples don't focus on KDR when you play Warzone as long as you are around 1 or better. If you are .5 KDR I would advice going to TDM to practice or playing campaign on hard. Here is hoping this game finds its audience. It deserves it. Best MP FPS this gen so far by a mile.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Been saying it since launch week. Spawn camping sucks. And having no mics only makes it worse.Really? Thats one of my favorite maps..
Anyhoo.... Spawn camping in TDM is pretty bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sok2GXebtJw
I totally agree... It sucks not being able to chat with your teammates. Again, I barely have any friends on PSN and none of them play Killzone.
fuzzyreactor
Banned
You need to calm down insulting people just because they prefer hipfire that is actually viable in a fight.
I hate that I can't kill someone that is 10 feet away just because I'm not using ADS, it's ridiculous. The sooner they fix this, the better.
ZealousMonkey
Banned
Calm down? I'm not uncalm, good sir. I am explaining to you what the forums are like. And yes certain KZ2 vets are annoying as hell. I am a KZ2 vet myself. When you can't spell, create constructive opinions, or be decent to people you don't belong on a message board telling mp designers what they should and should not be doing. End of story.
As for your debacle. I am part of the faction that does not think you should be able to aim at people and point shoot to kill them 10 feet away unless you are crouched or some other mechanism is in place to prevent you from going rambo on and just straight shotting the whole room which is in that range at various points in warzones. You don't seem to understand, or maybe you do idk, that when you make point shooting viable from 10 or so feet you are also going to be getting a lot more spray and pray on objectives. This is a huge downside to tweaking this mechanism in what is OBVIOUSLY an ADS designed game.
KZ2 is its own game. People that think they are suddenly going to have KZ2 back are kidding themselves. Less input lag will also enable the hipfire dudes to be more deadly than in KZ2. A lot of things still need to be discussed.
The idea is that we want point shooting tuned but we don't need people who can't aim using this mechanic to kill people unjustly. It's just a fact of life that military shooters rely on real world tactics. Sorry to say but people do ADS from 10 feet away. I don't see the problem. I can do it both ways. I prefer ADS.
As for your debacle. I am part of the faction that does not think you should be able to aim at people and point shoot to kill them 10 feet away unless you are crouched or some other mechanism is in place to prevent you from going rambo on and just straight shotting the whole room which is in that range at various points in warzones. You don't seem to understand, or maybe you do idk, that when you make point shooting viable from 10 or so feet you are also going to be getting a lot more spray and pray on objectives. This is a huge downside to tweaking this mechanism in what is OBVIOUSLY an ADS designed game.
KZ2 is its own game. People that think they are suddenly going to have KZ2 back are kidding themselves. Less input lag will also enable the hipfire dudes to be more deadly than in KZ2. A lot of things still need to be discussed.
The idea is that we want point shooting tuned but we don't need people who can't aim using this mechanic to kill people unjustly. It's just a fact of life that military shooters rely on real world tactics. Sorry to say but people do ADS from 10 feet away. I don't see the problem. I can do it both ways. I prefer ADS.
DoomGyver
Member
You do realize that in the military, when they are clearing rooms with m4a1s equipped with acog sights they do not have the time to aim down their sight. They are taught to point and shoot.
fuzzyreactor
Banned
and even if we aren't talking realism here, games with hipfire are just more fun to play. The combat is more dynamic and refreshing.
James Sawyer Ford
Banned
Why are people saying hip fire is nerfed?
It's not. For short to mid range distances it will easily beat anyone bringing up ADS if you are skilled.
I hope GG doesn't fucking mess with it.
It's not. For short to mid range distances it will easily beat anyone bringing up ADS if you are skilled.
I hope GG doesn't fucking mess with it.
fuzzyreactor
Banned
No way. ADS stomps hipfire in pretty much any encounter in this game. I even use ADS with the shotgun because I get one shot kills more often that way. It got severely nerferd compared to KZ2 and KZ3.
Hip fire is extremely gun dependent in this game - Submachine Guns and Shotguns have a distinct edge over the assault rifles for sure in hip fire. The assault rifles in general are not that great at it vs the shotguns/submachine gunes.
Conversely, the submachine guns are noticably worse than the assault rifles on mid-long distance fights. Choose your poison basically.
In fact one of the attachments makes hip fire significantly better on the submachine guns due to a noticeably smaller spread reticle. .
