Did Obama have any debates for his primary in 2012?
PoliGAF 2015-2016 |OT3| If someone named PhoenixDark leaves your party, call the cops
- Thread starter Diablos
- Start date
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Unless it's all Reagan era Strategic Defense Initiative references.
Hexa
Member
Retromelon
Member
I knew it would be a hit.
RustyNails
Member
Trump already setting sights on Hillary.
It's on.
It's on.
Tarkus
Member
RustyNails
Member
Marco Rubio Pushes to Block Low-Cost, High-Speed Broadband
Relevant part quoted. A new American century ladies and gentlemen
Aaron Strife
Banned
Rubio is Yugi, Karl Rove is Yami Yugi
Trump focus group
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-voters-are-loyal-to-donald-trump/
Complete adoration
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-voters-are-loyal-to-donald-trump/
Complete adoration
Oh man, that would be sweet.
I should have totally started a parody thread about it in the OT, that would've been a worthy hill to die on.
And while we're at it, as stupid as the SDI was, it gave us probably the greatest military acronym ever - Compact High Energy Capacitor Module Advanced Technology Experiment or CHECMATE.
Okay, the greatest acronym this side of ASRAAM
Black Mamba
Member
Remember when these same voters complained about the cult of Obama?
RustyNails
Member
I can't believe Kasich said that.
I would certainly give your debate thread a go.
I don't expect the anti-science party to have much acumen for statistics, so it's in keeping with my expectations at least.
The first one is the worst. Like nothing happens - Luke's parents are killed, they rescue Leia, they destroy the Death Star, and the movie is over. The big lightsaber duel looks like kids playing with cardboard tubes. They give Luke command of an X-wing squadron because he shot animals at home.
Hexa
Member
It's the only one that doesn't take itself so seriously, which is why I like it.
And what do you mean nothing happens?
He save a space princess and blow up a space death star and kill a bunch of space nazi and get space medals for it.
It's not this amazing story or anything, but a proper one for a silly romp if you ask me.
I still don't think it's great or a masterpiece, but it works pretty well, and I loved it when I was 8 (which is the perfect age to enjoy those movies if you ask me).
You know if someone asked me whether I thought Trump or Clinton were more honest, I would say Trump because I don't really think he has a filter and will say what he honestly thinks, whereas Clinton is a politician at heart and knows exactly what to say and when. It's just what Trump says is batshit insane.
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
So do you think he believes his own lies?
I don't think this is right. I mean, maybe he's more genuine than Clinton, but I don't know that Trump is particularly honest. He sounds like a couple MBA types I know when they're trying to sell something. He bullshits constantly. It's not so much that he's lying but that he just doesn't really care if what he's saying is true.
Pretty much. He strikes me as every businessman I've ever talked to for work, he's always on and always selling. He basically so full of his own shit that he doesn't know how to turn it off.
Trump is absolutely calculated in his speeches. His style is hyperbolic and extemporaneous which makes it seem like he is being "honest" but his intentionally vague language, who and what he chooses to address, how he dismisses criticism, and the few real positions he's taken are as politically driven as any speech by any other politician.
Basileus777
Member
We're still get a fair amount of RV polls and those tend to be the ones Trump does better in.
vicissitudes
Banned
Exactly. It's so ridiculous when Bernie supporters are mocked for defending Trump, when Trump is a lot more similar to Bernie than Hillary is in many ways.
Honesty:
- Bernie is honest and believes in his convictions, even if politically unpopular
- Trump is honest and believes in his convictions, even if politically unpopular
- Hillary is dishonest and take positions when politically expedient
Outsider:
- Bernie has not been part of either establishment party for the past ~30 years and only recently started to caucus with Democrats
- Trump has not been part of either establishment party for the past ~30 years and only recently joined the Republican party
- Hillary has been a Democrat since her college days and is seen as a lifelong establishment Democrat
Funding:
- Bernie is not taking any PAC money and relies on small donations, does not cater to lobbyists
- Trump is not taking any PAC money and is self-funding, does not cater to lobbyists
- Hillary has been taking huge sums of PAC money, is friendly with Wall Street and big banks
Endorsements:
- Bernie has almost no endorsements, relying on strong polling in early states and caters to the people
- Trump has almost no endorsements, relying on strong polling in early states and caters to the people
- Hillary has an overwhelming number of endorsements, giving the appearance of a "coronation" which is off-putting to most
Ideology:
- Bernie proposes more extreme, radical ideas which represent real change and energizes the base, bringing out huge numbers and rallies
- Trump proposes more extreme, radical ideas which represent real change and energizes the base, bringing out huge numbers and rallies
- Hillary proposes middling, "me-too" compromises which excites no one
If you are a Bernie supporter, purely logically speaking, Trump is clearly the #2 choice if Bernie does not get win the primaries, with Hillary a distance 3rd.
