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Wasteland 2 Kickstarter project by inXile entertainment [Ended, $3 Million Funded]

P

PaulLFC

Member
StoppedInTracks said:
Kickstarting is no problem for me but asking for preorders for a minimum price at this stage of... uh... pre-development analysis is borderline shady.
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Plenty of other games have done this. Why shouldn't they have the option to preorder? They're not forcing anyone to, it's people's own decision whether they want to preorder at this stage or not.
 
P

Pachterballs

Banned
StoppedInTracks said:
Kickstarting is no problem for me but asking for preorders for a minimum price at this stage of... uh... pre-development analysis is borderline shady.
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Nah. preorders aren't at the minimum price. Its $20. Its already a lock anyhow; so it afford johnny come latelys the change to still buy the game. At this point; also, I don't think they're invoiced til the game is ready. Its not like they're not making the game because:

this just in:


Brian Fargo ‏ @BrianFargo
Going into a design meeting now with Chris Avellone and the troop...
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tumblr_lka2l1zhMx1qae6ua.gif
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
it's good that I'll be able to upgrade my tier, because I had to downsize it but I still want that box.
 
MrCunningham

MrCunningham

Member
Talyn said:
He followed that last tweet with this:
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Well, that sounds a little more reassuring. Hopefully large projects like this can push development of the Linux build forward, that they announced last year. I know it is inevitable that it will still happen. But I just hope there isn't a large gap between this and the Windows and Mac versions.

But with that said, Unity is a pretty solid and versatile game engine for development. Seems like a decent choice for this project.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
Seems like a wise choice. Very interesting that they're working on a Linux version with the Unity guys.

Now show them screenshots, damn it!
 
Sentenza

Sentenza

Gold Member
Not really that happy about Unity. Judging from what I experienced so far with it I would say is an underperfoming engine, useful if you want to make a broweser game (which is not the case here).
Also, Unigine guys offered them a free license for this game, I wonder what wasn't so appealing about it.
 
L

LiquidSolid

Member
Corto said:
http://unity3d.com/gallery/made-with-unity/game-list

Not a complete list. From those the ones I know are Rochard and Battlestar Galactica Online. It seems to be a very versatile engine covering different platforms, genres and art styles.

I want those screens. Release the screens!
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Escape Plan's another high profile game but yeah, otherwise it's mostly shovelware.

No clue why they went with this but hopefully they made the right decision.
 
G

Guri

Member
TucoBenedictoPacifico said:
Not really that happy about Unity. Judging from what I experienced so far with it I would say is an underperfoming engine, useful if you want to make a broweser game (which is not the case here).
Also, Unigine guys offered them a free license for this game, I wonder what wasn't so appealing about it.
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Not really. Unity has been used to show browser games because it's marketing. I already used it and it can be great for a project like this.
 
MrCunningham

MrCunningham

Member
hemtae said:
Is/wasn't Unity the thing Dudebro is being made with?
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A variation on the Dude Bro engine, yes. But I think Dude Bro used the free engine, while this one is using the "pro" unity variation that is licensed at a price. It's not a terrible engine though, and it is more versatile than I believe most people think it is. I think it will do fine for an isometric game environment.
 
V

Vamphuntr

Member
I'm not really worried about how the game will look. I'm not asking for a pretty game, something along the line of Fallout 1-2 or the Infinity Engine games would be fine with me as long as gameplay is great and is supported with deep RPG elements.

If they got the license for free for Unity then good for them! They'll be able to use that money somewhere else.

Hopefully we got one of those making of videos at the end of the summer.
 
T

Tobor

Member
Here's the latest update regarding the choice of Unity:

Project Update #16: Unity Chosen to Drive Wasteland 2

Posted by inXile entertainment

We recently announced the choice of Unity as the game engine for Wasteland 2 development.  Many of our supporters are curious about why we chose Unity over multiple other options, and whether Unity is able to meet the requirements of the project.  In this post I will talk about the factors leading to our decision and how Unity addresses the needs of Wasteland 2.

Background

Before diving into specifics I’d like to take a step back and talk about inXile’s approach to game development.  We are decidedly not a technology development company.  We are a game development company.  We pursue game ideas first and then decide what technology to use to best realize our ambitions for the game design and our business goals.  Consequently we have used several different game engines and multiple third party tools and solutions over the past decade.*  There is inevitably some engine-level work that we do to tune the engine for the particular game we are making, but we try to make initial choices that minimize that risk factor.

