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PoliGAF 2017 |OT6| Made this thread during Harvey because the ratings would be higher

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K

kirblar

Member
whyamihere said:
It's a terrible strategy and no they don't. The Democratic base doesn't want politicians who work with Trump. The difference is that with Heidi is that her crossover voters are much higher than the Dems who don't want to see her vote with the GOP. This is Virginia!

I don't really want to argue this anymore, but it's a colossal fuck up and absolutely not what the Dem base wants at this point from their elected leaders. Don't give them reasons to stay home.
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You seem to be arguing for a permanent primary campaign all election long.
 
B

Blader

Member
I don't even know what constitutes the "Dem base" these days. Who are these people, what do they really want, and why are they so fragile? I feel like I am part of the base and yet I so rarely hear characterizations of it that make me think, oh yeah, these are my people.
 
D

DTC

Member
Sorry for not having any evidence, but I saw a few polls recently that a majority of Democrats would like Democrats to work with Trump on areas of agreement. That seems pretty reasonable to me! Remember Twitter isn't representative of the Democrat base. :p

Unfortunately, with how Trump has been governing, there have been very few areas of agreement. But if there are areas of agreement, I'd hope we could work together and make things better. Doubt this will happen though.

Northam's problem is more the fact that he talks like a block of wood. He's incredibly boring. Regardless, I think he will win by +6, and the house of delegates in Virginia has potential to be even more promising.
 
S

Schucky Ducky

Banned
DrForester said:
DLPKoHOX0AI-bRr.jpg
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What is this from?
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
Blader said:
I don't even know what constitutes the "Dem base" these days. Who are these people, what do they really want, and why are they so fragile? I feel like I am part of the base and yet I so rarely hear characterizations of it that make me think, oh yeah, these are my people.
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I don't think either my private political beliefs (whackjob technocracy) or my public voting habits (as a liberal Mississippian I vote for basically any Democrat) match with what people describe as the Dem base.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
I don’t think Northam saying he’ll work with Trump where he thinks he can is that bad. Plenty of Democrats, progressives, centrists, you name it have said that. Even kos was advocating for that on election night (granted, with demands he knew Trump would never meet - fixing the VRA and appointing Garland, but shit, I’d still take that). He blasts Gillespie a second later for not willing to stand up to Trump.

I think VA politicians are in a weird spot because it was pretty red right up until 2008, then poof, blue state. Most of the Dem politicians with any sort of credibility to make statewide runs were elected in years where their constituents loved Bush and just made exceptions to their straight-ticket voting for Northam, or Kaine or Warner. Perriello is the first prominent politician I recall to make a serious run who was outside that mold (swept in on an Obama wave, swept out on an Obama backlash) and his campaign greatly underperformed expectations.
 
D

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
This is a few days old, but doesn't seem to have been mentioned. Just what in the hell is going on?

The Weekly Standard: The Mother of All Fake News
How a windowless room in the basement of the Capitol was set up to look like a fake congressional hearing.
Watchers of Ukraine’s NewsOne television channel on September 25 were treated to what was suggested to be a congressional hearing in Washington about corruption in the National Bank of Ukraine (the NBU), which is the Ukrainian equivalent of the Federal Reserve Board.

The event, which took place in the basement of the U.S. Capitol, Room HC 8, was billed by the Ukrainian television channel as a meeting of the “US Congressional Committee on Financial Issues.”
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Except, what was broadcast was not a hearing of any committee of Congress. No current members of Congress were even there. What was this odd event? A private panel discussion hosted by former Rep. Connie Mack IV (R-FL), along with veteran political fundraiser and operative, Matt Keelen. But unlike an actual congressional hearing, this private event was open only to invited guests (including congressional staffers), two Ukrainian reporters (from NewsOne), and one American reporter (me).

Handed out to attendees was a report titled “HONTAREVA: Combatting Corruption in the National Bank of Ukraine.” The report’s subject is Valeriya Hontareva, who resigned as governor from the NBU in April in the wake of death threats after she reformed the Ukraine’s banking system, including nationalizing the largest bank, PrivatBank. Hontareva is an ally of Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko.
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Much of the event was spent criticizing Hontareva. Mack wore his old congressional pin on his lapel throughout. He opened by musing about his time on the House Foreign Affairs Committee. “It was always important for us as a committee and as a Congress to understand what’s happening around the world, and the topic of corruption would always come up,” he said.

Curiously, James Woolsey, the former Clinton Administration CIA director and former Trump campaign adviser, also attended and briefly spoke during the event.

