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[axisofweevils]

Another one wanting the magic money tree... Sigh...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-36629533?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter (Correct link)

 

[Beefy]

Going to go out on a limb and suggest its because London is the capital city.

But it is also part of the reason they have got in this mess. The rest of the UK are fed up with everything being about London.

 

[Heckler456]

Oh yeah wikipedia is always right ? Haha you're funny.

What are your sources?

 

[tmespe]

Well, as a random addition to this thread, Coldplay in Amsterdam (I was working there) at least said they loved Europe several times. Thanks Coldplay.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roA60XMPz0c Around 0:20.




I am afraid that would involve a lot of negatiations with the EU, in which the UK soon has no voting power anymore since they are not a part of it. Why would the EU simply give in to the UK and change whatever is needed for the UK to remain as it is?

As the financial sector doesn't exactly like uncertainty to this extent (who knows how this goes down in the coming year or years? It is unprecedented), part of the banks could move parts of their operations swiftly to a country that offers them a lot more clarity in the coming times. To them it is simply a matter of what they think would do the least amount of damage.

Just look to Norway to see what kind offer deal you can expect. It's basically like being in the EU with worse terms, and without any real influence. You get to keep the illusion of sovereignty, however.

 

[rodvik]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36630326

I love the way Merkel just walks into the room, smacks Junker & the other assorted cretins upside the head, tells him to STFU and states that there is no rush at all in forcing the UK out and it can be a perfectly pleasant relationship going forward.

Nice to have someone with a braincell back in charge. Now if only we had a leader in the UK who had one, we might be able to get out of this fucking mess.

 

[Rektash]

What are your sources?

History facts are for the weak. What I feel is more important.

 

[R_thanatos]

Oh yeah wikipedia is always right ? Haha you're funny.

This is an historical event. With statement from both france and germany.
This has been recorded , it's widely used whenever the french president is talking about europe.

You're denying easily verifiable facts.

Why do i bother .?? this is ridiculous

 

[cjp]

 

[LordRaptor]

For those in the know, how easy/difficult would it be for the "financial services sector" to relocate to the continent lock, stock and barrel? Would there be a domino effect?

I'm not sure I've asked the right question or, even worse, missed a more important one. But I do wonder about the revenue stream for the exchequer.

Pretty much any services based rather than industrial based multinational that has big enough and nice enough offices all over the planet can up-sticks and relocate wherever they want with basically just some local red tape either end stopping them from doing so.

 

[SmoothOperator]

This is an historical event. With statement from both france and germany.
This has been recorded , it's widely used whenever the french president is talking about europe.

You're denying easily verifiable facts.

Why do i bother .?? this is ridiculous

My car is red but I tell you it's black : If I tell you it's black then it's black.

There are always underlying motives behind every political move : How old are you ?

 

[Biggzy]

Just needed to vent and get this off my chest:

I'm a white, working class northerner and I feel like I don't belong in my own country anymore. Not because of immigrants, but because of my fellow countrymen.

This referendum campaign has been so vile and nasty, with immigrants and European Union being scapegoated as the main cause of all the UK's problems, lies and mistruths being flung from all sides of the debate, the right-wing press has been whipping people up into a nationalistic frenzy and a Member of Parliament was murdered in cold blood. How on earth do we come back from all of this?

Right now I feel scared about the future of this country (socially, economically and on the world stage) and furious that those of us who will have to live with this decision for the longest, have been overruled by those who will not have to face the consequences for anywhere near as long. You can say more young people should have turned out to vote (and I agree with you), but that doesn't make me any less angry.

Like most young people, I've been a citizen of the European Union for almost all of my life and now soon I wont be anymore. Leavers can call it over dramatic all they want, but I used to feel both British and European, and right now I feel stateless.

Leave campaigners were talking yesterday about coming together and uniting the country, but I have no idea how that's going to happen, or even if I want it to happen, because the Britain I've seen over the course of this campaign is not one that I want to be a part of.

You and me both. Thursday's vote has really enabled a large group of people to vent their anger and express their views more publically. This does not go away overnight and I fear it won't because this country's problems are caused closer to home rather than the boogie man that is the EU – so they will not go away.

 

[Volimar]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClzxHjSUgAInUrG.jpg

I mean he's not wrong but it's mostly a product of where he's looking. Confirmation bias at it's best. Doesn't excuse the shit others have been spewing though.

 

[azyless]

Why do i bother .?? this is ridiculous

Yeah, don't bother. Some people are too far gone. If he continues like that he'll be banned soon enough anyway.

