That's not what I'm talking about.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PoliGAF 2016 |OT| Ask us about our performance with Latinos in Nevada
- Thread starter Makai
- Start date
- Status
That's not what I'm talking about.
February surprise.
Hillary dun fucked up with that. They need to damage control that ASAP.
Serious question, what should she have done differently?
Don't defend that crap, the super predator was coded racist language, not to mention it's dehumanizing youth at risk.
Now I don't think Hillary Clinton is a racist, but that tough on crime bullshit the Clintons pushed was very much intended to appeal to voters who were concerned about damn savage dark kids coming to murder them.
Now personally I don't think that's a huge deal when deciding who to vote for this election, like, the Clinton are political opportunists, they always were, but while you can pass moral judgment on that the fact that the pendulum swung completely to the other side on this issue (especially with democrats) means that if elected, she is likely to be on the right side of this issue.
UltimaPooh
Member
I'll look into it.
I'm not really sure. And taking off my Hillary hat for a second, I'm trying to be fair here because I applauded when BLM did this to Bernie and Martin at Netroots.
Bad optics for Hillary either way, but the girl really harmed her point by not actually giving Hillary a chance to respond, especially when Hillary seemed ready to respond.
Those "Well, if you just let me talk" lines in that setting looked and sounded bad. Clinton did a good job trying to give her an answer, but there is enough there to make her look abrasive and petulant when the vid is cut up tomorrow morning for networks.
I think the best play on this is to let the girl have her say, defer to her (it is an intimate setting, you don't need to command the room the way you do during a debate), and when she's done, try to answer her question. If she keeps interrupting (like she did here), just let her have her say.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
Similarly, the use of the word "thug" in conservative media refers to law breakers of any race. Right?
The overall snippiness on Hillary's end wasn't great. And saying "Now back to the issues" at the end is inarguably terrible phrasing.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
I don't think Hillary did anything wrong in the video. Those types of interruptions, whether they're done by race activists or abortion activists, are meant to make the candidate look bad. You're not going to win. It's best to diffuse it and move on like nothing happened.
Obviously Hillary's record on the issue is bad. As others have said crime was high in the 90s and just as fear has lead to a demand for ridiculous action on ISIS today, similar fear led to ridiculous action on crime then. There was no sympathy for drug users either, as there is now that the abusers are white. The political climate demanded blood and they got it. Now the climate is different and Clinton has changed her position. But she's not the only one to do so.
Obviously Hillary's record on the issue is bad. As others have said crime was high in the 90s and just as fear has lead to a demand for ridiculous action on ISIS today, similar fear led to ridiculous action on crime then. There was no sympathy for drug users either, as there is now that the abusers are white. The political climate demanded blood and they got it. Now the climate is different and Clinton has changed her position. But she's not the only one to do so.
Nope. It was a terrible thing for her to say back then and it's frankly indefensible.
Hillary can also get a bit ugly when she gets heckled.
Man if I'm wrong on the Texas primaries it'll be by far my single biggest loss ever on PredictIt.
The early voting, the home field advantage, the three million volunteers all make me favor Cruz in an otherwise tie situation.
But the fact that it's an open primary, the fact that Cruz is tanking everywhere else and Trump is gaining momentum, gives me pause.
Don't let me down Ted.
The early voting, the home field advantage, the three million volunteers all make me favor Cruz in an otherwise tie situation.
But the fact that it's an open primary, the fact that Cruz is tanking everywhere else and Trump is gaining momentum, gives me pause.
Don't let me down Ted.
Yeah, the latter is right.
Abinash117
Member
So Donald Trump is going to bring something that many Black voters already remember from 20 years ago to destroy the reputation of a candidate that already has huge support among that group and has a history(good or bad) with that group, and is going to have he backing of Obama. Donald Trump the one that is also a Republican and outright says vaguely racist things, and Black voters is going to trust him, a person they don't like?
Some people come to the dumbest conclusions.
Some people come to the dumbest conclusions.
I don't know how I feel about that.
