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[User 250141]

Scott Walker, the real 2016 frontrunner: He could unite the whole GOP and unlike Chris Christie or Ted Cruz, Scott Walker can appeal to the entire party.

Yeah, I think Walker is the most likely nominee at this point (although I personally would still prefer Santorum or Huckabee).

 

[PhoenixDark]

Conservative Georgia Newspaper Praises Senate Dem Candidate Michelle Nunn

A conservative newspaper widely expected to endorse one of the Republicans running for Senate in Georgia has some kind words for Democratic Senate candidate Michelle Nunn.

A recent editorial by the Savannah Morning News's editorial page said "it's too bad the national Democratic Party doesn't field more candidates like Michelle Nunn."

The editorial went on to say that the fact that Nunn actually hasn't served in elected office before could serve as an asset.

"But at a time when the approval rating of Congress is a miniscule 9 percent, her lack of experience may not be a big negative. Instead, her background is rooted in the non-profit, volunteer sector." The Morning News editorial page described that as "a plus."

"President Obama may have been a 'community organizer' before Chicago’s Democratic political machinery transformed him into a big government senator from Illinois," the editorial continued. "By contract, Ms. Nunn appears to be cut from the JFK kind of Democratic cloth: Ask what you can do for your country, and your community, on your own time and your own dime. Compared to many others in her party in Congress, she’s a refreshing voice."

Nunn is widely seen as the likely Democratic nominee in the race for outgoing Sen. Saxby Chambliss's seat. Republicans running for the seat include Reps. Paul Broun, Jack Kingston and Phil Gingrey.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/conservative-georgia-newspaper-praises-michelle-nunn

 

[Karakand]

Rather than utilizing a barcode system, [Hobby Lobby] uses manual pricing for ordering of product and accounting.

------

What century is this company operating in?

 

[WayneMorse]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/conservative-georgia-newspaper-praises-michelle-nunn

Considering that all of the other candidates are psycho Tea Party congressman this seat is actually a good opportunity for a Dem pickup.

 

[RoninChaos]

I bet rosa parks was a republican just like lincoln, frederick douglass and mlk jr

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Is this fucking REAL?!

 

[Aaron Strife]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/conservative-georgia-newspaper-praises-michelle-nunn

But they didn't endorse Kay Hagan, so she's doomed.

 

[ivysaur12]

But they didn't endorse Kay Hagan, so she's doomed.

How does she even get out of bed in the morning?

 

[Link]

Rather than utilizing a barcode system, [Hobby Lobby] uses manual pricing for ordering of product and accounting.

------

What century is this company operating in?

The Time of The Lord.

 

[JesseEwiak]

Yeah, I think Walker is the most likely nominee at this point (although I personally would still prefer Santorum or Huckabee).

As a Democrat, I'd prefer Santorum too.

 

[B-Dubs]

Scott Walker, the real 2016 frontrunner: He could unite the whole GOP and unlike Chris Christie or Ted Cruz, Scott Walker can appeal to the entire party.

When is his reelection? Let's see if he can even survive that before everyone starts calling him the GOP's savior.

 

[empty vessel]

Cute. I've long suspected you take government to be a god, and this tends to confirm it.

Irony. The reason that corporations do not have protected rights is because they are governmental units, not citizens from whom government derives its power (in our legal tradition). The bestowal of rights onto corporations is equivalent to the government bestowing rights upon itself vis-a-vis the people from whom its power is allegedly derived. It's a power grab by government.

Anywho, I didn't come in here to argue, but to point to a resource that should be helpful for anyone wanting to understand the Hobby Lobby case. But, on the question of corporate rights, Volokh does say this (in the first post I linked to above):

I don't consider Eugene Volokh a persuasive legal authority.

 

[Oblivion]

Stupid Democrats owned again.

 

[The Librarian]

How does she even get out of bed in the morning?

If I can't get my traffic ticket dismissed, then and ONLY then will we know for sure if Kay Hagan is doomed.

 

[David Incorporated Esq.]

Scott Walker, the real 2016 frontrunner: He could unite the whole GOP and unlike Chris Christie or Ted Cruz, Scott Walker can appeal to the entire party.

But he has such a punchable face. How could someone with such a punchable face get elected?

