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PoliGAF 2017 |OT6| Made this thread during Harvey because the ratings would be higher

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L

Lord_Byron28

Member
The Technomancer said:
How did Bernie do in 2016 again? Oh wait that's right, Clinton "handed Trump the presidency" but Bernie "had his presidency cheated from him"

Why can't we fucking get over this. Bernie has some shitty sides to him and people call him out on those shitty sides or have valid reasons to be skeptical of him as a politician. Not everything has to be about this petty fucking feud that you honestly seem to be the one unable to let go of, since I don't think any of us introduced the topic of 2016 until you
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Lol. I see and hear more from Hil-gaf who's blood is still boiling over Sanders running in 2016. I see more people on this forum screaming to shut Bernie up and lock him in a closet.


This forum and community was obsessed with making fun of posts in Sanders Reddit subforum. They were constantly talking about a stupid comment from a Sanders fan. Instead of focusing on the candidate they attacked the fanbase which is the first thing that the extreme Hillary supporters did wrong. It's also rather obvious that a lot of those posts were from Russian fake accounts. I don't recall the Sanders fanbase engaging in such desperate, obsessive and unhealthy behavior. Again there were awful supporters on both sides and much like Hillary, Bernie was no angel either. Personally during the election I saw a lot of people in this thread more obsessed with Bernie Sanders than his own fans.

I voted for Hillary and would say I'm a supporter of hers but this forum was full of Hillary Extremists.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Bernie Sanders' wife is currently under investigation for fraud. I'm not sure he's really a good role model and he needs to go away.

He's a phony. Always has been, always will be. Fake, fake fake fake fake. Probably the worst possible person to be a liberal icon.
 
D

DTC

Member
I'm an 08 Hillary primary supporter and a 16 Hillary primary (and obviously general election) voter.

I don't think it's productive to put blame on Sanders on Hillary's loss. Sanders engaged a lot of youth in the political process and while many of these people were not fond of Hillary, a lot of people held their nose and voted for her anyways. It is very clear that the Sanders movement is very powerful and that democrats will need to make some concessions to them. We would be fools to keep on attacking them, even if some of them can be a bit ridiculous at times.

It's clear that income inequality, the relationship between money and politics, and the feeling that the system is rigged and stacked against people is a very powerful force in this emerging democrat party, and has a lot of appeal to even independents as well. We need candidates that people feel are fighting for them.

I have always been the believer to not blame anything but the candidates themselves. I dislike when people say the primary was rigged against Bernie, and I dislike when people say Hillary only lost because she was smeared. That's what's expected in politics -- you get smeared no matter how great you are. Hillary's campaign was incredibly out of touch and disappointed me at almost every step in the way. Many people never thought she cared about someone like them.

I don't regret supporting Hillary for 08 and voting for her in the 16 primary -- I think she would have been the more effective president that better dealt with the republican house in 2016, and that she would have better utilized a supermajority than Obama. But I realize it's time to move on from Hillary's politics. Bernie is also light on political details which personally annoyed me as I tend to prefer the more technocratic detail-oriented candidates. She should obviously be allowed to speak wherever she wants, but I realize that many people are justifiably annoyed at Hillary.

The bernie crowd is going to have a stronger argument in the 2020 primaries because our candidate did poorly with independents and lost a very winnable election. We need to encourage these people to join the political process and come together in unity in opposition to not just Trump, but the huge amount of politicians in the GOP who don't give a damn about anyone but their donors and would rather watch the world burn that enact policies that help people. We must unite everyone against the plutocrats in the top that are making it harder and harder for hard working Americans to get to a good standard of living, and we have to make the case for the democratic policies to as much people as possible.

I'm really really hoping we nominate someone like Sherrod Brown in 2020 who I think can appease both Bernie and Hillary supporters.
 
O

Ogodei

Member
I think the Sanders supporters are really just looking for a rallying figure. It wasn't the ideals of Sanders that were particularly appealing, just that he was good at selling his anti-establishment message.

The easy thing to look at would be the overlap between Sanders and Obama supporters in terms of young progressive activists, when Obama was cut from the same cloth as Clinton in terms of ideology (incrementalist, corporatist, progressive on social issues), but Obama was able to sell the centrist Dem message as "hope and change."

I do think the party should adopt more of Sanders' ideas because they were good ideas, but we need a candidate designed to speak to the future of the party, which is non-whites.
 
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Lucky Forward

Member
Because Mike Pence said so...

