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Putting the mega drive back into Sega: how the company wants to return to creating video game "rock & roll", compared to Nintendo's "pop music"

ManaByte

Gold Member

Interview was done BEFORE the TGAs. The thing he is hinting at was the Virtua Fighter reveal (FUCK YEA).

Sonic's made a comeback in both games and now with the movies, which is symbolic of Sega's resurgence. But you're reinvesting in some of the classic Sega IPs as well, Jet Set Radio, Crazy Taxi...

Utsumi:
We made that announcement at the Game Awards [2023]... With the first round [of announcements] I was basically focusing on trying to revive Sonic, Yakuza, and Persona. Three IPs that can be even stronger. And to make Sega more like Sega... Sega has so many great IPs and they've aged very well, and they could appeal to the market again.

Sega always had a fun edge.

Utsumi:
Sega had that kind of style [back then]. Sega's position was like, 'If you have attitude, Sega's the company for you, rather than Nintendo', because of the games, because of the style, because of coolness or the kind of attitude. We have such beautiful content value in Sega, and some other IPs, so we're trying to revive it with a little bit of the flavour of hip-hop now.

Interesting. Yakuza games have always felt like the right size. Deep, lots to do, and always a satisfying amount of content, but never too intimidating. I like knowing there's an end. I don't know if I could handle a GTA-sized Yakuza. Do you have any feelings on how the Yakuza series is doing, veering from action to RPG-style mechanics?

Utsumi:
We feel the series is expanding. We're trying to have an action base game, and a role-playing game mix of audience. And the [Ryu Ga Gotoku] studio is likely to take a kind of hybrid direction going forward. And theme-wise, the studio keeps its Japanese authenticity, with global appeal.

Is something going to happen there?

Utsumi:
I hope so. [Laughs] So regarding the announcement of legacy titles at the past TGA - my people really didn't want to make that happen because it was too early to make an announcement. But I wanted to make the announcement working with Geoff [Keighley], because we're otherwise so dependent on first-party announcements. I want to make our own story, I want to control the message. Now Geoff's presentation is one of the biggest opportunities, other than new platform announcements. So I said, 'Hey, just announcing Shinobi alone is not big news. So we had to package it'.

Well, you certainly made a splash with those reveals.

Utsumi:
I wanted to send a message saying 'Sega is coming back'.
 

Deerock71

Member
Sonic was a pop star. All flash, no substance. Mario had layers.
shrek GIF
 

BlackTron

Member
2D Sonic was superior to 2D Mario.

That's common knowledge.

Mario was more technical, allowing for more depth in the gameplay, but lacks the entertaining rolling physics, speed and graphics, which you can get out of an easier to play game with only 1 button. Overplaying one makes me crave the other.

Sonic was a pop star. All flash, no substance. Mario had layers.

This. I wouldn't say Sonic had no substance, but did max out a different stat than Mario, lol
 

64bitmodels

Reverse groomer.
Mario was more technical, allowing for more depth in the gameplay, but lacks the entertaining rolling physics, speed and graphics, which you can get out of an easier to play game with only 1 button. Overplaying one makes me crave the other.
Mario has more secrets in the world too but i think Sonic has more replay value. There's more incentive to replay levels and get better.

You'll spend a lot of time on a first-run playthrough of mario, while Sonic will be shorter. But Sonic will have you coming back for more especially to play as different characters, or to come back for the emeralds and get super sonic.
I'm a firm believer that Sonic games become way more fun when you make getting the emeralds an active goal. I've started playing them way more after trying to get all 7- you explore levels more, looking into walls, finding new routes, etc to get into a big ring.

Mario's level design is... well, it can vary. the simpler gameplay style means there's more fresh and interesting gimmicks between levels. Sonic levels have their own set of gimmicks too, but nothing that really fundamentally changes the way you play moreso as adding a modifier to stage hazards, enemies, etc. Mario's beauty is in its simplicity allowing the gameplay to be easily modified. Changing how a Sonic game plays requires a lot of work, because designing a Sonic level is a lot of work.

they are both good 🤷‍♂️ Mario these days is way better though. Wonder is fantastic while Superstars is a mediocre mess.
 

