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PoliGAF 2017 |OT6| Made this thread during Harvey because the ratings would be higher

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K

kirblar

Member
Fragamemnon said:
the panhandle, like the rest of the deep south, lost its mind in the 1994 midterm realignment election. So then you had the GOP in the panhandle + GOP in South Florida and the affluent-and aging-burbs. It's a tough nut to crack.

Also the GOP is exceptionally well organized in Florida, and the state Dem party has been a basket case for nearly two decades.
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Florida's problem is that the people who move there are super f'ing old relative to other places w/ massive population influxes (VA, TX, CA, etc.)
 
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Barzul

Member
Mark Andrew said:
GOP tax plan doesn’t seem too horrible to be honest. Finding a few trillion in offsets will be interesting to say the least.
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Yeah I went through it and it really isn't awful. I'm just not seeing how it's deficit neutral. But if they can repatriate a lot of that offshore money, would be pretty significant.
 
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cartoon_soldier

Member
I see that GOP is already winning by releasing a vague tax plan proposal that everybody seems to like.

G1M8Vd4.png
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balladofwindfishes

Member
Their high level "this is what we want to do" for bills never sound all that terrible. When they actually write out a bill and the specifics come out, the opinion will turn, as it usually does.
 
R

Ryuuroden

Member
Mark Andrew said:
GOP tax plan doesn’t seem too horrible to be honest. Finding a few trillion in offsets will be interesting to say the least.
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Its not terrible really is pretty true. I don't even take issue with lowering the corporate rate if they can permanently close the tax havens loopholes that countries like the Netherlands make use of. I do wish the highest percentile was at closer to 50% and that it progressive tiering on dividends as well. I think dividends should be progressively tiered at the same rates as regular income tax. I also think charitable deductions and mortgage deductions should not be allowed unless you allow it to be stacked on top of the standard deduction. In a perfect world though there should be no deductions allowed outside of child and standard due to the fact they almost always lead to tax loopholes that only the rich can take advantage of.
 
K

Kusagari

Member
This will be their new strategy. Release vague outlines of a plan that sound okay and then when they actually reveal the actual terrible bill, they'll point to the vague outline over and over instead of the real details.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Mark Andrew said:
GOP tax plan doesn’t seem too horrible to be honest. Finding a few trillion in offsets will be interesting to say the least.
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It’s freaking terrible.

Josh Barro said:
If you have children, your fate is uncertain. The plan would abolish the $4,050 personal exemption you get to take for each of your children. But it would also increase the Child Tax Credit - by an unspecified amount. Once that amount gets specified, you'll be able to figure out whether you face a tax increase or a tax cut or what.
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I mean, this has the potential to absolutely destroy my income. I have 4 kids and we rely heavily on our tax return.

Plus, I see no student loan deductions.

This is a blatant transfer of wealth to the rich.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Kusagari said:
This will be their new strategy. Release vague outlines of a plan that sound okay and then when they actually reveal the actual terrible bill, they'll point to the vague outline over and over instead of the real details.
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This isn't a new plan. They've always released outlines that don't quite sound as bad on the surface as the actual bill.

The outline for the ACA repeal "only" kicked 12 million off Medicaid, but provided them tax credits to buy insurance. The final House bill was over 20 million with no real replacement for those people.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
Barzul said:
Can you expound on this? Are the corporate loopholes still in place for example? I know it isn't deficit neutral for one.
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It's a bunch of "taxes will be cut and we'll pay for it by cutting tax breaks like... Uhhhhhhhhhhh... We'll get to that later. Maybe we'll tax middle class parents more?"
 
C

cartoon_soldier

Member
Barzul said:
Can you expound on this? Are the corporate loopholes still in place for example? I know it isn't deficit neutral for one.
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It has zero actual details.

It take away other deductions which standard deduction won't cover. Low earners will pay more tax on their first taxable income than under the 10% bracket.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
daedalius said:
No child exemptions or student loan writeoffs?

Fuck that, me and my wife would be screwed.
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They say the Child Tax Credit will be raised, but by how much?

The whole “Double standard deduction!” thing is a complete joke. Theyre using it as a selling point but nobody is going to care when their taxes raise because they got rid of every other credit/deduction. Make no mistake: “simplifying the tax code” has always been a guise for raising taxes on the poor and middle-class.
 
X

XMonkey

lacks enthusiasm.
lol at thinking any tax plan from the GOP is going to turn out alright for anyone but a) large corporations and b) wealthy people.

Wait for the details, not this non-specific bullshit they’re peddling.
 
Emerson

Emerson

May contain jokes =>
XMonkey said:
lol at thinking any tax plan from the GOP is going to turn out alright for anyone but a) large corporations and b) wealthy people.

Wait for the details, not this non-specific bullshit they're peddling.
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The Republican party has a pretty long history of giving the middle class a small tax break as cover for much larger tax cuts for the rich while further screwing the poor.

