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Toonami |Jan14| See you, Space Cowboy. Hello, Space Dandy

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D

Doctor Decimate

Member
SAB CA said:
It continues to be funny to me that an idea like this is offensive / off-putting to anime watchers in general.

SAO took some odd round-a-bout ways to get to it's ends, but from a certain point, it's basically been a [spoilers]haphazardly and somewhat juvenile[/spoilers] story of 2 people falling in love, forming a committed relationship, and then going through the hardships that come from said relationship.

It has a lot of weird moments surrounding it, sure, but in a world full of harem "heroes" that never fully commit to a paring, and stick with it, I actually appreciate this aspect of the show so far.
Click to expand...

the only idea people find offensive/off-putting about that is how incredibly forced the "we have a child!" aspect of it was.
 
M

MetatronM

Unconfirmed Member
BassForever said:
Space Dandy
Bleach
Naruto Shippuden
One Piece
Soul Eater
SAO
Samurai Jack

Actually what is the 8th show? Blue Exorcist is replacing either SAO or Soul Eater unless we're counting Clone Wars as "new"
Click to expand...

Dandy
Bleach
Shippuden
One Piece
Soul Eater
SAO
FLCL (series finale, leaving the block)
Clone Wars (Adult Swim premieres)

Samurai Jack should be on the next week, so the 8 highlights/bolds should continue.
 
D

Doctor Decimate

Member
speaking of SAO, i watched the first episode of Log Horizon and i.......found it kinda dull. it portrays this idea of a video game crossing over into the real world quite well, but that's honestly about it; it may be doing the world-building well, but that doesn't necessarily equate to me finding the world it's building very interesting. characters weren't too much to speak of, either.
 
B

BassForever

Member
GMN said:
speaking of SAO, i watched the first episode of Log Horizon and i.......found it kinda dull. it portrays this idea of a video game crossing over into the real world quite well, but that's honestly about it; it may be doing the world-building well, but that doesn't necessarily equate to me finding the world it's building very interesting. characters weren't too much to speak of, either.
Click to expand...

Just keep watching
 
K

kayos90

Tragic victim of fan death
GMN said:
the only idea people find offensive/off-putting about that is how incredibly forced the "we have a child!" aspect of it was.
Click to expand...

I find the Kirito and Asuna relationship fine. I mean... I'm not that off-put by it. It's Yui that is extremely offputting. It's very weird.
 
K

kayos90

Tragic victim of fan death
BassForever said:
I like Yui and think she's adorable, they just needed to spend more time establishing them as a family before they "itemized" her.
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I think the idea of two teenagers having an AI as a child a weird thing. No amount of time will fix that for me.
 
D

Doctor Decimate

Member
kayos90 said:
I find the Kirito and Asuna relationship fine. I mean... I'm not that off-put by it. It's Yui that is extremely offputting. It's very weird.
Click to expand...

see, that's the thing. i'm somewhat ok with Kirito and Asuna's attraction to each other, putting aside the comical sex part (and i don't even mean 16.5) and the fact that she gets randomly downgraded to total uselessness and forgetting about the weird marriage thing. but Yui? Yui was the writers smashing your face into a sign that said "CARE ABOUT HER CARE ABOUT HER SHE'S SO CUTE YOU LOVE HER NOW"

BassForever said:
I like Yui and think she's adorable, they just needed to spend more time establishing them as a family before they "itemized" her.
Click to expand...

the "MOMMY DADDY" shit needs to fucking stop.
 
B

BassForever

Member
kayos90 said:
I think the idea of two teenagers having an AI as a child a weird thing. No amount of time will fix that for me.
Click to expand...

I mean the idea of a 17 and 15 year old having sex and getting married is also weird. If you can accept that them having a child isn't any more ridiculous.
 
B

BassForever

Member
GMN said:
the "MOMMY DADDY" shit needs to fucking stop.
Click to expand...