64bitmodels

Reverse groomer.
Anyways, RGG studio and Atlus are great but they need to stop carrying the entire damn company. We want new IP (NOT A FUCKING GAAS. You saw Astro Bot win those awards while Concord flopped. We don't want another Hyenas) and some revivals if it can be helped.

Like yeah, all those old games were great but we still need new IP
 

Impotaku

Member
The last thing we need is Sega trying to go back to its edgy period. It was fucking cringe the first time I hated that era Nintendo America were just as guilty of that shit.

Maybe try some totally new ips instead of relying on more sonic shit. I enjoy when they try to do something brand new last new one I genuinely enjoyed was hero bank it had a really neat premise and was a lot of fun to play.
 

IDKFA

I am Become Bilbo Baggins
Mario was more technical, allowing for more depth in the gameplay, but lacks the entertaining rolling physics, speed and graphics, which you can get out of an easier to play game with only 1 button. Overplaying one

no-hahaha.gif


Sonic is a literal one-trick pony. Mario can do anything with a power-up.

Sonic 2D games more technical and also have power ups. They're also more exciting and require more skill.

Mario gargles on Sonic's nuts in the 2D space.

Also, this is giving me flashbacks of 1990s school arguments. I love it.
 

64bitmodels

Reverse groomer.
The last thing we need is Sega trying to go back to its edgy period.
what edgy period? The same period that gave us Jet Set Radio Future, Sonic Adventure 2, Space Channel 5, Sonic Rush, Billy Hatcher, Sonic Adventure 1, F-Zero GX (sega developed Nintendo title), Puyo Puyo Fever and Persona 3?

Why's that the last thing we need?
 

ReBurn

Gold Member
I didn't read the article but the title resonates with me. Most of the games that are released now are video game "pop music" and I really miss the edgy video game "rock 'n roll" of the past.

I'm probably heading into senility now.
 

BlackTron

Member
Sonic 2D games more technical and also have power ups. They're also more exciting and require more skill.

Mario gargles on Sonic's nuts in the 2D space.

Also, this is giving me flashbacks of 1990s school arguments. I love it.
This is something I just can't agree with. When I was a kid SNES came out shortly after I got NES so I was playing Mario 1, 3, World, and Sonic 1 and 2 extensively having played very few other games beforehand (just a bunch of Capcom NES titles really).

I think they complement each other very well which is why they made such powerful exclusive games. It would have been torture choosing to dump one.

Never said Sonic doesn't have power-ups, just that it's less technical; sure you need more skill to clear a stage in a really cool looking sexy way with Sonic, but Mario will ask for that much skill just to finish the game. If Mario has technicality, Sonic has organic flow, which are both valid.

Modern Mario might be too fresh in your mind. Go back and play Mario 3 and tell me it's easier than Sonic.

I'm a Sonic nut and usually find myself defending the hedgehog's history. I even used a freaking Game Gear in the back of a car...with BATTERIES. This isn't some sort of Sonic was never good posturing lol
 
I'm all for it. People were trying to doom-gloom after Nagoshi left but honestly we wouldn't be getting many of these great revivals of classic IP if Nagoshi stayed at RGG. He just seemed laser-focused on Yakuza, at the expense of everything else. Still got a lot of respect for him tho.

Now I just want to see SEGA bring back the following, and we'll be fully back in the game:

-(Classic) Shining Force, like the ones Camelot made​
-Dragon Force​
-Panzer Dragoon (including PD Saga. At least give us a remake of the original if not a sequel)​

...those are honestly the Big 3 of theirs I'd love see return, because they're already bringing back almost everything else that matters (Virtua Fighter, Shinobi, Streets of Rage, Jet Set Radio, Crazy Taxi etc.). Though thinking of it now there are some others, i.e ThunderForce, Outrun, etc.

Just glad we're in this timeline TBH.

