winjer
Gold Member
Very true. BVH traversal in the PS5 is done in the CPU or shaders.
So having a dedicated unit for BVH traversal, will be able to offload calculations.
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PS5 Pro Specs Leak are Real, Releasing Holiday 2024(Insider Gaming)
- Thread starter jm89
- Start date
Very true. BVH traversal in the PS5 is done in the CPU or shaders.
So having a dedicated unit for BVH traversal, will be able to offload calculations.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
Sony's internal testing must have concluded that they didn't need to do much of anything to the CPU. Cause surely if they needed to even a bump to 4Ghz could have been possible.
Perrott
Member
Sony's testing should've been focused towards delivering a product worth of having the word "PRO" in it's name, rather than finding what's the bare minimum they could get away with for, again, an enthusiast piece of hardware.
I'm certainly lowering all expectations I had for the Pro, although I'm still gonna get it regardless.
Calverz
Member
Yea. It’s called epic store.
Leonidas
AMD's Dogma: ARyzen (No Intel inside)
If you trade-in and upgrade you will be eating at least $100, maybe even $200 after considering the taxes you paid on the old and new machine.
Buy PS5 for $500 years ago($540 after tax), trade it in get $370 (you lost $170) . Buy PS5 Pro for $600(~650 after tax if that is the actual price) then after taxes the Pro will end up costing you $820... all for a paltry 45% uplift after 4 years, but at least RT and upscaling went from abysmal to good.
At this point I'm hoping BC is not improved, I can make the OG PS5 my last Sony console, and I won't take a $100-$200 loss by trading/selling and upgrading.
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James Sawyer Ford
Member
Something PC elitists will never click on or else they’ll face the wrath of lord gaben
Self_Destructive
Member
Drop the PCMR Derail
Midrange GPUs will be far more powerful than PS6 by the time it releases... I'll have already had a PC more powerful than PS6 for multiple years by the time PS6 comes out lmao.
I wont be forced to buy another multi thousand dollar PC. YOU will however be forced to buy a PS6 to play PS6 games.
90ns is massively better than the can be achieved with GDDR6 on the PS5 though. From memory the 4700S is like ~150ns or so.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
What's to say more CPU cache was not added?
Even if it wasnt though, I just don't think sony felt they had a CPU bottleneck problem and decided to do nothing about it. Maybe making the GPU better, especially with regards to RT and having dedicated AI hardware for upscaling frees up the CPU some.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
You said Sony right? Not Nvidia? This is a console, right?
TheRedRiders
Member
People talking about CPU bottlenecks, I’m here frickin worrying about the memory bandwidth.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Yes you will, home girl
Those “mid range” gpus that “smoke” ps6 will cost you 2-3x the cost of a ps6 alone, excluding any other components you must upgrade
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TheRedRiders
Member
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
I think if they mentioned a miserable 10% clock increase, they would have mentioned more cache.
Plus Sony can determine whatever they want, we can see the reality in everyday games. When we have devs like Warner Bros who ship games like Gotham Knights with only a 30fps mode because they're too incompetent to use multithreading, you need a fast CPU. I was initially confident that 60fps wouldn't be a problem in almost every game with that CPU, but after seeing more and more recent benchmarks, I'm not so sure.
winjer
Gold Member
Yes, but its still an 3600x that is underperforming.
Consoles might have higher memory latency on the CPU, but they also have lower level APIs, and custom BVH implementations, and a unified memory system that doesn't require going over pcie bus to main memory.
Leonidas
AMD's Dogma: ARyzen (No Intel inside)
My Epic Store collection is probably over 400 games strong now. Probably even bigger than PS+ Extra collection, and a lot of the same games too, all for free, and in higher resolution and much higher fram-rates (since a lot of the PS Extra games are PS4 games which are capped at an abysmal 30 FPS at 1080p or less).
Epic Store Free games > PS+ Extra paid games that you lose access to
nosoynadie22
Member
GTA 6 on PS5 Pro:
•quality RT mode: 4K/30fps
• performance RT mode: 1290P/60fps upscaled to 4K?
•quality RT mode: 4K/30fps
• performance RT mode: 1290P/60fps upscaled to 4K?
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Self_Destructive
Member
That price will be mitigated by me selling my previous parts.
So perpetually I'll be experiencing performance 2-4 years in the future... while you eventually get to it for $600 years later.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
At a massive loss, unlike your lucky situation during the pandemic
Self_Destructive
Member
No... it's not at a massive loss. I'll have had years of fun and high performance with that hardware. That's not wasted money.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
And you just hit the nail on the head. I think that right there is the problem. Sony would know that there is a lot of CPU overhead left unused in those games that were poorly optimized to fully use all available 14 threads they gave devs. ANd I don't see sony building out hardware to accommodate incompetent devs. We can talk up CPU bottlenecks with regard to some third-party devs. But I have seen sony first-party devs that look significantly better than those third party games maintaining locked 60fps.
