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[Blackhead]

It's not the development of the atom bomb I take issue with, its possession, or even its use. My issue with Hiroshima and Nagasaki as targets is that the bomb was used to deliberately target civilians and do as much "psychological damage" as possible.

Wreaks of terrorism to me, only when the "good guys" do it, it's okay.

Now this is anti-government I heartily agree with.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Yeah...it was hard to watch and not feel for him. To be surrounded by such stupidity and to still desire their support must be very strange and humiliating....

I think honestly that footage showed he cannot support, internally, what his campaign is dishing out. It's probably why he's so angry and resentful. He's pissed that Obama's awesomeness has driven this beast with his name on it to do such dishonorable things. Absolutely he agreed to it, so I barely feel bad for the guy, but at this point I don't think he wants this shit being propagated any more than we do. But it's all spinning out of control. I don't think he has the power, even in his own campaign, to turn it around. He's been kicked out of the wheelhouse, so to speak.

 

[StoOgE]

Pat has been geting hit at both sides for his comments recently. I think hes just trying to describe the political side of the McCain attacks while everyone else is saying what its doing for this country. Regardless I think McCain's statements recently have shown that he does not run his campaign. The people who jumped off Bush have planted themselves on Palin.

I agree with this. The fundies are pinning their hopes on Palin in 2012.

 

[EviLore]

Ah, that's what you were getting at: the draft re: WW2.

In that case, no, absolutely not.

I said it above and I meant it. A just cause has no shortage of volunteers. A job that pays well has plenty of applicants. Between these two statements, a slave soldier should not be needed. If slave soldiers are needed, perhaps the merits of that cause require reexamining.

It's easy to hold the position that everything will always naturally work out as you predict , that a just cause ---> enough numbers so a draft isn't necessary, but your views on human nature may not necessarily correspond 100% with reality. If I say that the world falls to genocidal fascism if there isn't a draft, that a very just cause still does not provide enough manpower...then? Are you going to dismiss the scenario as impossible (it's not), are you going to let the world fall (your beliefs taking us all to our graves or worse), or are you going to...eventually, when clearly necessary and the alternative is so much worse for our freedoms...put it on the table?

Just curious as to how far you'd be willing to damage the world with your beliefs . I agree that drafts are in direct opposition to personal liberty, but I think there's such a thing as real necessity and setting aside how you think things *should* work when something to the contrary is already happening.

 

[Slurpy]

"Barack Obama's attacks on Americans who support John McCain reveal far more about him than they do about John McCain. It is clear that Barack Obama just doesn't understand regular people and the issues they care about. He dismisses hardworking middle class Americans as clinging to guns and religion, while at the same time attacking average Americans at McCain rallies who are angry at Washington, Wall Street and the status quo," reads a statement from spokesman Brian Rogers. "Even worse, he attacks anyone who dares to question his readiness to serve as their commander in chief in chief. Raising legitimate questions about record, character and judgment are a vital part of the Democratic process, and Barack Obama's effort to silence and shame those who seek answers should make everyone wonder exactly what he is hiding."

Jesus...reading this shit is equivalent to swimming in a stew of vomit.

 

[Keylime]

TPM has the McCain comments on their site.
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/

 

[BobTheFork]

I agree with this. The fundies are pinning their hopes on Palin in 2012.

That picture is basically Palin signing McCain's concession speech.

 

[JayDubya]

Are you going to dismiss the scenario as impossible (it's not), are you going to let the world fall (your beliefs taking us all to our graves or worse), or are you going to...eventually, when clearly necessary and the alternative is so much worse for our freedoms...put it on the table?

It never belongs on the table under any circumstances.

If, paradoxically, the cause is just and people will not serve it, then the consequences lie on those that refused to serve it and so be it.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I think honestly that footage showed he cannot support, internally, what his campaign is dishing out. It's probably why he's so angry and resentful. He's pissed that Obama's awesomeness has driven this beast with his name on it to do such dishonorable things. Absolutely he agreed to it, so I barely feel bad for the guy, but at this point I don't think he wants this shit being propagated any more than we do. But it's all spinning out of control. I don't think he has the power, even in his own campaign, to turn it around. He's been kicked out of the wheelhouse, so to speak.

Part of him may feel bad, but he's still doing it. At the end of the day he's in charge of his campaign, and I have no doubt that he's letting it happen because if he wins, it won't matter. That's the bottom line for him. I don't feel bad at all for the guy. He started this, and watching him wince because of the blowback doesn't generate sympathy.

I mean, just a few pages ago were reminders that his rhetoric was stoking the crowds to the point where violence is becoming a very real possibility. No amount of squirming gets McCain off the hook for that.

