Support NeoGAF

[Karsticles]

Karst! This is largely a montage of cool tricks, but this guy seems to play a solid Mewtwo.

Just okay, honestly. A cool montage, but all of those guys could have just...paid attention instead of autopiloting or idling. The fact that he was down so much against Ganondorf in that match is disconcerting. Almost lost to the worst character in the game.

 

[TWILT]

You still up for those games TWILT?

Yeah, sure. Not for too long though. Room'll be up in a bit.

 

[Fandangox]

Shoryu Ken has no end lag?

 

[Karsticles]

Shoryu Ken has no end lag?

Until landing.

 

[Fandangox]

Until landing.

He literally just spammed it 3 times in a row while grounded.

 

[TWILT]

This lag is kinda bad x_x Nothing on your end, Fand?

 

[Fandangox]

Roommate playing LoL which should bpunished with exile at this point.

 

[TWILT]

Yeaaahhh, think I'm done for now. Lags too bad for me to focus properly lol. Some other time, Fand.

 

[Fandangox]

GGs Twilt.

 

[Snacks the sober sea lion]

He literally just spammed it 3 times in a row while grounded.

Input Shoryuken has no landing lag. Have to punish it before he lands.

 

[Fandangox]

Input Shoryuken has no landing lag. Have to punish it before he lands.

Interdarsting

 

[Wyndstryker]

Was bored and did a tourney.

Had a match with a max that I won at last second as we're both falling.

Had a link which u nearly jv3

Finals had a Robin who SD on 2nd stock...

...at least it was enough to pass the boredom lol

 

[Robiin]

Anyone want to play some?

 

[Gucci Messiah]

Really tired of the computer and its frame perfect air dodge bullshit. Doesn't matter if I try and bait it, they only dodge when I actually go for an aerial which means this cheap AI is just reading inputs.

 

[Oidisco]

Taking a break from this game is gonna be harder than I thought. I never realised just how much I was playing Smash until I stopped.

Maybe taking a month break is a little much, so let's say 2 weeks!

 

[NamikazeBurst]

Taking a break from this game is gonna be harder than I thought. I never realised just how much I was playing Smash until I stopped.

Maybe taking a month break is a little much, so let's say 2 weeks!

I didn't play yesterday and I haven't played today. It feels weird, almost like I did nothing at all. I just got a new laptop yesterday so hopefully I can get through some PC games before Smash takes me back.

 

[Karsticles]

Really tired of the computer and its frame perfect air dodge bullshit. Doesn't matter if I try and bait it, they only dodge when I actually go for an aerial which means this cheap AI is just reading inputs.

Dont play AI.

 

[Oidisco]

Dont play AI.

I wouldn't go that far. I'd say play lower level AI if you're just trying to get a basic feel for a character and what they can do.
Nairo's main way of practicing for a long time was by playing the AI, it's how he got good at the game

I didn't play yesterday and I haven't played today. It feels weird, almost like I did nothing at all. I just got a new laptop yesterday so hopefully I can get through some PC games before Smash takes me back.

Yea I've got my speedrunning drive back after getting a little burned out the last few months, so that should keep me away from Smash for a little while. I hope!

 

[Boney]

I'll be back tomorrow so you guys better not quit

 

[Wyndstryker]

I'll be back tomorrow so you guys better not quit

I'm still around, although still in the process of the playstyle overhaul. But at least now it's way more apparent on my style than before. If you saw me play 2 weeks ago to how I play now it'll be evident on how many changes I've done on how I deal with things. A lot more nairs, tilts and quick air phantoms on top of my usual hard read punishes.

 

[Oidisco]

I'm still around, although still in the process of the playstyle overhaul. But at least now it's way more apparent on my style than before. If you saw me play 2 weeks ago to how I play now it'll be evident on how many changes I've done on how I deal with things. A lot more nairs, tilts and quick air phantoms on top of my usual hard read punishes.

Have you been doing fastfall nair to elevator, because you should. Land the nair just right and it's a guaranteed combo!

 

[Fandangox]

After we saw a very dumb "tier list" that put characters on how easy/hard they were to use, we started discussing it and my friends think Bowser takes no skill to use, just that he has no potential.

Kars, Cronoc, I require a thesis by the time I get back.

 

[Karsticles]

After we saw a very dumb "tier list" that put characters on how easy/hard they were to use, we started discussing it and my friends think Bowser takes no skill to use, just that he has no potential.

