Support NeoGAF

[ctrayne]

I have a dumb issue with the game that I am trying to get over. When I played ME2 I had little previous exposure to BioWare and knew nothing about the company or it's fan base, having only recently (at the time) been getting into PC gaming. I enjoyed the game quite a bit despite some of the cheesy bits and thought it was great.

Fast forward to today, and I know much more about BioWare - the expensive, short DLC, the Dragon Age II fiasco, the weirdo posts devs make on the official forum (paraphrase: play female Hawk and watch her bum sway, ooh!) and the creepy fan base which seems second worst only to Sonic fans (Tali sweat). I find it harder to enjoy the game now because, especially when it comes to the romance options, it all seems pathetic and corny. Too many cheesy sexual innuendos, it's almost fan-fic quality. And Jack's character design is the most ridiculous thing in the world. The game feels like a nerd daydream simulator next to games like Max Payne 2 or Civ V.

Couple that with the restrictive Paragon/Douchebag options, which are so limiting compared to Alpha Protocol or Deus Ex's conversational systems, and it's tough to feel the love.

Am I being unfair to the game? I don't hate it, it certainly is an accomplishment, but it could have been a lot...classier.

 

[Gvaz]

No, your eyes are just opened to the truth. I wish everyone's eyes were opened.

 

[MaddenNFL64]

I think it's a tad unfair. Alpha Protocol has the best conversation system in the business, and Human Revs conversation system is even more bare bones than Mass Effects. If you're taking into account the "pick the correct response" minigame during the high stakes conversations, sure it's a highlight, but it doesn't make up the majority of conversations throughout the game. And speaking of corny romance, don't fucking tell me the romances in AP were any better than the shit in Bioware games. They weren't. It's fluff, and optional. In a 35 hour game about being a betrayed spy, or a space marine fighting robots, it's about as good as this stuff is gonna get.

All the other stuff, you can take it or leave it. Nutty Tali fans, problems with DA2, $10 DLC, you can nitpick to shit if you're looking for reasons to not like something.

edit: DX fan here as well, so on second thought, i'll say they were equal in scope when it came to options in dialogue.

 

[Wallach]

Not sure how the weirdo fans affect you, but yeah the romance things in both of these games are fucking hilariously awkward.

 

[ctrayne]

And speaking of corny romance, don't fucking tell me the romances in AP were any better than the shit in Bioware games.

I definitely never said that, only that the conversation system was better. But the romances in AP were a little more avoidable and didn't reek of basement-dweller scent as badly. Maybe because they're all humans, maybe because their outfits weren't so form-fitting. There's just something creepy about most of ME's romances. You're right though, it's not like AP's are particularly good.

I also would argue that DXHRs conversations are better than ME2 because you won't fail miserably in the game because you want to explore dialogue options. In ME2, if you don't go full-on Paragon or Renegade, you miss out on a LOT in the game, as the middle-ground is never an option because you miss out on the points. In DXHR, you can explore and be schizophrenic and still get the most out of the game.

 

[MaddenNFL64]

You can certainly say whatever the hell in DX, for sure haha. That is a good quality to it, but I do enjoy the renegade paragon system for the impact it gives if you play the ME games multiple times, which I did. In Human Rev, I tried to play it like an ass, but it just never stuck. I just played the good guy, who once in a while said something nutty. Guess I need the carrot on a stick.

On the creepy aspect of the romances, it's easy to avoid the fluff in all the Bioware games. Just don't take the obvious route & explore them. I mean if you want to get into creepy homosexual conversations in Dragon Age, you can, or you can tell people to back off, and it never comes up again.

 

[Keinu]

No, your eyes are just opened to the truth. I wish everyone's eyes were opened.

Opened to the truth or blinded by other people's opinion?

 

[ctrayne]

On the creepy aspect of the romances, it's easy to avoid the fluff in all the Bioware games. Just don't take the obvious route & explore them. I mean if you want to get into creepy homosexual conversations in Dragon Age, you can, or you can tell people to back off, and it never comes up again.

Hah, that is true. I told off the elf guy in DAII and he let it rest rather quickly. Nothing against the guy, but I just couldn't handle the writing anymore.

 

[Lothars]

Opened to the truth or blinded by other people's opinion?

I'm thinking the second one especially with gvaz saying his eye's were opened to the truth.

 

[The Technomancer]

On the creepy aspect of the romances, it's easy to avoid the fluff in all the Bioware games. Just don't take the obvious route & explore them. I mean if you want to get into creepy homosexual conversations in Dragon Age, you can, or you can tell people to back off, and it never comes up again.

I dunno, I was fairly annoyed that I had to stop talking to Jacob completely in ME2 because every conversation option, including things like "Hows it going" turned into
*relax seductively against the table* "So uh...hows it going?"