 

[Oblivion]

Krugthug says the problems with healthghazi.gov are pretty much over:

In short, the crisis is over — for Obama and the Democrats. It’s just beginning for the Republicans, who won’t be able to let go of the notion that it’s a criminal scandal, and that mobs with pitchforks will march on the White House if only they can find the right words.

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/12/02/benghazification-begins/?smid=tw-share&_r=2

 

[PhoenixDark]

Krugthug says the problems with healthghazi.gov are pretty much over:



http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/12/02/benghazification-begins/?smid=tw-share&_r=2

Major problems remain
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/02/b...-gains-on-health-site.html?ref=politics&_r=1&

 

[Oblivion]

Major problems remain
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/02/b...-gains-on-health-site.html?ref=politics&_r=1&

He noted that, and doesn't seem to be very bothered by it.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Krugman isn't the person I'd go to over website issues

 

[Jooney]

I'm going to resurrect the Hobby Lobby discussion long enough to direct your attention to the following blog posts by Eugene Volokh:

The first outlines the several posts he'll be making regarding the case and the issues it raises.

The second summarizes the history and basic provisions of the Religious Freedom Restoration Act, the 1993 law that will be at the heart of the case.



Based on the first two posts, it seems that this series will be quite informative, so I thought you all might be interested.

Putting aside the discussion on whether corporations are entitled to first amendment religious protections, the Hobby Lobby case exemplifies once again why it's ludicrous to have health insurance pooled by employment. Why does an employer get to deny a prescribed, legal medical procedure or drug to an employee? Why does an employer get to know the medical history of their staff? Isn't there a right to privacy? We wouldn't be having this discussion if health insurance was another government program, or was left exclusively to the private individual market.

 

[WayneMorse]

Krugthug says the problems with healthghazi.gov are pretty much over:



http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/12/02/benghazification-begins/?smid=tw-share&_r=2

Next stop, the public option!

Didn't Hillary run on the public option back in '08?

 

[speculawyer]

Dems should view the Hobby Lobby as a godsend. If the GOP wants to stake their future on theocratic corporations having the right to deny birth control then let them take that position. They'll have as much success with that as Rick Santorum's presidential bid.

 

[KingK]

I was home over Thanksgiving and my mom has still been having trouble with the website. It shows her the available plans, but we can't see what the subsidies are. It won't let her make a new account either since she's already created one. The good news is that even without subsidy information, the plans available are significantly cheaper than what she's paying now for insurance.

My mom is like the definition of an American center swing voter; she voted for Bush twice, and voted for Obama twice (although I think the Tea Party and all the racism flung at Obama has made her become a bit more liberal over the last few years) and she was much more angry with the contractors who made the website than the law itself or the administration. More and more though, I see people (even people who vote Republican) saying "we might as well just have national health insurance. It'd be a lot simpler than all of this."

 

[empty vessel]

Next stop, the public option!

Didn't Hillary run on the public option back in '08?

No, that was Obama.

 

[Metaphoreus]

The reason that corporations do not have protected rights

Let me stop you right there. Corporations do have protected rights. You (and many others) may not think they should have protected rights, but it's undeniable that they do.

because they are governmental units, not citizens from whom government derives its power (in our legal tradition)

That corporations are not "citizens" is true. That they are "governmental units" is not. They are private associations in which the owners benefit from limited liability, which is a benefit bestowed by government. But corporations are no more "governmental units" because of that benefit than married couples are "governmental units" because of the benefits built into marriage.

I don't consider Eugene Volokh a persuasive legal authority.

I wasn't offering that paragraph as legal authority. Volokh was there giving a policy opinion, not a disquisition on law. My point, though nominally addressed to you, was actually directed at the more open-minded individuals perusing this thread (those for whom the correctness of their own opinions isn't something that "should be obvious"), to indicate that even the question of corporate rights is touched on in Volokh's posts.

 

[WayneMorse]

I was home over Thanksgiving and my mom has still been having trouble with the website. It shows her the available plans, but we can't see what the subsidies are. It won't let her make a new account either since she's already created one. The good news is that even without subsidy information, the plans available are significantly cheaper than what she's paying now for insurance.

My mom is like the definition of an American center swing voter; she voted for Bush twice, and voted for Obama twice (although I think the Tea Party and all the racism flung at Obama has made her become a bit more liberal over the last few years) and she was much more angry with the contractors who made the website than the law itself or the administration. More and more though, I see people (even people who vote Republican) saying "we might as well just have national health insurance. It'd be a lot simpler than all of this."