Mack identified Woolsey as “a special guest with us today.” Woolsey got up from his seat in the sparse audience and recalled the time years ago when he helped negotiate a conventional arms treaty in Europe. He mentioned Ukraine in that context, but did not talk about corruption. Woolsey said in part that after the fall of the Berlin Wall, “For the next three to four years, the Russians were very easy to get along with. They were sweethearts.” The former CIA director went on to say, “I would love to see the international events work out in such a way that we end up being able to do two things. One, is to deal with the existence of corruption in the way that you referred to and that many people here are experts on. And the other is to keep Ukraine and other states in the region, such as Poland, from feeling that they are constantly under pressure from Russia to do the wrong thing. Resuscitate the days of friendly Russia in the early ‘90s.”
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A Senate aide with knowledge of the event said, “It was a strange, strange event. Even by Ukrainian standards, that was an odd one. . . . I mean, why would a former CIA director be in the basement of the Capitol for a inter-oligarch dispute? [Former] CIA directors don’t just go to events and say, how much we could get along with the Russians. They don’t do that without a reason.”
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The Daily Beast: Congressman Duped Into Holding Sham Hearing for Ukrainian TV
A former U.S. lawmaker appears to have duped a freshman congressman's office into organizing a sham “hearing” that aired on Ukrainian television on behalf of a shadowy lobbying client implicated in the Panama Papers leak, The Daily Beast has learned.

Former Rep. Connie Mack (R-FL) reached out to the office of Rep. Ron Estes (R-KS)—a freshman lawmaker who won the special election to replace CIA Director Mike Pompeo—to reserve a room in the basement of the Capitol for an event on the Ukrainian banking sector.
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During the event, Mack implied he is still a member of Congress—which likely bolstered NewsOne’s characterization of the event as a congressional hearing.

“One thing is clear: that we, the Congress of the United States—and there are taxpayer dollars at risk, and there are allegations, suggestions, and evidence—should investigate” the corruption allegations, Mack said at the conclusion of the event, according to an audio recording obtained by The Daily Beast.

Mack did not respond to requests for comment.

As The Daily Beast previously reported, he is also registered to lobby on behalf of Hungary’s Putin-allied ruling party, and the former congressman has played up praise for Trump by the country’s right-wing prime minister as a means of getting him in the president’s good graces.
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W

whyamihere

Banned
kirblar said:
You seem to be arguing for a permanent primary campaign all election long.
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I'm arguing for a campaign that doesn't allienate the voters you need the most. Especially since Northam is so fucking uninspiring. It's not like Obama where he could pull of bipartisanship because he was such a strong and alluring figure. Northam needs to give Dems a reason to go to the polls. Saying he'll work with Trump when you are a sweater vest is not the answer.

There are ways to talk to swing voters that don't alienate your base.
 
F

Fenderputty

Banned
When Schumer and Pelosi both dealt with Trump for the DACA / debt ceiling extension, did anyone besides the most ignorant far left of the party get upset? Hasn't Bernie said the same damn things regarding working with Trump?
 
W

whyamihere

Banned
Fenderputty said:
When Schumer and Pelosi both dealt with Trump for the DACA / debt ceiling extension, did anyone besides the most ignorant far left of the party care? Hasn't Bernie said the same damn things regarding working with Trump?
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They didn't make a TV ad about it in a contentious election they're already fucking up.

Like almost all Democratic voters want Trump impeached. Don't run on working with him!
 
K

kirblar

Member
whyamihere said:
I'm arguing for a campaign that doesn't allienate the voters you need the most. Especially since Northam is so fucking uninspiring. It's not like Obama where he could pull of bipartisanship because he was such a strong and alluring figure. Northam needs to give Dems a reason to go to the polls. Saying he'll work with Trump when you are a sweater vest is not the answer.

There are ways to talk to swing voters that don't alienate your base.
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Who the on earth are these hypothetical "dem base voters" living in a purple state trending blue that's been under GOP legislative control for decades who are going to be alienated by token "moderate darling" posturing in a general election campaign ad prior to a soft attack on Trump?

The Dem base is African Americans across the state, NoVA, Richmond, and parts of the Norfolk/Hampton Roads area:
343px-Virginia_Presidential_Election_Results_2016.svg.png

(Clinton/Trump map)
Click to expand...

Maybe you're not used to this, but we sure as hell are.
 
