I'd rather Frank Castle's background not tie into ancient ninja cults.
And it was kinda clear to me she knew already. Maybe even since the end of season 1.
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Marvel's Daredevil S2 *Spoiler Thread* |OT| Elektra Boogaloo - March 18th on Netflix
- Thread starter TheOddOne
- Start date
And it was kinda clear to me she knew already. Maybe even since the end of season 1.
daredevil season 1 is great. it's like they watched arrow season 1 and decided to make a tv show based on it. it runs on a little too long and had a weak finale, but it's mostly a good origins story.
jessica jones is wasted potential the whole way through, with tennant and ritter being the only standouts. the show is full of dumb and it's incredibly unfocused.
daredevil season 2 feels like a blend of the two. there are parts where it's really interesting,
jessica jones is wasted potential the whole way through, with tennant and ritter being the only standouts. the show is full of dumb and it's incredibly unfocused.
daredevil season 2 feels like a blend of the two. there are parts where it's really interesting,
like defending frank castle and anything involving kingpin. and then there's boring dumb bad pacing stuff like everything to do with the hand and the chaste. i tuned out big time on those elements.
i think what daredevil season 1 had was a hero at a disadvantage and a central villain. the central villain keeps things focused and the disadvantage makes you root for the hero. the reason the hallway fight in episode two is so compelling is because it's done shortly after murdock almost had died and he's super tired, but maybe just has enough juice in him to keep going. the tension is highlighted by it being done in one take and the small space in which the fight takes place. the equivalent of that in season 2 is the defense of frank castle, in which things quickly go south for the defense team in a lot of ways, but it's interesting to see if and how they'll climb out of that hole. but then the whole thing sort of resolves itself so the punisher can talk to the kingpin. it just winds up feeling like a big waste of time.
after murdock met with kingpin, i was really hoping there would be more focus on kingpin taking murdock down from within prison. instead we get a lot of mysticism stuff and talk about elektra being a chosen one. somewhere in all this is the idea that matt might have to go too far and take a life. when it finally happens, there's no weight to it because the focus is all over the place.
i think what daredevil season 1 had was a hero at a disadvantage and a central villain. the central villain keeps things focused and the disadvantage makes you root for the hero. the reason the hallway fight in episode two is so compelling is because it's done shortly after murdock almost had died and he's super tired, but maybe just has enough juice in him to keep going. the tension is highlighted by it being done in one take and the small space in which the fight takes place. the equivalent of that in season 2 is the defense of frank castle, in which things quickly go south for the defense team in a lot of ways, but it's interesting to see if and how they'll climb out of that hole. but then the whole thing sort of resolves itself so the punisher can talk to the kingpin. it just winds up feeling like a big waste of time.
after murdock met with kingpin, i was really hoping there would be more focus on kingpin taking murdock down from within prison. instead we get a lot of mysticism stuff and talk about elektra being a chosen one. somewhere in all this is the idea that matt might have to go too far and take a life. when it finally happens, there's no weight to it because the focus is all over the place.
I don't want her to do anything, I'm saying that of the things that were suggested for her in the show, law school made more sense than her going from secretary at Union Allied, to secretary at Nelson & Murdock, to reporter at major New York newspaper.
Please tell me the connection between being good at research and being good at writing. Ben didn't get help from while he was writing, she was simply a source. And yes, a reporter needs examples of their writing before they can be hired as a reporter. You can't even get a job at a videogame site without some writing samples.
I actually didn't like the trial of Frank Castle as presented to us. It's full of contrived Hollywood law and eventually is shown to be utterly moot, as Frank tanks his case anyways. And while Frank meeting Fisk was badass, Frank undoing the whole prison thing by just walking out the door due to Fisk somehow magically controlling all the guards was such fucking dumb bullshit. It's like Arrow levels of dumb bullshit. You'd think Fisk suddenly developed Kilgrave's powers or something.
At least when bullshit happens in the magic zombie ninjas plot, I can just hand wave it aside due to the magic zombie ninjas.