Michele Bachmann Offers Her Thoughts On Donald Trump Being A ‘Man Of Faith’

"We were in a meeting with the vice president and the president, about 25 of us. I know the vice president. I served with him in Congress, and he is a vocal, committed believer of Jesus Christ himself. And he said, ‘I want all of you to know that the president is a committed believer. He is a man of faith.’"
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Bachmann also said that Trump “understands who put him into the White House, and that is people of faith,” and that “he’s asked God for help and for wisdom” and wants prayer.

“He knows that he needs prayer,” she said. “We’ve been in the Oval Office with him. We asked him if he wants prayer and he said, ‘Sure.’ We put our hands around him respectfully and we prayed for him.”
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"Sure.........whatever."
 
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balladofwindfishes

Member
I think it's become pretty clear that a good number of Busters were Russian plants sowing unrest in liberals. I think Bernie could have done a better job diffusing tensions, but it's kind of hard for him to be entirely at fault when a hostile foreign country is the main culprit.
 
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Mark Andrew

Member
balladofwindfishes said:
I think it's become pretty clear that a good number of Busters were Russian plants sowing unrest in liberals. I think Bernie could have done a better job diffusing tensions, but it's kind of hard for him to be entirely at fault when a hostile foreign country is the main culprit.
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I certainly don’t blame him, and I think he has generally been a force for good in the party. And while I would have appreciated him working more to bring the party together, I think that has little to nothing to do with why we actually lost.
 
O

Ogodei

Member
Ithil said:
Evangelicals are some of the most gullible people alive. All you have to do is the most unenthusiastic, boilerplate lip service and they're proclaiming you a saint.
That's not counting the ones that are actively bullshit artists themselves, obviously.
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I don't think it's gullibility, i think it's them correctly identifying who their allies are and swallowing their pride and working with them to get what they want. One of the things the right does better than the left. They endorse the pussygrabber-in-chief who, by his own admission, has never asked God for forgiveness, and they get control of the Supreme Court through 2050, possibly.
 
H

Holmes

Member
Plinko said:
1. Mike Pence is a habitual liar.

2. Trump's response is hilarious. Saying "Sure" to a "Hey, do you need prayer?" does NOT make someone a "man of faith." My goodness, people.
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Watching evangelicals bend over backwards to try to make Trump out to be a "man of faith" really exposes the authenticity of their beliefs and morals.
 
D

dramatis

Member
Lord_Byron28 said:
Lol. I see and hear more from Hil-gaf who's blood is still boiling over Sanders running in 2016. I see more people on this forum screaming to shut Bernie up and lock him in a closet.

I voted for Hillary and would say I'm a supporter of hers but this forum was full of Hillary Extremists.
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How many "Hillary hate" threads have been made since the election compared to "Sanders hate" threads? It takes some willful blindness to say you see and hear more from "Hil-gaf" "screaming to shut Bernie up and lock him in a closet".

mlclmtckr was the one who hurled insults and used "Bernie bros", of course he as an ardent progressive man knows much more about what women think and feel than pigeon who asked his wife or me who is a female. Women can't possibly think or feel for themselves, and they certainly aren't allowed to have bitterness over the garbage that was slung after Sanders lost the primary, which mlclmtckr dodged having to answer for. They aren't allowed to snap back now because of unity under mlclmtckr's umbrella, but mlclmtckr's crowd was allowed to snap back after the primaries because "the primaries".

It's hypocrisy. Those who consider themselves "far left" can take the criticism and the hate just like the Hillary primary voters had to last year. The nature of human beings is that no one is perfect, so certainly Sanders is not perfect and requires no defensive cult.
 
T

tbm24

Member
Was saving my thoughts on the Clinton Book for a time where I thought it wouldn’t bring up some primary argument. Seeing that I’ll likely never get that chance. I liked it for what it’s worth, about as much as I think certain people can handle.
 
C

CrimzonSamurai

Member
There's a bar/brewery in Florida that's giving away free beer for every two tickets to a Richard Spencer event you bring them (the tickets are free). So basically they're guaranteeing two empty seats at the event per free beer.

That's pretty ingenious, and awesome.
 
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Aaron Strife

Banned
Between the potential of Senate and gubernatorial races in California not featuring any Republicans at all, and the bill requiring presidential candidates to disclose their tax returns before they can be included in the ballot, I don’t know if the Republican Party of California could even be considered a step above a third party.
 
D

Diablos

Member
I mean I'm 2500+ miles away so I don't really care who wins in Cali as long as it's a Democrat, but I think De Leon would be refreshing. Di-Fi is a legendary Senator, yes, but I don't think she made a good decision announcing a run for another term. The Democratic party needs to revitalize itself.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
BTW: CNU is going to be doing a weekly tracking poll of the Virginia gov race starting tonight at 11pm (EST I’m presuming). There will be three of these between now and the election.
 
