kiphalfton
Member
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The battle over Gamestop is getting really interesting
- Thread starter LordOfChaos
- Start date
hollams
Gold Member
Is it illegal what the hedge funds tried this week by trading amongst themselves at low volumes to drive the share price down. You could see exactly when it started as the stock would go down 100-150 points in about 30 seconds. This happened multiple times. I guess it's hard to prove but that just seems wrong and unethical.
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420bits
Member
Wallstreet don't give a fuck. the whole thing is a scam and built on fucking regular people over. You think they will play by any rules?
thismeinteil
Member
Well, it looks like Elizabeth Warren is on the side of the hedge funds. Here's what here letter to the SEC said...
"I am deeply concerned that these casino-like swings in the value of GameStop and other company shares are yet another example of the gamesmanship that interferes with the 'fair, orderly, and efficient' function of the market, raising obvious questions about public confidence in the market and those trading in it."
She wants to know how they'll prevent this "market manipulation" in the future. Seems like every other politician in Congress appears to be siding with the retail investors. It'll be interesting to see how the government actually acts on this issue. I'm still expecting a tiny pinch on Wall Streets hand, possibly with a bailout, and a giant slap across the face for future retail investors.
"I am deeply concerned that these casino-like swings in the value of GameStop and other company shares are yet another example of the gamesmanship that interferes with the 'fair, orderly, and efficient' function of the market, raising obvious questions about public confidence in the market and those trading in it."
She wants to know how they'll prevent this "market manipulation" in the future. Seems like every other politician in Congress appears to be siding with the retail investors. It'll be interesting to see how the government actually acts on this issue. I'm still expecting a tiny pinch on Wall Streets hand, possibly with a bailout, and a giant slap across the face for future retail investors.
*Nightwing
Banned
Yes but it is a calculated risk. They will face fines in the millions, but managed to save billions with thier illegal shenanigans so it's economically the right move for them to make.
Edit: and here in America they will easily afford the best attorneys to stay out of jail
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BigBooper
Member
Truly a candidate of the people. She really had people fooled.
quickwhips
Member
and its back down.
Shmunter
Member
What do you mean? It's climbing steadily.
No guarantees it will continue of course, just saying what I'm observing.
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quickwhips
Member
When I looked it was dropped on coinbase. Just a little humor
The Gorby Congressmanz
Banned
That's not how this works. Millions of 1/29 calls were sold or were worthless on Friday. The stock jumped multiple times in a 1.5 week period, you can't expect the same guys to be able to afford to jump back in with "reinforcements" only those who think strongly enough the stock will rocket another $150+ and made gains or already have a good amount of money would join in.
Most likely the vast majority of the 1/29 call holders have no interest in reentering, can't reeneter, or already have lost their money or are in debt because they were on margin.
This goes for new regular joes looking to jump in, they would need over $1000 to get 3-4 shares, and they would need over $4-5000 to buy option before close yesterday. On Monday this situation barely changes if the stock crashes but a good number of option buyers hold, and changes for the worst if the stock launches. it's too high.
You're making the unrealistic assumption Gamestop is still where it was 1.5 weeks ago where a person could still salvage some stuff and join in some way, that's gone, and most of the 1/29 call holders are gone, and some of the people who held other calls also sold, and some people sold shares, this isn't a monolith.
People really don't get that the "fight" as they say is over. Some major big investors and firms pulled or cut positions, and some may also do that as well, because many are going to start preparing to make money when things reverse.
The Gorby Congressmanz
Banned
If you're talking pre-market than if your broker supports it yes, but only shares.
Blackrock has been in for a long time and so have some of the other, they didn't drag GS above $14 before, you have no idea how this works, them staying in doesn't hedl hold-the ling to PROP UP the value of Gamestops stock prices, and some of those guys are slowly hedging because they are expecting it to drop which also makes this point of view pointless.
Most new larger investments from firms and rich individuals are targeting a drop, only a small amount jumped in, and that was during the broker blocking scandale on Thursday, some of them pulled or cut on Friday.
