This. If we really do get entire fluid pvp worlds in pve servers I may just sign up with gaf. Finding a good guild is annoying.CcrooK said:PvP servers have their moments. Though the game seems to have a lot of area's of PvP available to use whenever you want so I don't see the issue of PvE servers. Plus I want my world boss kill to go in my favor
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Star Wars: The Old Republic [Releasing Date: Dec 20 NA/EU - NDA Lifted]
- Thread starter Blackface
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Ya, if an entire world is dedicated to it, then we have nothing to worry about. There basically won't be a reason to be on a PVP server unless you love the risk associated with it. I for one value my time. We ALL know what it's like on PVP servers AFTER the first year. You'll be running an alt around doing quests and somebody will be walking around ganking OR you will get jumped by an equal level character and kill them, only to find their high level main over your body camping you 20 minutes later.gatti-man said:
Not for me.
Edit: Uh oh, it appears EA has struck. The cake does not exist anymore. I repeat, the cake does not exist anymore.
Double edit: Wow, I've been beaten and it's just a site upgrade. Damn that scared me. I love Betacake. Anyways, for anybody that wants to access the website for what was still there, just use the Google cached version that appears when you google betacake. http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:5TpG4fPlCy4J:betacake.blogspot.com/+betacake&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca&source=www.google.ca
The_Inquisitor
Member
AZRandom_guy said:
I can't confirm or deny anything
^_-
Crazypanda_85
Member
This is going to be my first MMO and I'm excited Sadly, I'm going to be working nights and school full time (15hrs) and I doubt I will be able to be in a guild. I hope this game is still fun playing solo.
Sadly, I'm going to be working nights and school full time (15hrs) and I doubt I will be able to be in a guild. I hope this game is still fun playing solo.Touche bro. I'm doing a 4 course load this coming semester with 20 hours of work per week. This will translate to 3 nights and 1 week day. Not all 8 hour shifts, but it takes it's toll. Add that to the fact that the classes I'm taking this semester are quite heavy as I'm now in the 2nd year of my CS degree, and I'm more than a little scared for my free time/sanity.Crazypanda_85 said:This is going to be my first MMO and I'm excited
I asked my proff from last semester how her 2nd year was as she went through the same program at my Uni, and she said it was the most overnighters she has ever pulled in any of her years of education. Needless to say I found that quite encouraging. :/
You don't have to read 175 pages because it's on the firstiRobotZombie said:
EDIT: Whoops, no there's not. Weird.
Join us anyway. I'm a full time student again with ADD which means all my homework takes forever to finish.Crazypanda_85 said:This is going to be my first MMO and I'm excited
EhrgeizVII
Member
I'm definitely rolling on a PvP server with my Sith character (and my Jedi alt!). The idea of running into a random Jedi player while questing, who's willing to fight me to the death in an epic light saber slash force abuse duel is really appealing. Ofcourse, if I get ganked by multiple enemies I'll call my friends on Skype and tell them to log to turn the fight into one epic world PvP fest. It's been that way ever since I started WoW and I won't play it any other way. Oh Stranglethorn Vale, how I miss you..
Baller. PhD
Banned
News at 11:
MMO = giant epeen showcase
Minds blown?
MMO = giant epeen showcase
Minds blown?
The problem is that almost every MMO released is built on a PvE engine. These are primarily PvE games at their core and PvP is almost always tacked on or crammed to fit inside the PvE space. I still don't get the fascination with PvP in MMOs. There are many genres of game out there that do PvP much better and in a much more balanced fashion if you feel the need to get your gank on.
PvP has never worked, nor made sense to me in a MMO. Seldom is there any balance. You have level disparities, gear disparities, class balance disparities, and when the MMO matures, you have usually have sheer number disparities in addition to the first 3 problems.
Like some have mentioned, my time is pretty valuable to me. Some days I only may get 1-2 hours to play and I certainly do not want to spend that time watching some doucheflake teabag my corpse and camp me to no end ruining what time I have available to play.
Plus, this is a story driven game, and that's a big appeal to me. I'd like to be able to enjoy the stories without the headaches that come with playing on PvP servers.
