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League of Legends |OT9| Stealing Abilities From Inferior MOBAs since 2009

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http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/3d618i/the_actual_problem_with_the_adc_role/

Gooby posted a rant about adcs on reddit

I think adc mains are just a bunch of babies that whine when they can't hypercarry but I'm also trash at this game so

Mostly I'm just salty because my bot lane has never won in all my games I've ever played

Gotta be some kinda statistical anomaly
ADC is in a like reverse power creep right now. Riot keeps nerfing the top picks while giving other roles more power, bot lane is super swingy but also not relevant enough and IE just plain sucks.

Not really a matter of hypercarrying, I just don't want to play siege minions with utility that need to get assfucked for 20 minutes before being relevant.
 

jerd

Member
It just seems like any game that goes mid-late the adc is mostly gonna be tops on the team n damage unless they fed hard or split pushed (looking at all the sub 10k damage to champs vaynes out there)

Yet adcs act like they can't do their jobs or something

Like yeah you're dogshit without items but you're supposed to be
 
All this complaining about ADCs.

It's supposed to be this way. It's the damn reason why they get supports. That's the damn point, you get assblasted it's your own damn fault and your supports.
 
All this complaining about ADCs.

It's supposed to be this way. It's the damn reason why they get supports. That's the damn point, you get assblasted it's your own damn fault and your supports.
This isn't how the game worked 6 months ago let alone last season.

Supports were "supposed" to be gold-less ward mules, tanks were "supposed" to be utility mules, junglers were "supposed" to have almost no gold, why is it only ADC players that get told to fuck off and stop being babies as if they want season 2 levels of domination back?
 
This isn't how the game worked 6 months ago let alone last season.

Supports were "supposed" to be gold-less ward mules, tanks were "supposed" to be utility mules, junglers were "supposed" to have almost no gold, why is it only ADC players that get told to fuck off and stop being babies as if they want season 2 levels of domination back?

Because ADCs are mostly still the same as they have been for the past few years. Weak in the beginning, and depending on how they farm or get fed, unstoppable late game. Now that they've widened the pool, where it suddenly isn't just about getting the ADC fed, people are complaining. 'But this game should be about us! We're the important ones! Why is jungle/top/mid killing us so badly!?'

I'll tell you why. Because the game doesn't revolve around ADCs anymore. The time of getting the ADC fed and then having the team comp form around them is over. ADCs will still have a place, only if they're well farmed, and only in the late game.

If you don't like it, then stop picking ADC. You have to be in the mindset of farming and getting to late game. No more running around like a headless chicken getting kills in every lane because other lanes used to be weaker.
 

Leezard

Member
ADC is fine the way it is. Top is too strong atm tho. They need to nerf TP a bit harder.
Yeah, if anything it is annoying to have 4 or 5 man ganks bot lane all day. It's tough to play a good aggressive lane since aggressive moves are punished with TP.
It's no wonder the competitive bot lanes are passive.
 
Because ADCs are mostly still the same as they have been for the past few years. Weak in the beginning, and depending on how they farm or get fed, unstoppable late game. Now that they've widened the pool, where it suddenly isn't just about getting the ADC fed, people are complaining. 'But this game should be about us! We're the important ones! Why is jungle/top/mid killing us so badly!?'

I'll tell you why. Because the game doesn't revolve around ADCs anymore. The time of getting the ADC fed and then having the team comp form around them is over. ADCs will still have a place, only if they're well farmed, and only in the late game.

If you don't like it, then stop picking ADC. You have to be in the mindset of farming and getting to late game. No more running around like a headless chicken getting kills in every lane because other lanes used to be weaker.
No one is saying the game should be about ADCs. They aren't mostly the same, most core ADC items and champions are shadows of their former selves, but I digress.

All I want is some better build paths, a BF rush item that isn't useless alone and maybe a slightly cheaper LW, is that too much to ask? If Riot would stop nerfing every ADC that becomes relevant that would be nice too.
 
I think ADC's are fine right now. The good ADC players have not had problems with this meta. The bad ADC players have.

I just had my first game as Sivir in almost a year. I went 7/1/9 by 20 mins in. Then five mins later I was 9/5/13. In that five mins they played as a team and took advantage of my piss poor positioning.

Literally the only reason I blame to my deaths as ADC, were to my poor choice in positioning. Malphite coming at me? Better stay the hell away unless I know he used that ult and his team are all accounted for.

Gragas and Anni coming mid, with a WW in the river getting ready to all in, your damn right I should have moved myself further away from the front line.
 
No one is saying the game should be about ADCs. They aren't mostly the same, most core ADC items and champions are shadows of their former selves, but I digress.