Retail will try to keep it in its current range on monday but a lot of support is gone, millions of calls 1/29 are gone, you can't make up for that in pre-market on monday and the price is too high for a lot of those same retailers to jump in and the average joe who was eyeing gamestop is likely not able to help at a $300+ a share price point or $4000 for ONE of the FARTHEST and CHEAPEST call options available.
brains people use them.
LordOfChaos
Member
If you're not on one of the American brokers that restricted them, there's been no problem.
I don't know America brokers but anyone who doesn't use Citadel as a market maker. I've heard that Fidelity, Vanguard, and Merrill are all confirmed OK and I think Schwab should be as well.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
If the volatility keeps up, there are still opportunities to get in under $300 and possibly even under $200. There are also fractional shares.
Most people in it believe that the squeeze has not even truly begun yet. If the price can be kept above $200 ~ $300 each day, it will main a lot of pain for whoever still has short positions.
Then again, that's assuming that there's no illegal collusion going on in which the hedge funds and such simply don't have to pay any interest on their short positions and are never asked to return them until the price is way down.
Do you have any data showing that it was mostly the 1/29 calls that were propping up the price? Just wondering why you are so certain of this. I already closed my GME position, but I think there's still a situation where this thing skyrockets and I hope it does.
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The Gorby Congressmanz
Banned
It seems you haven't been paying attention to the prices while also trying to argue semantics, while also bringing up the worthless feature of fractional shares. We have statics for average income and connection to the stock market, most people don't have $200 to throw on more than one share either, $200 is ONE share. Then options are vastly more expensive than that currently. Fractional shares won't really do anything and you'd have to have half at minimum to even have a chance of worthwhile gains which is still $100+ so this is nothing but trying to find excuses while ignoring the likely reality of what's about to happen on monday, or if they hold it steady to prevent a hard drop, tuesday.
Most people investing in Gamestop don't even know about the Squeeze, they see people making money and the numbers go higher and jump in. Your projecting what you believe or what a more niche part of the market (reddit etc) believe over the general populace which doesn't even make sense.
You are also falling for the manufactured information that Hedge funds are the only ones o mostly the only ones involved in shorting this. Other people with tons of cash and several organizations and firms have shorts or puts while still retaining their investments. Which they will quickly switch to when things look like it's going to move the other direction.
Which I never said, implied or hinted at. I never once said that 1/29 calls were propping up the price (though obviously they contributed) I said they ARE GONE because those calls EXPIRED, or people sold before close. Which means millions of people are no longer in GME.
Again i don't see why that part is confusing, it's harder to fight a battle if you have more people hedging and you lose millions of people helping hold the line. That's a lot of money no longer in the game, which many of which won't be able to come back in, and if they are option only they wouldn't be able to come back in until AFTER open on Monday even IF they wanted to.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Sorry, man, but I think you are wildly underestimating how much attention this is getting. It's gone mainstream. It's all over the popular YouTubers and Blue Check Marks on Twitter. The word is getting out and this squeeze opportunity is being distilled into easier and easier to understand messages that are being circulated at a rapid pace. And while you may think wallstreetbets is niche, their sub has grown from 600,000 at the beginning of last week to just about 7 million as of this morning. People are getting the info.
No, I don't think it's only the hedge funds, but I do think the institutional investors, even if typically competitors, will not hesitate to temporarily band together to squash an uprising of poors given the opportunity.
Why wouldn't they jump back in, especially if Monday doesn't see the whole thing collapse? I've jumped in and exited GME twice and made a decent amount of money (by my standards). I'd be fine losing half of my profits and fully intend to get right back in if there is an opportunity come Monday and my funds clear to my new brokerage account.
Who knows, you might end up being completely right about this, but I think you're underestimating just how much of a meme this has become and how powerful that can be. Still, if you are so confident in your wisdom, maybe you should short the stock.
Raven117
Member
You should try it yourself.
the staying in obviously props up the price (not pump it). Of course they are hedging as well. But if they wanted this party to be over, it would be over.