PvP has never worked, nor made sense to me in a MMO. Seldom is there any balance. You have level disparities, gear disparities, class balance disparities, and when the MMO matures, you have usually have sheer number disparities in addition to the first 3 problems.
Like some have mentioned, my time is pretty valuable to me. Some days I only may get 1-2 hours to play and I certainly do not want to spend that time watching some doucheflake teabag my corpse and camp me to no end ruining what time I have available to play.
Plus, this is a story driven game, and that's a big appeal to me. I'd like to be able to enjoy the stories without the headaches that come with playing on PvP servers.
CzarTim said:
This is where I've always stood. I've enjoyed more recently quite a casual environment in PvP centric games, but maybe its because the game has matured so much that the whole hardcorz thing (particularly when levelling) is mainly a pve experience.
Well, we will see closer to launch, I feel like I'm going to have so little time to play this...
Alex
Member
bill0527 said:
Because no competitive game really offers the type of play you can get out of MMO PvP, as close as you really get is something like a DotA-type, which is why there's a lot of cross over between MMO players and things like League of Legends.
It's a very appealing feature to some people. Ultima Online back in the day really nailed it, in my opinion, but it was a very different type of MMO that worked more within the confines of exploring a cutthroat world rather than the modern loot n' levels fare.
Dark Age of Camelot RvR was also magnificent, DAoC was crippled in other areas but they really got a good piece of kit going with RvR and it's trappings. WAR should have followed it up but faceplanted.
WoW had... flashes of greatness, they have the best and most responsive combat system in the genre but they never truly commited to PvP and it's just been butting heads with their see-saw PvE systems for years. Convolution and ridiculous burst and control/interrupts has finally overtaken any fun factor as of Cataclysm. Also, as Rob Pardo himself admitted, arenas were a giant mistake and they've pretty much (along with the above) ruined any future for PvP in WoW as they refuse to back out of them.
Either way, I don't think I'll be trying a world PvP server for TOR, I don't buy into that rhetoric working for a level-based MMO. But I assume the organized fare is open to PvE servers, and that'll scratch the itch fine enough. Hopefully it's a fun diversion and they keep tinkering with it. TOR seems less dependant on the trinity role type, so I think they have some room to grow.
bill0527 said:
There have been a number of PVP MMO's that have worked perfectly. People enjoy PVP because PVE is the easiest thing on planet earth. Fighting another person takes skill, and practice. I also can't really think of many mmo's that launched on a "PVE" engine, and tacked PVP on. Outside of a couple, like LOTRO. Most MMO's people play today have had PVP in mind from the start.
People enjoy PVP in MMO's because it allows you to fight and compete against hundreds or thousands of other people. PVP can be anything from 3 faction RVR in DAOC, to tactical server wide battles in EVE.
It sounds to me like you are just not very good at the MMo you play, and don't like getting killed. Or maybe you are good, but can't handle getting killed. Either way, you will be able to avoid PVP if you like. But trying to take PVP away from players who enjoy it is completely self centered.
Crazypanda_85
Member
Ulchie said:
Sorry to hear that :/ Since I'm in the third year of the Education program at my school, I have to spend two days at a school and three days on campus
It will work out for you, don't let it get you down too much. Before you know it, the holidays will be here.Crazypanda_85
Member
Billychu said:
Thanks. I'll probably do that. Just would hate to not be around as much as everyone else.
Impossible. As much as they can't corpse camp, what if you're trying to complete a quest in a certain area. Patrol the area and bam, you've ruined their agenda for the day. PVP is only fun in the initial few months when the levels of disparity haven't reached the ever widening gaping chasm that we see in MMO's like WoW. After that, you're always either outgeared or outmanned. Fair fights are few and far in between. Most of us value our time. If you don't value your time and you can afford to lose 3 hours to some random world PVP you never have a chance in, then fine. Many of us, however, have jobs and lives to tend to. Our time is limited and that 3 hours could be all the time we have in an entire week to play the game.gatti-man said:
I honestly don't have a case. I could care less what everyone rolls. I was just reading posts and each one was full of generalizations that really don't apply to swtor. The only arguments that could be valid is the new content issue and if you just don't like pvp. That's it.Giolon said:
Epeen just comes off as an excuse.