Kars, Cronoc, I require a thesis by the time I get back.

Executionally, he is one of the easiest characters. He also doesn't have many combos, tricks, or gimmicks to learn. However, Bowser also has nothing safe. He requires consistent difficult reads to win. It is a different kind of difficulty. Sheik doesn't NEED hard reads to win. She just has to abuse frame data and be safe.

 

[AnkiRendan]

Anyone up for some games?

 

[Wyndstryker]

Have you been doing fastfall nair to elevator, because you should. Land the nair just right and it's a guaranteed combo!

I like it, but it's something that I can't pull all the time so it's not very high on my playstyle at this time at least. Trying other things first, more specifically on damage racking and phantom zoning. Especially phantom shenanigans. Quick air phantoms do so much in screwing players who love to jump

 

[Fandangox]

Executionally, he is one of the easiest characters. He also doesn't have many combos, tricks, or gimmicks to learn. However, Bowser also has nothing safe. He requires consistent difficult reads to win. It is a different kind of difficulty. Sheik doesn't NEED hard reads to win. She just has to abuse frame data and be safe.

Thats pretty much what I told them in one line, almosy everythin leaves him open.

 

[Gucci Messiah]

I'll play somebody NNID GucciGAF

 

[Brqan]

nevermind

 

[NamikazeBurst]

Anyone know the inputs to quickly get a reverse back air out? I mostly want to know for the Luigi down throw -> bair. Do I down throw, go backwards, jump backwards, and then bair? Or is it something else?

 

[Karsticles]

Anyone know the inputs to quickly get a reverse back air out? I mostly want to know for the Luigi down throw -> bair. Do I down throw, go backwards, jump backwards, and then bair? Or is it something else?

Down throw, go backwards, jump, Bair. Practice in training mode.

 

[Robiin]

My Fox is getting better.

I didn´t know how much I missed my LAN adapter until I actually started playing with it again. Most matches are basically lagless, or as close to it as possible!

https://youtu.be/B11D34WQ2eQ

 

[Boney]

I'm still around, although still in the process of the playstyle overhaul. But at least now it's way more apparent on my style than before. If you saw me play 2 weeks ago to how I play now it'll be evident on how many changes I've done on how I deal with things. A lot more nairs, tilts and quick air phantoms on top of my usual hard read punishes.

Yaaaay

 

[Cronox]

After we saw a very dumb "tier list" that put characters on how easy/hard they were to use, we started discussing it and my friends think Bowser takes no skill to use, just that he has no potential.

Kars, Cronoc, I require a thesis by the time I get back.

A Bowser player needs great situational awareness and matchup experience. They need to develop the reflexes to jump cancel fortress or JC usmash at opportune times. They must practice Bowser bombing to the ledge, know the spacing to Bowser bomb onstage to ledge cancel, master the pivot grab... in the end, much like any other character, the player must know the right time to throw the right moves out. He doesn't have combos besides the ones he and his opponents' DI create - but with a cooperative opponent Bowser can create some damaging combos.

I feel like I'm getting off track here though. To play any given character takes very little skill. To play a character well absolutely takes skill. To make the reads Bowser needs to win a battle, especially against the top 10 characters, requires Bowser to significantly outplay the other player. Let's say I play a Luigi. Luigi has the ability to take Bowser from 0-60 if not more off one grab. If I win that you better believe I'm playing better.

I don't know what makes a character harder or easier to play anyway. They all have tools and matchups to get used to. Some characters have to rely on players having the reflexes to read DI (Lucas, Sheik, ZSS) to get their combos properly. Some characters are legitimately complicated and have lots of advanced techniques (Rosaluma/Sonic). But the majority of characters are easy enough to play... so I don't really get the question. Most characters' bread and butter combos work at low percents no matter the DI. Is it more skillful for a ZSS to grab me and dthrow into fair at low percent, and dthrow into uair, uair, [optional up b] at mid-percents? Certain characters like Sheik/ZSS/Diddy play the game at a higher speed because of their speedier frame data and movement... so I guess that makes them harder? If I was ranking easiest to hardest, I'd put the most complicated characters first, the higher speed/reflexes characters second, then the rest of the cast (40+) below.

Anyone know the inputs to quickly get a reverse back air out? I mostly want to know for the Luigi down throw -> bair. Do I down throw, go backwards, jump backwards, and then bair? Or is it something else?

http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/Reverse_Aerial_Rush

 

[Oidisco]

The hitbox on Zelda's up-air needs a buff. It should be like project M where her hand has a hitbox that knocks you into the explosion, and also allows her to hit grounded opponents.

