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PoliGAF 2016 |OT8| No, Donald. You don't.

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M

Maledict

Member
Plinko said:
I can't believe Cruz thinks this will help him.

Big donors are going to remember this in 4 years.
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What big donors? Other than Sheldon Addelson, one of the big stories of the primary season and this election has been how unhappy the republican big donors are with TRUmp. Many aren't supporting him at all. I think Cruz gains more from them potentially in 2020 than he loses from the few who will be pissed off.
 
T

thebloo

Member
Diablos said:
I have a feeling Trump is going to make the speech of his life tonight.
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My God. Like, how? Logically, how would that play out in the real world?

On the other topic, I don't think this hurts Cruz at all. He played every card from the shitty hand he had perfectly. He was basically the anti-Bernie. I don't know if he can win 2020, but it won't be because he stuck it to Trump. 4 years from now, assuming he loses, Trump will be seen as a blemish and everyone that bowed to him can be attacked on it.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
Plinko said:
As already clarified, donors aren't the only problem. See above with FOX News, and I guarantee talk radio is blasting him for weeks. This won't be forgotten.
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Trump's biggest ally at Fox just lost his job. And if talk radio can forgive Chris Christie, which they did this year overall, they can certainly forgive Cruz.

Trump is going to lose this election, big. Those who supported him will look like fools who were suckered by a con man. Cruz will be able to say "I told you so," which is always a good place to be in politics. Meanwhile Ken Cuccinelli and other Cruz allies are pushing for 2020 primary changes concerning open/closed contests. I'd expect the next RNC chair to determine that closing more primaries is a good way to avoid a Trump-type redux. That will benefit Cruz.

Not saying he'll be the nom in 2020 or come close. But the people who matter in GOP politics are grassroots organizers, many of whom have Evangelical ties. A lot of those people thought Cruz was going to betray them last night. He didn't. I don't foresee a better candidate for them in 2020. The establishment seems to be ready to give their money to Tom Cotton and some others, but Cruz has the grassroots.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
Joe & Mika seem insistent that Trump was some 4th dimensional chess master over the Cruz debacle LOL

Cruz now trying to spin his speech last night - "I technically didn't say anything bad about Trump and won't in the future".

Cruz also saying Trump surrogates are basically admitting Trump is untrustworthy by booing his speech LOL
 
M

metalslimer

Member
Cruz is speaking to the Texas delegation. He said it's funny that the new York delegation immediately booed after he said vote your conscience.

Cruz won't admit he's voting for Trump lol
 
D

Dierce

Member
I definitely hope that Clinton picks Warren or Brown but the more I think about it Stavridis would be a smart move to virtually serve as a firewall against republican attacks. That is as long as he also supports liberal core values.
 
B

bangbang i'm a timpani

Banned
H

HylianTom

Banned
If Cruz keeps this whole disunity story as the dominant headline, I'm not sure I want any leaks from Team Clinton today. Let the GOP twist in the wind.
 
J

jon bones

hot hot hanuman-on-man action
Dierce said:
I definitely hope that Clinton picks Warren or Brown but the more I think about it Stavridis would be a smart move to virtually serve as a firewall against republican attacks. That is as long as he also supports liberal core values.
Click to expand...

his 2012 TED Talk sold me on his core values

i think he's a great pick
 
J

Joe Shlabotnik

Banned
I literally have no idea what Pence said in his speech last night. I have no inclination to actually watch the RNC so I'm just following it through the news and online etc. and I am not even 100% sure he spoke.
 
T

TheCrow

Member
Wait. Cruz is talking today? I need to watch this once I get to work. That quote about breaking the pledge due to insults to his family is a solid defense. I know it's a political play but it works.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
Plinko said:
He does, actually. He had a respectable 2nd place performance this time around and has a decent base of loyalists. He could have laid low and then came back in 2020 with the, "See, you should have supported me!" line. Now he irritated all big donors by not being united. EVERY single opponent will bring that up in the primaries next year. They'll make it look like he was out for himself instead of supporting the party.

