~Devil Trigger~
In favor of setting Muslim women on fire
awesome eps
I wonder If
I wonder If
Queenie's truly dead
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
AMERICAN HORROR STORY: Coven |OT| When witches don't fight, we burn....
- Thread starter Nemesis_
- Start date
- Status
Escape Goat
Member
She got a gunshot to the stomach which takes awhile for you to die from so she may yet be saved. If she magiked the head shot then I guess she should be safe.
This season is such a mess. I mean, I know the show's whole schtick is being a mess, but it's usually entertaining.
Couldn't agree more. I don't know what 'sophisticated' point about race Ryan Murphy is trying to make, but he's failing spectacularly.
There's a rumour doing the rounds that
which sounds so absurd that it's probably true.
That said, there were some genuinely great moments this episode: Myrtle being a psychopath in Dior, Patti LuPone singing (though I still don't see the point of her character, unless they're going to troll us and she's actually the next Supreme), Emma Robert's fur hat, Cordelia and Misty bonding.
Couldn't agree more. I don't know what 'sophisticated' point about race Ryan Murphy is trying to make, but he's failing spectacularly.
There's a rumour doing the rounds that
Lalaurie's head gets stuck on Queenie's body
That said, there were some genuinely great moments this episode: Myrtle being a psychopath in Dior, Patti LuPone singing (though I still don't see the point of her character, unless they're going to troll us and she's actually the next Supreme), Emma Robert's fur hat, Cordelia and Misty bonding.
Spectral Glider
Member
These are pretty close to my thoughts. A lot of potential this season, but the writing had no idea where to take any of it.
BertramCooper
Banned
I don't think the self-inflicted voodoo doll gunshot would kill her, but the other shot (which I think was to her stomach) probably did.
If I'm understanding her power correctly, she can heal self-inflicted injuries, but not ones from external sources.
So if she shoots herself? Healed. If someone else shoots her? Dead.
Matt_
World's #1 One Direction Fan: Everyone else in the room can see it, everyone else but you~~~
Queenie and La Laurie seem to come as a pair, so either they both are dead or will die soon or they'll both be back. I wouldn't be shocked at some sort of trade between la laurie getting her head back and queenie being revived
I always wouldnt be shocked
I always wouldnt be shocked
at the head swap rumour
Father_Brain
Banned
The melon baller scene might have been the single most over-the-top bit of scenery-chewing I've seen on a Ryan Murphy show, and that's saying a lot. Can't deny it was entertaining, though.
It's a pretty hot mess, unfortunately.
It's a pretty hot mess, unfortunately.
Is it at least better than the first season?!
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
If the voodoos are really that pathetically weak, then why haven't they been exterminated by the witches or the witch hunters yet? The battle between witches, voodoos, and witch hunters has been going on for centuries. If the voodoos are that weak, all it would take is one supreme (or even just a regular witch) or one witch hunter to walk into their home and slaughter them all. The voodoos are totally defenseless and mostly powerless, and yet everyone is bafflingly afraid of them.
Laveau told the witch hunter that she would kill him unless he brought her the two witch heads by that night, so it stands to reason that she would have had the voodoo doll out within reach in case he failed. Also, while he was in the salon shooting the place up, why was she just cowering away in her throne room? She could have at least tried to do something to help. That she was hiding instead of fighting doesn't fit with the sort of character they had previously established her to be.
It's happening!!
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
This season makes the first season seem coherent. The difference in quality between seasons two and three is staggering.
Fenderputty
Banned
I enjoyed the last episode. Frankenkyle finally has a purpose. Melon ball scene was rad.
I was hoping for a witch war, but a war with evil corporate witch hunters could be good too.
I was hoping for a witch war, but a war with evil corporate witch hunters could be good too.
KibblesBits
Member
Why won't the people die on the show that is full of magic and nonsense? It would solve all the problems.
Finished my last final today and got caught up with the season. It has been interesting but it doesn't feel like we are close to the end. If anything this last episode feels like what should have been the mid-season finale. I hope the last couple of episodes doesn't feel too rushed. Season 1 and 2 were pretty good about actually finishing there story before all the episodes were through and giving a nice epilogue episode at the end.