From a lead programmer perspective, my goal is always to enable the designers to most directly implement their vision by providing tools that keep me out of their way.   That requires analyzing the game design up front, and with budget and time in mind, deciding what technology I should license and what I should write.  I want to license enough and develop enough that the designers have all the tools they need, but without wasting money on overkill solutions, whether licensed or developed.

Wasteland 2

So along comes Wasteland 2 and we began the familiar yet always unique process of identifying the requirements so we can evaluate game engines and tools that will get the job done most efficiently.  The original Wasteland was party-based and turn-based with a top-down POV that relied heavily on text-based story and drama achieved through deep connections and consequences between story and character.  

For Wasteland 2, with the help of our Wasteland fans we decided to keep the focus on story and character, retaining the party-based and turn-based mechanics.  The top down POV would remain as well but we would go with a full 3D render to bring it into the modern graphics era.   During our Kickstarter we also promised to deliver on Windows, Mac and Linux platforms, and to provide support for the modding community.

With those broad strokes on requirements, we began evaluating engines and tools.  

The Influx of Support

It’s been a great pleasure to feel all the support from fans of the game during Kickstarter, and that has continued during our engine and tools evaluation.  Multiple vendors who also supported the Kickstarter came forth with their products, not just to hawk their wares, but to offer genuine encouragement and generous offers of custom support.  Among them were prominent engine vendors as well as specialized tool vendors.  We necessarily must decline some generous offers as we let the game requirements drive us to single solutions in each category, but we do so with great appreciation for the genuine good will expressed in the offers.

There was a broad enough offering just from the vendors that came to us that we prioritized our evaluations to these products first, hoping to find our solution amongst the ones making generous offers and hence help devote more resources to the game.

Development Requirements

Besides the items mentioned above, high on our list of requirements for an engine was ease of use by the artists and level designers for getting assets into the game and editing levels.   We are a small team and must be able to work very efficiently.   This became a first-pass filter when evaluating engines.  Also very important was ease of development for the promised target platforms.   Following a close third was amount of support from the vendor and general availability of expertise for crowd-sourcing, contracting or hiring.  Putting it all together we came up with a list of engine requirements that looked like this:

1.       Ease of use by artists and designers

2.       Targets Windows, Mac and Linux

3.       Support and expertise available from vendor and in community

4.       Adaptability for player modding

5.       3D rendering, pathing, AI, physics, character animation tools

The 3D rendering and other game systems at the bottom of the list are very important as we plan to make a great looking game with physics and effects.  But these things, at the level we need them, are commonly provided by full-fledged engines, so they end up lower on the list in terms of differentiating factors.

Given the top down POV and camera height required to show a party of characters and enemies, it would be overkill to spend too much of our resources on detailed character models and all the cutting-edge rendering and animation techniques associated with that level of detail.

If we plan well, then we can put just the right amount of resources into modeling and animation so that it looks great from our camera POV without wasting effort on detail that will never be seen.  Then we can spend more time working on other enhancing effects that will be noticed from or POV, such as physics for ragdolls and flying debris, and the fire, smoke and particle effects for the gunfire and explosions that cause those ragdolls and flying debris (hopefully for your enemies and not your party of rangers). 

Unity

Unity Technologies, with their Unity 3 game engine, was among the vendors that came to us with congratulations, goodwill and offers of support.   Their engine stood out as an early front-runner on point 1 of our requirements.  The artists loved its support for the native formats of the art tools we already use (3DS Max and Photoshop).   I also like its built-in version control for assets and code.  

At first it seemed to be missing a leg on point 2 (support for Linux platform), but I knew that we could get source code and therefore could provide the Linux port ourselves.  Given that the engine is designed and structured to support multiple platforms, I felt it would not be insurmountable to port it to Linux (or actually hire some outstanding external contractors we’ve used before to do the job).  After talking to Unity about this, we found they’ve already been working on a Linux port, so Unity is supplying inXile the Linux port alpha source code.  InXile will work with Unity in order to port Wasteland 2 to Linux.

Where Unity really bowled us over was on point 3.  Besides generous support available from Unity staff, the Unity Asset Store is a treasure trove of assets (3D models and code) provided by the large and growing community of Unity users.  A recent Unity newsletter announced that the Asset Store customer base has topped 100,000, and the catalog has reached over 3,000 packages!   We’ve been able to find all kinds of useful 3D assets and code in the Asset Store ranging in price from cheap to free!  Having an organized marketplace like the Asset Store for finding assets and expertise fits right in with our desire to leverage and give back to the community.   While we cannot share engine source code changes, we can share script code and components, as well as graphical assets as part of our modding support.