Conversely, the submachine guns are noticably worse than the assault rifles on mid-long distance fights. Choose your poison basically.
In fact one of the attachments makes hip fire significantly better on the submachine guns due to a noticeably smaller spread reticle. .
fuzzyreactor
Banned
which attachment is that?
DoomGyver
Member
I just did this, and now my game won't even boot. I get the GG logo and then it backs out to the XMB.
What the hell.
EDIT: deleted my gamesave, no change.
Laser pointer on the submachine guns. Tap L1 and the spread reticle becomes noticeably smaller.
ZealousMonkey
Banned
A team of Seals will generally point and shoot to my knowledge only when necessary. They are ADS'ing as they come into a room depending on size. Guns are always up on shoulders depending on member of squad.
Please take a look at this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRRMFVZXBls
Notice the ACOG and notice the frequent use of eye to ACOG. It appears you are not in the military?
DoomGyver
Member
Those are Aimpoints, (red dots). They have no magnification and are used differently than ACOGS. It appears you are not in the military?
If they buff assault rifle hip fire, they might as well remove the submachine guns completely. Either that or they would need to double the clip size of the submachine guns to make them worthwhile in close quarters combat vs a buffed hip fire assault rifle.
I'm not even much of a first person shooter player and I even picked up on the differences immediately between the guns and how they perform related to distance in combat.
I'm not even much of a first person shooter player and I even picked up on the differences immediately between the guns and how they perform related to distance in combat.
ZealousMonkey
Banned
Edit: actually, now that I am looking over these things those don't look like red dots sights. They look like ACOGs LOL but I have no idea. Maybe Marine GAF could enlighten us.
Here is some more about how much our marines love ACOGs and how they use them in CQ combat in a certain way: http://www.strategypage.com/militaryforums/1-6853.aspx#startofcomments
Red dots ACOG whatever. I did notice those were not longer distance sights the first person view was using but again hard to tell for me. And that has zero bearing on things.
No, I am not in the military and don't know that much about tactical warfare but I do know some and you don't point shoot unless you have to. It is a last resort to my knowledge and everything I have read about it.
A red dot is just another scope. The main point is they were using scopes for 10ft combat. They were sure as heck not point shooting.
So if you do happen to have an ACOG they still come with ghost ring iron sights for closer combat.
Point is all this point shooting is video game stuff mostly. People rarely use these tactics in the field with success even close to that of ADS. Aiming is almost always going to win when two people are against each other evenly and scope is up.
The other thing I and others are bringing up is that people are seemingly trying to paste KZ2 mechanics in this game when they have forgotten this isn't KZ2.
Scouts no longer can fire while cloaked. Do you realize what super accurate point shooting would do to this class? It would destroy it unless you also buffed the point shoot of the scout rifles! And then.....
Madness. I think GG just needs to leave this stuff alone or do a little tweak in the 3-6ft range.
BattleMonkey
Member
The guns feel so good and satisfying to shoot and score kills with in this game. The little "bring" noise from KZ2 always is fantastic thing to hear.
Going to make an unpopular suggestion here : if GG nerfs automatons (turrets and drones) , they need to change how they're leveled so it is ASSISTS OR KILLS and not just KILLS.
Something like, instead of 400 kills to level XI Air Drone, it should be 400 kills OR 600-800 assists. The Assault Buddy Drone, Air Drone, Turret are all too unreliable to get 400 kills legitimately.
Automatons are simply too unreliable as killing mechanisms to level up in a reliable manner. Quite a lot of players are smart enough to deal with them and only more will pick up on how to take care of them the more they play.
Something like, instead of 400 kills to level XI Air Drone, it should be 400 kills OR 600-800 assists. The Assault Buddy Drone, Air Drone, Turret are all too unreliable to get 400 kills legitimately.
Automatons are simply too unreliable as killing mechanisms to level up in a reliable manner. Quite a lot of players are smart enough to deal with them and only more will pick up on how to take care of them the more they play.
In fact, I'd overhaul the entire leveling mechanism for kills (get X number of kills with so and so) so it rewards more team oriented play - make the skills reward leveling for both the owner and and the assist dealer.
One thing that immediately comes to mind is shoot through a teammates Shield as Assault would count towards your own leveling.
Adjust the number of kills/assist if necessary if it levels too fast.
One thing that immediately comes to mind is shoot through a teammates Shield as Assault would count towards your own leveling.
Adjust the number of kills/assist if necessary if it levels too fast.