#TeamNanForSupreme
#TeamNanForSupreme
Lord_Byron28
Member
I think the real problem has been pacing the past few episodes. So far I think the season peaked at episode 5 with Burn Witch Burn. The biggest issue I'd say is just pacing. I find that they dump a ton of flashbacks and backstory for one character in one episode and then that character/storyline is dropped and forgotten about for many episodes and at that point I sort of lost interest. Also there were a number of times where I felt they had pointless scenes that could've been better spent. For example the episode prior had a few interesting developments and touching scenes with Fiona but they spent a large amount of time on coming up with a plan to kill Fiona, to convince Fiona to kill herself, and then Finch convincing her to live. There was a few interesting moments but then you realize little happened in the episode. Or for example Hank. I can say that I only started to care for his character this episode and I started to empathize with him and felt bad for him and nervous for the coven but at the end of the episode he was killed. He was around all season and had for the most part little development until the episode they killed him off in.
Well when you put it like that it starts to sound like The Walking Dead.
Velcro Fly
Member
They did that a ton for Murder House and it worked way better than having a dozen different storylines that went nowhere like Asylum.
Eppy Thatcher
God's had his chance.
Why are you the only person in the world who agrees with me that Asylum was fucking ridiculous. Hearing people talk about this season being a confused clusterfuck and how it's ruining the flow and shit but then turn around praise the insane shit storm of absolutely stupid characters that paraded straight through asylum only to have their character and complete plot/storylines dumped without any ceremony like 4 episodes before the finale.
This season makes 2 look like warmed up shit stuffed in a sewn up mouth. I didn't hate that they showed for a moment that these "super powerful, super scary intimidating witches" are still fucking people and they fucking talk too much. Show up with a shotgun and a 9mm and just fucking shoot them in the face and they die just like you and me.
The worst part of that whole scene was the retardation of the Witch Hunter dude. Uhhuh.. great Jon Woo no look gut shot to the girl that weighs 350 only to lovingly stare at the bitch who just tortured you like 2 hours ago long enough to your wig magically split.
Stupid shit solely for the purpose of plot infuriates me and things like wasting that whole episode of Mrs. Lange aaallllmost killing herself just to all of a sudden talk to ghost-spalding and change her mind ... just.. blah.
All 3 of these seasons have had a really really hard time ending strong...or even baseline. They always start to slide downwards around 4 or 5 episodes before the end and can just never pull out of their nosedive into stupid.
toastyToast
Member
This season is such a mess and not even enjoyable mess like last season. How that dude just rolled up to the voodoo salon and laid waste to 90% of them like it was nothing was too much. Myrtle getting her revenge was the only scene worth a damn.
Oh yeah, probably brought up but shouldn't Queenie have died since the physical bullet still went into her head even though she voodoo'd the impact to that dude whose name I forgot already?
Oh yeah, probably brought up but shouldn't Queenie have died since the physical bullet still went into her head even though she voodoo'd the impact to that dude whose name I forgot already?
a secret-boss
Banned
the last couple of episodes was getting boring. the bickering and how would they top another scene (threesome, mother and enema).
this last episode was good hopefully part 2 gets more focus
this last episode was good hopefully part 2 gets more focus
Spectral Glider
Member
Because while the crazy characters were paraded through the asylum (which, in an asylum kind of makes sense) and then mostly dropped, the main hooks of Lana's story and Sister Jude were always there and playing out. There is no hook in this season. Cordelia did nothing till she got blind, but suddenly she's not blind anymore, oh well. And Fiona, what's her main story anyway? She's the supreme, but she's dying, but she's dating a ghost, then she's not....and her dying isn't really a problem anymore I guess. And there's a feud with the voodoo people, but there's a truce, but there isn't. But now they're working together.....ahhh, who gives a fuck.
The hate for this season is really surprising, it has a coherent plot and some pretty intresting characters. It makes me think that the haters are trolling because things aren't that hard to understand.