O

Ogodei

Member
Reading some of that, it seems like he's the district south of Pittsburgh, which is the heart of Coal Country in Western PA, and also huge into shale gas since that started being a thing. There are some Pittsburgh suburbs in there like Mt. Lebanon, but they're purple enough to make little difference to the rest of the district.

The only flippable PA districts are all in the east end, one D-held, a few others R-held. Why PA needs that gerrymandering ruling yesterday.
 
K

kirblar

Member
whyamihere said:
This has been circulating recently from a former Dem staffer who's fairly well regarded in VA circles and sort of echoes some things I've been hearing anecdotally.

https://medium.com/@brendanlilly/heads-up-an-impending-disaster-in-virginia-99a67afaa8a4
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It would help if you led with this instead of vague feelings of "we're going to lose" and "we picked the wrong guy"! Because otherwise we're left arguing with what essentially seem to be your random gut feelings!
 
H

Holmes

Member
I think the polling in the race allow it so that any narrative you want to push can be valid.

"Northam' only ever been up 4-6 points. He sucks!"

"Gillespie's been unable to move poll numbers for the past 4 months. He sucks!"
 
C

ChoklitReign

Member
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/scalise-las-vegas-shooting-fortified-second-amendment-position

House Majority Whip Steve Scalise (R-LA) said a shooting in Las Vegas that left 59 dead and hundreds injured, as well as his own shooting at a congressional baseball practice in June, has only “fortified” his position regarding the Second Amendment.

“Inevitably, questions about the Second Amendment are raised by what happened in Las Vegas,” Fox News’ Martha MacCallum asked Scalise. “Have you, your experience of your own, and what you saw in Las Vegas, has it changed how you feel about any of that?”

“I think it’s fortified it,” Scalise said. “Because first of all, you’ve got to recognize that when there’s a tragedy like this, the first thing we should be thinking about is praying for the people who were injured and doing whatever we can to help them, to help law enforcement. We shouldn’t first be thinking of promoting our political agenda.”

Scalise returned to Congress last week for the first time more than three months after he was shot in the hip at a Republican congressional baseball practice in June.
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The meaning of the 2nd Amendment to Republicans: the freedom to shoot people and legislators to do nothing but pray for the victims.
 
W

whyamihere

Banned
pigeon said:
What the fuck. Why is this "former Dem staffer" posting angry blog posts on Medium instead of GOING OUT AND CANVASSING? He lives in Virginia!
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His next Medium post was literally posting how to get involved with the Northam campaign and he posted it as a wake up call to complacent Dems in VA.
 
N

nature boy

Member
Jake Sherman‏Verified account @JakeSherman 6m6 minutes ago
More
SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico (AP) - Governor of Puerto Rico says official death count for Hurricane Maria has climbed to 34.
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"Only 16" nonsense unfortunately.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Without speaking to any of the things I can't really form an opinion on from the Medium article, the issues with the Hillary 2016 campaign dating to the McAulliffe campaign (which Mook ran) were really obvious to me following the election. Mook ran the McAulliffe campaign, and it's presumably where the "trade rural voters for Suburban ones" thing came from. This worked in Virginia, because we have a massive influx of people moving to NoVA and other blue areas from out of state - less than half of the people living here grew up here. (I'm not sure if I even count, I moved here in elementary school.)

And while the model works very well for states with a large population influx like VA, it was clearly disastrous in states in the Rust belt which are bleeding population. But this doesn't mean it's not still the model to use in VA - the basics of our state haven't changed at all, and its still the model to go w/ when trying to win statewide elections.
 
B

BoboBrazil

Member
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump

It is a "miracle" how fast the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police were able to find the demented shooter and stop him from even more killing!







Why is miracle in quotes?
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
BoboBrazil said:
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump

It is a "miracle" how fast the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police were able to find the demented shooter and stop him from even more killing!







Why is miracle in quotes?
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Because he doesn't know what it means. Like the restaurant near where I used to live that advertised, "We have the best 'pizza' in town!"
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Ted Lieu‏Verified account @tedlieu 1h1 hour ago

Ted Lieu Retweeted Brad Heath

Kushner's moving of email accounts to Trump Org may constitute Obstruction of Justice. Also, why does he still have a security clearance?
Click to expand...

Oops!
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Blader said:
I'm glad he didn't die, but...that's the only nice thing I have to say on that.
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If only a good guy with a gun was there to shoot the Las Vegas shooter.

With sniper like precision.

Towards his 32nd floor window.

While he was shooting a modified semi-automatic weapon.

And people were stampeding.
 
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