This is something I just can't agree with. When I was a kid SNES came out shortly after I got NES so I was playing Mario 1, 3, World, and Sonic 1 and 2 extensively having played very few other games beforehand (just a bunch of Capcom NES titles really).

I think they complement each other very well which is why they made such powerful exclusive games. It would have been torture choosing to dump one.

Never said Sonic doesn't have power-ups, just that it's less technical; sure you need more skill to clear a stage in a really cool looking sexy way with Sonic, but Mario will ask for that much skill just to finish the game. If Mario has technicality, Sonic has organic flow, which are both valid.

Modern Mario might be too fresh in your mind. Go back and play Mario 3 and tell me it's easier than Sonic.

I'm a Sonic nut and usually find myself defending the hedgehog's history. I even used a freaking Game Gear in the back of a car...with BATTERIES. This isn't some sort of Sonic was never good posturing lol

TBF to that poster, I do think the classic Sonic games get ripped on as being "bad design" or too easy because people are obsessed with speed. There's actually a REALLY good (super-long) documentary I came across months ago about Sonic CD, I'll link it here. They also touched on the Genesis Sonic games to show just how in-depth the game mechanics & level design of Sonic CD is versus those Genesis titles.



I'm only halfway through it but the second half is mainly on story lore & development history. The actual focus on game design & level design, & game mechanics is in the first 3 hours. 100% worth a watch, it gave me newfound appreciation for Sonic CD as a whole.

That all being said...there is no world where the classic Mario games are "easy". I'd say they're actually similar to Sonic in that if you're unskilled, there are still routes for you to beat the game. You'll just struggle a lot and do a lot of unoptimized things. But like Sonic, for those who want to master the game mechanics and use their skill to its peak, those classic Mario games are definitely designed to allow that and test your skill level if that's what you want.

It's the providence of choice there that makes classic Mario & Sonic games so timeless and appealing to casuals & hardcore simultaneously. And I'd say in many ways modern installments in both encourage much of the same (tho Mario's been a lot more consistent with their quality vs. Sonic), even if it's not quite to the level of their 2D installments.
 
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Holammer

Member
Now I just want to see SEGA bring back the following, and we'll be fully back in the game:

-(Classic) Shining Force, like the ones Camelot made​

Imagine a new game with 80's or 90's manga/anime style character design. Like Yoshitaka Tamaki's original work (RIP).
In any game/genre really. If it happens, it'll be from a Western studio.
 
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DeVeAn

Member
Truly the timeline is correcting itself. Sega is on a roll! They actually turn their Titanic around. Yeah it was long slow turn took YEARS. These past few years they on the right track! Now bring back Skies of Arcadia.
 
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Let me say this. I think just looking at the faces of the people heading such a company and listening to them talk for at least a minute tells you a lot. I had a very good feeling when I saw the three in the Virtua Fighter stream (obviously talking about the three Japanese SEGA employees, not leather jacket man and the other dudes). They seem like the right people in the right positions to make SEGA great again. Crossing my fingers.
 

Geometric-Crusher

"Nintendo games are like indies, and worth at most $19" 🤡
Now I just want to see SEGA bring back the following, and we'll be fully back in the game:

-(Classic) Shining Force, like the ones Camelot made​
-Dragon Force​
-Panzer Dragoon (including PD Saga. At least give us a remake of the original if not a sequel)​

...those are honestly the Big 3 of theirs I'd love see return, because they're already bringing back almost everything else that matters (Virtua Fighter, Shinobi, Streets of Rage, Jet Set Radio, Crazy Taxi etc.). Though thinking of it now there are some others, i.e ThunderForce, Outrun, etc.

Just glad we're in this timeline TBH.
The main thing you don't wish

Edit- Is this the new Sega Saturn thread?
 