 

[kmag]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36630326

I love the way Merkel just walks into the room, smacks Junker & the other assorted cretins upside the head, tells him to STFU and states that there is no rush at all in forcing the UK out and it can be a perfectly pleasant relationship going forward.

Nice to have someone with a braincell back in charge. Now if only we had a leader in the UK who had one, we might be able to get out of this fucking mess.

That's one way of reading it. She's just being good cop during this empasse that'll change closer to her election where domestic politics will require a hard line to see off a challenge from the right (sound familiar)

The German position has already been leaked and it's not good for the uk. Basically it's eea membership aka Norway or nowt

 

[tmespe]

The funds you pay to be part of EEA more than the funds you pay to be part of EU I assume.

But still why wouldn't you want to be in EU since it's the same but better?

Because EU is big, bad and wants to take away our "sovereignty".

 

[Shahed]

They're opposite a pro-immigration protest, as far as most reports go, so you'd probably be fine. Didn't actually see them myself when I was out and about in the Toon earlier, I have to admit (Though was amused to see several of the currency conversion places hadn't even bothered switching their displays on this morning)

Oh at least that's a positive. I'm not really pro or anti immigration. I just don't like the idea of having too many barriers amongst people. There's not much we can do about Language, but there's no reason in my head to put anymore walls between people.

Wonder how this will affact the Toon's foreign players in the Championship! Bigger concerns exist I know but more than any economical or political fallout, that's what I heard people more worried about...

 

[SporeCrawler]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36630326

I love the way Merkel just walks into the room, smacks Junker & the other assorted cretins upside the head, tells him to STFU and states that there is no rush at all in forcing the UK out and it can be a perfectly pleasant relationship going forward.

Nice to have someone with a braincell back in charge. Now if only we had a leader in the UK who had one, we might be able to get out of this fucking mess.

Lol if you think that Merkel is siding with UK on this. She is the master of making soft talk and ruthless decisions a bit later.

 

[nOoblet16]

Anecdotal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oq3qdX2TGps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNmPyXtaa1c

 

[Rodelero]

When Brendan O'Neill tells you he hasn't noticed any bigotry from his side, you shouldn't believe him. It's Brendan O'Neill after all.

 

[slider]

Pretty much any services based rather than industrial based multinational that has big enough and nice enough offices all over the planet can up-sticks and relocate wherever they want with basically just some local red tape either end stopping them from doing so.

I didn't wanna seem hysterical so avoided caveating that!

I wonder if... when it'll begin. Tax breaks for rich banks here we come!

 

[Empty]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClzxHjSUgAInUrG.jpg[/mg][/QUOTE]

the remain campaign has argued some bad stuff in frustration at the result and has been guilty of being patronising and rude to leave voters over the entire campaign but to talk about all the leave voters he knows not saying anything bigoted and to put the burden of hate on them is a ludicrously rosy position.

he seems more interested at kicking his opponents than being a credible-anti racist leaver given what this vote will incite and the rhetoric that has been thrown around.

 

[show me your skeleton]

okay brendan.

 

[Zaph]

So, in short, we get a deal which means (at best):

status-quo in trade
giving the EU a lot of money with no say in how it's used
empowered right wing with no EU holding them back
accepting free movement
more working class unhappy their immigration dream didn't happen and go further right (hello UKIP) to solve all their problems

[img ]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClzxHjSUgAInUrG.jpg[/img]

I love this shit. "I've not seen any in my family, but let me talk about all the bile i've seen on the internet from the other side."

Meanwhile, actual videos of actual behaviour from Leavers paint a very different picture, and significant polling and research makes it clear this is a single-issue referendum about immigration.

 

[R_thanatos]

My car is red but I tell you it's black : If I tell you it's black then it's black.

There are always underlying motives behind every political move : How old are you ?

You're denying the french germany friendship that is in place since 30 years and has always worked so far and is at the very base of the EU , because ????

The motive is Stated ... it's simple and clear. Together , they are stronger , they have the upper hand to negociate .. more poilitical power, more economical power . We have spend 2 war in the 20th century fighting and now we are allies.

SIMPLE , CLEAR , EXPLAINED..

You want a motive ? It's written ! it's stated ... Everyone understood and years later , after both sides have reaped the benefits , you're blind to them ? WTF

 

[SporeCrawler]

So, in short, we get a deal which means (at best):

status-quo in trade
giving the EU a lot of money with no say in how it's used
empowered right wing with no EU holding them back
accepting free movement
more working class unhappy their immigration dream didn't happen and go further right (hello UKIP) to solve all their problems

also loosing the passport to the european financial market. also dont forget that norwegians accepted Schengen.