All I want is some better build paths, a BF rush item that isn't useless alone and maybe a slightly cheaper LW, is that too much to ask? If Riot would stop nerfing every ADC that becomes relevant that would be nice too.

That's more of a problem of how ADCs are in this game. Because an ADC's end game is literally just right clicking, they're kinda funneled into the items they have to buy. Speed, Crit, Last Whisperer, whatever else. They're never going to have better build paths because of this.

Like...let's say they introduce a champion who focuses on using skills more than right clicking. And because of this, they can afford to have multiple build paths because they're not dependent on crit, life steal, or attack speed. That hero will create a power creep that will slowly invalidate other ADCs.

So they're forced into this rut, where they have to create ADCs focused on right clicking. Then comes along Kalista, and holy shit what a travesty of a kit. Orb-walking made easy, % damage that is limitless, suddenly when you want to rate how an ADC does, Kalista is the bar. This is the rut they're stuck in.

This is why build paths won't change for an ADC. Not because they're too weak, but because they've been extremely pidgeon-holed into that role. Deviation is weak, build the right things. Right click to victory, your skills are only auxiliary.
 
I'm not talking about having better itemization, I'm talking about stuff like making a Pickaxe build out of a Longsword so if laning goes sour you can still afford items without having to save up 875~1550 gold if you're a BF ADC
 
I'm not talking about having better itemization, I'm talking about stuff like making a Pickaxe build out of a Longsword so if laning goes sour you can still afford items without having to save up 875~1550 gold if you're a BF ADC

nah ADC itemization is already too good for early game. Making Pick Axe build out of Long sword would be a huge fucking buff to Long Sword.
 
nah ADC itemization is already too good for early game. Making Pick Axe build out of Long sword would be a huge fucking buff to Long Sword.
Only if you're a Botrk or Trinity ADC. Hell, Botrk just got a pass at that with the Recurve Bow changes, at least make BF build out of a Pickaxe + Longsword

IE as a whole is just not too hot. I'm starting to hope the meta becomes so silly that BT rush needs to be the norm again as opposed to a "in case of Runeglaive Ezreal" thing
 

killatopak

Gold Member
Oh but there are champions that does not focus on the general items that adcs buy like Ez and Corki.

The difference is that they aren't strong at late game but on mid game which is fine.

What I want is something like Dota where the ADC doesn't have to be a ranged champ but just someone who can hard carry at late game.
 
I've been playing a lot of ADC recently with some varying degrees of success

usually my KDA is fairly high, I just don't really carry. Mostly because I'm actually godawful mechanically at the role, my positioning sucks, I just know how to not make dumb decisions and get caught.

basically I play ashe and sometimes my arrows win teamfights and I don't feed. i find it really hard to carry as an adc because even if you're ahead you have to be like "please don't let the bad people hurt me, team"

i'm goddamn awful at kiting which is why i bought kalista to try to get a little better at it since you can't cancel her autos. I suck at using attack move because it feels awkward to cancel a command using shift, maybe i should move it to a mouse button
 
Kind of a silly argument when Riot just made a pass at AP itemization, making NLR and Wand cheaper plus adding tome to recipes in order to make build paths more fluid lol

They already did the same for ADC items a long time ago.

Did you forget when BF Sword used to cost 1850? Or when Long Sword was 440? Pickaxe reduced 100 gold from 975? They've already made passes on AD Itemization. It's simply fair they finally did it to AP items.
 
They already did the same for ADC items a long time ago.

Did you forget when BF Sword used to cost 1850? Or when Long Sword was 440? Pickaxe reduced 100 gold from 975? They've already made passes on AD Itemization. It's simply fair they finally did it to AP items.
That's when ADCs were gods and those weren't price changes, they changed the values of the stats and it was game-wide, not just for ADC items. Those changes were meant to nerf ADC by making crit and AS harder to get, cheaper AD was a consolation prize lol
 
Kind of a silly argument when Riot just made a pass at AP itemization, making NLR and Wand cheaper plus adding tome to recipes in order to make build paths more fluid lol

i don't buy the whole "AP items have variety, why can't ADC items?" thing. AP users primarily use their spells as a means of damage, and spells vary wildly in what they do and what stats they can make use of. Some mages benefit more from CDR and mana regen, some benefit form an additional slowing effect via something like rylai's, etc. but all ADCs are, at their core, the same thing. more DPS via auto attacks, and auto attacks are all the same. There's a little variety via passive stuff and thats where you see the IE/BORK duality, but beyond that, it's really hard to introduce item variety because it's hard for items to interact with auto attacks in a meaningful way, beyond simply adding more power to them.