I grew up in a large black family in South Central Los Angeles. I was a kid, too young to participate in discussion but old enough to have a vague understanding of what was going on around me. I remember the 1992 LA Riots and where I was (hiding under the seats of a pickup truck with my cousins while my mom and aunts raided a grocery store, thinking the whole thing was fun until we noticed people breaking windows). I remember my grandmother screaming at my mother for having us out in the middle of that. The riots were only a few years before Clinton, and there was still residual fear from the riots mixed in with the general fear of gang violence at that time. I remember my family talking about it; I remember my all-black church talking about it. There was a lot of fear back then, and it wasn't just white people.
I have my issues with Hillary using that term superpredator. Watching the speech, you see she was speaking specifically about gang-violence, and not black men in general. But I do wish she hadn't used that word, which was problematic even then.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Closest to my view with a few caveats.
Even though the political climate demanded it, that did not make it right at the time. Additionally, the situation in the video could have been handled better.
Lastly, that comes really close to coded BS language that we should avoid.
As mentioned already, the narrative is switching to drug abuse treatment rather then incarceration, so with time this will become a non-issue simply because as policy changes show results, the changes will continue.
Are you talking about me? I'm not talking about some shit Hillary said, I'm talking about a time when Hispanics and blacks were at each other's throats. And I'm not predicting success for Trump, I'm pointing out the strategy that his team has been foreshadowing. He's going to blame black economic struggles on illegal immigration and promise to be the first President that will do something about it.
shinra-bansho
Member
That was handled rather poorly, overall. I don't entirely know how one would have handled it better I guess. I guess she could have just stood there and let the girl heckle her. At some point she was going to get ushered out though.
I'm kind of surprised people manage to get past her Secret Service detail. That didn't look like an open event.
I'm kind of surprised people manage to get past her Secret Service detail. That didn't look like an open event.
Come to think of it, she did get awfully close.
Abinash117
Member
No. I'm speaking generally here about Donald Trump and stuff that happened in the 90s with Trump trying to get the Black vote.
Black communities were certainly concerned, I'm not doubting that, but the tough on crime (and law and order campaigns in general) was originally an appeal to white people who were afraid of the racial unrest of the 60s and 70s (thanks Nixon) and Bill Clinton's co-opting and one-upping it was a part of his triangulation strategy.
So while Clinton didn't wasn't racist and didn't mean to directly appeal to racist, these polices and that rhetoric was meant to attract white voters (I don't think that was part of the black voter outreach in any shape or form).
And again, I don't really hold that against the Clintons any more than I hold them responsible for triangulation in general (and I do, a whole lot actually), but we really should not pretend that this wasn't a toxic language that led to terrible terrible policies.
aspiegamer
Member
There wasn't a notable Trump subreddit previously? That's sort of surprising given there's a sub for, well, everything.
Okay, there is a /r/trump but of only 2000 people. By comparison, my default go-to example for "there's seriously a sub for everything", /r/tsunderesharks, boasts 40k+.
Someone contact the chan admins and get them to start a /trump/ so we can corral as many people into as few of places as possible. Going to be a long year, kids.
At least get the quote right!
I agree with a lot of that. I just think looking at this situation as Hillary calling all black men superpredators is such a simplistic read and removes so much context that it becomes dishonest. There are things to criticize the Clintons about when it comes to the 90s that don't require this much spin.
Elaugaufein
Member
I can't believe we're talking about Cruz possibly losing Texas. What kind of world are we in?
And I can't believe that I actually want Rafael Eduardo Cruz to win anything but here we are.
Jack Remington
Banned
I'm not touching that market.
I choose to think of it this way: If Cruz wins, I'm happy because I make a bunch of money.
If Cruz loses, I'm happy because Cruz fucking lost to Donald Trump in his home state holy shit.
I win either way.
Chezzymann
Member
Probably people picking a random person lol
Probably the same people who buy his book(s?). The only strange thing to me is that I can't imagine Carson creating even a small cult of personality when his personality is so damn boring.
Officerrob
Banned
Yikes, that video was not good
Elaugaufein
Member
Is there a historical reason for Vermont being rural and extremely Liberal ? That's not exactly a normal combination (there a few areas like that in Australia basically old hippies and yuppies looking for a tree change but they aren't even large city sized).
RastaMentality
Banned
She came off as the shrill white teachers I had in middle school who used to talk down to the black kids. I felt like when she finally got protested it wouldn't go well, but the audience being all rich white old people hissing didn't help.