Norwegians get EU Regulations by fax by the way. and they have to adhere to it. that sounds way more like dictatorship to me

 

[Kathian]

Schengren just isn't a big factor for the U.K. It's only land border with the eu is unmonitored and every other transport method requires identification

Uhm what nonsense. Britain and Ireland are non Schengen.

 

[PJV3]

Brilondland will be beautiful, he's more than welcome to emigrate.

 

[RedSparrows]

And in my echo-chamber, I see loads of idiocy from Leave voters. Boom, boom! The other side is wrong, and childish to boot!!!!1
etc etc etc, ad nauseum

 

[Feffe]

I can't see how a Norway-like solution could work for the UK. It's basically "do what Brussels want without saying anything". Norway has the largest oil reserve in Europe and 1/10 of UK population and can afford it, UK definitely not.

 

[kmag]

Uhm what nonsense. Britain and Ireland are non Schengen.

Er that's what I'm saying

It's a non factor and would be a nonfactor in any negotiations

Hell if it was in place now the only difference would be you could use a drivers license instead of a passport on the eurostar

 

[avaya]

For those in the know, how easy/difficult would it be for the "financial services sector" to relocate to the continent lock, stock and barrel? Would there be a domino effect?

I'm not sure I've asked the right question or, even worse, missed a more important one. But I do wonder about the revenue stream for the exchequer.

You have to separate it out. There's sell-side and buy-side. Sell-side would follow buyside, who are likely to move first. Regardless, the issue is passporting, if that's gone then the UK is no longer viable to do business in (can't access EEA market) and/or the UK becomes costly to do business in.

For most banks, new rules post 2008 and the reduction in certain type of activity means there is severe pressure on net interest margin (NIM). Given that pressure, institutions has become far more spend-thrift on back and middle office spending, which is the actual bulk of jobs. That pressure has already forced some to move those departments to other parts of the UK (south coast, midlands). Without a passport the UK office could be dead in the water or represent a significant cost of doing business. They would need to make that calculation before moving. For some it's already quite simple.

The biggest impediment to people leaving is moving their families. Which is only an issue they will consider for their front office staff who they don't want to lose, however those in front office are also the best paid (those bonuses people speak of) and are in the best position to move.

For the UK government losing the passport means tanking London and if London goes then so does the economy. You can't replace that so it's going to be crucial to keep it. The French especially want to be harsh on the passporting rights, we get too many exceptions.

Regardless of what happens London will lose financial sector jobs, Euro clearing is definitely on the chopping block.

 

[SuperSah]

Can someone give me a brief summary of this Norway deal?

 

[Izuna]

Can someone give me a brief summary of this Norway deal?

Won't happen.

 

[SmoothOperator]

You're denying the french germany friendship that is in place since 30 years and has always worked so far and is at the very base of the EU , because ????

The motive is Stated ... it's simple and clear. Together , they are stronger , they have the upper hand to negociate .. more poilitical power, more economical power . We have spend 2 war in the 20th century fighting and now we are allies.

SIMPLE , CLEAR , EXPLAINED..

You want a motive ? It's written ! it's stated ... Everyone understood and years later , after both sides have reaped the benefits , you're blind to them ? WTF

You still don't get the point do you ? No need to get upset by the way.

If you can't understand why De Gaulle would want to put some of Germany most valuable assets which were Coal and Steel (which are essential to build weapon and armory ) industries in common under the supervision of an organization then I think you still have so learning to do.

Do you still believe in WMD in Irak because it was written in many statements from US officials ?

 

[Lucumo]

So this was the German 100 year plan all along, but this time without a war !

Devised with France obviously.

 

[SuperSah]

Won't happen.

Hahaha, I mean the general deal they have?

 

[kmag]

Can someone give me a brief summary of this Norway deal?

You need to pay into the European Budget. You need to accept Freedom of Movement. You need to enact certain EU Laws and all regulatory compliance without any recourse to the formulation of those regulations and laws. All the while you've lost your place at the table and more importantly your treaty veto. And you've lost the Budget Rebate.

That about covers it

 

[guit3457]

Can someone give me a brief summary of this Norway deal?

http://openeurope.org.uk/today/blog/what-would-a-norway-style-relationship-with-the-eu-entail/

 

[Darkstorne]

Non sequitur thought.

