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Star Wars: The Old Republic [Releasing Date: Dec 20 NA/EU - NDA Lifted]
- Thread starter Blackface
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BattleMonkey
Member
Darklord said:
Maybe they have the companions off for demo purposes or they just aren't allowed in Flashpoints? Believe they said companions aren't used in PVP
Tanks. DPS. Heals. Aggro. CC. Loot. Does it have to be so Goddamn committed to the MMORPG status quo?Door2Dawn said:
Bioware seems content to recycle old and ubiquitous mechanics served up in a Star Wars wrapping. But can the market support yet another polished Everquest? WoW blew the doors off using that formula, and then a dozen games tried the same thing and ended up needing a res.
BattleMonkey
Member
Draft said:
None of this is unique or new to MMO or perfected by WoW. RPG's have been using these mechanics for years and long before even video games came along and adopted them from pen and paper rpg sources. In decades to come, we will still be seeing these mechanics being used in rpgs.
BattleMonkey
Member
The mechanics stream from Pen and Paper games and work well in MMO's because it is designed for multiplayer with a person playing each character. Single player RPG's are set up differently usually and since you have one player in control of all roles or a single character often, the games usually have very different style of game play. In a MMO setting such style of gameplay would be harder to achieve and hence why taking from classic pen and paper mechanics of old that it just works flawlessly in MMO environments.
I think its also an area that causes issue when the games come to PVP as the mechanics were originally designed for use in a coop environment, and not for competitive play against other players. Allowing for the switching of character roles and unique pvp mechanics is where I think lot of MMO's show some more unique aspects mechanic wise. Basic pve mechanics will often fall into the same patterns though despite changing how the game is played. Be it turn based, real time, auto attacking queue fests, you will keep going back to the defined combat role mechanics. Want something different? You have to approach it like single player games which have one protagonist character who is capable of doing multiple roles but in the process you lose character uniqueness which is a popular trait of MMO play.
RIFT has a unique set up allowing players to assume multiple roles with a single character because of the soul system, yet it does not change the fact that in group play, players have to still assume a common rpg designation. Someone still has to be the tank, someone the healer, dps, etc. RIFT just gives you the freedom of not being locked down in a singular role with a character which is refreshing.
I think its also an area that causes issue when the games come to PVP as the mechanics were originally designed for use in a coop environment, and not for competitive play against other players. Allowing for the switching of character roles and unique pvp mechanics is where I think lot of MMO's show some more unique aspects mechanic wise. Basic pve mechanics will often fall into the same patterns though despite changing how the game is played. Be it turn based, real time, auto attacking queue fests, you will keep going back to the defined combat role mechanics. Want something different? You have to approach it like single player games which have one protagonist character who is capable of doing multiple roles but in the process you lose character uniqueness which is a popular trait of MMO play.
RIFT has a unique set up allowing players to assume multiple roles with a single character because of the soul system, yet it does not change the fact that in group play, players have to still assume a common rpg designation. Someone still has to be the tank, someone the healer, dps, etc. RIFT just gives you the freedom of not being locked down in a singular role with a character which is refreshing.
Matrix Online did the same thing. It's a solid idea, but the problem is that you don't really get a chance to "learn" the class. It's the same as someone paying a few hundred dollars to farmers to grind their characters up. They don't know what to do with them when they skip the grind.BattleMonkey said:
BattleMonkey
Member
Draft said:
You missed the part about how I'm talking about games long before Everquest came out. MMO's did not invent these mechanics.
I ignored that because we're talking about video games, not pnp RPGs. We're specifically talking about a hugely popular, overstuffed genre of videogames. A genre of videogames that's been aping the granddaddy of the genre for over 10 years, recycling that game's mechanics and counting on... I'm not sure what, to differentiate themselves. A business model that's left a trail of abandoned servers and shuttered development studios, with few exceptions and one spectacular outlier.BattleMonkey said:
fizzelopeguss
Banned
Draft said:
"you think my game's gonna be shit? why don't you come here and say that to my face motherfucker?"
BattleMonkey
Member
Draft said:
So you are just sour on MMO's in general then? It doesn't matter if it's video games or not, since pen and paper RPG's is where the core mechanics and the genre really started from. MMO's especially make use of pen and paper tropes because they share very much in common, more so than you find in traditional single player rpgs which have more flexibility and control when dealing with a single player focus.
The MMO business is risky, there have been failures no doubt and this one is taking a big risk from a investment point of view, but there is obvious gold in them hills that can be made without reaching success on the proportions of the king of MMOs.
I don't get why people are complaining about the archatypes.
Would you rather it be a console game where everyone is DPS?
The MMO genre has more variety in play-style then almost any other when it comes to individual character types.
If you think they shouldn't follow this, then please I would love to know an alternative thats actually viable.
Would you rather it be a console game where everyone is DPS?
The MMO genre has more variety in play-style then almost any other when it comes to individual character types.
If you think they shouldn't follow this, then please I would love to know an alternative thats actually viable.
Outdoor Miner
Member
Draft said:
It is super disappointing in that respect. It seems so weird to turn the Star Wars universe into your typical themepark-raiding-loot grind-halfassed pvp MMO. Can't wait to see what Tier 1 armor sets look like! Not.
I really liked SWG in the beginning and felt that was way more true to the SW spirit than this effort will be. Shame the launch period was such an epic clusterfuck that drove away so many folks and then the big changes killed it off permanently.
So it seems on the Republic side, both Trooper and Knight have an optional defensive specialization for tanking (Vanguard / Knight respectively), and both Smuggler and Consular have an optional defensive specialization for healing (Scoundrel / ???).
In this playthrough it looked like all of them (aside from possibly the Consular's "Sage?") took those defensive specializations; I wonder if that's why the fights took so long but on the other hand they had strong aggro control and minimal danger in terms of anyone coming close to dying.
In this playthrough it looked like all of them (aside from possibly the Consular's "Sage?") took those defensive specializations; I wonder if that's why the fights took so long but on the other hand they had strong aggro control and minimal danger in terms of anyone coming close to dying.
BattleMonkey
Member
Outdoor Miner said:
SWG was great in concept but sadly so much fuck ups ruined it. Lot of bad ideas too (you can be the ultimate star wars cookie maker!... wtf?). SWG also followed the old UO style of MMO design where you have an open world run by players, but with no real content. And later on when they did add more unique game content to the game, you know what they did? Yes, the common rpg archetypes came into play suddenly. And even before the content, combat in the game for pve involved the same archetype role assuming game play. Tanks, drawing aggro, dps, healers, it was all there in the game from day one.
SWG though had something that no MMO to me has ever replicated, and it was the sense of community and social interaction. So much fun to be had hanging out with people in game, and in large part thanks to them having social based classes that had an impact on actual gameplay. I can't believe such ideas never really made it big into any other MMO
JayDubya said:
The knight player was DPS from what I gathered from what was being said by the dev early on in the video as he was labeled the big damage dealer.
BattleMonkey said:
Looked like a Guardian, though. The Guardian's the heavier armor, single saber specialization, Sentinel's the dual wielding DPS sort, though for all we know things aren't as simple as Guardian = Tank, Sentinel = DPS.
It did appear that in that group the Knight was off-tank only in a pinch and was otherwise using flashy mobility powers and big damaging attacks.
The_Inquisitor
Member
Hey guys. Just applied as a consular for the republic. Want to be a healer. Please add me. 
BattleMonkey
Member
JayDubya said:
The builds are supposed to be fairly flexible according to past Q&A on the official site. Assume the dual wielding Jedi would be more optimum DPS build though.