I'm mostly venting, rather than responding to your post, BTW.

 

[StopMakingSense]

I agree with this. The fundies are pinning their hopes on Palin in 2012.

Man, Obama v. Palin in 2012. That would be such a hilarious election. Too bad she'd be toast in the primaries.

 

[Zeliard]

Seeing the footage...man. My heart almost goes out to the guy. This is so clearly out of his hands.

Sarah Palin is the fuck who keeps saying inflammatory shit and riling the crowd up.

OBAMA LAUNCHED HIS POLITICAL CAREER IN THE LIVING ROOM OF A DOMESTIC TERRRIST!

McCain needs to tell her to shut the fuck up. She's literally doing everything in her power to destroy his campaign, from her moronic interviews to her constant tossing of red meat to a rabid, bigoted crowd.

 

[besada]

We are lucky, in a way that Japanese adherence to Bushido and other aspects of their philosophy, allowed them to accept a "beating" and move on.

I can't think of a Western country that would be so forgiving.

Ridiculous. We killed more Germans in Dresden than we did Japanese in Hiroshima, and unlike Hiroshima, Dresden was entirely non-military, and was filled with Allied POWs.

And yet Germany, with no Bushido code, seems to be doing okay dealing with the folks that wiped one of their most beautiful cities off the map.

 

[CharlieDigital]

Its a shame because I still think McCain would have been a good president in 2000.

I'm not going to say he would have been a good president, but he would have been better than W.

 

[reilo]

Anything on Troopergate?

 

[StoOgE]

Man, Obama v. Palin in 2012. That would be such a hilarious election. Too bad she'd be toast in the primaries.

Actually she might, I think the fundies have taken over that party and are very quickly driving the moderates from it.

 

[Cloudy]

Why feel sorry for him? His campaign didn't have to pull the crap they've tried to.

Seriously. If he had picked a legit VP and kept pounding the experience angle, they wouldn't be in desperation mode now..

 

[Fox318]

Man, Obama v. Palin in 2012. That would be such a hilarious election. Too bad she'd be toast in the primaries.

4 years is a long time. Besides Newt will probably run in 2012. Expect, Huckabee to be back and even Pataki and Romney. All you have to do is check for politicians who don't put years on their campaign signs. Edwards stored his signs and rally stuff and reused it in the 2008 election.

 

[BobTheFork]

Sarah Palin is the fuck who keeps saying inflammatory shit and riling the crowd up.

OBAMA LAUNCHED HIS POLITICAL CAREER IN THE LIVING ROOM OF A DOMESTIC TERRRIST!

McCain needs to tell her to shut the fuck up. She's literally doing everything in her power to destroy his campaign, from her moronic interviews to her constant tossing of red meat to a rabid, bigoted crowd.

McCain doesn't make those decisions anymore; she's become more important than him in the span on a month. She is better at rallying the crowd, and many people are only showing up to hear her speak at dual events. Most of McCain supporters are turning the page to Palin 2012. I think the same stupid logic that put her on the ticket will put her up front in 2012 'for the good of the party'

 

[perryfarrell]

Update from blog on release of Troopergate investigation report:

Kyle Hopkins is at the Legislative Council meeting with his iPhone. Come back for updates. We're posting updated stories on the homepage.

3 p.m.: So here's something to consider while we wait for the Legislative Council to vote -- and yes, we're still waiting:

The council needs eight votes to release the investigator's report. Three members of the 14-member council aren't here -- Rep. Ralph Samuels, Rep. John Harris and Sen. Gary Wilken.

Unless they called in after the meeting started, that means they're automatic "no votes."

So what's going on behind those doors? Do they have enough votes to make the report public?

Sen. John Cowdery isn't here, but phoned in.

Also: Someone is handing out granola bars to reporters. Everyone had a caffeine crash about an hour ago, but they opened a door to a soda machine and we all bought Diet Dr. Peppers.

 

[saelz8]

Indeed, he just snatched the microphone out the hands of a woman who began her question with, "I'm scared of Barack Obama... he's an Arab terrorist..."

"No, no ma'am," he interrupted. "He's a decent family man with whom I happen to have some disagreements." Source

Frankenstein successfully brings it to life only to be repulsed and terrified by its monstrous ugliness. He abandons and flees his creation, who disappears and soon embarks upon a journey of vengeance that results in the deaths of several of Frankenstein's family and friends. When the monster demands that Victor create a companion for him, Victor agrees, but upon considering it, he destroys the half-created monster.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

LBJ wouldn't have been bad if the Vietnam War never happened. The man should've been tried for treason for the BS Gulf of Tonkin Resolution.