 

[Emitan]

I dunno, I was fairly annoyed that I had to stop talking to Jacob completely in ME2 because every conversation option, including things like "Hows it going" turned into
*relax seductively against the table* "So uh...hows it going?"

And it starts so fast. Pretty much 4 hours into that game you can't talk to Jacob anymore.

 

[MaddenNFL64]

I dunno, I was fairly annoyed that I had to stop talking to Jacob completely in ME2 because every conversation option, including things like "Hows it going" turned into
*relax seductively against the table* "So uh...hows it going?"

I was man shep, so all i got was Bro Jacob.

I have seen the femshep convos with him tho. Jacob is hammy as fuck lol.

 

[Wallach]

I dunno, I was fairly annoyed that I had to stop talking to Jacob completely in ME2 because every conversation option, including things like "Hows it going" turned into
*relax seductively against the table* "So uh...hows it going?"

You wanted it. He knew.

 

[Woorloog]

I dunno, I was fairly annoyed that I had to stop talking to Jacob completely in ME2 because every conversation option, including things like "Hows it going" turned into
*relax seductively against the table* "So uh...hows it going?"

Jacob is depraved. Think about it a bit. The whole crew has ridiculous amounts of issues, Jacob seems to be the only sane man. But, if everyone else has issues, why doesn't he? Of course he has. Sexually depraved... which is quite mild compared to others but there it is.

Spoiler

And issues with his father

 

[Emitan]

You wanted it. He knew.

What? He's not even blue! How could I romance anyone but Liara?

 

[MaddenNFL64]

You just want a avatar quote.

 

[Emitan]

You just want a avatar quote.

Not particularly. It's not like I was in love with Toph or anything.

 

[The Technomancer]

Not particularly. It's not like I was in love with Toph or anything.

Was that a joke based on the tsundere trope or am I just too tired and reading waaay too far into things?

 

[Wallach]

Was that a joke based on the tsundere trope or am I just too tired and reading waaay too far into things?

who writes a sentence like this

 

[Gvaz]

I dunno, I was fairly annoyed that I had to stop talking to Jacob completely in ME2 because every conversation option, including things like "Hows it going" turned into
*relax seductively against the table* "So uh...hows it going?"

Yeah they're not really that avoidable since everyone's so come-ony

Also all of those reasons are completely valid reasons to dislike the franchise/fans/game because none of those things are really appropriate. "the fans? what did the fans ever do? Gvaz you're reaching!" you say. *looks at tali being included as a romance option after they had vehemently opposed it (also in ME1 she was 16)* *sighs*

 

[ctrayne]

For the record, I don't mean to sound like a hater - the game is decent. But I still stand by my thoughts.

 

[MaddenNFL64]

For the record, I don't mean to sound like a hater - the game is decent. But I still stand by my thoughts.

it's all good in the hood.

 

[Blue Ninja]

ME2's one of my favorite games of all time, but heck, I'll be the first to admit it's got issues. Nothing is perfect, after all.

 

[Emitan]

Was that a joke based on the tsundere trope or am I just too tired and reading waaay too far into things?

Geez, Technomancer...it's not like you're...reading too far into things or anything like that...

 

[NoRéN]

This game was awesome. I

Spoiler

saved everyone

and

Spoiler

sexed up Tali

.

 

[Rapstah]

I had my 50 hour odyssey through both games these past two weeks and it was pretty fun. Played female shepard, adept in both games. Compared to the first game, the second one seemed to drive you on a lot more in conversations. Wasn't a fan of my character talking for like eight boxes beyond what I clicked. I wasn't asking for that!

Spoiler

Saved everyone at the end after I realised what I should be doing. Didn't go for any romance options since I did Kaidan in the first game (that felt awkward by the way) and wanted to see if I'd be rewarded for not dropping that. I'll see in the third game. I guess I'm fine if my character didn't turn over the photo pre-Collector base?

What was with the missions that were pure Renegade by the way? I picked them up without even thinking and it turned out there wasn't any Paragon way of solving some of them, mostly the package pick-up on Omega and Liara's first two missions - I didn't do the rest because I seriously couldn't see any way of it ending without me getting Renegade points. And that planet got incredibly dull after an hour or two and like eight loyalty missions taking place there. Arfgfgh.

 

[nel e nel]

I definitely never said that, only that the conversation system was better. But the romances in AP were a little more avoidable and didn't reek of basement-dweller scent as badly. Maybe because they're all humans, maybe because their outfits weren't so form-fitting. There's just something creepy about most of ME's romances. You're right though, it's not like AP's are particularly good.

I also would argue that DXHRs conversations are better than ME2 because you won't fail miserably in the game because you want to explore dialogue options. In ME2, if you don't go full-on Paragon or Renegade, you miss out on a LOT in the game, as the middle-ground is never an option because you miss out on the points. In DXHR, you can explore and be schizophrenic and still get the most out of the game.