I think it would be silly of anyone to ever expect consoles to take the PC brute force approach to solving issues.
Perrott
Member
Grand Theft Auto VI won't have a non-RT quality mode, and it's already running at 1440p & 30FPS with RTGI and RT reflections on PS5.
On the Pro, going by GPU horsepower alone, it should punch way above that in terms of resolution, while boasting more RT features (raytraced shadows were already featured in the next-gen version of GTA V) on top of it.
The biggest question mark though would be the performance mode.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Yep, a massive loss, nobody wants second hand used pc parts the price craters
Self_Destructive
Member
Nope... because I don't game on midrange stuff. I game on the high end, and those GPUs retain better value, as they have higher memory capacities.
The GPUs I buy, are still very desirable 2-4 years later at high prices.. because they're still high end at that point.
Moses85
Member
jm89
Member
Uhm devs still focus on the base consoles, even with a pro offering on the market.
End of last gen we had stuff like last of us part 2 and rdr2 really pushing the base consoles. Those where some of the best experiences in gaming last gen.
Maybe all those things you listed is part of the right experience that you mentioned
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Leonidas
AMD's Dogma: ARyzen (No Intel inside)
Nvidia GPUs hold their value pretty well. PC parts only lose value if you hold onto them too long.
I went from 2070 to 2070 Super to 3070 at no additional cost.
I paid more for the 4070 but that was a $100 price increase and unlike the 2070 and 2070 Super, I waited too long to sell the 3070 (I could have gotten $900 if I sold it during mining boom but I instead decided to mine on it instead, if I sold the ETH today I would have made somewhere around $2000 on the 3070, enough to cover my GPU purchases into 2030...
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Seriously,the Pro is supposed to be a stopgap product,I personally don't find anything wrong with what's being produced. I can't fathom why some want the Pro to be the PS6.
The only thing I find interested is the CPU frequency being under 4GHz,I assumed the clock will be about 3.8GHz.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Yall still think this is 2020, get real
nosoynadie22
Member
This sounds like a PS5.1
similar power to the original model but with better performance with RT and ML
similar power to the original model but with better performance with RT and ML
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ChiefDada
Gold Member
Self_Destructive
Member
Yes, that's precisely my point. Just make ONE good console, and stand by it for 7 years.
Remind me again how many Naughty Dog and Rockstar games have released this gen?End of last gen we had stuff like last of us part 2 and rdr2 really pushing the base consoles. Those where some of the best experiences in gaming last gen.
Maybe all those things you listed is part of the right experience that you mentioned
You're getting 1 game per gen from these studios now.. and Naughty Dog's next game, and GTA6 will be massively impressive surely... but it's because it will be their first actual current gen games. They're not really growing over the course of a generation on the hardware like they did in the past.
Sure... at the cost of simplicity for the consumer and complexity for the developer. The more options they offer you, the more they have to compromise.. that's just facts.
Leonidas
AMD's Dogma: ARyzen (No Intel inside)
It doesn't matter what time it is, if I sold the ETH I mined on the 3070 today, my GPU costs would be covered till at least 2030...
I barely ever took a loss on selling GPUs before since I always sold them when prices increased, and took advantage of the market in some instances. I am aware I will probably not have the luck in selling that I had in the past, but as long as ETH doesn't plummit to nothing, I will get several more GPUs at no additional cost. The only thing stopping me from doing this is if I hold onto the ETH too long and it plummets significantly in that time.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
That’s my point, you’re counting on a Ponzi scheme or pandemic supply chains to inflate the value
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Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
I'm really curious how this plays into AI and upscaling etc. MS have a large library of AI wares and Sony/non-MS background have the optimisation and speed. It's going to be interesting to see how devs handle such differences and if MS/Xbox actually get out of their self-induced MS performance hit they usually put on themselves. Surely with that much inline power backwards compatibility would be a no brainer?
I'm more interested in what this does for gaming, devs and what we actually get to play rather than the "raw" specs of it all. We saw the who gives a shit with this gens launch specs and BS, there's fuck all difference IMO. There's a few titles that go above an beyond in first party e.g. frames or IQ but the majority of the games catalogue it's a who gives a fuck category. Will this Pro/mid-gen refresh be more than just marketing?