 

[Fox318]

Seriously. If he had picked a legit VP and kept pounding the experience angle, they wouldn't be in desperation mode now..

He wanted to pick Liebermann. He just couldn't get his way with the party.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

i have to give it up for mccain for standing up to the crowd. props.

You know what? Fuck that. He's ultimately responsible for the tone of his campaign and the tone set at appearances. You're playing with fire by creating an environment that thrives on fear and anger as he, Palin, and his campaign have done for the last week. If you can't effectively control your tone at public events where thousands of people show up in support of your candidacy, then I shudder to think of how out of control things will become when you're responsible for setting the tone for the entire country as President with half of the country not favoring you.

 

[StoOgE]

Ridiculous. We killed more Germans in Dresden than we did Japanese in Hiroshima, and unlike Hiroshima, Dresden was entirely non-military, and was filled with Allied POWs.

And yet Germany, with no Bushido code, seems to be doing okay dealing with the folks that wiped one of their most beautiful cities off the map.

I'm not a pacifist at all, and believe WWII was completely necessary. That said, when I went to Dresden and saw some of the buildings they didn't rebuilt makes you really reconsider that stance. Two times I nearly cried on that trip, it wasnt as powerful as the concentration camp but it got to me.

 

[EviLore]

It never belongs on the table under any circumstances.

If, paradoxically, the cause is just and people will not serve it, then the consequences lie on those that refused to serve it and so be it.

k, the relatively free world ends because of stubborn short-sightedness option. Just wanted to be clear.

 

[StopMakingSense]

Actually she might, I think the fundies have taken over that party and are very quickly driving the moderates from it.

Not in an Iowa -> New Hampshire first primary schedule, I would hope.

 

[The Chosen One]

I knew TrooperGate was going to be a big letdown today.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Update from blog on release of Troopergate investigation report:

http://community.adn.com/adn/node/132527#none

Diet Dr. Pepper? Good stuff.

 

[Confidence Man]

http://www.thepresidentialcandidates.us/founder-of-readers-digest-pal-of-terrorists/913/

old? lulz mccain

So McCain accepts endorsement of a woman who funded a domestic terrorist? I hope we see this on Olbermann or something.

 

[kkaabboomm]

McCain just called on his supporters to be respectful at his town hall.

"We want to fight, and I want to fight, but we will be respectful," McCain said to boos at first. "I want everyone to be respectful," he then said and people began to clap.

In response to a later question he added, "You can be respectful and point out facts," as he called on his supporters to point out facts to their neighbors but be respectful.

*** UPDATE *** McCain just added, "He is a decent person and a person who you do not have to be scared as president of the United States."

After that, McCain said of himself that he just thinks he'd be a better President of the the United States." Some in the crowd booed his statement and shouted, "No!"

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/

maybe i'm quite late to the party on this development, but hey, at least he realized a narrative was developing and is trying to possibly do something about it, you know?

 

[ViperVisor]

4 years is a long time. Besides Newt will probably run in 2012. Expect, Huckabee to be back and even Pataki and Romney. All you have to do is check for politicians who don't put years on their campaign signs. Edwards stored his signs and rally stuff and reused it in the 2008 election.

Fat bastard Newtage, as I call him, will be 69yo and unless he starts walking the golf courses his slob ass waddles to and from the cart through the muppet motherfucker will be a few of cookie monster's chocolate chips from the grave.

That will get me through a few more of his almost daily FOX appearances.

 

[Fox318]

McCain doesn't make those decisions anymore; she's become more important than him in the span on a month. She is better at rallying the crowd, and many people are only showing up to hear her speak at dual events. Most of McCain supporters are turning the page to Palin 2012. I think the same stupid logic that put her on the ticket will put her up front in 2012 'for the good of the party'

Nobody thought that she would have had a future. If anything Jindal would have been pushed if that were true. I think McCain picked Palinfor two reasons

1. She would excite Hillary Clinton voters and McCain wasn't expecting Bush to do anything good in the coming months.

• McCain WANTED to bring the issue of experienced. He believed that save for LBJ nobody will vote for the VP. McCain leads in only one poll, experience. If McCain could make that the issue he believed he could win. McCain didn't see Palin getting big or the economy. Now if McCain were to win Palin would be the one calling the shots in the White house, she already stated she wants more power as a VP and the GOP sees here as a way to control two branches. She would become the next Dick Cheney.

 

[Cloudy]

i have to give it up for mccain for standing up to the crowd. props.

No props. They wouldn't have done this if the media didn't call them out...

 

[CharlieDigital]

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/

maybe i'm quite late to the party on this development, but hey, at least he realized a narrative was developing and is trying to possibly do something about it, you know?

