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[Raonak]

I blame pokemon.

 

[BlackTron]

Yep, I remember when Dread released, the amount of people getting filtered by EMMIs were numerous and frequent.

Not on GAF of course though, we're all skilled gamers here.

I consider myself pretty decent at platformers and forget the EMMIs, the bosses kicked my ass! That game is not a joke

Edit: At least I didn't get stuck from the shootable wall though, that took seconds. I'm sorry...you know who you are

 

[KungFucius]

This is kind of pathetic whining. I am glad the game includes an easy mode. My 7 year old son can try this as his first RPG. I played it when I was a teenager and already beat several SNES/Genesis JRPGs. Why shouldn't a younger audience get to play this in a less serious fashion? Or even older gamers that just want to replay it for nostalgia. Games are supposed to be fun, if someone's idea of fun is no stress entertainment then why the fuck do you care? You can play on normal or go play the original.

And Nintendo is not easy. Mario wonder has some levels that are much more challenging than anything in the OG SMB.

 

[BlackTron]

This is kind of pathetic whining. I am glad the game includes an easy mode. My 7 year old son can try this as his first RPG. I played it when I was a teenager and already beat several SNES/Genesis JRPGs. Why shouldn't a younger audience get to play this in a less serious fashion? Or even older gamers that just want to replay it for nostalgia. Games are supposed to be fun, if someone's idea of fun is no stress entertainment then why the fuck do you care? You can play on normal or go play the original.

And Nintendo is not easy. Mario wonder has some levels that are much more challenging than anything in the OG SMB.

No problem with it including an easier mode. I do have a problem with there being no way to make the game at least as challenging as the SNES version, even on Normal. Which wasn't even hard anyway. And it's a trivial problem to solve for an RPG. It's not level design or anything, just stats.

 

[swaffles23]

Special World is tough though.

 

[_Ex_]

Super Mario Bros Wonder I had high hopes for, because they finally got out of the NEW series style, but I ended up finding it easier than the last NEW smb game.

You clearly didn't play Wonder's "Final-Final Test Badge Marathon" stage.

 

[Knightime_X]

It's an rpg.
Don't upgrade your gear, choose only the worse level-up bonuses
See how easy the game is for you then

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

You clearly didn't play Wonder's "Final-Final Test Badge Marathon" stage.

What's a couple hard stages compared to the entire game tho? Yes there are a couple difficult stages but by and large they trivialized the challenge.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

This is kind of pathetic whining. I am glad the game includes an easy mode. My 7 year old son can try this as his first RPG. I played it when I was a teenager and already beat several SNES/Genesis JRPGs. Why shouldn't a younger audience get to play this in a less serious fashion? Or even older gamers that just want to replay it for nostalgia. Games are supposed to be fun, if someone's idea of fun is no stress entertainment then why the fuck do you care? You can play on normal or go play the original.

And Nintendo is not easy. Mario wonder has some levels that are much more challenging than anything in the OG SMB.

Because they don't give us the OPTION for more difficulty and that's entirely unnecessary. They could've let us turn on timers. They could've let us turn off having a power up item on standby. You see how it goes both ways? You're post comes across as more of a knee jerk whining than any other in this thread.

Btw- kids can still play and succeed at platform games with challenge. How did we survive playing games while growing up in the 80's and 90's when every game was hard as hell?

 

[coffinbirth]

You're just flat out wrong on this one, sorry, but play SM3/smw, new sup mario u deluxe then Wonder. It's not just about level design, it's what they're adding and removing in terms of power ups, lack of timers, forgiving mechanics. For instance in Wonder you get to hold an extra power up at all times during the level! What is that if not one of the most rediculous challenge-killing mechanics ever? You get hit and turn into small mario? Just hold the a button to get a free power up! See? This is what I mean

That mechanic has been in since Super Mario World.

 

[Dorfdad]

Sounds awesome I can finally complete a game without having know ever trick in the game to beat a boss battle! You know clean old good fun! Not every game has to be a challenge to your manhood imho.

If today’s kids find gaming to easy hit the school books for a real challenge!