Giolon
Member
gatti-man said:
There's no reason for someone to corpse camp or grief others than ePeen. I think there's a time and place for PvP - when it's organized, (more or less) fair, and mutually agreed upon by all participants. At least two other people made the argument that it's not all about "oooh I don't like getting killed" - if I didn't, I wouldn't have been a raider for the past half a decade. It's about time - as Ulchie directly above you said, I value my time more than anything else. When I'm questing or exploring, the last thing I want is some asshole and his friends to come gank me and sit on my corpse for the next hour or two. That might be the only 2 hours I have available to play for the day or week!
Your attitude of "oh you guys are just babies and can't handle a little loss" is kind of bullshit. I don't denigrate your choice of server, so don't belittle me for mine.
Rapture
Member
Kalnos said:
I don't really understand how ganking is fun, unless you get some sort of satisfaction from knowing you're ruining someones game experience, In which case shame on you. Also its not like we're talking about another sort of GW or WOW universe here, some people who are new to MMO's will be coming to this game purely for the fact its a very story driven Star Wars title and they've always wanted to run around as Jedi with their friends. I know i have!
RaySpencer
Member
Rapture said:
When I kill someone in CoD, I get a satisfaction that im ruining their experience.
PvP in MMOs is the same.
Rapture said:
WoW had plenty of lore and tons of players played it for the story, though not me personally. If you don't like PvP then role on a PvE server, I really couldn't care less if you don't enjoy the things I do in an MMO. The danger of a PvP server is appealing to me; I can attack other players or be attacked at any moment while PvEing/leveling in the wilderness of the world, it's great.
Ganking isn't ruining anyone's experience, it's participating in a server community type that you willingly rolled a character on.
Giolon
Member
Kalnos said:
This is why having a choice of server is great. Though, ganking does ruin my experience, which is why I don't roll on PvP servers anymore. But I wouldn't advocate banning people who want to do it or abolishing PvP servers.
It's not the same when your assailants are 10+ levels higher and the game mechanics literally make it impossible for you to defend yourself from the attack or fight back (i.e. if you're level 30 and the other player is level 40 your miss chance is 99% and your damage is scaled to 5% etc).Nobiru said:
RaySpencer
Member
Giolon said:
Yeah I guess. I really enjoyed those things when I look back at it now though, it gave me a little extra motivation to level, track that person down and kill them. Or gather up some friends and take them down, which has brought some great stories that we will tell for years.
I can see why people wouldnt like it though. I have the same feelings when wiping on Raids over and over again. I usualy just stay out of raids, and thats the end of it. No arguments needed.
Im sorry if im coming off that way. My point is there isn't corpse camping in swtor so why even bring it up? Also I always rolled pvp in wow and I never was griefed for more than 10 minutes at a time. If you want to have a real discussion drop the exaggerated hyperbole which is my entire point. The pve crowd keeps tossing around a ton of exaggerated negatives we already know aren't in tor like death penalty and corpse camping.Giolon said:
They aren't exaggerated. There have been several times in WoW where I was corpse camped or area camped (where I was trying to quest) for hours at a time. As an adult with responsibilities now, that won't fly anymore. Also, it may not just be one individual corpse camping. Sometimes you meet a string of people all in a row who will kill you on sight.gatti-man said:
Rapture
Member
Kalnos said:
I wasn't implying that WoW was lacking lore, in fact that was why i loved WoW. And i completely agree with you i actually prefer a PvP server, it's more realistic to me, if i see an enemy player of course I'm going to want to attack them. I guess i just didn't make my point clear, i just don't see the enjoyment in going to a low level neutral area and corpse camping players who pose no challenge.
I enjoy making new characters and It happened far too often to me in WoW and i just hope TOR has some sort of game mechanic to avoid getting stuck in those situations so that it doesn't interrupt, and as a result, ruin my experience and waste my time.