It's like you kinda know what you are talking about but missing the bigger and obvious parts
UnravelKatharsis
Member
A.Romero
Member
Truth is nobody knows what will happen so it's not a good idea to play with money you can afford to lose.
If the market was so easy to read, everybody would be rich by now.
Maybe it's an illusion, maybe not. Most regular folks never even have a chance to participate in something like this. To me is worth it to try.
I think they are in trouble, otherwise they wouldn't dare to do all the shit they did this past week and bring all the attention on to them. Will it result in wealth re-distribution? Maybe. I hope so.
If the market was so easy to read, everybody would be rich by now.
Maybe it's an illusion, maybe not. Most regular folks never even have a chance to participate in something like this. To me is worth it to try.
I think they are in trouble, otherwise they wouldn't dare to do all the shit they did this past week and bring all the attention on to them. Will it result in wealth re-distribution? Maybe. I hope so.
Buggy Loop
Gold Member
Is this guy for real? Brokers are literally choking on capital and restricting trades, IBK CEO goes on TV to say that brokers might die off and they have to protect the house.
63k calls ITM at 325$ Friday
the highest OI
~10.3k calls at 115$ ITM
~9.2k calls at 200$ ITM
~7.8k calls at 320$ ITM
next highest strike with high interest is 3.9k calls at 570$ OTM.
The 63k call contracts ITM ends up with potentially 6.3M shares purchased by market orders, nearly 13% of the 50M float that will settle by the next 2 trading days, up to Tuesday.
Somehow that's a bear win...(reverse world?)
edit: Actually, it seems someone did a lot more thorough look at calls ITM Friday and the numbers above are even too conservative.
• Outstanding Call Options ITM 150+ = 40373
• Outstanding Call Options ITM 100-150 = 33408
• Outstanding Call Options ITM <100 = 18766
• Total Outstanding Call Options ITM ($0.50 to $320) = 92547
So potentially 9,254,700 shares of GME that will be transferred by call options alone.
They are forced to buy to cover in an already share starved market, this will create enormous buying pressure on GME.
Anyone thinking of buying puts at highs, it looks like a good way to make money, but with the IV (implied volatility) so high now, as the price goes down, you'll be IV crushed. I'm all for tactics to make money on the way down, but look into IV crushing before.
63k calls ITM at 325$ Friday
the highest OI
~10.3k calls at 115$ ITM
~9.2k calls at 200$ ITM
~7.8k calls at 320$ ITM
next highest strike with high interest is 3.9k calls at 570$ OTM.
The 63k call contracts ITM ends up with potentially 6.3M shares purchased by market orders, nearly 13% of the 50M float that will settle by the next 2 trading days, up to Tuesday.
Somehow that's a bear win...(reverse world?)
edit: Actually, it seems someone did a lot more thorough look at calls ITM Friday and the numbers above are even too conservative.
• Outstanding Call Options ITM 150+ = 40373
• Outstanding Call Options ITM 100-150 = 33408
• Outstanding Call Options ITM <100 = 18766
• Total Outstanding Call Options ITM ($0.50 to $320) = 92547
So potentially 9,254,700 shares of GME that will be transferred by call options alone.
They are forced to buy to cover in an already share starved market, this will create enormous buying pressure on GME.
Anyone thinking of buying puts at highs, it looks like a good way to make money, but with the IV (implied volatility) so high now, as the price goes down, you'll be IV crushed. I'm all for tactics to make money on the way down, but look into IV crushing before.
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UnravelKatharsis
Member
So is there any confirmation this happened?
mango drank
Member
Help me understand something. If the current investors hold the line, and if there are indeed tons of shorted shares still out there that need to be bought if the shorters cave in and are forced to buy, will those forced short buys raise the stock price significantly?
Or are people holding the line just to mess with the shorters on principle, but the stock price won't really move?
(Yeah, I know there's discussion about calls potentially raising the price too; but I'm wondering about the short buybacks specifically.)