 

[deriks]

How many tries did you take on the very final level of Mario Odyssey?

 

[Bernardougf]

This is the first thread I've made in the 2 years I've been on Gaf because I'm so upset after learning that Nintendo has removed any and all difficulty in another game, Super Mario RPG. This is a game that I missed out on playing back in the day, so I was really looking forward to this "lovingly and faithfully created remake", only to read GameSpots review where the "con" of the game is "unbalanced new gameplay mechanics that remove ANY challenge".

I can't express how much of a shot to the gut this is to hear because this was a game known for having some difficulty with some of its encounters! Recently, I was really excited about Mario Wonder, but as I've been playing I've been extremely bummed about what "could have been" had Nintendo not nerfed just about every mechanic that used to make the average 2d Mario challenging.

Doesn't Nintendo have Kirby, Yoshi, Pokémon, and many other kid friendly, EASY games? That had to neuter Mario too? Seriously if you don't believe me just play Mario U Deluxe HD on Switch then play Wonder. The same thing happening to Mario RPG was what I was afraid of and here it is.

An argument can be made that Nintendo is making every one of their franchises incredibly easy now compared to how the average Nintendo game was in the past. Zelda might present a bit of challenge here and there but that's it.

A game having some sense of challenge is necessary to be a great game that has any lasting replay value. Nintendo absolutely used to understand this with games like Super Mario World, most Zelda's, Metroid etc. Part of the magic of Nintendo games was they were accessible while still offering a challenge for most players.

This sucks.

They didnt take away the difficult... you just grew up ... kids games are easier and therefore nintendo games seems easier to you... now go get that pokemon son

 

[Power Pro]

You clearly didn't play Wonder's "Final-Final Test Badge Marathon" stage.

I did, and if you thought that was hard, then...I can't help ya. You suck worse at games than I do.

 

[BlackTron]

They didnt take away the difficult... you just grew up ...

This is false. Before playing Wonder I played World and 3 all week. There isn't really even a comparison to be made.

What really happened is that past games had difficulty curves that ensured anyone could have fun in earlier areas, while preparing them for challenges in later areas. It was expected that you would get game over, turn off your system without being able to save, and do it all over again with repetition making you better and and more prepared for the later areas (finishing earlier areas with less deaths, saving up more lives for the trials ahead, etc). This is actually what made them fun, timeless games worth playing over and over again to this day. Playing 3 is like driving -it's a fun skill you can build up and keep doing forever for its own sake, not something to complete and move on from.

Present day Mario Wonder is afraid to do that. They want everyone to be able to beat the game, full-stop. It's full of design choices to ensure you can't get stuck and always have a way out, with most of the difficulty stacked post-game in the Special World. Regardless of preference, this is not the same thing as the old days. Many are apologetic due to the post-game content, but personally, I'd like an intelligently designed adventure that scales to the final boss, not a cakewalk with a romhack tacked on to the end as a consolation.

 

[calistan]

You clearly didn't play Wonder's "Final-Final Test Badge Marathon" stage.

How many tries did you take on the very final level of Mario Odyssey?

People always mention the one or two super hard challenges they put in these games, but I think that's missing the point. Designing a game with a well-judged difficulty curve is an art that Nintendo used to be incredibly good at, but they just don't do it anymore.

I suppose as long as enough hardcore fans are satisfied with sleepwalking through a game to get to the final small part that might actually test them, Nintendo has made the right decision in making games you can't really fail at.

 

[SteadyEvo]

Mario Wonder has challenge for this wanting it. I was stuck on a bonus level for 2 days. These are optional and not required to roll the credits.

 

[Evil Calvin]

Is Sony any better? I remember people complaining about Atreus not shutting his damn mouth and spoiling all the puzzles solutions…

Did they ever nerf that? I quit after that contant yapping.

 

[gaming_again]

Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze is brutal.

 

[ssringo]

If it was a completely brand new game I'd be on board with whatever difficulty the devs wanted to do. However a remake should be reasonably faithful to the original and any mechanics added should be cause for the game to be rebalanced around to maintain to the feel of the original.

