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PoliGAF 2016 |OT| Ask us about our performance with Latinos in Nevada

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T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Gruco said:
But at the same time. Trump really enraged me with his behavior, on a completely personal level, which I'd never quite seen him do before. I think he took the talking over other too far. Came across as spoiled, entitled, and petulant all at once. Like, someone there needed to ask him whether he was a big boy or not, and give him a time out. I can't cheer for this nonsense anymore. The guy needs to loose asap. I don't want the democrats to run against him. Shit is too dangerous. And fuck everyone on that stage other than Bush for being too cowardly to go in on him.
Click to expand...

You know what?

I'm fine with that

Here's why: the moderator needed to do his goddamn job. Trump gets away with this shit because everyone is afraid of looking bad if they shut him down.
 
E

EatinOlives

Member
Makai said:
I like that the Trump supporters are finally coming out of the shadows.
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The GOP debate thread is a mess. Just constant shoe licking of Trump and pretending he's not a terrible candidate for no reason.

The amount of leniency he gets by some people is astounding.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
EatinOlives said:
The GOP debate thread is a mess. Just constant shoe licking of Trump and pretending he's not a terrible candidate for no reason.

The amount of leniency he gets by some people is astounding.
Click to expand...

It was bound to happen. He's going to bring together the standard republicans on the forum as well as the anti-establishment dudes. It'll be an interesting election, that's for damn sure.
 
D

Diablos

Member
EatinOlives said:
The GOP debate thread is a mess. Just constant shoe licking of Trump and pretending he's not a terrible candidate for no reason.

The amount of leniency he gets by some people is astounding.
Click to expand...
These people probably don't pay attention to politics normally. Trump has huge appeal to these kinds of people... which is scary
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
HylianTom said:
Watching Douthat witness and cope with what's been going on over the past year ("terms of surrender" on marriage equality, denial over Trump's potential, and now ramifications of Scalia's departure) has been pretty interesting.


In a limited sense, he's right. If Trump is nominated, it's a signal that the party base didn't really care too deeply about adhering to conservative principles. And if Scalia's replacement is a lefty, suddenly egregious conservative legislation, redistricting schemes, and a whole generation of close rulings all become less solidly-grounded.
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I mean, Scalia's last major comment was talking about how black people should go to slower schools so it's not like American conservatism is changing that much from Scalia to Trump. Trump is just ditching the pretense of respectability.

Who won the debate question asked with scientific polling:

Rubio 32%
Trump 24%
Kasich 19%
Cruz 12%
Carson 8%
Bush 5%
Click to expand...

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/poll-who-won-the-cbs-news-republican-debate-2016/

Looks like it went fine for Trump. Especially since Cruz was not praised.
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
How does bush keep getting 5% lol.

I think Rubio has a typical debate. Just no kamikaze Chris Christie to destroy him.
 
B

Bowdz

Member
Diablos said:
Rubio redeemed?
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Probably enough to stay alive with the donor class. Who knows when Bush will drop if he gets 5th in SC, but Kasich seems like he's in until Ohio and as long as there is at least one other establishment candidate, Rubio is still boned on support.
 
V

Veritigo_X

Member
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
Who won the debate question asked with scientific polling:
Click to expand...

Who won the debate asked without scientific polling:

Ryf1VH3.png


Courtesy of Drudge
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
I mean, Scalia's last major comment was talking about how black people should go to slower schools so it's not like American conservatism is changing that much from Scalia to Trump. Trump is just ditching the pretense of respectability.
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Trump is undoubtedly conservative on that kind of issue and others, but it's stunning how non-conservative he seems to be on other big-ticket issues, and how so many GOP voters are just overlooking or hand-waving these points away. If a Democrat were to say some of the things that Trump has said, we'd see the usual frothing at the mouth from the FreeRepublic crowd - but because it was Trump who said it, it's a-okay. We had a significant portion of the base convinced that they lost 2012 because Romney wasn't sufficiently conservative, and yet the party is going in this reeeeallly odd direction.