I don't know if I've said this before here but I had an ultra-conservative friend who went to Germany for about a month over the summer and when he came back he was absolutely in love with their healthcare system.

I told him it was basically single-payer, and he said that single-payer was alright, as long as they do it "like Germany does it" and not like Obamacare.

 

[WayneMorse]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=726583

And soon everyone will want to live in a social democratic society.

 

[Baraka in the White House]

Rather than utilizing a barcode system, [Hobby Lobby] uses manual pricing for ordering of product and accounting.

------

What century is this company operating in?

Dude. I went there with my wife and watched her go through the return process. It's fucking archaic. They have to whip out a small scanner to make copies of your receipts and shit.

 

[B-Dubs]

I don't know if I've said this before here but I had an ultra-conservative friend who went to Germany for about a month over the summer and when he came back he was absolutely in love with their healthcare system.

I told him it was basically single-payer, and he said that single-payer was alright, as long as they do it "like Germany does it" and not like Obamacare.

I can't say I'm very shocked. Who wants to deal with insurance companies? Most of the people saying how horrible single payer is have never experienced it or likely have never left the country. They are basically coming from a place of ignorance, which is not meant as an insult.

 

[Aylinato]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/conservative-georgia-newspaper-praises-michelle-nunn

They butchered JFK's civil service quote into a corporate pile of shit.

 

[empty vessel]

Let me stop you right there. Corporations do have protected rights. You (and many others) may not think they should have protected rights, but it's undeniable that they do.

That they do empirically is counterrevolutionary and in direct opposition to the most fundamental legal principles upon which the country was founded (that being popular sovereignty). The citizens of this country have never voted to ratify any amendment permitting the government to flip the script in this manner and claim divine rule over the people. So I think flatly rejecting the proposition that the government has rights against the people is perfectly acceptable.

That corporations are not "citizens" is true. That they are "governmental units" is not. They are private associations in which the owners benefit from limited liability, which is a benefit bestowed by government. But corporations are no more "governmental units" because of that benefit than married couples are "governmental units" because of the benefits built into marriage.

It's right in the name: corporation. A corporation is an entity distinct from citizens. It is the state--and only the state--that can create and empower this entity to exist and operate. It accomplishes this creation via the issuance of a charter and for the purpose of serving a public end. That it delegates its operation to individuals does not alter its character. Indeed, many of the original colonies and states were corporations charted by the English monarchy. As are most cities and municipalities today. These entities are created entirely the same way as business corporations are.

Marriage does not create a legal entity separate from the individuals within it.

I wasn't offering that paragraph as legal authority. Volokh was there giving a policy opinion, not a disquisition on law. My point, though nominally addressed to you, was actually directed at the more open-minded individuals perusing this thread (those for whom the correctness of their own opinions isn't something that "should be obvious"), to indicate that even the question of corporate rights is touched on in Volokh's posts.

And I am telling others that they should not rely on Volokh. He is part of the conservative rot that has taken over the legal profession in the last several decades. The same rot that has successfully sought and continues to seek to expand the power of government in its corporate form vis-a-vis the citizens.

 

[Piecake]

SNAP saved 5 million Americans from poverty in 2012- Congress wants to cut it by 5 billion

At the same time Congress allowed a recession-era boost of $5 billion to the federal food stamps program to expire in early November, the U.S. Census Bureau released new data that suggests more than 5 million people stayed out of poverty in 2012 because of the program. But that's not stopping Congress from considering deeper cuts to food stamps in the next farm bill, ranging from $4 billion in a Senate bill to $40 billion in a House version.

That's wrongheaded, says Timothy Smeeding, director of the Institute for Research on Poverty at the University of Wisconsin-Madison. "No other program for the nonelderly does such a great job preventing poverty or alleviating poverty's weight on those who remain poor," he says. Smeeding and many other antipoverty researchers decry the recent interest by Congress in cutting the food stamps program -- officially known as the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP). They say the cuts would hurt the poor while doing little to address concerns about the federal debt.

