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[thepotatoman]

Poor turtle.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/27/...repeal.html?src=twr&smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur





He may get there, but he's not the master tactician he would want us to think he is.

The article doesn't seem to be about McConnells tactics to get the bill to pass, just about how terrible of a bill it is. They seem most worried their propaganda network can't deflect something that hurts a ton of their voters in a very real way while they have complete control. No amount of tactics can help with that.

 

[Sibylus]

WaPo (Made by History) - Why are Republicans trapped on health care? Because Democrats stole their best idea.

Last Thursday, Senate Republicans released the text of a bill to repeal the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (ACA) that had been drafted in secret by a select group of 13 (all-male) Republican senators. Mitch McConnell and his men pursued this strategy not just because the bill is likely to be unpopular — although it is — and not just because their majority is small and fractious — although, again, it is.

Instead, Republicans negotiated in secret because they are trapped by the history of the health-care policy debate over the last half-century. Barack Obama and Nancy Pelosi passed the ACA using conservatives’ best health-care idea — individual and employer mandates. Now Republicans are compelled to repeal the ACA even though they are stuck with inferior policy solutions.

I'm going to spend a lot of time in this section.

 

[Sianos]

https://mobile.twitter.com/bad_takes/status/879862242967203840

Brit Hume: "it's a kind of a form of virtue signaling, to be asking tough questions at a briefing"

I can't roll my eyes hard enough.

whining about virtue signalling in inexplicable situations is one of the purest examples of virtue signalling

 

[Box of Kittens]

Kirblar right yet again re: state GOP parties. On the federal level, Republicans have embraced extremity and obstruction - well, some of them - but at the state level, they have to be somewhat moderate to get elected in blue or blue-leaning states (e.g., Baker in MA, Martinez in NM, Sandoval in NV). They object to this far-right monstrosity because it'll kill their states.

Congressional Republicans basically just spend the last several years saying no. At the state level they have actually had to govern. Not to say they have necessarily done that well, but it is still a very different thing from what Congress has done, and it shows.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

The upcoming town halls

Spoiler

if any will be held

are gonna make Shether look like a wet noodle.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

WaPo (Made by History) - Why are Republicans trapped on health care? Because Democrats stole their best idea.



I'm going to spend a lot of time in this section.

Everyone hates the individual mandate and the main part of the GOP's bill is cutting Medicaid, not sure I get this argument.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Trump admin appears to be trying to buy off Collins/Murkowski - https://www.propublica.org/article/is-trump-administration-visa-push-way-to-win-health-care-votes

(This probably won't work very well)

This is the great negotiator?

 

[Autodidact]

The far-right, especially Breitbart, won't like his trying to admit more scary brown people only so he can persuade some senators.

 

[kirblar]

This is the great negotiator?

His negotiating strategy has been to make a deal then screw over the other party afterwards.

This is not a strategy that works well when repeated.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

His negotiating strategy has been to make a deal then screw over the other party afterwards.

This is not a strategy that works well when repeated.

He's so awful at this, it's hilarious

Trump is willing to trade slightly more immigrants to cut 22 million people's healthcare

This is a bad deal no matter what. It's a bad deal for Trump because his nationalist crazies will hate it. This is a bad deal for the Senators because it's a trivial thing to exchange for their political careers. And there's no guarantees Trump even keeps his word since nothing will be codified into law.

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

Watch Rand Paul make an ass out of himself: http://www.rawstory.com/2017/06/cnn...y-makes-the-case-for-nationalized-healthcare/

 

[Sibylus]

Everyone hates the individual mandate and the main part of the GOP's bill is cutting Medicaid, not sure I get this argument.

That they ceded the ideological mechanism that Dems later took up as the individual mandate, and now find themselves boxed into measurably worse policy for insisting on hardline opposition to everything they do. Quoted only the intro.

 

[Autodidact]

As I said in the health care thread, Murkowski and Collins should just crank that Jim Jeffords and go independent. Neither would be penalized by her constituents; in fact, those two might increase their popularity. Murkowski has pretty much hated her party since the 2010 elections, and Maine will accept any decision Collins makes. If they want to be "moderate" voices, they could prove it.

They probably balk at the idea of losing those committee chairmanships, though. Murkowski in particular wouldn't want to relinquish the chair of the energy committee.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

I just got through that NYT piece

This bill is in worse condition than we imagined. Lee's out there requesting stuff that literally cannot even be included. Governor's are revolting against the GOP. Everyone is furious at Trump. McConnell made massive misplays right off the back excluding even his own party from the bill.

What a mess.

Maybe there will be a push for McConnell to resign. He messed up big time.