On the Modding front, we always figured we would have to provide custom tools to users, so we didn’t rank modding support high on our list of engine requirements.  We’ve also had generous offers from the Wasteland community of coders to help with developing those tools.  And yet I think the fact that Unity provides their basic engine/editor for free is a big plus as a starting point for providing the tools necessary for supporting modding of Wasteland 2.  And there again, I think the Asset Store will facilitate ongoing collaboration with the community on modding tools that can be offered in the store for free.

Finally, from looking at Unity demos, other games developed with Unity, and conducting our own art and coding tests, we are convinced that Unity delivers on the game system that we need to build Wasteland 2 in style.  This includes advanced 3D rendering, pathing, physics (PhysX), multiple options for scripting language, advanced 3D level editor that is customizable with scripted components, and much more.

Summary

In summary, Unity hits the sweet spot for us defined by the specific requirements of the Wasteland 2 game design, deployment plan, and the unique circumstances of the development effort which includes community involvement on an ongoing basis. 

It has been my experience over decades of game development that no engine or tool is ever perfect for the game you want to build.  Any engine or tool will have points of weaker comparison to other options, but you have to evaluate how the whole offering matches up with your resources and skills to make a good choice for the project at hand.  Unity is an excellent choice that will allow us to deliver the great game we’ve promised in Wasteland 2.

Best Regards,

John Alvarado
Director of Technology
inXile entertainment

*Technology inXile has used:  Snowblind Engine, RadTools, UE3 Engine, Gamebryo Engine, RKEngine, and various smaller third-party tools for game sub systems such as, path-finding, physics, character animation and lip-synching, etc.
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P

Phoenixazure

Member
Nice to see them use Unity, its a very easy game engine to use comparatively (made my student project on Unity, a 3rd Person flight Game ala Rogue Squadron). Wish them all the best and want to see how they utilize the engine.
 
MrCunningham

MrCunningham

Member
zkylon said:
Reasoning is sound and they're not forgetting about modding. Good update.
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Indeed, sounds like they are making the best out of the unity engine. It's also great to hear that the Unity developers gave them access to the Linux alpha. That would really save them a lot of legwork.


HP_Wuvcraft said:
It's sad that there are people upset that it won't look exactly like Wasteland 1.
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I really hope they show us some screenshots soon of a WIP. I'm really curious to see what it will look like.
 
A

Aselith

Member
TucoBenedictoPacifico said:
Not really that happy about Unity. Judging from what I experienced so far with it I would say is an underperfoming engine, useful if you want to make a broweser game (which is not the case here).
Also, Unigine guys offered them a free license for this game, I wonder what wasn't so appealing about it.
Click to expand...

More than likely they offered the engine free for publicity. This would be a high profile game on their engine. Goes a long way towards getting others to use it also.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
I also just got my email asking for shipment details :)

I kinda wish I had pledged for the boxed copy that's signed by MCA but my cash flow's not doing so well these days, so this'll have to do :p
 
M

Madrugador

Member
I just got a survey asking which country do I live in and which version I want (Windows, Mac or Linux).

I only pledged $15 by the way, so it's not about shipping.
 
M

mclem

Member
Madrugador said:
I just got a survey asking which country do I live in and which version I want (Windows, Mac or Linux).

I only pledged $15 by the way, so it's not about shipping.
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At the $150 level, it was full address, country, platform and name to appear in credits.
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
Being without a publisher doesn't just give you freedom to work how you want, but to say what you want.

Listen, I would go on press tours and be told in extremely strong terms to avoid using certain words. I wasn't allowed to use the word 'dungeon' when I was talking about Hunted: The Demon's Forge. I was unable to use the word. You get kinda stifled, you know? On one hand, they're paying the bills so I'm trying to be respectful; on the other, you end up going through these scenarios you're not comfortable with. If you don't stay to the script, you get these nasty emails if something wasn't said right so after a while, yeah, you don't want to talk to anyone anymore because it's not worth the fear of repercussions.
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ugh...
 
M

mclem

Member
MightyHedgehog said:
Kickstarter blowin' up.
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I assume he meaks the 4.5k were the projects live at the same time as him. That is, I'm wondering how staggered the queue is; it might be that that 70k is the lineup of projects for the next year or so or something, which would put the amount of concurrent projects at 6k.
 
I

Ignis Fatuus

Banned
HP_Wuvcraft said:
Aaaaaaand their fanbase just found out they are on Origin.
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In practical terms I guess putting it on Origin makes sense, but it does rub me the wrong way to see Brian Fargo singing the praises of EA of all publishers after just having taken a few million dollars from Kickstarter. If EA is so wonderful and their relationship so deep, why won't they release the rights to the original Wasteland code? It's not like they're ever going to use it for anything.
 
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