I would be very surprised if their tax plan actively raises taxes on the middle class. You can't sell that to the average Republican voter, and increases in taxes are one thing you can't just pretend didn't happen. People notice.
 
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Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Emerson said:
The Republican party has a pretty long history of giving the middle class a small tax break as cover for much larger tax cuts for the rich while further screwing the poor.

I would be very surprised if their tax plan actively raises taxes on the middle class. You can't sell that to the average Republican voter, and increases in taxes are one thing you can't just pretend didn't happen. People notice.
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As of now, unless they drastically increase the child tax credit, this is a sizeable increase on the middle-class. That’s why the whole “Double standard deduction” thing comes off as a huge lie.
 
O

Ogodei

Member
Plinko said:
As of now, unless they drastically increase the child tax credit, this is a sizeable increase on the middle-class. That’s why the whole “Double standard deduction” thing comes off as a huge lie.
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It would probably help me a bit, but i'm a young single, non homeowner, and i blessedly discharged my student debt earlier this year. But i'm a pretty small slice of things.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
House Freedom Caucus
House Freedom Caucus‏ @freedomcaucus

The Freedom Caucus has taken an official position in support of the GOP framework for #TaxReform. Statement coming..
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SHOCKING
 
N

nature boy

Member
Frank Thorp V‏Verified account @frankthorp 28m28 minutes ago
More
Corker says "tax reform takes intestinal fortitude," says "tax reform is going to make health care look like a piece of cake."
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#tiredofwinning
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Fuck the Sessions DoJ

The Justice Department’s latest wound was fully self-inflicted, as Tuesday’s arguments in Zarda v. Altitude Express should not have involved the DOJ in the first place. The case revolves around a question of statutory interpretation: whether Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 outlaws anti-gay workplace discrimination. Title VII bars employment discrimination “because of sex,” which many federal courts have interpreted to encompass sexual orientation discrimination. The 2nd Circuit is not yet one of them, and Chief Judge Robert Katzmann signaled recently that he would like to change that. So on Tuesday, all of the judges convened to consider joining the chorus of courts that believe Title VII already prohibits anti-gay discrimination in the workplace.
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http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...ture_just_got_shut_down_in_federal_court.html
 
C

Cybit

FGC Waterboy
The whole Trash Nate vs Good Nate and Gold Nate thing is what happens when you have mathematicians who see only the quantitative aspects and build a regression model without necessarily diving deep into the qualitative aspects of why the model behaves the way it does, and Silver having a better understanding of the qualitative aspects that influence the regression analysis itself.

AKA, Nate S did his research and assumed history was a better guide than straight math.
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
NeoXChaos said:
why is McDaniel challenging Wicker when he can just wait to see if Cochran retires? unless he thinks he can't win a R primary in an open race, beat Cochran again if he runs or Wicker is easier.
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Wicker is easier to beat as people think he's a bit slimier than you'd want, especially compared to Cochran's folksy thing. And McDaniel is a hardcore true believer, so he'll run for everything because he desperately wants to get more power to advance his agenda. The dude is the craziest republican I've ever seen.
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
Plinko said:
They say the Child Tax Credit will be raised, but by how much?

The whole “Double standard deduction!” thing is a complete joke. Theyre using it as a selling point but nobody is going to care when their taxes raise because they got rid of every other credit/deduction. Make no mistake: “simplifying the tax code” has always been a guise for raising taxes on the poor and middle-class.
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Honestly, simplifying the tax code needs to go away. Virtually every deduction you see has a legitimate reason for existing. People are just bitching about paperwork.
 
O

Ogodei

Member
balladofwindfishes said:
The party is so broken they don't even know how to do tax cuts anymore.
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Because they're aiming high for something they could stick permanently and have to abide by reconciliation rules to do it. I do think they'll end up doing something similar to reinstating the Bush cuts for another decade.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Cybit said:
The whole Trash Nate vs Good Nate and Gold Nate thing is what happens when you have mathematicians who see only the quantitative aspects and build a regression model without necessarily diving deep into the qualitative aspects of why the model behaves the way it does, and Silver having a better understanding of the qualitative aspects that influence the regression analysis itself.

AKA, Nate S did his research and assumed history was a better guide than straight math.
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It's due to Trash Mate ignoring his math in the primaries w Trump.
 
B

Blader

Member
Assuming the option becomes available, should Democrats pursue bipartisan tax reform with Trump and the GOP? Or does it play to their advantage to force Republicans to pursue a party-line vote on tax reform so they're forced to use the budget reconciliation for the next year? Rather than pursue a plan that would get 60 votes and let them reserve reconciliation for another go at healthcare in the next fiscal year.
 
C

chadskin

Member
@AP: BREAKING: Trump says he's `not happy' with Health and Human Services Secretary Price, is looking closely at his private plane use.

@AP: BREAKING: Trump says he'll work with Dems on health care and is considering order to let people buy insurance across state lines.
 
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