 

[Aaron Strife]

As I said in the health care thread, Murkowski and Collins should just crank that Jim Jeffords and go independent. Neither would be penalized by her constituents; in fact, those two might increase their popularity. Murkowski has pretty much hated her party since the 2010 elections, and Maine will accept any decision Collins makes. If they want to be "moderate" voices, they could prove it.

They probably balk at the idea of losing those committee chairmanships, though. Murkowski in particular wouldn't want to relinquish the chair of the energy committee.

If Democrats had just won one more seat, I wouldn't put it past either of them. As it is... not likely, but maybe if we gain next year.

 

[Autodidact]

I just got through that NYT piece

This bill is in worse condition than we imagined. Lee's out there requesting stuff that literally cannot even be included. Governor's are revolting against the GOP. Everyone is furious at Trump. McConnell made massive misplays right off the back excluding even his own party from the bill.

What a mess.

Maybe there will be a push for McConnell to resign. He messed up big time.

Senate Majority Leader John Cornyn

They hate him more than McConnell. McCain and Murkowski in particular loathe him. He would surely inspire loyalty among the caucus.

 

[Isaac Otherworld]

So what was the bomb Benjamin Wittes was teasing last week?

 

[Autodidact]

So what was the bomb Benjamin Wittes was teasing last week?

Yet to explode. Be patient. The Manafort and Page stories might be preludes to the big action.

 

[whyamihere]

But how could he smile if he wasn't a political mastermind?

legit lol

 

[Aaron Strife]

I snorted... moderately.

Moderately and concernedly I'm sure.

 

[~Kinggi~]

So what was the bomb Benjamin Wittes was teasing last week?

Well he at least reliably does a BOOM after the ticks, so either the story got killed or it hasnt run yet.

 

[Plinko]

I just got through that NYT piece

This bill is in worse condition than we imagined. Lee's out there requesting stuff that literally cannot even be included. Governor's are revolting against the GOP. Everyone is furious at Trump. McConnell made massive misplays right off the back excluding even his own party from the bill.

What a mess.

Maybe there will be a push for McConnell to resign. He messed up big time.

This would be an amazing turn of events.

 

[Random Human]

Yet to explode. Be patient. The Manafort and Page stories might be preludes to the big action.

I'm wondering if one of them flipped. It's weird they're back in the news all of a sudden.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

Is Heller speaking somewhere? Ralston is tweeting some of his comments and he's going to town on this bill.

 

[Autodidact]

Is Heller speaking somewhere? Ralston is tweeting some of his comments and he's going to town on this bill.

Ralston covers Nevada, so maybe Heller has decided to show his face there.

Also permanent "LOL Kentucky" if the caucus deposes McConnell.

 

[Blader]

I don't think hindsight matters. It was an unforgivably bad decision to not take action for this reason.

In situations like this, they have to get it right. He made a poor judgement call and we are up shit creek because of it.

I don't even know what this means. No response Obama gave, publicly or covertly, was going to retroactively change that Russian hackers had stolen DNC/Clinton emails and were leaking them via Wikileaks. Hell, Wikileaks started dropping the Podesta emails after the government announced that Russia was interfering in the election.

So when you say we're up shit creek because of an unforgivably bad decision and poor judgment call on Obama's part, I can't understand how you're drawing that correlation. You can argue that Obama did not punish Russia enough for their breach, but we were up shit's creek the moment the DNC and Podesta email accounts were compromised.

 

[Fenderputty]

Everyone hates the individual mandate and the main part of the GOP's bill is cutting Medicaid, not sure I get this argument.

Would everyone still hate the mandate if the republicans took coownership of the ACA and weren't blasting it for 7 + years?

 

[Mizerman]

He gained that reputation by saying no to everything for eight years. Senate Majority Leader Ron Paul would have been no different.

I see what you did there.

But how could he smile if he wasn't a political mastermind?

*Snerk*

 

[whyamihere]

lololololol HE DIDN'T EVEN WIN THE POPULAR VOTE HERE

@FoxNews
.@EboniKWilliams on "America First": "I'm OK with a president who's not winning the popular vote across the globe." #FoxNewsSpecialists

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Would everyone still hate the mandate if the republicans took coownership of the ACA and weren't blasting it for 7 + years?

My dad is a hardcore Democrat and hates the mandate. It's not just Republicans

Probably because he actually had to pay it once, and it annoyed him a lot

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

I just got through that NYT piece

This bill is in worse condition than we imagined. Lee's out there requesting stuff that literally cannot even be included. Governor's are revolting against the GOP. Everyone is furious at Trump. McConnell made massive misplays right off the back excluding even his own party from the bill.

What a mess.

Maybe there will be a push for McConnell to resign. He messed up big time.

Pelosi chuckled.