Why should an adopted daughter not be able to call her adopting parents mommy and daddy? My father was adopted and he's always called my grandparents his mom and dad, I have a step mother and step father from divorce/remarriage and I call them my mom and dad along with my real mom and dad. Should I not be allowed to call them that when they've raised me for 18 and 10 years?
 
S

Seda

Member
MetatronM said:
Dandy
Bleach
Shippuden
One Piece
Soul Eater
SAO
FLCL (series finale, leaving the block)
Clone Wars (Adult Swim premieres)

Samurai Jack should be on the next week, so the 8 highlights/bolds should continue.
Click to expand...

I had forgotten that Clone Wars was on Adult Swim before. But the second season (starts in two weeks) never was?
 
S

SAB CA

Sketchbook Picasso
GMN said:
the only idea people find offensive/off-putting about that is how incredibly forced the "we have a child!" aspect of it was.
Click to expand...

Which lasted like... 1 episode. After the introduction, the important aspect is how the characters deal going forward.
And I'm glad we didn't have to see a game-version of 9 months carrying > birthing a child in it's place.

It is interesting to think about the different ways the story could have handled getting a child into their lives. Spending a whole episode on picking out shared personality traits to force onto a new npc, imagining the possibilities, and asking everyone they knew what they thought a child between them would look like could have been funny.

In all reality, I think most of them time when I have seen players with a "Child" in a game, it's much less through gameplay systems (like Phantasy Star III Dragon View, or apparently Agarest War?) and more through forcing something unrelated (like a pet or slave NPC) into the position, for the sake of role-play.

Actually, this totally reminds me of the Marriage System / Skill Tree from Ragnarok Online.

adoption_img7.gif


The idea of getting another player to play your child was quite funny.
 
S

Schadenfreude

Member
Call me an old man, but the way they act is what grosses me out. The whole "I don't want to live without you" thing is so childish. That's not love. That's teenage infatuation. I actually know a couple that has been together since middle school and are, in fact, getting married in a year and they act nothing like that. Heck, all the couples i've ever met have been nothing like they are. That's some middle school shit they have. Basically they are an anime version of "luv u 5ever" and it weirds me out that people see it in any way that isn't "complete disgust". Eureka and Renton's romance, on the other hand, wasn't taken as seriously. Renton said stupid things and people laughed at it because they were laughably adorable things.
 
L

Levyne

Banned
I can't say why but even if she simply used "mom" and "dad" it would be better. Like...it would be less try-hard cutesy but still would hold onto the (admittedly iffy) premise of her being the "daughter".

Edit: Well....they are teenagers..and a show targeted to teenagers.
 
D

Doctor Decimate

Member
BassForever said:
Why should an adopted daughter not be able to call her adopting parents mommy and daddy? My father was adopted and he's always called my grandparents his mom and dad, I have a step mother and step father from divorce/remarriage and I call them my mom and dad along with my real mom and dad. Should I not be allowed to call them that when they've raised me for 18 and 10 years?
Click to expand...

because it was right out of the gate and so it became really damn weird and really damn forced immediately. she opened her eyes and said "MOMMY!" the show clearly wants you to go "d'aw", but my reaction was more along the lines of "fuck you."

SAB CA said:
Which lasted like... 1 episode. After the introduction, the important aspect is how the characters deal going forward.
And I'm glad we didn't have to see a game-version of 9 months carrying > birthing a child in it's place.
Click to expand...
you know, it might have actually been better if it lasted more than one episode. maybe then it wouldn't have seemed so awkward and poorly handled.
 
S

Schadenfreude

Member
Levyne said:
I can't say why but even if she simply used "mom" and "dad" it would be better. Like...it would be less try-hard cutesy but still would hold onto the (admittedly iffy) premise of her being the "daughter".

Edit: Well Franco....they are teenagers..and a show targeted to teenagers.
Click to expand...

Please, call me by my fake name. Franco was my father's name. Also, fair enough. But as an adult I am allowed to be grossed out.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
GMN said:
speaking of SAO, i watched the first episode of Log Horizon and i.......found it kinda dull. it portrays this idea of a video game crossing over into the real world quite well, but that's honestly about it; it may be doing the world-building well, but that doesn't necessarily equate to me finding the world it's building very interesting. characters weren't too much to speak of, either.
Click to expand...