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64bitmodels

Reverse groomer.
those are honestly the Big 3 of theirs I'd love see return, because they're already bringing back almost everything else that matters (Virtua Fighter, Shinobi, Streets of Rage, Jet Set Radio, Crazy Taxi etc.). Though thinking of it now there are some others, i.e ThunderForce, Outrun, etc.
i just want another racing game from them. and no i dont mean the sonic racer. i want sega rally
 

Geometric-Crusher

"Nintendo games are like indies, and worth at most $19" 🤡
To be honest Sega games were average, the best were Sonic, Shinobi and Streets of Rage, after the talentless devs left the company improved.
Project Century in my opinion looks better than anything Sega has made with the exception of the three games I mentioned.
 

BlackTron

Member
That all being said...there is no world where the classic Mario games are "easy". I'd say they're actually similar to Sonic in that if you're unskilled, there are still routes for you to beat the game. You'll just struggle a lot and do a lot of unoptimized things. But like Sonic, for those who want to master the game mechanics and use their skill to its peak, those classic Mario games are definitely designed to allow that and test your skill level if that's what you want.

All other things being equal, Sonic would still be easier due to its rings health mechanic. If you were Sonic, you could just peel through world 8, rushing to grab at least one ring every time a bullet bill smacks your brazen face. As Mario, the injury lasts forever, in fact it fight cancel the power up you just consumed from the map inventory, punishing every small mistake in agonizing attrition; Sonic's survivability makes finding all those paths and enjoying the loopy level design easier without as much anxiety (so it's the right system for that game, but undoubtedly easier). The final boss to Sonic 3 just beat me senseless while I kept grabbing my last ring over again, that's how I was able to beat it in 1994.

There would never be a situation in Sonic where you made sure to grab a specific item to clear a level you need it for, like a P-Wing, and acting with sweaty hands to make sure you don't lose it to a dumb turtle in the beginning of the level, or the plan is botched. Mind you, this is a quality that Mario dumped with 64, and I was uneasy about it even back then.
 

IDKFA

I am Become Bilbo Baggins
This is something I just can't agree with. When I was a kid SNES came out shortly after I got NES so I was playing Mario 1, 3, World, and Sonic 1 and 2 extensively having played very few other games beforehand (just a bunch of Capcom NES titles really).

I think they complement each other very well which is why they made such powerful exclusive games. It would have been torture choosing to dump one.

Never said Sonic doesn't have power-ups, just that it's less technical; sure you need more skill to clear a stage in a really cool looking sexy way with Sonic, but Mario will ask for that much skill just to finish the game. If Mario has technicality, Sonic has organic flow, which are both valid.

Modern Mario might be too fresh in your mind. Go back and play Mario 3 and tell me it's easier than Sonic.

I'm a Sonic nut and usually find myself defending the hedgehog's history. I even used a freaking Game Gear in the back of a car...with BATTERIES. This isn't some sort of Sonic was never good posturing lol

I had the Sega Mega Drive (or Genesis if you're from North America) and the SNES. I can speak from experience. Every kid in the 90s who knew about gaming knew the Sega MD was far superior to the SNES, knew the Sega MD had a far better library of games than the SNES, agreed that the console looked better and EVERYONE and their dog knew 2D Sonic was miles better than 2D Mario.

I rest my case.

*mic drop*
 

BlackTron

Member
I had the Sega Mega Drive (or Genesis if you're from North America) and the SNES. I can speak from experience. Every kid in the 90s who knew about gaming knew the Sega MD was far superior to the SNES, knew the Sega MD had a far better library of games than the SNES, agreed that the console looked better and EVERYONE and their dog knew 2D Sonic was miles better than 2D Mario.

I rest my case.

*mic drop*

Oh, absolutely. SEGA was way cooler than Nintendo, and Sonic played his role well as the Mario killer. But they did that by making a more approachable, more marketable game: better graphics, better character, and easier to play, with less buttons and mechanics. You were more dazzled per unit of energy spent playing it. None of this means it was harder, or more technical. I personally love Sonic for not being Mario, and that's why I liked both, if one was just a less good version of the other it would be pretty lame, with a clear winner between them.