That said, the writers fucked up bad by having Matt push the firm into taking the case and then never show up.
And Anihawk, I think Kingpin taking down Matt Murdock from within prison needs its own season to develop.
At least when bullshit happens in the magic zombie ninjas plot, I can just hand wave it aside due to the magic zombie ninjas.
That said, the writers fucked up bad by having Matt push the firm into taking the case and then never show up.
And Anihawk, I think Kingpin taking down Matt Murdock from within prison needs its own season to develop.
Done.
I had fun with it, more or less like with Season 1.
Unlike most here, i didn't find the first half of the season that amazingly compelling, none of the Punisher scenes had me on the edge of my seat, despite liking the character's interpretation overall.
I think his best moments came in the second half, between the whole trial, and the prison brawl, a nice Rorschach moment right there.
All the Hand stuff was a bit too "Arrow" level garbage, mostly because poeple dressed like ninjas running around New York look comical (give them some modern, techno ninja suit, ffs) and because ultimately, it was a whole lot of jibberish that meant nothing to me (Black Sky, Hand, Chaste); none of it did anything concrete or was explained in doing anything beyond vague "doomsday" scenario.
And yet, i had more fun following the second half of the season, having the trio of heroes disgregated was better drama, Elektra was fun, Punisher had his best scenes, the ninjas were silly, but they felt still fairly dangerous... and most importantly, we got Wilson Fisk back.
Vincent D'Onofrio's Kingpin may have sort of a funny way of talking, but the guy is like a bright spotlight in your face, every time he's on screen, he steals it, and he gives the character more depth than it deserves, just by having a worried look here and a pained expression there.
Fuck i think him slamming Murdock on the table (when he goes find him in prison) was the best moment in the whole season.
The fighting this time didn't captivate me as much as it did in S1, and as i said, i don't think The Hand was nearly as interesting a villain as Fisk was, plus the writing was pretty crass, as it was in S1, maybe even worse at times, but over all i think the pacing was better, and the show was just as fun.
And i'm happy they had Elektra to step in for the Daredevil love story, because every scene between Murdock and Karen being romantic was shit, they have zero chemistry on screen, and it always feels forced.
Also, the journalist crap is always painfully boring, it was in S1, and it is in S2.
On that note: "You're a hero; you're a New Yorker" Listen, i'm not American and maybe i'm missing context here, but shit like this does nothing but reinforce the stereotype about New Yorkers having their heads far up their asses, thinking they're special; why even write something that cringe worthy?
I had fun with it, more or less like with Season 1.
Unlike most here, i didn't find the first half of the season that amazingly compelling, none of the Punisher scenes had me on the edge of my seat, despite liking the character's interpretation overall.
I think his best moments came in the second half, between the whole trial, and the prison brawl, a nice Rorschach moment right there.
All the Hand stuff was a bit too "Arrow" level garbage, mostly because poeple dressed like ninjas running around New York look comical (give them some modern, techno ninja suit, ffs) and because ultimately, it was a whole lot of jibberish that meant nothing to me (Black Sky, Hand, Chaste); none of it did anything concrete or was explained in doing anything beyond vague "doomsday" scenario.
And yet, i had more fun following the second half of the season, having the trio of heroes disgregated was better drama, Elektra was fun, Punisher had his best scenes, the ninjas were silly, but they felt still fairly dangerous... and most importantly, we got Wilson Fisk back.
Vincent D'Onofrio's Kingpin may have sort of a funny way of talking, but the guy is like a bright spotlight in your face, every time he's on screen, he steals it, and he gives the character more depth than it deserves, just by having a worried look here and a pained expression there.
Fuck i think him slamming Murdock on the table (when he goes find him in prison) was the best moment in the whole season.
The fighting this time didn't captivate me as much as it did in S1, and as i said, i don't think The Hand was nearly as interesting a villain as Fisk was, plus the writing was pretty crass, as it was in S1, maybe even worse at times, but over all i think the pacing was better, and the show was just as fun.