You've actually voted to strip the EU citizenship of not just yourselves and those others eligible to vote, but all those without suffrage under the age of eligibility.

Someone who will turn 18 in the months and years to come during this messy division had no say in losing their place in the Union. And unlike a periodic election there are no backsies. No vote to come for them to regain what was lost.

Good job I guess.

This is why there's so much anger towards the elderly right now. 75% of people 25 and under voted to remain. The young feel betrayed by their elders, and unlike electoral mistakes we can't change course in four or five years time. Younger generations are now permanently locked into a situation they overwhelmingly didn't want.

 

[deli2000]

The leave campaign was so non discriminatory that it failed to win the black vote.

 

[BlastProcessing]

 

[nOoblet16]

Er that's what I'm saying

It's a non factor and would be a nonfactor in any negotiations

Hell if it was in place now the only difference would be you could use a drivers license instead of a passport on the eurostar

Actually forget driver's license, I don't think there would be any checks at all for Eurostar because it'll be one Schengen area to another. Same for the ferry from Dover to Calais but that's about it I think.
When it comes to airports, that is probably where you could get by using driver's license.

 

[Respect]

"I'm a white man and I don't notice any racism, sounds like propaganda to me!"

 

[BumblebeeCody]

Non sequitur thought.

You've actually voted to strip the EU citizenship of not just yourselves and those others eligible to vote, but all those without suffrage under the age of eligibility.

Someone who will turn 18 in the months and years to come during this messy division had no say in losing their place in the Union. And unlike a periodic election there are no backsies. No vote to come for them to regain what was lost.

Good job I guess.

Old people screwing over the younger people who can't vote

Like it or not, the a lot of vocal people who voted for Leave aren't very well educated, are old or are along the thought lines of UKIP and other racist people. Not saying all people who voted Leave are racist but you have to come to terms with the fact you're on the side with plenty of racist and stupid people.

 

[Biggzy]

Can someone give me a brief summary of this Norway deal?

Basically, Norway is pretty much an EU member but isn't - so they have no say how a large number of their laws are made. It is a terrible deal for Norway in terms of sovereignty, but they do have access to the single market - which is crucial to them.

 

[kmag]

Actually forget driver's license, I don't think there would be any immigration control at all for Eurostar. Same for the ferry from Dover to Calais but that's about it I think.

There would always be some id in place from France to the U.K. due to Calais I'd think

 

[The Incarnation]

The leave campaign was so non discriminatory that it failed to win the black vote.

I wouldn't put too much stock in this actually. They can be bothered to separate the Hindu and Sikh voters but not the Afro-Caribbean and African ones.

And a lot of African are Muslims as well, and the vast majority of Afro-Caribbean are Christian.

 

[R_thanatos]

You still don't get the point do you ? No need to get upset by the way.

If you can't understand why De Gaulle would want to put some of Germany most valuable assets which were Coal and Steel (which are essential to build weapon and armory ) industries in common under the supervision of an organization then I think you still have so learning to do.

Do you still believe in WMD in Irak because it was written in many statements from US officials ?

Continue with your outdated worldview and your delusions .i'm DONE with this subject

Spoiler

NEWS FLASH : USSR doesn't exist anymore.

 

[Darkstorne]

The leave campaign was so non discriminatory that it failed to win the black vote.

The Christian vote is interesting. I suspect that's because Christianity is far more prevalent in our aged population, and rare in the younger generation? I have six Christian friends roughly my age (29) and they all voted to Remain.

 

[TheLaughingStock]

I'm not mad about about this. Hopefully UK leaving will push EU to improve itself for all its members. This is an opportunity for EU to evolve in the right place. Obviously I don't know if that will happen, and there's a fear that this creates an opportunity for even more austerity like a certain German loves

And yes, UK deserves a shit deal. That's not punishment, it's simple logic, otherwise might as well tear down the EU right now.

How's the EU going to improve itself by watching one of its strongest members raise taxes and cut spending alongside a concerted effort by bureaucrats to give the aforementioned a shit deal?

Moreover, the last thing I'd imagine supporters of simple logic would want to do is incentive more people to listen to other elites. Like the ones being quoted on Vox, doing TV interviews on outlets like CNN/Bloomberg/Fox, blogging for newspapers, and so on saying the costs are overstated and/or that the EU is a failure. I'd hope they keep in mind people are going to get paid handsomely at the expense of those who want to get tough and cute out of common courtesy.