Macho Madness
Member
You left out policy.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
If you value the ideal of honesty over the content of that honesty to such a degree that you would support trump for being honest in his racism and xenophobia than I...don't actually know what to say. Honesty is not some kind of virtue in and of itself. Honestly saying horrible things is not a positive trait.
First of all, I think Trump is an opportunist, he changed his views many times and has positioned himself very differently based on what was expedient to him. Sanders if nothing is not consistent (at least on the big issues and his priorities).
But more importantly, I reject the idea that your distance of your positions from an imaginary "center" point is an important trait of who you are politically.
Trump and Sanders are nothing alike, and while it is possible that there can be some people who would take both Sanders and Trump over Clinton, I can't imagine their number is going to be significant (and if someone like that exists on GAF, I would like to talk to them, because to me it doesn't make a whole lot of sense, and I'd like to understand where they're coming from).
No. There's nothing "purely logical" about that flow of logic you just attempted, especially when we get down to the things that matter (hint: it's not the fluff you typed up there).
Hexa
Member
I think that's a good description. He isn't lying about what he believes or flip flopping. He just doesn't really believe in anything.
DOWN
Banned
My dad had a show on Fox News playing simply called "Justice" and the host played clips of people in the streets saying that the president isn't protecting us but then one woman was like "no we're not safe but you can't judge all Muslims based on a few bad ones" and then the host yanks the mic back because you can't end an answer like that! And she goes "WELL JUST LIKE YOU CANT JUDGE ALL GUN OWNERS BASED ON A FEW BAD ONES" and then they go back on topic. and then she later is saying how gun bans are ineffective and Chicgo is the most gun riddled place despite banning guns because all the criminals get guns so there shouldn't be gun bans. Then she goes back to the streets and is like "WE SHOULD BAN ALL THE MUSLIMS RIGHT?"
So don't judge all gun owners based on a few and total bans don't work for those who sneak through anyway, UNLESS WE ARE TALKING ABOUT MUSLIMS - BAN EM ALL
So don't judge all gun owners based on a few and total bans don't work for those who sneak through anyway, UNLESS WE ARE TALKING ABOUT MUSLIMS - BAN EM ALL
Judge Jeanie. All she does is yell. She's the Nancy Grace of Fox News, but racist and an idiot.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
If you're not muslim, black, gay, an immigrant, a refugee, suffering from an illness that requires expensive treatment, a college student hoping not to drown in debt or in poverty then yeah, sure, the differences between Sanders and Trump might be an afterthought. If the only concern you have for a candidate is their persona and position within the political world then, sure, there are similarities. If you belong to any of the aforementioned groups though, and even if you don't, you should really pay attention to their stances on specific issues and not just the way they're presented. One candidate is hugging muslim people at rallies and the other is calling for a ban on all muslim immigration. How is that a superfluous difference to you?
Trump is only a good second choice if you literally don't give a shit about anything Bernie has been talking about. The two could not be further apart politically.
A lot of people seem to like the idea of Bernie more than what he actually says.
At lol at the idea Trump is honest and believes in his convictions even if politically unpopular.
Mind you that's a fair bit easier when he always seems to find himself in a party where those convictions are popular, isn't it?
When he was a Democrat he was pro choice, pro drug legalisation, wanted gun control (specifically assault rifle ban, background checks and waiting period) and felt the US should move towards universal healthcare.
When he became a Republican and started running for President he repudiated all those positions.
At lol at the idea Trump is honest and believes in his convictions even if politically unpopular.