And i'm happy they had Elektra to step in for the Daredevil love story, because every scene between Murdock and Karen being romantic was shit, they have zero chemistry on screen, and it always feels forced.
Also, the journalist crap is always painfully boring, it was in S1, and it is in S2.
On that note: "You're a hero; you're a New Yorker" Listen, i'm not American and maybe i'm missing context here, but shit like this does nothing but reinforce the stereotype about New Yorkers having their heads far up their asses, thinking they're special; why even write something that cringe worthy?
Steven Moffat.
Why did Stick want Elektra dead? He just saved her a couple of episodes earlier. He could have let her die then. Wasn't his entire goal to get her to not be so kill-happy? And then when she chooses to go with Matt and not murder everyone, that's when Stick decides to put her down? Why did the Hand try to kill her? They knew who she was, and they sought her out not much later.
LordRaptor
Member
My thoughts on where things might be going...
- This is the first introduction of mystical stuff into the MCU, right? It needed to happen at some point to prep for Dr Strange, but pretty much confirms Iron Fist will have a mystical background. Also opens the door for some other 'street level' magic based heroes and villains like White Tiger or The Hood
- Matt is pretty cavalier about his secret identity, was there a fight he didn't take his helmet off immediately afterwards to talk to someone this series? Getting outed as Daredevil by Fisk seems an inevitable plot point, and would be a great opportunity to bring in Cage and JJ as bodyguards like the comics did
- D'onofrio is still the best villain in the MCU.
- The blood stuff with the runaways and The Hand... if the IGH plot point from JJ is just a straight up substitute of mutant for inhuman and MGH, then I'd guess the blood stuff was how the Hand are manufacturing IGH, and at some point its going to start hitting the streets
- Was there someone in the resurrection coffin thing before they put Elektra in? If yes, does coming back from the dead super power you up? If yes, do we get The Owl as Hells Kitchen IGH pusher supreme?
- The dossier on Karen suggests to me that her (comic spoilers)
is in her past in the MCU, not her future - when she looked at it and was shocked and the editor guy said he didn't care and nor did Ben, that was my takeawayJunky porn star life
- The big hole in the ground was obviously trying to excavate the terrordome for Krang
The Hand could just steal her corpse at anytime and revive her.
wait nvm you are telling that other dude what they could do (and did) and why they attacked her
Answer to the question why would they try and kill her.
Edit: yeah my quote failed earlier
I think he says something like "I should have let her die in that car". But as seen in the flashback, it seems he cared enough for Elektra to keep her safe (maybe?). If that's the case he did jump to just wanting her death pretty quick though.
Oh no
I think once she rejected him, he figured that she was too far gone and that The Hand would be able to get to her.
Do we know this, or are we speculating because that's what occurs in the comics? I think later events make clear they would prefer her alive.
BronsonLee
Member
'Why does Stick do X'
Because he's a dick
Because he's a dick
"Matt let me explain this stuff"
"Na Stick fuck you I don't believe in Ninjas"
He never said he didn't believe in ninjas. He was fighting them last season. He said the black sky was a myth. And so far all signs point to that being the case. The conversation was more like this:
"Matt, the black sky is the most powerful weapon of all time."
"What is it?"
"No one knows."
"What does it do?"
"No one knows."
"How do you know it exists?"
"No one knows."
"Fuck off, Stick."
NoblesseOblige
Banned
I cannot read the OP because it's just images hosted somewhere that a work firewall is blocking; so I don't know if spoiler tags are needed here but ....
Who was the black man that Stick killed (in episode 12 I think)? I had closed-captioning on and it called him "[Star]" at one point. It was the guy who wanted Elektra dead after she killed one of his students.
José Mourinho
cocknose
I cannot for the life of me understand the hatred for Karen.
BronsonLee
Member
Matt was basically Mr. Bad Idea Man this whole season.
Defending Frank in court.
Hooking up with Elektra again.