But conservatives argue that food stamps warrant a major overhaul, in part because they may create a dependency on government programs and reduce people's incentive to work. "If anything, the compromise SNAP reductions are far too modest," wrote Michael Tanner, a senior fellow at the Cato Institute, a libertarian think tank, in a blog post earlier this month. Tanner has called for a variety of reforms to SNAP, such as strengthening work requirements and eliminating broad-based categorical eligibility -- where people qualify for food stamps because they are eligible for another federal public assistance program.

Gotta love the reasons for conservatives wanting to cut the problem. Their whole dependency argument rests on ideology and 'common sense' instead of actual facts.

 

[Aylinato]

SNAP saved 5 million Americans from poverty in 2012- Congress wants to cut it by 5 million



Gotta love the reasons for conservatives wanting to cut the problem. Their whole dependency argument rests on ideology and 'common sense' instead of actual facts.

That's infuriating to say the least.
(not what you said but Congress dicking around with people's lives)

 

[Joe Molotov]

Do you know how many of these so-called poor people own refrigerators? The numbers might shock you.

Probably stocked with t-bone steaks and king crab legs, no less.

 

[WayneMorse]

SNAP saved 5 million Americans from poverty in 2012- Congress wants to cut it by 5 million



Gotta love the reasons for conservatives wanting to cut the problem. Their whole dependency argument rests on ideology and 'common sense' instead of actual facts.

Democrats fucking suck and the GOP have a brilliant strategy once again.

By the House passing the $40 billion in SNAP cuts they successfully pushed the negotiations hard right and turned the debate from arguing whether or not SNAP should be cut to how much they should cut it by. It's absolutely disgusting. Has anyone ever argued for expanding SNAP? It doesn't help that every white person in this country has some stupid racist anecdote about how they saw some black (they always say the person was black) girl use their iPhone while buying food at the supermarket.

 

[rocketknight]

Governor Scott Walker Tells Supporters To Forgo Buying Children Presents, Give Money To His Campaign Instead

http://thinkprogress.org.feedsporta...ott0Ewalker0Echristmas0Epresent0C/story01.htm

“Instead of electronics or toys that will undoubtedly be outdated, broken, or lost by the next Holiday Season, help give your children the gift of a Wisconsin that we can all be proud of,” the email read.

 

[platypotamus]

Governor Scott Walker Tells Supporters To Forgo Buying Children Presents, Give Money To His Campaign Instead

http://thinkprogress.org.feedsporta...ott0Ewalker0Echristmas0Epresent0C/story01.htm

This is the true War on Christmas

 

[WayneMorse]

When is his reelection? Let's see if he can even survive that before everyone starts calling him the GOP's savior.

I think PPP did a poll a while back of Wisconsin and found out that Walker was beating everyone with the exception of Russ Feingold in hypothetical matchups.

I'm still betting on Walker's re-election, and it seems like a lot of other people are betting on it too.

 

[B-Dubs]

I think PPP did a poll a while back of Wisconsin and found out that Walker was beating everyone with the exception of Russ Feingold in hypothetical matchups.

I'm still betting on Walker's re-election, and it seems like a lot of other people are betting on it too.

Well let's see how it's going once the campaign is underway. Once people actually start campaigning I think those numbers will change a little bit.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Governor Scott Walker Tells Supporters To Forgo Buying Children Presents, Give Money To His Campaign Instead

http://thinkprogress.org.feedsporta...ott0Ewalker0Echristmas0Epresent0C/story01.htm

Because its not kids who need gifts, it's Corporations and CEOs.


Had a conversation with my Dad. He's a democrat but still did the whole, bothsides are obstructionist and the government is more inefficient than the private sector ($900 dollar toilets!!!). The GOP has been brilliant at distracting and misdirecting from actual real problems and government success stories.
He still votes for Dems when it matters though

 

[User 250141]

When is his reelection? Let's see if he can even survive that before everyone starts calling him the GOP's savior.

2014.

But he already won a recall attempt against him; he'll be fine.

 

[B-Dubs]

2014.

But he already won a recall attempt against him; he'll be fine.

If I remember the recall was more about people looking at Dems like they were sore losers than anything else.

 

[demon]

2014.

But he already won a recall attempt against him; he'll be fine.

Against the same dude he beat the first time around, and as far as I remember by the same margin, in a recall election a lot of people didn't want. I just hope to god someone worthwhile runs against him next year and we can boot his ass. A Walker 2016 presidential run grosses me out.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Walker's favored right now because he's whipped the right-wingers in WI into a frenzy and the state is close enough where that's enough to win an election, or at least come close.