Well, that's kinda the point in these choose-your-own-adventure style games no? Your choices create a unique experience that only your Shepard has. I don't quite understand people's obsession with 'good' or 'bad' outcomes in RPGs. The only outcome is the one you craft for yourself.

Roll a new Shepard and make different choices if you want to see the stuff you missed. I've played through both games 3 times and have had different romances, missions and conversation options open up each time. For me at least, that was part of the fun: "oh shit! that didn't happen last time!" I've done the min/max style of gameplay and the pick-one-and-stick-with-it style, and I generally get more out of the latter style. Also, in ME2 at least, taking the middle ground rewards you with both Paragon and Renegade scores most of the time. In ME1 you would generally get Paragon, but much fewer if you went true Paragon.

I do agree that DXHR's conversations felt much more dynamic and not as dichotomous, and yes, some of the dialog is cheesy, but I've felt that Bioware injects a lot of tongue-in-cheek and self-referential humor into their games. Sure, it's not totally realistic, but then again, who's to say what romance would be like with a chitinous vigilante?

 

[Leonsito]

I finished Mass Effect last week and today Mass Effect 2 arrived from zavvi.

I have a finished campaign in ME with lvl 50, and started another one and now I'm lvl 51, just arrived at the citadel...

It's worth playing the entire game again to reach lvl 60 for importing the character in ME2?

I know that the Colossus armor and the HMWxx weapons doen't carry over, but aside from that, can anyone tell me what are the differences between importing a lvl 50 character and a lvl 60 in ME2 ?

 

[AAK]

EDIT: Nvm

 

[onken]

I'm sure this isn't the first person this happened to but I'm pretty pissed off

Spoiler

everyone else was fine but Mordin randomly died at the end

for no reason whatsoever. I basically had 100%ed the game, every submission, everyone was loyal, all personal upgrades, ship upgrades, the lot. What a crock.

 

[Wallach]

I finished Mass Effect last week and today Mass Effect 2 arrived from zavvi.

I have a finished campaign in ME with lvl 50, and started another one and now I'm lvl 51, just arrived at the citadel...

It's worth playing the entire game again to reach lvl 60 for importing the character in ME2?

I know that the Colossus armor and the HMWxx weapons doen't carry over, but aside from that, can anyone tell me what are the differences between importing a lvl 50 character and a lvl 60 in ME2 ?

Here's all the changes from the wiki page:

• A portion of the character's Paragon/Renegade points (up to 190 each, which requires the bar(s) to be 50% full[1]) are transferred over.

• Importing a level 1 through level 49 character will grant 1,000 XP (the player starts at level 2), 20,000 credits, and 2,500 of each resource.

• Importing a level 50 through level 59 character will grant 2,000 XP (the player starts at level 3), 30,000 credits, and 5,000 of each resource.

• Importing a level 60 character will grant 4,000 XP (the player starts at level 5), 50,000 credits, and 10,000 of each resource.

• Having the "Rich" achievement from Mass Effect will grant an additional 100,000 credits.

• The import bonuses will stack with the Mass Effect 2 completion starting bonuses (200,000 credits and 50,000 of each resource).

I wouldn't say it is worth leveling to 60 for that, no.

 

[Leonsito]

Here's all the changes from the wiki page:



I wouldn't say it is worth leveling to 60 for that, no.

So it's basically 2 more levels and a couple more credits... ok, not worth another 20hours in ME1.

I'm going for you ME2 !!

 

[Typographenia]

I'm sure this isn't the first person this happened to but I'm pretty pissed off

Spoiler

everyone else was fine but Mordin randomly died at the end

for no reason whatsoever. I basically had 100%ed the game, every submission, everyone was loyal, all personal upgrades, ship upgrades, the lot. What a crock.

Ending spoiler-

Spoiler

Easiest way to make sure he lives is to send him back to protect your crew after you rescue them.

 

[lucius]

I beat Mass Effect 2 360 multiple times got like 150 hours in it, but decided to double dip with the digital PS3 version. I was originally waiting for Live to get it On Demand since I would play multiple careers and didn't like swapping discs but they didn't get it. I actually think I like the lighting in the PS3 version a bit more you can see character details better the way it is lighted throughout the game, although at times it can look washed out, overall I think it is better. The gameplay runs slightly more stable on 360 at times but it is hard to notice, also like the 360 controller more for this game.

 

[onken]

Ending spoiler-

Spoiler

Easiest way to make sure he lives is to send him back to protect your crew after you rescue them.

OK I played it again did that and this time

Spoiler

Tali randomly died

Fuck this game.

 

[GSR]

Re: ending troubles:

Spoiler

You need to leave all your heavy hitters behind to hold the line if you want everyone to live. Take weaker characters (eg. Tali, Kasumi, Jack) with you to the final boss and they're guaranteed to survive.