I'm more interested in what this does for gaming, devs and what we actually get to play rather than the "raw" specs of it all. We saw the who gives a shit with this gens launch specs and BS, there's fuck all difference IMO. There's a few titles that go above an beyond in first party e.g. frames or IQ but the majority of the games catalogue it's a who gives a fuck category. Will this Pro/mid-gen refresh be more than just marketing?
Lagspike_exe
Member
We are discussing the Pro specifications here. The people who are buying this are people interested in PlayStation ecosystem who want the best hardware. The PC comparison has been done ad nauseam.
jm89
Member
Ok, they are already doing that? Nothings changes this gen compared to last gen, for playstation atleast.
Naughty dog have separate issues going on right now which don't have anything to do with what you mentioned.
Rockstar have been milking GTA online, gta5 is still the top seller every year. They of course will take their sweet time coming with a new game when they have a money generator for almost 3 generations.
Those features that you listed really aren't what's causing long dev times of 1 game per gen lol. Sure they will add some additional Dev and testing time but too an extent where it takes 5 years to develop a game for some Devs, nah.
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Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Sounds like the quality of the upscaling will make or break this based on the specs being so modest.
I don't have faith at all that Sony will spend the necessary amount to insure a true DLSS alternative and I really do think that's what is needed. It needs ML cores darn it
I don't have faith at all that Sony will spend the necessary amount to insure a true DLSS alternative and I really do think that's what is needed. It needs ML cores darn it
Draugoth
Gold Member
System Memory
It’s also understood that as a means to make the PlayStation 5 Pro as “competitive” (not my phrasing here) as possible, it will have a detachable disc drive which will be identical to the latest iteration of the standard PlayStation 5, and 1TB of storage space.
Currently, the PlayStation 5 Pro is running on SKD 9.00, and SDK 10.00 is expected in Fall 2024, which is the current targeted release date of the console.
CPU
Audio
GPU (Previously revealed)
In addition: 30 WGPs running specialised BVH8 traversal shaders vs 18 WGPs running BVH4 tranversal shaders on the standard PlayStation 5.
It’s also understood that as a means to make the PlayStation 5 Pro as “competitive” (not my phrasing here) as possible, it will have a detachable disc drive which will be identical to the latest iteration of the standard PlayStation 5, and 1TB of storage space.
Currently, the PlayStation 5 Pro is running on SKD 9.00, and SDK 10.00 is expected in Fall 2024, which is the current targeted release date of the console.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
This guy was crying about his master pc being so much better and cheaper than consoles and in the same breath is saying a pro console makes development much more complicated. Get real dude, PC is orders of magnitude more complex than a single pro console lmao
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Well, hopefully, that CPU proves to be enough but with how games run even on a GPU that should be more than enough but still drops to 720p, I don't have that much faith. Dragon's Dogma dipping to the 20s and struggling to maintain 30 is likely due to a CPU issue.
Insane Metal
Member
I'm still trying to figure out what "rendering 45% faster than OG PS5" means.
bitbydeath
Member
Feels like PS5 specs reveal all over again with people not understanding what any of it means but acting like they do.
Leonidas
AMD's Dogma: ARyzen (No Intel inside)
I'm not really counting on it, just using it as an example. Many PC gamers already made their money from ETH. Even taking that out, I've kept track of my GPU spending since 2013, I haven't taken a loss yet, even without the potential thousands ETH I mined.
I will take losses in the future though, its unavoidable, but I'm okay with it since I get a faster GPU every generation. I don't have to wait 4 years for a paltry 45% raster increase.
Its a 45% raster increase. Like going from a 6700 to a 7700 XT. A minor upgrade when you consider its been 4 years.
Yes yes, the RT 2-3x is good, but that just takes the abysmal ray-tracing to being decent.
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Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
I'm console only but he makes valid points. First of all, will this really outclass a monster rig from 2020-2021? I doubt it. Secondly, how is factoring in PS Plus disingsnuous? Yeah it's "technically" optional, but not if you're like most people and want to play online. Therefore it's not really optional.
I despise Sony and MS for this bullshit tactic of sucking out more money from people just for the right to play online. It's a scam and they know it. They've only gotten away with it by the idea that you get "free monthly games" with it. There should be a way for the people who don't care or want those monthly (usually crap) games, to be able to play online for free. Imagine spending $60-$70 on a game and not being able to play the online portion of it? That's what they've done.
And a couple years ago when people started to question this and call for a free tier (for people who just want to play online) and the pressure increased? They had GamePass and PS Plus subscriptions to "justify" holding gamers hostage again.
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Insane Metal
Member
That can't be can it? That's really bad.
Coupling that with the same CPU... ouch
From lower than low to medium lol.
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