Also nair needs to extend lower down her body and fair/bair needs to change. Either make the sweetspot easier to land by making bigger or longer lasting like Melee, make it have less endlag or make the sourspot a little stronger.

And while we're at it, u-tilt should have more hitstun so that it can actually combo. Fuck it lets keep going.

Din's fire needs to be completely changed, don't need to go into detail about that since everyone knows that it's trash.
Phantom is good now, but needs less endlag and more HP.
Farores is pretty great but needs a few changes, main ones being endlag and horizontal movement. The endlag should be reduced a bit so punishes aren't quite as nasty. And make it so you can move horizontally in the air immediately after use. Currently when you use FW vertically on stage, you can't start moving left or right until just before you land. It's awful and has caused me to either get killed or sd many times.

 

[Karsticles]

The hitbox on Zelda's up-air needs a buff. It should be like project M where her hand has a hitbox that knocks you into the explosion, and also allows her to hit grounded opponents.

Also nair needs to extend lower down her body and fair/bair needs to change. Either make the sweetspot easier to land by making bigger or longer lasting like Melee, make it have less endlag or make the sourspot a little stronger.

And while we're at it, u-tilt should have more hitstun so that it can actually combo.

I feel like Zelda is presicion: the character. Everything she has requires precise aiming and placement to work right. I think that's just part of her character.

Her biggest issue is that she just doesn't have any good approach options that aren't projectiles. Fair and Bair should probably hit harder for how hard they are to hit. Her general reward on landing her various sweetspots could be a lot better.

 

[Oidisco]

I like that she has to be precise, but as you said she should be getting much greater rewards for that precision. Some of her moves need to be safer or alot more poweful to help her out.

And give her a faster jab and d-tilt!

 

[Karsticles]

I like that she has to be precise, but as you said she should be getting much greater rewards for that precision. Some of her moves need to be safer or alot more poweful to help her out.

And give her a faster jab and d-tilt!

Completely agreed.

 

[NamikazeBurst]

Down throw, go backwards, jump, Bair. Practice in training mode.

http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/Reverse_Aerial_Rush

Okay, I guess I have been doing it right. Nice to know what RAR means after hearing it on a bunch of streams lately. Thanks to both of you.

 

[Wyndstryker]

Edit nvm something came up

 

[Boney]

I wanna see how good you guys got! I'm ready to play!

 

[Oidisco]

I wanna see how good you guys got! I'm ready to play!

I really wish we didn't have such bad lag when playing

 

[Boney]

I really wish we didn't have such bad lag when playing

Yeah it's a shame...

I did get GC controller adaptor though!

And a Pink Yoshi plushie Amiibo

 

[NamikazeBurst]

Anyone want to play?

 

[Wyndstryker]

Anyone want to play?

I can play a few matches

 

[NamikazeBurst]

I can play a few matches

Alright. I put a room up.

 

[Wyndstryker]

Ggs have to head out soon. Did alot better than expected since I find falco a troublesome match up

 

[NamikazeBurst]

GGs. I would actually say I did a lot better than I expected considering I just started Falco. All those misinputs though... jump not coming out before up-B, getting a fair instead of an uair. Is it even possible to shield Zelda's smash attacks and punish afterwards?

 

[Wyndstryker]

GGs. I would actually say I did a lot better than I expected considering I just started Falco. All those misinputs though... jump not coming out before up-B, getting a fair instead of an uair. Is it even possible to shield Zelda's smash attacks and punish afterwards?

It's possible, but it's situational. Your falco isn't bad at all, and I'm definitely still in the process of overhauling my style. Just havn't had much practice on non FG stages against players with my playstyle tweaks.

 

[NamikazeBurst]

It's possible, but it's situational. Your falco isn't bad at all, and I'm definitely still in the process of overhauling my style. Just havn't had much practice on non FG stages against players with my playstyle tweaks.

Never seemed like I was able to get anything out of fully shielding fsmash as Falco. Not like I fully shielded it a lot. :S

 

[Boney]

GC controller is so awkward... Not having a face button above the B button makes jump canceling a lot harder and having the stick below is super weird now after getting used to the pro controller.

My pad is a little worn out so maybe I should invest in a new one..

Still, I guess it makes tourney life easier but I was fine with the pro controller