I'm inclined to agree. I watched the first 4 episodes and while I might go back for more, I wasn't super impressed. Its claims to fame seem to be A) it isn't SAO and B) Shiroe is an intelligent protagonist and a change of pace from a lot of recent anime (especially MMORPG-themed) protagonists. After you've watched 1000x shows with Naruto/Luffy-type protagonists, one that stars a Shikumaru-type protagonist looks a lot better by comparison.

BassForever said:
Why should an adopted daughter not be able to call her adopting parents mommy and daddy? My father was adopted and he's always called my grandparents his mom and dad, I have a step mother and step father from divorce/remarriage and I call them my mom and dad along with my real mom and dad. Should I not be allowed to call them that when they've raised me for 18 and 10 years?
Click to expand...

Because the whole thing in SAO is un-earned and comes off as weird, creepy pandering. The idea itself isn't abhorrent but its TERRIBLY WRITTEN and screams ulterior motive (otaku pandering) all over it.
 
S

SAB CA

Sketchbook Picasso
GMN said:
speaking of SAO, i watched the first episode of Log Horizon and i.......found it kinda dull.
Click to expand...

LH starts off a bit plain to me, and it's characters seems like a bunch of clones of RPG characters I've seen elsewhere. But as the show goes on, it really starts to have fun with it's cast, and the hierarchy between different levels of players, and eventually the NPCs, becomes very fun to watch, if you're into that kind of thing.

Instead of just being "RPG fight scenes, the anime", it focuses much more on world dynamics, politics, and playing with the concept of what real people would do if they got to STAY in an RPG world.

GMN said:
Yui was the writers smashing your face into a sign that said "CARE ABOUT HER CARE ABOUT HER SHE'S SO CUTE YOU LOVE HER NOW"
Click to expand...

So... Japan being Japan. They LOVE cute. It's offputting to us, but for a country that will SD every anime series and make female personificatiosn out of Operating Systems and Battleships, it seems per-the-course.

Levyne said:
Edit: Well....they are teenagers..and a show targeted to teenagers.
Click to expand...

Yeah, from that perspective, I ultimately have no problem with how lovey-dovey they are to each other. If they were time-skipped to like 27 years old, and were STILL acting like that to each other, it'd be annoying, but as young as they are, and given the situations that started the relationship... Acceptable.
 
D

Doctor Decimate

Member
SAB CA said:
LH starts off a bit plain to me, and it's characters seems like a bunch of clones of RPG characters I've seen elsewhere. But as the show goes on, it really starts to have fun with it's cast, and the hierarchy between different levels of players, and eventually the NPCs, becomes very fun to watch, if you're into that kind of thing.

Instead of just being "RPG fight scenes, the anime", it focuses much more on world dynamics, politics, and playing with the concept of what real people would do if they got to STAY in an RPG world.
Click to expand...

the comedy seemed pretty flat to me. does that get better?

So... Japan being Japan. They LOVE cute. It's offputting to us, but for a country that will SD every anime series and make female personificatiosn out of Operating Systems and Battleships, it seems per-the-course.
Click to expand...

it's possible to create cute characters without trying so damn hard and shoving it in the audience's face until they accept it through sheer brute force. "Japan!" really is not an excuse at all.
 
M

MetatronM

Unconfirmed Member
Seda said:
I had forgotten that Clone Wars was on Adult Swim before. But the second season (starts in two weeks) never was?
Click to expand...

Correct. When it ran in 2009, it went back to the beginning after the season 1 finale (before being yanked entirely).
 
S

SAB CA

Sketchbook Picasso
GMN said:
you know, it might have actually been better if it lasted more than one episode. maybe then it wouldn't have seemed so awkward and poorly handled.
Click to expand...

It asked us to believe in what seems like an extreme amount of emotional attachment in a very short timeframe. But that's SAO (especially it's early parts) in a nutshell, so far.