I think it was a mistake.
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It depends very much on the manner of Trump's defeat (I'm not assuming a Trump defeat here - I won't assume anything any more, not after that Brexit vote - but if Trump wins then Cruz is toast anyway).

If Trump loses in a typically Republican way by basically following the demographics, then Cruz will have made a misjudgement.

But if Trump loses in a uniquely Trump way by alienating vaste swathes of the electorate and making loads of stupid bombastic baby errors, then Cruz is a visionary.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
metalslimer said:
Holy shit Cruz said that pledge went out the window when Trump attacked his wife and father

This whole thing is the ultimate payback.
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He comes out this looking like a fighter. Jeb Bush took his ball and ran home, Cruz walked into the lion's den. Little Marco and Paul Ryan cowered in front of a bigot.

This is going to come up again after the debates, where Trump will say anything to survive. Most of his interview gaffes are due to him taking the opposite position of his of previous one, just to shut up the interviewer. That's going to look really ugly in a debate where he is confronted with his previous comments on abortion for instance, and decides to take a middle-of-the-road position. Once again Cruz will look great.
 
B

Bowdz

Member
Dubbedinenglish said:
This is actually smart to get out there for an early press conference to get in front of the GOP/Trump attack machine.
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Dude just stole the rest of the day until Trump speaks. It's crazy how much letting Cruz speak fucked things up. It boggles my mind that they allowed him on stage at all.
 
K

Kid Heart

Member
Bowdz said:
Dude just stole the rest of the day until Trump speaks. It's crazy how much letting Cruz speak fucked things up. It boggles my mind that they allowed him on stage at all.
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I think Trump thought he could control Cruz's message by having Newt put that little spin on it during his speech. Needless to say its backfired tremendously.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
I don't get you guys arguing that this "makes Cruz looks great."

As if the establishment wasn't mad enough about Trump, now Cruz is making it even worse. These are the guys who can easily change the rules for next primary. He has turned his back on:

1) The establishment, who will be doing everything in their power to get back control for 2020
2) The current candidate
3) The talk radio goons, who have a ton of influence
4) The Fox News talking heads, who have the most influence on the base
5) Every person who voted for Trump and wants a united party

Who is left? The people who voted for him, who weren't anywhere near enough to get him the nomination?

So in 2019, the story is that he's going to come out and say, "I stood up against Trump?" What happens when everyone else replies, "Yeah, you further fractured our party, causing less voters to help us win the election?"

The entire primary will be based around how Cruz screwed over the party for his own personal gain and his obsession with how he thinks he's the next Reagan. The entire thing can be spun that Cruz doesn't care for the party or the country--he's too selfish. Sorry, I don't think that's good for him in the least.
 
D

Dubbedinenglish

Banned
Ignatz Mouse said:
They could have let him speak and not have it become a debacle. Like the plagiarism, the response is making it far worse.
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It was said here, if Trump's people organized the booing they made this blow up and turn it into a spectacle. If they let him speak, cheered and that's it this story would be a footnote.
 
N

nature boy

Member
Plinko said:
I don't get you guys arguing that this "makes Cruz looks great."

As if the establishment wasn't mad enough about Trump, now Cruz is making it even worse. These are the guys who can easily change the rules for next primary. He has turned his back on:

1) The establishment, who will be doing everything in their power to get back control for 2020
2) The current candidate
3) The talk radio goons, who have a ton of influence
4) The Fox News talking heads, who have the most influence on the base
5) Every person who voted for Trump and wants a united party

So in 2019, the story is that he's going to come out and say, "I stood up against Trump?" What happens when everyone else replies, "Yeah, you further fractured our party, causing less voters to help us win the election?"

The entire primary will be based around how Cruz screwed over the party for his own personal gain and his obsession with how he thinks he's the next Reagan. The entire thing can be spun that Cruz doesn't care for the party or the country--he's too selfish. Sorry, I don't think that's good for him in the least.
Click to expand...

Well from a democratic perspective this just shows how the GOP is divided - why would media outlets broadcast his speech if everyone is against him?

And what's the difference between Kasich and Cruz? Or Cruz and Bush? Or Cruz and Romney? That he's taking the piss on Trump's parade?
 
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