 

[Woorloog]

OK I played it again did that and this time

Spoiler

Tali randomly died

Fuck this game.

Nobody ever

Spoiler

randomly dies. The system is perfectly consistent assuming you make correct choices, have loyalties (or not if you want some to die) etc.

Re: ending troubles:

Spoiler

You need to leave all your heavy hitters behind to hold the line if you want everyone to live. Take weaker characters (eg. Tali, Kasumi, Jack) with you to the final boss and they're guaranteed to survive.

Only some, not all.

EDIT here's the best guide for the final mission, spoilers of course: http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/5855452

 

[GSR]

Sorry, hyperbole on my part. What I meant to say is the more the better. You wouldn't want to do something like

Spoiler

take Garrus and Grunt to the final boss after sending Zaeed back with the survivors.

 

[Woorloog]

Sorry, hyperbole on my part. What I meant to say is the more the better. You wouldn't want to do something like

Spoiler

take Garrus and Grunt to the final boss after sending Zaeed back with the survivors.

Yup, that doesn't exactly work... The more the better

 

[Joe Molotov]

I got the best ending the first time without consulting a guide; I feel awesome.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I got the best ending the first time without consulting a guide; I feel awesome.

At this point I've got a scenario for everything. Ever person, every option. I'm the reason Bioware shouldn't have had so many characters in 2.

 

[Evolved1]

This game doesn't have enough animation variety. If feels incredibly static. Especially during combat.

Very limited. Consider Shepard's combat pose... weapon straight out, never fucking moves her arms. You can put the weapon away or sprint, and that gives you a posture change, but walking through hallway after hallway with the same boring posture... annoys me. And the cover system is the worst in the business. Clunky, lacks options for moving around, with just really poor animation. The crouched pose behind cover looks so bad, and the movement to pop out of cover and fire is lol-worthy.

Games like Gears and Uncharted, their cover systems and animation make this look amateurish.

Unless they actually put some work into ME3 there's no chance I'm buying it. Recycled gameplay three times in a row, is too much.

Just playing through the game today, trying to finish it up, and this is what I'm thinking the whole time...

 

[MaddenNFL64]

So all you thought about was the cover system. And running animations. This game has failed you completely then. Ya, it's best you never return.

 

[Evolved1]

So all you thought about was the cover system. And running animations. This game has failed you completely then. Ya, it's best you never return.

No... I've posted at length about the game. This was just something else I was thinking about while playing today.

 

[onken]

Nobody ever

Spoiler

randomly dies. The system is perfectly consistent assuming you make correct choices, have loyalties (or not if you want some to die) etc.

Only some, not all.

EDIT here's the best guide for the final mission, spoilers of course: http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/5855452

Ah ok, first time

Spoiler

I took Legion and Grunt with me, second time Garrus and Grunt. This time I'll leave the big guys back.

 

[MaddenNFL64]

No... I've posted at length about the game. This was just something else I was thinking about while playing today.

Oh. Carry on then.

edit: On the final mission, speed is an issue, along with

Spoiler

Mordin

being the squishiest person in the group. So send the weakest link (health wise) back home, and nuke the final boss.

 

[Typographenia]

Unless they actually put some work into ME3 there's no chance I'm buying it. Recycled gameplay three times in a row, is too much.

Gameplay has definitely changed, maybe not as wildly as you appear to want it to, but that's why most of us complain, haha.


Also, go look at some of the video for ME3 if you're worried about the animations. They still are recycling some things, but it's a major improvement over the ME2 animations.

 

[Evolved1]

Gameplay has definitely changed, maybe not as wildly as you appear to want it to, but that's why most of us complain, haha.


Also, go look at some of the video for ME3 if you're worried about the animations. They still are recycling some things, but it's a major improvement over the ME2 animations.

Thanks, I will... I was trying to push through and finish ME2 before seeing ME3 media.

I think I probably come off too negative, maybe... I loved ME1. And some things about ME2 are fantastic. I love the aesthetics, parts of the story, some of the characters. Just the gameplay didn't resonate with me like I thought it would.

I'm nearing the end though. And I'm curious how the story plays out.

 

[Typographenia]

I'm nearing the end though. And I'm curious how the story plays out.

Hehe... yeah...

It's got awkward, middle-child-of-a-trilogy syndrome. I hope.

 

[AAK]

Damn... this game is so addictive... I'm loving it. This is honestly the first RPG I've ever enjoyed this much.

Couple things:

-Planet Scanning for Resources is so fucking tedious... and there are 100's of planets :/
-Is it just my PS3 crapping out or is the sound always having an off sync delay during cutscenes where some action scene is taking place (gun shot/physical strike/etc)?
-Frame rate is also ass when rotating the camera
-I went with a female Shephard, am I missing out on anything really special that would have been unique with male Shephard?