At this point? It's just for show. I can't trust his sincerity one bit as he's been allowing his campaign to go forth with these tactics for the last week, week and a half.

 

[Saint Gregory]

McCain doesn't make those decisions anymore; she's become more important than him in the span on a month. She is better at rallying the crowd, and many people are only showing up to hear her speak at dual events. Most of McCain supporters are turning the page to Palin 2012. I think the same stupid logic that put her on the ticket will put her up front in 2012 'for the good of the party'

A lot of people thought this election would mean the end of the conservative movement of the Reagan era but I'm starting to think this might be the end of the Republican party as a whole. It's brand is so damaged now and if Palin is their future they really have no future.

 

[TDG]

I too give McCain props for taking the mic from the woman and saying those things about Obama. Likely just political, but I like to thionk that he realizes that things have gone too far, and that there's a limit to how far McCain's campaign will go.

EDIT: Holy shit, Matthews was on fire today.

 

[Zeliard]

McCain doesn't make those decisions anymore; she's become more important than him in the span on a month. She is better at rallying the crowd, and many people are only showing up to hear her speak at dual events. Most of McCain supporters are turning the page to Palin 2012. I think the same stupid logic that put her on the ticket will put her up front in 2012 'for the good of the party'

I don't think there's any way in hell the Republicans will nominate Palin in 2012. A lot of them are completely embarrassed right now, and we've been seeing some conservatives like William Buckley's son endorsing Obama.

 

[faceless007]

Nice, on Hardball Chris is nailing some GOP hack about their whole history of charges of "anti-American" and "traitor," going back to Dukakis. Guy just says he heard similar things about Bush in 2004.

 

[kkaabboomm]

I too give McCain props for taking the mic from the woman and saying those things about Obama. Likely just political, but I like to thionk that he realizes that things have gone too far, and that there's a limit to how far McCain's campaign will go.

i think he at least realized what would've been said HAD HE NOT TAKEN the mic from her.

 

[Fox318]

I don't think there's any way in hell the Republicans will nominate Palin in 2012. A lot of them are completely embarrassed right now, and we've been seeing some conservatives like William Buckley's son endorsing Obama.

Not if the Regan leftovers still have money or are alive.

 

[3phemeral]

Hard to keep up with this thread; don't know if it was posted already:

McCain supporter calls Obama an Arab, McCain defends Obama

 

[agrajag]

Seriously. If he had picked a legit VP and kept pounding the experience angle, they wouldn't be in desperation mode now..

I don't know why this party is still associated with fiscal conservativism anymore. They're just fundies. Earlier today the McCain campaign released a new ad attacking the Democratic Congress for passing deregulatory legislature. :lol

 

[besada]

Health care doesn't matter much when you're dead. I'm also fairly sure that black slaves were fed better than WWI soldiers, since their masters wanted to insure that they'd stay big and strong.

Soldier's children weren't taken from them and sold as a matter of course. They weren't denied literacy. Their names and cultures weren't taken. When they died, they died as heroes, unlike slaves who were often buried in unmarked graves.

None of this includes, of course, the hundreds of thousands that died making the middle passage, or touches on the fact that men, women, and children were slaves as opposed to only young men, or that fact that masters raped their female property.

Attempting to paint the draft as equivalent to American slavery is repugnant. There's no question to me that requiring people to fight and die is wrong, but that doesn't represent moral equivalence.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

I think it's funny that McCain defending Obama will probably do more for McCain's campaign than a month of tying him with Ayers would have.

 

[Nabs]

Hard to keep up with this thread; don't know if it was posted already:

McCain supporter calls Obama an Arab, McCain defends Obama

aaaaaaahahahahahhaha wat

 

[kkaabboomm]

just to illustrate the depths of badness

 

[Byakuya769]

:-( Please tell me the kitty won.

Are you anti-america?

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

I think it's funny that McCain defending Obama will probably do more for McCain's campaign than a month of tying him with Ayers would have.

Yup. I can see him hitting 45% again.

 

[Haunted]

Hard to keep up with this thread; don't know if it was posted already:

McCain supporter calls Obama an Arab, McCain defends Obama

Nice to see McCain still having a shred of decency left. Then again, correcting and cutting that woman off was also done to protect himself - who knows what she was about to say about "that arab", and if he were to have her say it uncontested, it would've bitten him in the ass.

Hope this will be the norm from here on out. If he can't lead and control his own supporters, how will he etc. etc. Then again, the way he has conducted himself in this campaign, I shouldn't be too hopeful.

 

[agrajag]

Are you anti-america?

If being pro-pussy anti-american, then so be it!