 

[Deleted member 1159]

Well he at least reliably does a BOOM after the ticks, so either the story got killed or it hasnt run yet.

Seems like he hedged on the timing after the initial tweet, but with some of the preemptive messaging going on with collusion supppsedly being ok or Obama's fault out of the admin and FNC, I think something big will drop by Friday

 

[Fenderputty]

My dad is a hardcore Democrat and hates the mandate. It's not just Republicans

Probably because he actually had to pay it once, and it annoyed him a lot

It would still have to be less and, overall opinion would be higher

 

[Ogodei]

Everyone hates the individual mandate and the main part of the GOP's bill is cutting Medicaid, not sure I get this argument.

Mostly because they can't go further right than the ACA without creating a monstrosity (both from a logical policy perspective and from a moral one). The Democrats basically boxed them out, thanks to Lieberman and the Blue Dogs.

 

[Loxley]

Can I please just vote for IronStache now?

 

[B-Dubs]

I just got through that NYT piece

This bill is in worse condition than we imagined. Lee's out there requesting stuff that literally cannot even be included. Governor's are revolting against the GOP. Everyone is furious at Trump. McConnell made massive misplays right off the back excluding even his own party from the bill.

What a mess.

Maybe there will be a push for McConnell to resign. He messed up big time.

It really goes to show how amazing Pelosi was getting the ACA passed with a public option.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Pelosi chuckled.

Pelosi indirectly may have possibly lost an election for someone, although it's not really known if that was the main factor
"Off with her head!"

McConnell makes one of the largest political misplays a majority leader has made in modern history
*Dead silence*

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

From OT:

https://twitter.com/Lawrence/status/879873257251495938

Lawrence O'Donnell ✔ @Lawrence
How many votes did McConnell really have for his Obamacare repeal? Answer @TheLastWord 10pm. (Hint: single digit)

They only had 5 yeses.

 

[whyamihere]

hahahahahaha

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/27/us/health-care-bill-trump-pence.html

A senator who supports the bill left the meeting at the White House with a sense that the president did not have a grasp of some basic elements of the Senate plan — and seemed especially confused when a moderate Republican complained that opponents of the bill would cast it as a massive tax break for the wealthy, according to an aide who received a detailed readout of the exchange.

Mr. Trump said he planned to tackle tax reform later, ignoring the repeal’s tax implications, the staff member added.

After the meeting, Mr. Trump played the role of cheerleader on Twitter, encouraging his weary Republican allies to keep working.

“I just finished a great meeting with the Republican Senators concerning HealthCare,” he wrote. “They really want to get it right, unlike OCare!”

 

[balladofwindfishes]

From OT:

And one of those was himself lol

 

[Mizerman]

From OT:

...Impressive.

 

[Suikoguy]

lol, less people than the number who secretly wrote it.

I wonder how accurate that is.

 

[Sibylus]

From OT:

Dun Dihl

 

[Autodidact]

ladywithmathematicalequations.gif

How can only five have supported it when thirteen wrote it? Were they trying to sabotage it because they knew it would be suicide?

 

[Tamanon]

hahahahahaha

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/27/us/health-care-bill-trump-pence.html

I mean, does anybody expect him to actually know anything about the bill?

 

[Plinko]

From OT:

LOL that cannot be true.

hahahahahaha

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/27/us/health-care-bill-trump-pence.html

Not surprised in the least.

 

[skullmuffins]

hahahahahaha

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/27/us/health-care-bill-trump-pence.html

He really shouldn't be president.

The public option as a backdoor to single payer strategy seems like it could work. I just read this article https://www.vox.com/2016/2/3/10899790/single-payer-americare and it seems reasonable & way easier than pushing for single payer outright. A key point is if you let employers buy into the government plan like they do with private insurance, they'll voluntarily switch over to it if it's cheaper (as the gov't plan should be).

 

[Autodidact]

He really shouldn't be president.

The public option as a backdoor to single payer strategy seems like it could work. I just read this article https://www.vox.com/2016/2/3/10899790/single-payer-americare and it seems reasonable & way easier than pushing for single payer outright.

Now if we could only explain as much to the people who want single payer and WANT IT NOW.

 

[B-Dubs]

Now if we could only explain as much to the people who want single payer and WANT IT NOW.

It seems like someone finally explained the plan to Bernie so he should be able to help with that.

 

[Suikoguy]

He really shouldn't be president.

The public option as a backdoor to single payer strategy seems like it could work. I just read this article https://www.vox.com/2016/2/3/10899790/single-payer-americare and it seems reasonable & way easier than pushing for single payer outright.

The main advantage is it's far easier to economically transition and prove to naysayers that it would work.

ladywithmathematicalequations.gif

Bwhahah, that's funnier than the gif.