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Tranqueris

Banned
Holmes said:
I'm with de Leon.
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I'm leaning this way too, also I'm not decided on Newsom for Governor yet, I didn't pay much attention to him when he was in San Francisco but he really seems like he's leaning hard on that "I'll say whatever you wanna hear" skill that politicians have.
 
D

Diablos

Member
I'm not crazy about Newsom for Gov, he just seems kind of phony to me the more attention that I pay to him. He'd be okay I guess, and honestly Brown is a tough act to follow no matter what.

Aaron Strife said:
Between the potential of Senate and gubernatorial races in California not featuring any Republicans at all, and the bill requiring presidential candidates to disclose their tax returns before they can be included in the ballot, I don't know if the Republican Party of California could even be considered a step above a third party.
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I just wonder if this will backfire. Say if Trump runs for re-election (assuming he doesn't resign or get removed from office), will a bunch of red states pass insane bills requiring Presidential candidates to disclose all kinds of silly things if they are to be on the ballot? You know you can just see Kobach and the Trump admin coordinating with all these states to enact what is essentially stealthy voter suppression masquerading as something else, and doing everything they can to hurt Democrats.
 
A

Autodidact

Banned
Newsom will win because no one can resist a handsome man with a firm jawline. Sex sells, especially for Democrats who need young, exciting candidates. Let's not act as though Obama's looks played no part in his success, for example
 
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IggyChooChoo

Member
Diablos said:
I'm not crazy about Newsom for Gov, he just seems kind of phony to me the more attention that I pay to him. He'd be okay I guess, and honestly Brown is a tough act to follow no matter what.


I just wonder if this will backfire. Say if Trump runs for re-election (assuming he doesn't resign or get removed from office), will a bunch of red states pass insane bills requiring Presidential candidates to disclose all kinds of silly things if they are to be on the ballot? You know you can just see Kobach and the Trump admin coordinating with all these states to enact what is essentially stealthy voter suppression masquerading as something else, and doing everything they can to hurt Democrats.
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What would be something that would hurt dem candidates but not GOP ones, though? I see what you mean but I can't come up with any good examples.
 
S

SatelliteOfLove

Member
Holmes said:
Watching evangelicals bend over backwards to try to make Trump out to be a "man of faith" really exposes the authenticity of their beliefs and morals.
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They, like most of the less Buckley-esque or moderate fringe of the GOP, are 100% for what someone is AGAINST rather than FOR. Fits with the sheer negativity that defines the Right as of now.

Or they're in deep "lying to self" mode as the wheels come off, one. I do stick by my prediction either the current American Right crumbles or America does though.
 
D

Diablos

Member
IggyChooChoo said:
What would be something that would hurt dem candidates but not GOP ones, though? I see what you mean but I can't come up with any good examples.
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I can't either, because knowing who the nominee is would be required to do that, but who knows... they could craft the law around anything remotely bad out there about the Democratic candidates and make sure it's passed in time for the general election. No idea how successful this would be, or if they'd even do it, but after 2016 you have to prepare for the possibility of the worst case scenario coming true.

B-Dubs said:
I'm sure they'll carve out an exemption for incumbents.
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This too.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Also I’m sure Democrats would be able to comply with whatever absurd requirements were made for ballot access. For all the allegations of scandal and corruption surrounding them, the Clintons were pretty much an open book.
 
D

Diablos

Member
Aaron Strife said:
Also I’m sure Democrats would be able to comply with whatever absurd requirements were made for ballot access. For all the allegations of scandal and corruption surrounding them, the Clintons were pretty much an open book.
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Agreed, but I think this should serve as a reminder that Dems need someone who is relentless, charismatic, and squeaky clean.
 
R

royalan

Member
Aaron Strife said:
Zuckerberg it is then
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Zuckerbeg is neither charismatic or squeaky clean.

And as more info comes out about Facebook and he continues to display how tone deaf he is, the more he becomes the symbol of the out-of-touch Silicon Valley technocratic elite that BOTH sides are starting to hate.
 
H

Holmes

Member
RastaMentality said:
Cute ad. The "poverty is poverty" regardless of race line bothered me but I realize it's something you can't verbalize into an ad. I think he has a fighting chance at beating Feinstein.
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Well, poverty is poverty regardless of race. But it affects people differently based on race.

But I agree, I think he actually can beat Feinstein in a Trump midterm. He doesn't have much room for error but the path is there.
 
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