Anime in general seems to go from one extreme to the next, so seeing 1 episode spent on a 3~5 episode development isn't too surprising, compared to seeing 7 episodes spent on a 2 episode fight.

I actually kinda wish more anime would give something a 1-episode try, admit it's not their strong suit, and then move on... rather than never trying at all.

GMN said:
the comedy seemed pretty flat to me. does that get better?
Click to expand...

They stick with a lot of the same jokes ("Master, is it OK if I kick this perverted man?" "You're suppose to ask BEFORE you do it!"), as a lot of the funny stuff is more playing with consistent personality quirks, rather than trying to tell unique jokes. But comedy isn't a HUGE aspect of the show, so the momentary shifts in mood are ultimately welcome.

I feel that the show knows when to pull back, and when to let loose, with just about each element. In this way, I find it nostalgic; I'm not actively forced to ignore segments of the show in order to get to the next thing, I can pretty safely enjoy it all evenly.

it's possible to create cute characters without trying so damn hard and shoving it in the audience's face until they accept it through sheer brute force. "Japan!" really is not an excuse at all.
Click to expand...

The point is that I don't feel like they see it as "brute force", but ultimately desirable.

I think a LOT of stuff in modern anime is heavy-handed, and that subtlety is something that needs to come back to the genre in general. But the consumers in Japan that this stuff is being made for... they apparently love much of it RIGHT where it is.
 
T

Tenumi

Banned
I'll be gone tonight. Not feeling too great, so I want to get some extra sleep. Best rest up so I don't get any worse. I'll probably catch up via DVR Sunday morning.
 
D

Doctor Decimate

Member
SAB CA said:
It asked us to believe in what seems like an extreme amount of emotional attachment in a very short timeframe. But that's SAO (especially it's early parts) in a nutshell, so far.

Anime in general seems to go from one extreme to the next, so seeing 1 episode spent on a 3~5 episode development isn't too surprising, compared to seeing 7 episodes spent on a 2 episode fight.

I actually kinda wish more anime would give something a 1-episode try, admit it's not their strong suit, and then move on... rather than never trying at all.
Click to expand...

hence the common complaint of pacing issues with SAO. i don't see how any of this is supposed to change what i said. it doesn't become less bad just because the show does it often.

The point is that I don't feel like they see it as "brute force", but ultimately desirable.

I think a LOT of stuff in modern anime is heavy-handed, and that subtlety is something that needs to come back to the genre in general. But the consumers in Japan that this stuff is being made for... they apparently love much of it RIGHT where it is.
Click to expand...

why does the fact that some people like it excuse anything?
 
J

Jintor

Member
BassForever said:
Why should an adopted daughter not be able to call her adopting parents mommy and daddy? My father was adopted and he's always called my grandparents his mom and dad, I have a step mother and step father from divorce/remarriage and I call them my mom and dad along with my real mom and dad. Should I not be allowed to call them that when they've raised me for 18 and 10 years?
Click to expand...

imho before you get into the politics of whether or not an adopted child can call their teenage parents mommy and daddy, SAO should deal with whether or not an AI is effectively a human being within the constraints of its own systems or not.

It basically already said 'yes' by implication, but it'd have been nice to address it. (Of course, SAO addressing anything of its weird shit it brings up by implication would be nice)
 
B

BassForever

Member
Andrex said:
Why so serious? Loosen up breh.
Click to expand...

Sorry if I don't enjoy unfunny fake trolling. I've seen 5 year olds come up with funnier jokes then your attempts to make fun of One Piece.

Jintor said:
imho before you get into the politics of whether or not an adopted child can call their teenage parents mommy and daddy, SAO should deal with whether or not an AI is effectively a human being within the constraints of its own systems or not.

It basically already said 'yes' by implication, but it'd have been nice to address it. (Of course, SAO addressing anything of its weird shit it brings up by implication would be nice)
Click to expand...

I feel like that's far lower on the list of things sao should deal with.
 
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