Probably the "I used to love watching him on the late night" crowd.
Xisiqomelir
Member
Cali is off the table, but Trump is a native son of NY who polls very strongly outside the Apple.
Jack Remington
Banned
Besides Barack Obama, what realistic Supreme Court nominee would inflict the most anguish on Republicans next year?
I'm thinking Hilldawg and Schumer (seriously, can a different guy be Majority Leader? Fuck Schumer) need to get a little sadistic. What McConnell and Grassley are doing cannot go unanswered. Immediately after Hillary is elected, it needs to be made loud and clear that retribution is coming.
And really, Schumer is a mistake. Find the most likable, charismatic Democratic senator and make that person the Majority Leader. Add some personality to the Democratic majority. Reid had the personality of a broken bagpipe, and McConnell looks like a fattened sea turtle with months to live. The people deserve a better class of majority leaders. And also, fuck Schumer.
I'm thinking Hilldawg and Schumer (seriously, can a different guy be Majority Leader? Fuck Schumer) need to get a little sadistic. What McConnell and Grassley are doing cannot go unanswered. Immediately after Hillary is elected, it needs to be made loud and clear that retribution is coming.
And really, Schumer is a mistake. Find the most likable, charismatic Democratic senator and make that person the Majority Leader. Add some personality to the Democratic majority. Reid had the personality of a broken bagpipe, and McConnell looks like a fattened sea turtle with months to live. The people deserve a better class of majority leaders. And also, fuck Schumer.
Hillary nominating Bill ought to do it
Best I can tell, a bunch of new yorkers did the same thing Bernie Sanders did in the 60s and migrated to Vermont to pursue some kind of hippie lifestyle. I'm not sure if this is also what happened to northeastern NY and Western MA; county level politics isn't as well documented as state level ones. My guess is, since those areas are naturally gorgeous (Berkshires in MA, Adirondacks in NY), that wealthy liberals from NYC started with summer homes and then later decided to just move there.
I love this Glenn Beck vs Breitbart civil war that's going on right now. Beck compared Trump supporters to Hitler's Brownshirts, so Breitbart posted this article about Beck lying about having a book that belonged to George Washington.
In response Beck compared Breitbart to Joseph Goebbels. Now Breitbart readers are trolling Glenn Beck's site and TheBlaze pretty heavily.
Proxy war between Trump and Cruz.
Trump is winning just like in real life.
In response Beck compared Breitbart to Joseph Goebbels. Now Breitbart readers are trolling Glenn Beck's site and TheBlaze pretty heavily.
Proxy war between Trump and Cruz.
Trump is winning just like in real life.
If I had to guess I'd say his remaining voter base looks a hell of a lot like the audience of a televangelist.
cartoon_soldier
Member
Saw the Hillary BLM video, I guess it doesn't look good but it's also obvious that the activists went there with a certain agenda in mind. Not letting her speak when she is trying to talk about Criminal Justice Reform, like now sure what they expect to happen.
Officerrob
Banned
The optics of that video are what look bad. Private event, rich white people, hissing, etc.
Jack Remington
Banned
I didn't have a problem with that video. When Clinton tries to respond, the activist talks over her by asking the same questions repeatedly. She wasn't interested in actually getting an answer.
cartoon_soldier
Member
She offered to discuss it later with them but they did not want to? Like what was their goal from this other than to have exactly this kind of video.
Elaugaufein
Member
This is their leverage against someone they were worried would make an Independent run ? I'm actually kind of impressed.
Black Republican
Member
that title change, whooooooooooooo did that
Officerrob
Banned
Oh I think the goal was to stand there, not let her talk, and get thrown out. With that said, it happening at an event full of hissing rich white people looks bad
Today's politico article on Sander's surprising surge on Super Tuesday plumbs some interesting depths. It highlights how he is ahead in Vermont and very close / tied in other states - and then goes on to say 'In all five states where he is poised to win...'.
Politico honestly was decent journalism back on 2008, but nowadays all it does is push memos and briefings from campaigns. It's pretty sad how rapidly the new became the old and tired.
Politico honestly was decent journalism back on 2008, but nowadays all it does is push memos and briefings from campaigns. It's pretty sad how rapidly the new became the old and tired.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked