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Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U DLC |OT2| Lucas comes out of Nowhere!
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
- Start date
already open.
I hope I have you already added
Captain Rage Quit 69
Banned
W-wait, do I even have you? I don't know if we've played before, my NNID is CRQ-L-07.
Edit: Checked and maybe I deleted you at some point or something, IDK. Sent you a request to accept, I'll make room this time!
Karsticles
Member
A game featuring an Evil Yoshi (redundant, I know) would be interesting.
Shamrock7r
Member
Anonymous Tipster
Member
Huh. Weird. Boshi, the garbage Yoshi the other Yoshis hate is blue.
NamikazeBurst
Member
You guys are starting this whole shtick a little early today.
Karsticles
Member
Snacks the sober sea lion
Member
How dare you speak poorly of Boshi
Who's around to play?
Who's around to play?
Captain Rage Quit 69
Banned
When it comes down to it, I'd say Mario vs. Luigi is heavily dependent on how good each player is in the neutral. Luigi imo has better tools to work with though.
If it were between two equally-skilled players, Luigi wins the majority of the time.
I don't know who's in your tourney, but if they are players around your skill level you shouldn't struggle much to beat them.
Edit: To be fair Boshi was an asshole.
If it were between two equally-skilled players, Luigi wins the majority of the time.
I don't know who's in your tourney, but if they are players around your skill level you shouldn't struggle much to beat them.
Edit: To be fair Boshi was an asshole.
lolez2matt
Member
They are controversial here.
Customs are godlike for Bowser.
I don´t mind them, but I like to use the base moves.
That slash claw that bowser does is awesome btw. <3
Karsticles
Member
Default side B is so bad.
Dash Slash makes him a whole new character. Personally, I don't use customs often.
NamikazeBurst
Member
I don't know if I can still call it good...
Captain Rage Quit 69
Banned
Funny, I didn't know you were a Boshi supporter.
lolez2matt
Member
Default side B is so bad.
Dash Slash makes him a whole new character. Personally, I don't use customs often.
side b was awesome when the game launched! But they had to change the order of dying!!
The enemy is down and bowser is up!!!
Karsticles
Member
Yeah, you are here now. :-(
<3
No, it has always been bad. In Smash Brawl, the move had super armor so you could use it to counter approaches. Now it's just a really short range grab that kills at ridiculously high %.side b was awesome when the game launched! But they had to change the order of dying!!
The enemy is down and bowser is up!!!
Captain Rage Quit 69
Banned
If you want we can take a break. I know I need one whenever I fight Namikaze for extended periods of time... =__=
Shamrock7r
Member
Uh bowser side b kills pretty early
Captain Rage Quit 69
Banned
GGs bro, and no problem.
Karst, we got a new member of the "I hate Yoshi" Club. Population: 90% of SmashGAF.
lolez2matt
Member
I was referring to the kamikaze attack mostly. But, yeah, you need to be hugging the oponent to grab him.
It's so hard to punish yoshi imo. with luigi I gotta do a perfect shield or it's hopeless xD
Shamrock7r
Member
I don't understand the Yoshi hate to be honest. Doesn't seem like that bad of a character
Me neither, but its funny to me, it just sort of became the running gag.
NamikazeBurst
Member
Luigi can't punish anything against anyone.
He's ridiculously overpowered.
/s
Boshi is purple.
I'm helpless vs the dinosaur
Captain Rage Quit 69
Banned
Just wait until you play Namikaze, his Yoshi makes grown men cry. Mine was but a pale imitation. D:
In my case it's not exactly hate but exaggerated complaining over minor annoyances that became a running gag.
IDK about Karst though, considering who he plays his hate might be genuine.
I just did yesterday or the day before yesterday after the fun luigi mirrors me and Namikaze had xD
NamikazeBurst
Member
It is nice to be able to make people older than me cry just by picking a character. Couldn't be easier.
Karsticles was doing really good against my Yoshi last night. Felt like I couldn't do anything when on the ground because my tilts got outranged by everything. We probably went 70/30 or 60/40 for wins. Even when I would get the first stock and only taking 40%, he would make some huge combo and almost win.
Luigi can't even punish Luigi
Anyone want to play?
I'm ready for more salt xD can you pick yoshi? Tha'ts the only way I learn this match up. hours of pain and salt
Karsticles
Member
I've had it fail as a KO move at >100% all the time. Pretty sad for a heavy. It should honestly KO at around 80%. It's harder to land than Marth's tippers, which KO all the time ~70%.
100%, right? Even Nami hates him.
Don't hug too close, though!
You play a top 10 character that can deal with most other top 10 characters.
You're part of the "safe options everywhere" club, so of course you don't understand!Mostly a running gag. It is frustrating when I carefully chip away at Nami's % for 30 seconds in the neutral, and then he hits me once and gets a combo that evens out the entire match. FAIR AND BALANCED.
I actually went even with Nami last night, and the last few times he and I played, the matches were much closer than they have been. It has been ages since he 2-stocked my Mewtwo
but it has been less than 24 hours since my Mewtwo 2-stocked his Yoshi!
The win/loss ratio felt about 50/50 to me. I wasn't keeping track, though. Just saving the "best" replays.It is nice to be able to make people older than me cry just by picking a character. Couldn't be easier.
Karsticles was doing really good against my Yoshi last night. Felt like I couldn't do anything when on the ground because my tilts got outranged by everything. We probably went 70/30 or 60/40 for wins. Even when I would get the first stock and only taking 40%, he would make some huge combo and almost win.
Luigi can't even punish Luigi
Anyone want to play?
You know I saved that match where I spiked Yoshi. FELT GOOD.
I don't know how to ledge guard Yoshi, though, because Egg Toss covers him. Can you help give me advice on that?
Shamrock7r
Member
Lol you're nuts. That's homer thinking. It kills around 90% on platform stages against lighter character, and kills pretty consistently around 110%. I think the move is fine as is.
You play a top 10 character that can deal with most other top 10 characters.
I win pretty consistently with my secondary characters against Nami's Yoshi.
Aside from that though I think the "you play a top tier" is a cop out answer for people who don't want to clearly evaluate what they are doing wrong in the matchup. That doesn't apply obviously to the lowest of tiered characters, but that mid range and up, yea, I don't buy it.
That's what I'm curious about too. and which stages do you want to take against yoshi and which not?
Snacks the sober sea lion
Member
I'll play somebody in a couple minutes.
Karsticles
Member
You only play safe, high tier characters. -_-
Brawler
Ness
Wario
Lucas
All have tons of safe options. Pick some weak characters and see how it goes.
110% is not good for a heavy. Here's the problem:
There's rarely a situation where Klaw will hit but Bowser Bomb will not. Klaw has AWFUL range. Bowser Bomb only comes out 3 frames slower, and it KOs at a % that Klaw SHOULD, which is around 80% on most characters.
Platform stages don't matter, because the opponent should have enough control over Klaw to prevent Bowser from landing on a platform. Additionally, Bowser doesn't really like platforms for the neutral. Flat stages are best for him. I always ban Delfino and Town and City with him, though I wish Delfino wasn't a stage so I could ban Smashville. Lylat and Battlefield are decent, though, just because platforms cover most of the field for Klaw bonus.
There's a reason Bowser is decidedly mid tier in this game. If he wants to do anything, he needs to take a huge risk. Many of those risks have weak payout, like Klaw and Fortress. If he is going to be better, his options need to be better.
Yoshi doesn't like platforms. They mess up Egg Toss trajectory. More platforms = better.
I'll play.
Shamrock7r
Member
you forgot:
Link
Pac Man
Wii Fit Trainer
and lol at you thinking Lucas and Wario are safe, or even Brawler. They have to take risks to kill. I think you are confusing "safe" characters with me just being really good at spacing.
Sorry this sounds like excuses. For someone who doesn't play Bowser regularly anymore, I am pretty able to regularly side B to a platform despite the opponent trying to control the movement. You love to hate on Mewtwo, but imo he is pretty damn solid character that has drawbacks yes, but enough good options to win the majority of matches against players online.
Snacks the sober sea lion
Member
The room is up.
Lucas isn't safe. None of his moves are exceptional in safeness at all.
Shamrock7r
Member
He has one safe move for approaching lol, fair
Karsticles
Member
Pac-man is really safe. Risks to kill? Who gives a shit. My characters need to take risks to DO DAMAGE. Bowser has ONE safe move in his entire arsenal for the neutral. ONE. Mewtwo has 2 or 3, depending on the matchup.
You've used Link like...two matches against me. I don't even remember playing your WFT, and we play a lot.
No, Lucas and Wario are crazy safe. Both have multiple aerials with no landing lag, and safe neutral projectile options.
Mewtwo is ANYTHING but solid. Most of his animations and hitboxes don't match up. If his hitboxes were consistent, he would probably move up a tier. As it is, his jab and grab both whiff against characters that are small all the time. Read the Mewtwo forums on Smashboards sometimes. My opinion is the majority one shared by Mewtwo mains. He can win, but he has to hope lolhitboxes don't mess anything up. Yeah, I walk all over randoms online. Who cares? I can beat 80% of For Glory players with nothing but Shadow Ball (including those with reflectors).
I have nothing to make excuses about. Like I said, I went even with Nami last night. My "excuses" are the opinions universally shared by the people that have played these characters for thousands of matches, not just your dabbling through random select.
LOOK AT THESE BULLSHIT MEWTWO HITBOXES:
https://miiverse.nintendo.net/posts/AYMHAAACAAADVHkNKIXVMQ
If you block the first hit of bomb you can roll away and punish, whereas klaw can't be block and can only be spot dodged punished ( I may be wrong here I play samus so I don't roll lol)
I think it needs a buff to it's range, but I think you're underselling it, because of your insistence to never take bowser to the air. I think fair and bair are really solid tools to deal with spacing and wall out attacking opponents and hit shields, so if you make people conditioned to block aerials approaches you can get klaw ins.
It also helps to land because it beats shields and due to the no landing lag you can throw something out without the fear of getting punished.
Dash klaw is better but this isn't useless at all. Especially now that you have more aerial control and don't risk an sd that much
I think it needs a buff to it's range, but I think you're underselling it, because of your insistence to never take bowser to the air. I think fair and bair are really solid tools to deal with spacing and wall out attacking opponents and hit shields, so if you make people conditioned to block aerials approaches you can get klaw ins.
It also helps to land because it beats shields and due to the no landing lag you can throw something out without the fear of getting punished.
Dash klaw is better but this isn't useless at all. Especially now that you have more aerial control and don't risk an sd that much
The only way a character with that much air control could possibly be considered unsafe is if every single aerial had 20+ frames of landing lag and never recovered midair.
Shamrock7r
Member
Pac-man is really safe. Risks to kill? Who gives a shit. My characters need to take risks to DO DAMAGE. Bowser has ONE safe move in his entire arsenal for the neutral. ONE. Mewtwo has 2 or 3, depending on the matchup.
You've used Link like...two matches against me. I don't even remember playing your WFT, and we play a lot.
No, Lucas and Wario are crazy safe. Both have multiple aerials with no landing lag, and safe neutral projectile options.
Mewtwo is ANYTHING but solid. Most of his animations and hitboxes don't match up. If his hitboxes were consistent, he would probably move up a tier. As it is, his jab and grab both whiff against characters that are small all the time. Read the Mewtwo forums on Smashboards sometimes. My opinion is the majority one shared by Mewtwo mains. He can win, but he has to hope lolhitboxes don't mess anything up. Yeah, I walk all over randoms online. Who cares? I can beat 80% of For Glory players with nothing but Shadow Ball (including those with reflectors).
I have nothing to make excuses about. Like I said, I went even with Nami last night. My "excuses" are the opinions universally shared by the people that have played these characters for thousands of matches, not just your dabbling through random select.
LOOK AT THESE BULLSHIT MEWTWO HITBOXES:
https://miiverse.nintendo.net/posts/AYMHAAACAAADVHkNKIXVMQ
Wario has one aerial with no landing lag. The rest have some, uair and nair its a small amount. So all my characters are safe? Lol. Come on Karst you're better then that.
Karsticles
Member
LOL @ bolded. I feel you. Bowser doesn't roll, either.
The tradeoff between Klaw and Bowser Bomb is kind of like this:
1) Yes, Klaw is safer - not punishable by rolling.
2) However, to land Klaw, you need to be REALLY close to your opponent.
3) Bowser Bomb has huge range (seriously, see how far you can land it).
4) In any situation where you KNOW Klaw will land, Bowser Bomb is the better option because you do more damage.
5) In any situation where you want to make a read, Klaw is harder to land because you need to be VERY close. You can make a read with Bowser Bomb from a good distance away. Most people will roll away from Bowser by the time her gets to Klaw range.
Bowser has awful aerial tools. Any Bowser main (ask Magius and Cronoc here) will tell you that. You only go to the air to land Fire Breath, SHADC, or pursue an aerial opponent.
Jump in Klaw is a horrible strategy. Most players will have rolled away by the time you have completed all of Bowser's slow jump, or they will have just attacked because there's no reason to respect Bowser's aerial approach. Nair OoS will punish everything Bowser can do in the air for most characters, or just shield grabbing since his hitbox is so large.
Why?