 

[_Ex_]

I did, and if you thought that was hard, then...I can't help ya. You suck worse at games than I do.

I beat Armored Core 6 without any artificial aid, that was good enough for me this year.

If you want a hard platformer for Switch, give Giana Sisters: Twisted Dreams - Owltimate Edition a shot.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

That mechanic has been in since Super Mario World.

Umm ..no it has not. In nsmbu you could select which power up between stages ..but that's a one time use. In Mario Wonder you can ALWAYS hold a backup power up while playing the level. So you get hit ...use a power up ...then the next one you find gets stored. That's

This is false. Before playing Wonder I played World and 3 all week. There isn't really even a comparison to be made.

What really happened is that past games had difficulty curves that ensured anyone could have fun in earlier areas, while preparing them for challenges in later areas. It was expected that you would get game over, turn off your system without being able to save, and do it all over again with repetition making you better and and more prepared for the later areas (finishing earlier areas with less deaths, saving up more lives for the trials ahead, etc). This is actually what made them fun, timeless games worth playing over and over again to this day. Playing 3 is like driving -it's a fun skill you can build up and keep doing forever for its own sake, not something to complete and move on from.

Present day Mario Wonder is afraid to do that. They want everyone to be able to beat the game, full-stop. It's full of design choices to ensure you can't get stuck and always have a way out, with most of the difficulty stacked post-game in the Special World. Regardless of preference, this is not the same thing as the old days. Many are apologetic due to the post-game content, but personally, I'd like an intelligently designed adventure that scales to the final boss, not a cakewalk with a romhack tacked on to the end as a consolation.

This perfectly describes what I wanted to convey. It's truly sad that it's come to the situation we gave today. Mario Wonder will never be a timeless classic because of this.

What's so outrageous about Mario RPG is its supposed to be a super faithful remake ..except for 1 thing, making it far easier than the already easy original.

I wonder if half the people here are younger and have only ever really known games made so easy that they dont understand the difficulty curve that used to be present in games.

Either way, it would be fine of Nintendo's prerogative was to make their games easier but at least give people the OPTION to turn these assists off.

All I can think while playing Wonder is what a game this could've been without these forced qol assists built into every aspect of this game. Kills challenge and replay value.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

They didnt take away the difficult... you just grew up ... kids games are easier and therefore nintendo games seems easier to you... now go get that pokemon son

That's just not true. They took away the difficulty. You are 100% wrong. If you can't see the game design choices that are woven into Wonder I can't help you understand this.

 

[GigaBowser]

just dont not do nintendos kiddie crud games Fzero 99 TOTKS and metroids dread are someof the berst games ever

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

Mario Wonder has challenge for this wanting it. I was stuck on a bonus level for 2 days. These are optional and not required to roll the credits.

Speaking of that, how cool were those credits? Love it when they do that stuff, just like Bayonetta.

 

[DragonNCM]

Today kinds if are challenged in games they just quit & pick new game.....
I see from perspective of my kids.....they just youtube every game they play & solve all puzzles, navigation, challenges except Elden Ring
They cant beat that because they don't want to learn mechanic of the game...damn Baboons

 

[mariosbrother]

Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze is brutal.

... and so awesome. And that soundtrack... that's a constant destination on youtube. Wish they would release an official soundtrack.

 

[coffinbirth]

Umm ..no it has not. In nsmbu you could select which power up between stages ..but that's a one time use. In Mario Wonder you can ALWAYS hold a backup power up while playing the level. So you get hit ...use a power up ...then the next one you find gets stored. That's

This perfectly describes what I wanted to convey. It's truly sad that it's come to the situation we gave today. Mario Wonder will never be a timeless classic because of this.

What's so outrageous about Mario RPG is its supposed to be a super faithful remake ..except for 1 thing, making it far easier than the already easy original.

I wonder if half the people here are younger and have only ever really known games made so easy that they dont understand the difficulty curve that used to be present in games.