To change it, riot is probably going to have to introduce drastic new ADCs, which they tried with kalista (somewhat successfully), or totally rework the way crit works (which they started with ashe) in order to give each ADC a little bit of a different flavor that lets you build them uniquely.

the problem isn't the items, it's the role.

Edit: WOW this post is literally word for word the discussion you guys already had. ignore me im an idiot and it's 4:30 in the morning
 
That's when ADCs were gods and those weren't price changes, they changed the values of the stats and it was game-wide, not just for ADC items. Those changes were meant to nerf ADC by making crit and AS harder to get, cheaper AD was a consolation prize lol

Yup, and until this season where Cinderhulk was introduced, ADCs were very much still gods.

I get it, you want ADC to be EZ mode and you want the game to focus around ADC's and the 'l33t kalista' dodging.

But that's why the game was so toxic in the first place.
 
Yup, and until this season where Cinderhulk was introduced, ADCs were very much still gods.

I get it, you want ADC to be EZ mode and you want the game to focus around ADC's and the 'l33t kalista' dodging.

But that's why the game was so toxic in the first place.
None of what you just said is even remotely true lol
 
None of what you just said is even remotely true lol

It's very true. There has always been a huge focus on ADC's. They were always the 'important role'. Mids come second, than junglers, than tops and lastly supports. Now that has been messed up. Supports can be extremely important, such as Naut, Jungles can actually carry easier than before, tops can have presence, and mids are also strong. ADC's are still late game terrors.

What more do you want? If you create better itemization for ADCs, then the focus will shift to them again and they'll be 'overpowered'. Simple as that.
 

Nekofrog

Banned
kIuvzJV.jpg

back to plat 4

pls dont ever make me play ad i feed uncontrollably as ad
 
It's very true. There has always been a huge focus on ADC's. They were always the 'important role'. Mids come second, than junglers, than tops and lastly supports. Now that has been messed up. Supports can be extremely important, such as Naut, Jungles can actually carry easier than before, tops can have presence, and mids are also strong. ADC's are still late game terrors.

What more do you want? If you create better itemization for ADCs, then the focus will shift to them again and they'll be 'overpowered'. Simple as that.
I fail to see how making bot lane less swingy is going to stop junglers from murdering my ass as they please. I just want to be less awkwardly behind when they do so, how will that suddenly make the game revolve around ADCs again?

And once more, this is only for BF sword / IE carries. The Botrk and Trinity ADCs all have decent build paths, does the game revolve around them perchance?
 

Nekofrog

Banned
It's very true. There has always been a huge focus on ADC's. They were always the 'important role'. Mids come second, than junglers, than tops and lastly supports. Now that has been messed up. Supports can be extremely important, such as Naut, Jungles can actually carry easier than before, tops can have presence, and mids are also strong. ADC's are still late game terrors.

What more do you want? If you create better itemization for ADCs, then the focus will shift to them again and they'll be 'overpowered'. Simple as that.

about top lane:

i think its one of the most important lanes in the game for early success. it's one of the easiest lanes to gank right now because mid is a short lane and people (usually) have a way to get away whether it's CC or a dash/blink. bot is a tossup as to what happens because of the lane dynamic and support picks.

top is a long lane. get your TP top laner rolling and he suddenly becomes a global presence in the game that can get other lanes rolling as well.
 
I fail to see how making bot lane less swingy is going to stop junglers from murdering my ass as they please. I just want to be less awkwardly behind when they do so, how will that suddenly make the game revolve around ADCs again?

And once more, this is only for BF sword / IE carries. The Botrk and Trinity ADCs all have decent build paths, does the game revolve around them perchance?

IE and BF are already huge power spikes.

That's why they cost so much. Y'know, just like the other high level items.

Don't see the problem.
 
IE is a mediocre power spike until you get more crit

Their prices aren't changing, you'll still hit the same power spikes at the same time, I never said I wanted cheaper IE builds. Why would making bot lane less snowbally be a bad thing?
 
But it would increase the power of a long sword and pick axe.
Uhh how? Their stats and prices are remaining the same. Making them more attractive purchases if you're behind isn't increasing their power.

You don't want ADCs to be overpowered but you want them to be able to snowball off their lanes easier, making them overpowered and important. Makes sense to me.
 
Uhh how? Their stats and prices are remaining the same. Making them more attractive purchases if you're behind isn't increasing their power.

You don't want ADCs to be overpowered but you want them to be able to snowball off their lanes easier, making them overpowered and important. Makes sense to me.

Because they build into BF Sword. That's why.

It's that simple.
 
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