I still don't know what class to pick. Guardians seem to be the only Republic Jedi spec that focus on a single, one handed lightsaber, which I prefer over double bladed or dual wielding. On the other hand, the Trooper seems like a huge badass, but I don't like the fact that I'd be wearing a helmet obscuring my face most of the time.
BattleMonkey
Member
Billychu said:
Consular has single saber usage as well but I guess you are wanting a more active combat role? I have to wonder if the consular can be done as a good non support role Jedi as well.
I would imagine that they would let you turn off helmets in the game visually, most MMO's seem to have that option by defauly nowadays.
I wish more MMO's assume a visual system like LOTRO or DCUO that let you really just turn off any visual option and even change what your gear looks like.
MrBelmontvedere
Member
Blackface said:
LOL!
is that a man? with breasts?
and a vagina/no penis?
@_@
godels rotating universe
Banned
Space, bro.MrBelmontvedere said:
The_Inquisitor
Member
czartim said:
Great. By the time this game is out I will have graduated from college. PLENTY of time to help out raiding.
Edit:
Do we know what raid group sizes will be yet?
I have thought about applying for a guild at this stage but I realise there really is no point for me as when the game launches I would rather sit back and let things develop before associating myself with a guild... not to mention I am Australian and would love to see what Bioware says about 'Oceanic' servers before making a choice
Some info from the Q &A
1. No companions in end game raids and flashpoints
2.No clown armor. You equip different color armor. There is an optional "colormatch" that will even out color.
3.Added world boss to Nar Shaddaa
4.World boss will take "more than a full group to take down."
5.Companion romance arcs are very diverse with "dozens of arcs"
6.Some are classic romances while others are bad relationship with one even cheating on you "after romancing her you will come back to your ship and see a guy leaving it."
7.Smugglers have the most romance arcs
8.IAs have the most sexual options (related IA to James Bond)
9.No non-contextual holidays. (no Christmas, no Thanksgiving, etc.) Only Star Wars holidays.
http://darthhater.com/2011/03/13/developer-meet-and-greet-live-blog/
1. No companions in end game raids and flashpoints
2.No clown armor. You equip different color armor. There is an optional "colormatch" that will even out color.
3.Added world boss to Nar Shaddaa
4.World boss will take "more than a full group to take down."
5.Companion romance arcs are very diverse with "dozens of arcs"
6.Some are classic romances while others are bad relationship with one even cheating on you "after romancing her you will come back to your ship and see a guy leaving it."
7.Smugglers have the most romance arcs
8.IAs have the most sexual options (related IA to James Bond)
9.No non-contextual holidays. (no Christmas, no Thanksgiving, etc.) Only Star Wars holidays.
http://darthhater.com/2011/03/13/developer-meet-and-greet-live-blog/
#9 on the list made me happy...I don't like commercialized holidays infecting the immersion. Real SW Holidays seem like the best thing to use when a real holiday is occurring.
I'm so pumped for Sunday, I hope they're saving the best for last.
Well, say two rare armor drops have funky colours, wouldn't you like to change it so it doesn't look clownish?
Thats what I'm hoping #2 is about...
I'm so pumped for Sunday, I hope they're saving the best for last.
Billychu said:
Well, say two rare armor drops have funky colours, wouldn't you like to change it so it doesn't look clownish?
Thats what I'm hoping #2 is about...
Doncamatic
Member
Not a huge fan of the UI at this stage. Have they made any mention of whether it will be fairly flexible, my point of reference for this being WoW, or if it was more set in stone. Also in the vids from PAX I didn't see any loot/chat panes, with them added the already chunky UI would take up a fair bit of real estate.
That's good to hear. Will be curious to see how the finished result looks/functions.
Speculator said:
That's good to hear. Will be curious to see how the finished result looks/functions.
Speculator
BioWare Austin
FreeFallin' said:
Ah the UI currently showcased at the moment is temp and obsolete actually.
BattleMonkey
Member
Billychu said:
Believe hes involved in the game somehow, he has given lot of info lately
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