Edit: apparently there is already a mechanic in game that helps with this that I'm not aware of? in which case i have no gripes and all is groovy
got2bekidding
Member
Betacake needs to come back. Alterswtor just doesn't have the consistent updates as BC did. I need my fix.
RaySpencer
Member
Ulchie said:
Roll on a PvE server? Problem solved?
gatti-man said:
They aren't exaggerated, at least not in WoW. Just yesterday on the front page of the forums there was a huge thread from a guy who was complaining about not being able to do the new Firelands content because he was followed for an hour and a half by a group of players who kept repeatedly killing him. I think that's his own fault for rolling on a PvP server in the first place. Another thread complaining that people were killing others in the Firelands then riding the Sanctuary line so they couldn't be attacked back. They would come out and kill people, then run back in where they couldn't be attacked. When Cataclysm first launched for about 3 weeks the front page was filled with threads from people who couldn't do the new content because they were outnumbered on their server by the opposite faction. Some of the PvP servers have as much as a 5:1 disparity in faction numbers. In fact, most all the PvP servers have a sizable disparity because the underdogs give up and either pay to move or re-roll on a new server where they are the dominant faction.
I don't mind being killed. I just want a fair fight and I've yet to see a MMO with open PvP that does that very well. Almost always the best you can hope for is that you've got enough friends on line to gather up so that you've got numbers over whoever is griefing you.
I am. Yet some people pop into the thread wanting to ridicule those that are rolling PvE. And as you can see, I'm quite prepared to defend my choice.
AZRandom_guy
Member
got2bekidding said:
Latest Cake update says the new site should be up by tomorrow, but if it's not functional within the next 12 hours he will set up a temporary blog for those who love Cake.
Ok well I've been on a wow pvp server for years and unless you just keep respawning over and over corpse campers move on. If I feel im being griefed I just minimize and read neogaf for 5 minutes and the campers are gone.bill0527 said:
I already agreed the new content camping is a legit reason for not rolling pvp however we don't know what that will be like in swtor since bioware and other beta people have said you can't corpse camp in swtor.
got2bekidding
Member
Sounds good to me. Hopefully he will have a backlog of goodies and it will be like christmas when it comes back up.AZRandom_guy said:
AZRandom_guy
Member
got2bekidding said:
I think Beta said the new site is going to be launching with the fully-completed talent calculator. That in itself would be enough of a backlog to keep me busy planning specs for a week!
I think the argument that you don't play on a PVP server because "my time is valuable", is a complete load of shit. Everyone's time is valuable. That insinuates that rolling on a PVP server, and competing against other players while leveling is a waste of time. It isn't.
In a game like World of Warcraft PVP servers became very popular because they attracted the best players. On average, more top PVE guilds, arena teams and rated BG teams are from PVP servers then any other type. It doesn't mean PVE servers are bad, they aren't. However that is where the attitude came from. Those players then think they are "hardcore" for rolling on a server where the ruleset makes it more difficult to level.
I have played on both PVP and PVE servers. They are both filled with idiots. Camping was pretty much a non-issue. Leveling up it happens a few times at best. I have never been camped for hours either. It happens, but extremely rarely.
Both server types have elitest idiots when you reach max level. I wouldn't be concerned about if my server is PVP or PVE as much as the community I will have to interact with at max level. That is where the massive waste of time comes in.
In a game like World of Warcraft PVP servers became very popular because they attracted the best players. On average, more top PVE guilds, arena teams and rated BG teams are from PVP servers then any other type. It doesn't mean PVE servers are bad, they aren't. However that is where the attitude came from. Those players then think they are "hardcore" for rolling on a server where the ruleset makes it more difficult to level.
I have played on both PVP and PVE servers. They are both filled with idiots. Camping was pretty much a non-issue. Leveling up it happens a few times at best. I have never been camped for hours either. It happens, but extremely rarely.
Both server types have elitest idiots when you reach max level. I wouldn't be concerned about if my server is PVP or PVE as much as the community I will have to interact with at max level. That is where the massive waste of time comes in.
SuperAwesome
Member
If you preorder the game via amazon (physical copy), how does the early game access work? Will I still be able to play the game prior to release, even if I don't have the box in hand?
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