Mind you that's a fair bit easier when he always seems to find himself in a party where those convictions are popular, isn't it?
When he was a Democrat he was pro choice, pro drug legalisation, wanted gun control (specifically assault rifle ban, background checks and waiting period) and felt the US should move towards universal healthcare.
When he became a Republican and started running for President he repudiated all those positions.
Aaron Strife
Banned
Yeah Trump is a great alternative to Bernie
$illary mirite
if you're stupid
$illary mirite
Wanders into PoliGaf......
I mean I hate to be rude or disrespectful but.......c'mon man! Really?
I don't know why the media makes such a big deal out of it, I mean we've seen people from Jersey cheering for worse organizations than Al Qaeda.
I think everything posted is fairly accurate aside from the part where Trump support necessarily translates to Bernie support. Otherwise Trump is fairly honest for a politician and does have some things in common with Bernie.Wanders into PoliGaf......
I mean I hate to be rude or disrespectful but.......c'mon man! Really?
vicissitudes
Banned
Policy doesn't matter as much, honestly, because that's mostly up to Congress. You think that Bernie will get half the things he wants to get done? Probably not, even if he gets elected. Same with Trump. No way his Muslim ban will actually get through, not to mention there's no way to even realistically implement it.
What's more important is energizing the voting public, and getting more people involved in the political process, so real change can be made. Once voter turnout increases, then depending on how the general public votes in the Congressional races, that will then shape policy. Hillary simply guarantees the same gridlock that we've seen for the past eight years; business as usual.
Besides, Trump and Sanders actually share similar positions on many issues that are simply overlooked:
Marriage equality:
Trump:
Respects the court's decision: "Some people have hopes of passing amendments, but it's not going to happen. Congress can't pass simple things, let alone that. So anybody that's making that an issue is doing it for political reasons. The Supreme Court ruled on it."
Donald Trump most LGBT-friendly Republican?
Bernie: Long time supporter of LGBT rights.
Ecnomy:
Trump:
Trump is against Wall Street and wants to tax hedge fund managers more: ""They're paying nothing, and it's ridiculous. I want to save the middle class"
"The hedge fund people make a lot of money and they pay very little tax," Trump said in an interview Wednesday with Bloomberg. "I want to lower taxes for the middle class."
In short, Trump is willing to raise taxes on himself and those like him.
Bernie:
Against wall street and wants to tax corporations more. Wants to transfer more wealth to middle class via tax policies.
Trade:
Trump:
The TPP should not be supported and should not be allowed to happen.
Bernie:
The TPP Must Be Defeated
Drugs:
Trump:
States should be allowed to legalize marijuana
Bernie:
"In my view, states should have the right to regulate marijuana the same way that state and local laws now govern sales of alcohol and tobacco."
Foreign Policy:
Trump:
"I Would Have Never Been In Iraq"
Bernie:
Bernie Sanders opposes Iraq War
Super PACs and Election Funding:
Trump:
"A lot of PACs are crooked business," Trump said.
"I don't want anybody from PACs. I don't want any money."
Bernie:
Bernie Pledges Not To Accept Super PAC Support
Gun Control:
Trump:
Supports 2nd amendment but also supports background checks. Need to fix the mental health system.
Bernie:
Believes in middle-ground legislation. Supports background checks. Wants to keep guns out of mentally ill.
Healthcare:
Trump:
Trump pushes single-payer healthcare, taxes on wealthy
Bernie:
Supports single-payer healthcare
Some of the differences between Trump and Bernie come down to the more radical ideas that will likely never get implemented anyway, like the Muslim ban, building a wall for Trump, or free College for all, and <=90% tax rate for Bernie.
titiklabingapat
Member
What is up with Bernie supporters and long blocks of texts?
JesseEwiak
Member
Hey, Muslim people will feel far less welcome in this country, but Trump lies and says he's kind of close to Bernie on some issues (BTW, Trump actually released a tax plan - guess who got tax cuts - spoiler alert - hedge fund managers did), so that's worth it!
As far as foreign policy, right, Trump just wants to invade Syria, destroy ISIS, and take their oil. Total peacenik!
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