However Tommy Thompson vs. Tammy Baldwin seemed like the perfect storm for the GOP - popular moderate former gov vs. big city liberal (who is also gay) - and Baldwin won in a walk.

(Which might I add I predicted back in August 2012 when conventional wisdom was that Baldwin would lose hard and was constantly nagged about it.)

So who knows, Mary Burke is a self-funder and has a similar profile as Baldwin's and Walker's record has been pretty wretched. I think the recall was a misfire because it was clearly for political reasons, even though I supported it. We'll see how much the DGA wants to invest, especially when Florida, Maine, Michigan and Pennsylvania are far easier targets.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

For some reason I get this weird cult like vibe from some Walker supporters.

Its weird. I understand the love of people like Christie or Obama but Walker? It just seems weird

 

[B-Dubs]

For some reason I get this weird cult like vibe from some Walker supporters.

Its weird. I understand the love of people like Christie or Obama but Walker? It just seems weird

It's the same thing as in the primary, flavor of the month. It'll be someone else soon enough.

 

[Avon Barksdale]

It's the same thing as in the primary, flavor of the month. It'll be someone else soon enough.

It's like when Bachmann and Cain were the front-runners.

 

[WayneMorse]

Walker's actual record as governor is pointless, Mitt Romney was an awful governor (by 2006 he was one of the least popular governors in the country and would've lost in a landslide if he ran for re-election) and people still considered him qualified, they'll do the same for Walker, all he has to do is win re-election.

Walker does have skeletons in his closet though, like the reasons he dropped out of college 3 years in. Just like Christie's skeletons I don't know how it'll come out under the microscope.

When it comes to 2016 the GOP has a surprisingly weak field. There's Christie and Walker, who, like I said, have some bad shit in their past waiting to come out, the country isn't ready to elect another Bush, Cruz is an asshole, Rand is a dumbass and Rubio is clueless.

Anyone else I'm missing out, because from here they all suck.

 

[JesseEwiak]

If I remember the recall was more about people looking at Dems like they were sore losers than anything else.

Yup. The problem is that Wisconsin has become so polarized in the past four years that Walker has a floor of 47-48% that he'll get next year even if he kills a baby on live TV, because the exurbs of Milwaukee and the rural areas of the state like that he's sticking it ot the unions and the liberals.

It is interesting for all the puffing up of Walker by the national media to compare Wisconsin's job record since he took over with a Republican legislature and Minnesota's job record since Dayton took over with a Democratic legislature (spoiler alert - it's not good for Walker.)

For some reason I get this weird cult like vibe from some Walker supporters.

Its weird. I understand the love of people like Christie or Obama but Walker? It just seems weird

He went after those liberal lazy overpaid unelected bureaucrats that are destroying Wisconsin.

 

[B-Dubs]

Walker's actual record as governor is pointless, Mitt Romney was an awful governor (by 2006 he was one of the least popular governors in the country and would've lost in a landslide if he ran for re-election) and people still considered him qualified, they'll do the same for Walker, all he has to do is win re-election.

Walker does have skeletons in his closet though, like the reasons he dropped out of college 3 years in. Just like Christie's skeletons I don't know how it'll come out under the microscope.

When it comes to 2016 the GOP has a surprisingly weak field. There's Christie and Walker, who, like I said, have some bad shit in their past waiting to come out, the country isn't ready to elect another Bush, Cruz is an asshole, Rand is a dumbass and Rubio is clueless.

Anyone else I'm missing out, because from here they all suck.

You're about right. Right now the GOP has no one that could give any Dem contender a good fight.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

It's the same thing as in the primary, flavor of the month. It'll be someone else soon enough.

Nah, I mean his Wisconson backers. They see him as some amazing folk hero of the people BECAUSE he told took down Unions. They love him because instead of focusing on jobs he took down one of the bases of the middle class

You're about right. Right now the GOP has no one that could give any Dem contender a good fight.

Christie can and will even Walker can (I don't see any people coming out of Congress doing the same, too much baggage). Party fatigue will set in. Hilary has a tremendous advantage but she's gonna still need to earn it and present herself as something other than another 4 years of Obama.