Failing a lot. Being a dumbass.
Ignoring Stick and telling him to fuck off was the one smart thing he did
Defending Frank in court.
Hooking up with Elektra again.
Failing a lot. Being a dumbass.
Ignoring Stick and telling him to fuck off was the one smart thing he did
I like Sticks, but i agree with the rest.
Worst part about the second half was how nothing was explained, so why should i give a shit? What is even so terrible about this Black Sky? This in a world where Hulk, Thor, Thanos exist and are real, well known things on the news (maybe not Thanos, but you get the idea).
José Mourinho;198791955 said:
Personally i just think she doesn't work as Murdock's love interest.
Aside from both being two attractive lead characters, they really don't seem to have that much chemistry on screen.
And her journalism plot wasn't that intriguing to me.
Foggy on the other hand, i straight up don't like the actor.
BronsonLee
Member
It was so they could revive Elektra
Remember in Season 1 when Stick killed the Black Sky kid? This is their countermeasure
Finished last night. Meh.
Elektra was boring as fuck. Hand was boring and underwhelming. Stick is a cool character, but again boring plot line I didn't care about that they didn't present well at all. Too much mystical bullshit mysteries that weren't interesting or engaging, let alone explained and paid off in any way.
Punisher was the best part of the season, but woefully underdeveloped and under used. The way they handled him was terrible after he was caught. I was so pumped to see an actual trial and it lasted all of like 3 minutes.
Matt came off as a complete tool and moron the majority of the season. And the whole Karen relationship subplot was so fucking terrible. They had zero reason to be together at all and it lasted all of like 5 minutes and they acted like it was this huge thing. The show had its good moments and its bad, but the bad tipped the scales this time around. Just like DD S1 and JJ S1 the show had some good highs, but at a lot of needless lows. They're all good, but still seems like Netflix is trying to figure out just how to do these street level super hero shows. This was so far the weakest of the three.
I don't really give a shit about Luke Cage as a character, but I at least hope they get it right with his series.
Elektra was boring as fuck. Hand was boring and underwhelming. Stick is a cool character, but again boring plot line I didn't care about that they didn't present well at all. Too much mystical bullshit mysteries that weren't interesting or engaging, let alone explained and paid off in any way.
Punisher was the best part of the season, but woefully underdeveloped and under used. The way they handled him was terrible after he was caught. I was so pumped to see an actual trial and it lasted all of like 3 minutes.
Matt came off as a complete tool and moron the majority of the season. And the whole Karen relationship subplot was so fucking terrible. They had zero reason to be together at all and it lasted all of like 5 minutes and they acted like it was this huge thing. The show had its good moments and its bad, but the bad tipped the scales this time around. Just like DD S1 and JJ S1 the show had some good highs, but at a lot of needless lows. They're all good, but still seems like Netflix is trying to figure out just how to do these street level super hero shows. This was so far the weakest of the three.
I don't really give a shit about Luke Cage as a character, but I at least hope they get it right with his series.
Oh ok was wondering if it was something more than that or related to the giant holes they were digging. Speaking of, did they ever cover what was up with those?
FunnyBunny
Member
I just finished it, and loved it.
Some of the criticism is hard for me to understand, especially surrounding the mysticism the show injected into this season. Daredevil takes place in the same MCU that features alien invasions, Infinity Stones, and Inhumans. None of it is grounded even a little bit.
Hell, Elektra won't even be the first MCU character brought back from the dead.
Some of the criticism is hard for me to understand, especially surrounding the mysticism the show injected into this season. Daredevil takes place in the same MCU that features alien invasions, Infinity Stones, and Inhumans. None of it is grounded even a little bit.
Hell, Elektra won't even be the first MCU character brought back from the dead.
BronsonLee
Member
All this means is that my main man Wesley has a shot at coming back too
#IBelieve #IDidSeeABodyButOk
#IBelieve #IDidSeeABodyButOk
The mysticism is not the problem, been discussed to death tbh. The problem is stakes aren't established and the threat is kept so nebulous it feels irrelevant.