Or are people holding the line just to mess with the shorters on principle, but the stock price won't really move?
(Yeah, I know there's discussion about calls potentially raising the price too; but I'm wondering about the short buybacks specifically.)
LordOfChaos
Member
That's the whole idea that got us here essentially, with shares being held firm, and shorts starting to cave in, they cause a short squeeze event and have to buy back the stock even at silly valuations.
One interesting development in the last week is that limit sells, which used to be virtually unlimited on most platforms, have started to have limits enforced on them, i.e I can't set a limit sell over 2K anymore but I used to be able to set 999,999 on a penny stock if I wanted to. Can't read the tea leaves, no idea when it will happen, but that would sort of feel to me like the clearing houses are getting ready to clear houses.
Wishing a stock would crash so we can go back to discussing marvel movies and celebrity drama
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UnravelKatharsis
Member
Ya forgive me if I'm missing it but I'm looking for confirmation he actually bought in to gme. I saw the tweet but don't see confirmation.
Dthomp
Member
Wishing a stock would crash so we can go back to discussing marvel movies and celebrity drama
Or I don't know...actual video games on a video game forum?
Are you blind? Do you not see the other threads here
UnravelKatharsis
Member
Dawg...there are plenty of movie and celebrity drama threads....this is in the gaming section...
there are plenty of people still talking about videogames here and on Reddit.Dawg...there are plenty of movie and celebrity drama threads....this is in the gaming section...
Kev Kev
Member
Lmao, after he slammed the chair, everyone goes "ooohhhhh!", and then one guy in the back goes "there it is."
UnravelKatharsis
Member
There are plenty of people still talking about movies and celebrity drama here and on reddit.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, fuck this noise. I want to get back to hearing about the Trump impeachment!
They are the ones who lent their shares to short the stock which is probably why they haven't sell yet; it may take a long time to recall those according to Michael J Burry
Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
AMC is next. A bunch of short orders expire Monday and those people will have to buy at a premium to cover. It's going to shoot up fast.
Unknown Soldier
Member
I'm honestly surprised someone somewhere thinks NeoGAF is important enough that they are sending shills to try and talk people down from holding.
There's like maybe 4 people here who seriously actually have GME. And none of us are selling. Give it up, you're wasting your time and money.
There's like maybe 4 people here who seriously actually have GME. And none of us are selling. Give it up, you're wasting your time and money.
kiphalfton
Member
I would sell if it hit $500, and then buy back in if it dips... but it sounds like online brokers are putting restrictions on buying Blackberry, AMC, Nokia, and Gamestop (not that I care about anything but Gamestop).
Buggy Loop
Gold Member
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Buggy Loop
Gold Member
Not that much related to GME's current affaire, but this is an insane interview with Jim Cramer detailing the immoral tricks short sellers use to manipulate stock price, even saying that SEC does not even understand it so they do it anyway.
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Kev Kev
Member
jesus dude calm down
I actually don't think i'm not calmed down enoughjesus dude calm down
Raven117
Member
It usually doesn't quite work like that. The broker is the one who lends the stock (of an other stockholder). They do pay a premium and interest while they search for those shares.They are the ones who lent their shares to short the stock which is probably why they haven't sell yet; it may take a long time to recall those according to Michael J Burry
Trimesh
Banned
I think he's right! Autodefenestrating hedgies is one of the few things I like more than $GME!jesus dude calm down
THEAP99
Banned
People to wake up and stop peddling internet meme bullshit. There is no war, there are no elites, there is no 1%, there's nothing here. Go to bed, flip burgers, browse reddit, game, repeat. The one percent and "deep-state elites" are only a fixation of imagination and do not exist. There is no line to hold other than the line that keeps you from progressing forward on your emotional journey through the universe.
Buggy Loop
Gold Member
Soooo, the short squeeze can crash the market, but they said yesterday that they pulled out from their short positions so a short squeeze should not be possible?
Their FUD is all over the place.
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