It's a really cool topic, and I hope Douthat fleshes it out more. This might be a party in an existential crisis.. not something we get to see very often.
 
M

Macho Madness

Member
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
It's odd how most Democrats are pretty willing to criticize Bill's record, but no Republicans other than Trump are willing to criticize W's.
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Because all of them except Trump have W's same basic principles. Especially on foreign policy. The definition of neocon did not change when W left office as one of the most unpopular presidents we've ever had. We thought it might change, but it did not. They're still reminiscing about Reagan and acting like W wasn't that bad.
 
P

Poodlestrike

Banned
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
It's odd how most Democrats are pretty willing to criticize Bill's record, but no Republicans other than Trump are willing to criticize W's.
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Because Clinton had some policies liberals aren't fond of, while all of W's were conservative approved; they just turned out disastrously. Criticizing W is criticizing the whole of conservatism.
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
I don't know if that's true. I think on foreign policy he must be unassailable to protect neocon ideology. On domestic policy, he seems to be fair game-- Katrina, immigration, etc. Iraq is the republican underbelly.
 
V

Veritigo_X

Member
Poodlestrike said:
Because Clinton had some policies liberals aren't fond of, while all of W's were conservative approved; they just turned out disastrously. Criticizing W is criticizing the whole of conservatism.
Click to expand...

Does anyone outside of the establishment think this though? Trump hasn't been shy about criticizing W throughout this whole primary. I don't think Trump supporters (and other anti-establishment types) think very highly of W and blame him for Obama.
 
M

Macho Madness

Member
An interesting statistic that doesn't really mean anything but whatever: The last time a new Republican president was elected and won the popular vote at the same time was in 1988.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
Makai said:
Cruz speaking in Spanish seemed like a tactical error to me. English-only movement is strong.
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Watching the clip, I think Rubio managed to do the impossible and irritate Cruz enough to break character. Look at Ted Cruz's double take and you can almost see the kayfabe drop.

Y2Kev said:
Trump. I can't say how this will affect Trump. In the past, the audience has clearly been against him and he's clearly been "attacked," but I feel like 9/11 is sort of sacred ground for Republicans. It's obviously a deep insecurity. The war in Iraq is another. It's very hard to comprehend how this could affect things. If Rubio wins South Carolina, Trump is back to in-major-trouble.
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It depends on your theory of Trump. I think the idea is that he's channeling the nearly revanchist anger of the poor American white person. As a candidate of pure anger, I think he gets latitude to direct it somewhat. It's clearly okay to be angry at politicians in general, even at Republicans. Being angry at W. doesn't seem like that much of a stretch. I mostly think he gets away with it, although it would've been safer to complain about the financial crisis.
 
D

Diablos

Member
Plinko said:
Come on.
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Bush and Kasich can't hold on forever. What other establishment candidate is left?

I'm not saying Rubio wins the long establishment game by being a genius, I'm saying he wins it by sucking the least. Team Rubio: "We suck less!"

It's gonna be Trump vs. Rubio before all the dust settles. They'll be the last two standing
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
I'm still mad that Ben Carson responded to: "Hey say something homophobic, you asshole." with "we shouldn't do free college because of the national debt keeping interest rates low" tsk tsk.
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Diablos said:
Bush and Kasich can't hold on forever. What other establishment candidate is left?

I'm not saying Rubio wins the long establishment game by being a genius, I'm saying he wins it by sucking the least. Team Rubio: "We suck less!"

It's gonna be Trump vs. Rubio before all the dust settles. They'll be the last two standing
Click to expand...

What happens to Cruz?
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Gruco said:
But at the same time. Trump really enraged me with his behavior, on a completely personal level, which I'd never quite seen him do before. I think he took the talking over other too far. Came across as spoiled, entitled, and petulant all at once. Like, someone there needed to ask him whether he was a big boy or not, and give him a time out. I can't cheer for this nonsense anymore. The guy needs to loose asap. I don't want the democrats to run against him. Shit is too dangerous. And fuck everyone on that stage other than Bush for being too cowardly to go in on him.
Click to expand...
If you are rooting for a Democrat in the office, you are hedging your bets. That's why you see tacit support for Trump to become the nominee because he's keeping far more dangerous candidates at bay. Trump has gone full nativist and is taking George Bush's presidency to the woodshed as well. There is simply no way he's going to be able to walk back the comments of Immigrants and Muslims in general. He has alienated lot of "traditional" Republican donor/establishment class with this rhetoric as it's opposite of what they want the party to be: Hide W under the rug and pretend they like Immigrants.
 