Hah, indeed. I was eating at the time and had to look down at my food. Everytime I thought, "ok they have to be done showing it!" and looked up only to see, nope! Still shoving them in there...
edit: Another scene that I cringed at was the diner scene when Punisher was just going to town on that guy's cheek bone with the butt of his gun... Ugh
BronsonLee
Member
Miles Quaritch
Member
Maybe that's the plan for any Punisher series?
Spieler Eins
Member
I'm not that annoyed by Karen, but they really shouldn't have killed the real journalist character last season...
Well to be fair they both
Die and come back to life in the comics
edit: While on the subject of Elektra
she comes back to life too in the comics
I was hoping for it after some of the other returns.
Wonder if Foggy will show up in JJ season two.It only took him one opening speech to make bank.
Kid Kamikaze10
Member
José Mourinho;198791955 said:
From what I've seen, there's three issues.
1) Dating back to Season One, killing off a well liked villain character.
2) The relationship with her and Matt not exactly clicking.
3) This is the big one, the journalism plot. It doesn't feel like a "Legacy" moment like the show makes it seem. it feels more like watering down Ben Urich post-mortem.
The fact that she was able to get the journalism job without training or nearly as much experience as Ben rings super false. Makes it seem like all Ben did was get into the thick of it, looked at some evidence, and boom, story. When there's so much more to journalism than that.
Add that to the fact that her mistakes got Ben killed, and it just piles on.
BronsonLee
Member
I have to imagine he's going to start getting his rep as the vigilante defender then. JJ's gonna do something stupid and he's going to have to help out
José Mourinho;198791955 said:
First season: her boneheaded moves get a character killed. Second season: she continues to get put into stupid situations where she has to be rescued.
I think the fault for this is obviously the writing, but yeah it just undermines her character.
The head editor can do what he wants; where it breaks down for me is that it seems like a pretty big shift from his personality in S1, and even with Ben dying I can't see him changing that much.
Still don't understand how that works. If you've bought off the guards once, with no more capital it seems like your hold is tenuous at best, especially to the point that you could effectively (and brazenly) run the whole prison.
Kid Kamikaze10
Member
I assume that he got it replenished taking all the old Kingpin's stuff.
I guess that's the best explanation, although jumping from "owning" a prison block to controlling the entire prison seems tenuous to me. But then again you have to buy into super villains controlling everything in these kinds of shows.
BronsonLee
Member
They made it very clear that the old Kingpin ran almost all of the drug trade.
That gets replenished very quickly. But yeah, it's tenuous. Just roll with it.
That gets replenished very quickly. But yeah, it's tenuous. Just roll with it.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
I have the feeling Fisk could just liquidate an insignificant portion of assets to pay off a prison. I mean it's not like prison guards make a lot.
Shadow Broker
Banned
I just Binge watch all season two last night.
There's only one thing I didn't like about this season and that's
There's only one thing I didn't like about this season and that's
Matt X Karen. It felt forced. I don't like their dynamic, their chemistry is off, and even when they're together they're like two close friends forcing it. It felt like a waste.
. I mean has he ever played a good guy? lol
MuddyDonut
Member
I thought Elektra was great and a good contrast to Karen. Karen is the path Matt wants to go down, and Elektra was the path that he needed to avoid, but already had established. He can not refuse her no matter how much he tries. She is dangerous for Matt.
Now why Karen? I am not too sure why, I never understood it in the comics either. He found her broken and wants to fix her, I guess? However, I liked the scene when they were grabbing Indian food. They had good chemistry there and at that moment you could understand the attraction, but it doesn't happen often enough to be completely believable when watching the show.
Now why Karen? I am not too sure why, I never understood it in the comics either. He found her broken and wants to fix her, I guess? However, I liked the scene when they were grabbing Indian food. They had good chemistry there and at that moment you could understand the attraction, but it doesn't happen often enough to be completely believable when watching the show.