Either way, it would be fine of Nintendo's prerogative was to make their games easier but at least give people the OPTION to turn these assists off.

All I can think while playing Wonder is what a game this could've been without these forced qol assists built into every aspect of this game. Kills challenge and replay value.

Incorrect.

Does this ring any bells?
Also, I beat this game in a weekend when I was 10 years old, you might be wrong about more than you think...

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Incorrect.

Does this ring any bells?
Also, I beat this game in a weekend when I was 10 years old, you might be wrong about more than you think...

SMW is not nearly as hard as you might remember. You were young then so everything was harder. I don't even think SMW was any harder than Wonder, since you can ride Yoshi in SMW but not in Wonder.

There's plenty of old school "Nintendo Hard" games from the SNES era but the Mario games weren't on any of those lists.

Anyone who hasn't actually cleared all the Special World stages, including the Final Final Challenge, ain't got shit to say about the so-called lack of difficulty of Wonder. The general courses are not meant to be hard, that's literally why they gave you the Special World. It's for people looking for more of a challenge.

 

[coffinbirth]

SMW is not nearly as hard as you might remember. You were young then so everything was harder. I don't even think SMW was any harder than Wonder, since you can ride Yoshi in SMW but not in Wonder.

There's plenty of old school "Nintendo Hard" games from the SNES era but the Mario games weren't on any of those lists.

Anyone who hasn't actually cleared all the Special World stages, including the Final Final Challenge, ain't got shit to say about the so-called lack of difficulty of Wonder. The general courses are not meant to be hard, that's literally why they gave you the Special World. It's for people looking for more of a challenge.

I mean, I just said I beat it in a weekend when I was a child, lmao.
SMB3 is STILL a motherfucker though, even now with my grisled platforming prowess.

I think maybe you should be directing this at the guy I replied to...I have no qualms with Wonder, it's a great game!

 

[Barakov]

just dont not do nintendos kiddie crud games Fzero 99 TOTKS and metroids dread are someof the berst games ever

 

[rhodesianshepard]

I do think one of the reasons why 90's Nintendo games were so hard was to pad the length the game. Hard to justify paying 60$ for a game you can finish in a couple hours

 

[_Ex_]

by and large they trivialized the challenge

Nintendo has been trivializing Mario platformer challenge since the inception of this atrocity:

White Tanooki Mario

White Tanooki Mario is a white lucent version of Tanooki Mario that first appears in Super Mario 3D Land. Luigi's version is named White Kitsune Luigi. In both cases, the format grants the user permanent invincibility and can be obtained by using an Invincibility Leaf.

www.mariowiki.com

Though Wonder swapped that out for the Nabbit and Yoshi characters.

 

[Zapperman]

They aren’t

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

Bumping old threads. Low effort antagonism. Probably some old alt of someone bored and looking to stir up crap against Nintendo and their fans.

 

[Zapperman]

Bumping old threads. Low effort antagonism. Probably some old alt of someone bored and looking to stir up crap against Nintendo and their fans.

It isn’t antagonism. I’m just stating the obvious. Also I don’t hate Nintendo.

 

[Gambit2483]

They aren’t

Fire Emblem games on Hard/Traditional will test your mettle.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

It isn’t antagonism. I’m just stating the obvious. Also I don’t hate Nintendo.

Calling people names over nothing, bumping and dragging up old negative Nintendo threads from the deep. Seems like something a fake boy would do.

 

[Danjin44]

It isn’t antagonism. I’m just stating the obvious. Also I don’t hate Nintendo.

Are you sure? because its feels like you are actively trying to make Nintendo fans look bad.

 

[Kilau]

If you don't hate Nintendo, you should stop posting because you are killing them with cringe by proxy.

 

[Deerock71]

I don't get that question from my kids trying to ace the Splatoon campaign, and they beat Zelda without exploring EVERYTHING. It's masochist levels for those that want it.

 

[Sojiro]

Calling people names over nothing, bumping and dragging up old negative Nintendo threads from the deep. Seems like something a fake boy would do.

Yeah that was my first thought too. Fucking wild Saturday night lol.