D

Diablos

Member
Y2Kev said:
What happens to Cruz?
Click to expand...
I think he's going to get hit really, really hard by both Trump and Rubio and flame out eventually. Case in point Rubio is already starting to follow Trump's lead there.

When it's just the three of them they'll have even more time to scream at each other. Not to mention Rubio will probably absorb most of whatever Bush and Kasich will have before they drop out.
 
G

gutter_trash

Banned
Bowdz said:
I hope Jeb never quits. Trump needs a punching bag to stay sharp.
Click to expand...

this, and those single digits would migrate to Rubio and we can't have that.

I hope that Jeb's bruised ego keeps him going until the end to not allow Rubio stealing it from the rightful Trump
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
I don't think most Americans want the muslin policy walked back. I don't think most Americans want Muslins in the country. Sorry, but that's what the ground zero mosque stuff taught me about OUR GREAT NATION.
 
D

Diablos

Member
Bush has to drop out at some point. He'd be doing more harm than good if he keeps going with such shitty support. He's smart enough to know that.
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
Ogrekiller said:
Trump hasn't even pulled the Katrina card yet. All he has to do is yell about how W was so concerned about Africans abroad and not the AAs at home and Trump will swing the momentum again.
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If I were Trump confronted with that issue, he could frame it as an issue of competence. It'd play into his overall (vague/bullshitty) message about hiring "the right people" and smart people for his administration.

===

And Robert Reich is claiming something on Facebook:
My mole in the White House tells me Obama will nominate 46-year-old Judge Sri Srinivasan, an Indian-American jurist who Obama nominated in 2013 to the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit -- and the Senate confirmed unanimously. Having confirmed him unanimously just three years ago, it would be difficult (but hardly impossible) for Republicans to oppose him now. (Twelve former Solicitors General, including Republican notables as Paul Clement and Kenneth Starr had endorsed his confirmation. Moreover, the D.C. Circuit has long been a Supreme Court farm team – Scalia himself, along with John Roberts, Clarence Thomas, and Ruth Bader Ginsburg were judges there before ascending to the Supreme Court.)

But is Srinivasan progressive? He had been Obama’s principal Deputy Solicitor General before the nomination, arguing Supreme Court cases in support of affirmative action and against Indiana’s restrictive voter ID law, for example. But this record doesn’t prove much. (Having once worked as an assistant Solicitor General, I know the inhabitants of that office will argue whatever halfway respectable arguments the Justice Department and, indirectly, the President, wants made.)

Before the Obama administration, Srinivasan worked for five years in George W. Bush’s Justice Department. Prior to that, as an attorney in the private firm of O'Melveny & Myers, he defended Exxon Mobil in a lawsuit brought by Indonesians who accused the company’s security forces of torture, murder, and other violations against their people; successfully represented a newspaper that fired its employees for unionizing; and defended Enron’s former CEO, Jeffrey Skilling, later convicted for financial fraud. But in these instances, too, it could be argued he was just representing clients. Another clue: After graduating Stanford Law School in 1995, Srinivasan clerked for two Republican-appointed jurists – Judge J. Harvie Wilkinson III, and Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Connor – both of whom were considered moderate.

Since he became a judge on the D.C. Circuit, he hasn’t tipped his hand. But I discovered one morsel of information that might interest you: In 2000, he worked on Al Gore’s legal team in the infamous Supreme Court case of “Bush v. Gore.”

My suspicion is Obama couldn't do better than Srinivasan. No other nominee with get a majority of Senate votes. What do you think?
Click to expand...
 
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