I might not have the same opinion if I hadn't started on NES. Mario 3 is just GOAT. This and Sonic 2 are the title from each series that stood the test of time the most for me. I still fire up both, starting from the beginning with 3 lives and no save, as God intended. Mario World is a great game, but takes on a bit of Sonic's easiness in being a big savable adventure you can pick away at, with scant penalty for Game Over.
 

nkarafo

Member
I had the Sega Mega Drive (or Genesis if you're from North America) and the SNES. I can speak from experience. Every kid in the 90s who knew about gaming knew the Sega MD was far superior to the SNES, knew the Sega MD had a far better library of games than the SNES, agreed that the console looked better and EVERYONE and their dog knew 2D Sonic was miles better than 2D Mario.

I rest my case.

*mic drop*
Both had their strengths. Mario's levels were more interesting to explore IMO.

Sonic has the better graphics.

But Genesis Sonic also had the best controls and physics ever created in a 2D platform game and it still hasn't been beaten. It was a joy moving him around, making the game feel more addictive. That's one of the biggest reasons why the Genesis games are better than any 3D Sonic. Because the 3D Sonic games dropped the ball with crappy physics and janky controls, while 3D Mario even improved on these aspects.
 

Meicyn

Gold Member
No that was Sonic since the first Adventure, when Sega gave him voice, more friends and more cinematics.

Og Sonic had substance.
It’s funny that Sonic 3 & Knuckles told a better and more cohesive story than any 3D Sonic that came afterwards, and it didn’t have a single shred of text or voice acting.
 

BlackTron

Member
Both had their strengths. Mario's levels were more interesting to explore IMO.

Sonic has the better graphics.

But Genesis Sonic also had the best controls and physics ever created in a 2D platform game and it still hasn't been beaten. It was a joy moving him around, making the game feel more addictive. That's one of the biggest reasons why the Genesis games are better than any 3D Sonic. Because the 3D Sonic games dropped the ball with crappy physics and janky controls, while 3D Mario even improved on these aspects.

Indeed, physics and controls are a major feature of Sonic, you could argue you were paying for Yuji Naka's rolling ball code which the entire game and even character were made around.

Which is why the 3D games piss me off, even when they get everything else right. Generations kills me, it looks like the perfect 3D Sonic but it don't feel like it. The first 3D game is still best at doing "Genesis in 3D", which is a travesty. It makes sense to me that Naka helmed the Genesis games and was still around for DC, so making a 3D game that represented Sonic's core was obvious for him. Then 2 added a context-sensitive button inspired by OOT (what?) then they pulled out of hardware and suddenly his biggest concern was fulfilling an obligation to deliver a multiplat game with Renderware...bye perfect physics. Since then ST has commented they didn't even know we WANT physics...Sonic didn't die with DC as a commercial property but he did die as a game concept.
 

nkarafo

Member
It’s funny that Sonic 3 & Knuckles told a better and more cohesive story than any 3D Sonic that came afterwards, and it didn’t have a single shred of text or voice acting.
True. Sonic & Knuckles cutscenes were short and on point. They showed you exactly what you needed to be shown without wasting your time with extra fluff.

And this highlights a bigger issue with the game industry IMO. Because when storage changed to optical discs and developers had the freedom to "express themselves" and games became more "cinematic" (something people hyped to high heavens as if that's a good thing)... the storytelling got worse, not better (at least for any genre that's not a story heavy RPG). Because now you had these long cutscenes that waste your time, all the exposition and all the voice acting, which most of the times was bad and completely ruined the character's tone and personality (like it did for Sonic, IMO).

And games that were never supposed to be story heavy, now had to be, otherwise they were considered archaic design. I still remember reviews cutting points from games because they had a simpler way of telling the story.

The evolution of storytelling in videogames is the poster child of "less is more".
 
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Danknugz

Member
sonic and mario are both 2d platformers but the similarities end there. sonic is much more momentum and movement based, mario is more about exploration and world setting. imo sonic was always good for the first couple worlds but the got very samey. mario had a little more depth when it came to its environments
 
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