Voodoo VS Witchs:
The truce was broken when all the white witches rolled up into the Salon. Voodoo hired witch hunter to stomp them out. Plans backfired and leaves her with no choice but to seek shelter among those also hunted by her enemies. La Laurie is a survivor, and will do what it takes to win, even putting aside a beef with the whities.
Voodoo Magic isn't weak, it's different:
Voodoo is powerful, but requires something personal and time to prepare. This has been pretty obvious from the start. Sure a straight up attack works, but if any voodooer survives they can take you and everyone you love out from some new place far away and safely; making any attack a one way trip.
Crazy Jesus Mom & Coma Boy:
The boy next door was the bait to lead the witches into the life of Crazy Jesus Mom. AHS always includes some good and crazy side characters. Now you have a crazy jesus mom who has no qualms about killing to protect herself, all the girls know her dirty secrets and are probably on her hit list. So crazy jesus mom is about to cut some witches.
Witch Hunters:
Lame dude hunter was lame, but we had some cool scenes and mini-plots with him. Now we find out that he has ties to the top tier of the witch hunter clan. Then he gets killed by some witches. That is good reason for the Hunters to bring down the hammer and kick some witche ass.
Racial Tensions:
Everyone complaining about the obvious racial shit in the show is missing some of the finer points. The voodooers are the modern racists. Queenie being the only one who is also a witch is also the only one who believes Madame can be taught that times have changed, but it's both Madame and La Laurie who are living in the past and La Laurie is easily just a big of a monster as Madame.
Supreme:
The Supreme is dying, but she won't go easily into the night. The story will probably climax when Fiona takes it upon herself to own up to her duty and make a sacrifice for the Coven, or when her replacement takes the title and power from her to do the same. A terrible leader is dying, but has the opportunity to redeem themselves, will they do it or will they fail yet again... not a bad plot point to watch play out.
I find it amazing that people can't follow 3 to 4 pretty simple plot lines. It's also funny to watch people ask for character deaths, but when other plot points change they act like the show is in dissarray.
Voodoo VS Witchs:
The truce was broken when all the white witches rolled up into the Salon. Voodoo hired witch hunter to stomp them out. Plans backfired and leaves her with no choice but to seek shelter among those also hunted by her enemies. La Laurie is a survivor, and will do what it takes to win, even putting aside a beef with the whities.
Voodoo Magic isn't weak, it's different:
Voodoo is powerful, but requires something personal and time to prepare. This has been pretty obvious from the start. Sure a straight up attack works, but if any voodooer survives they can take you and everyone you love out from some new place far away and safely; making any attack a one way trip.
Crazy Jesus Mom & Coma Boy:
The boy next door was the bait to lead the witches into the life of Crazy Jesus Mom. AHS always includes some good and crazy side characters. Now you have a crazy jesus mom who has no qualms about killing to protect herself, all the girls know her dirty secrets and are probably on her hit list. So crazy jesus mom is about to cut some witches.
Witch Hunters:
Lame dude hunter was lame, but we had some cool scenes and mini-plots with him. Now we find out that he has ties to the top tier of the witch hunter clan. Then he gets killed by some witches. That is good reason for the Hunters to bring down the hammer and kick some witche ass.
Racial Tensions:
Everyone complaining about the obvious racial shit in the show is missing some of the finer points. The voodooers are the modern racists. Queenie being the only one who is also a witch is also the only one who believes Madame can be taught that times have changed, but it's both Madame and La Laurie who are living in the past and La Laurie is easily just a big of a monster as Madame.
Supreme:
The Supreme is dying, but she won't go easily into the night. The story will probably climax when Fiona takes it upon herself to own up to her duty and make a sacrifice for the Coven, or when her replacement takes the title and power from her to do the same. A terrible leader is dying, but has the opportunity to redeem themselves, will they do it or will they fail yet again... not a bad plot point to watch play out.
I find it amazing that people can't follow 3 to 4 pretty simple plot lines. It's also funny to watch people ask for character deaths, but when other plot points change they act like the show is in dissarray.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
LOL....
no
BertramCooper
Banned
I'll admit to forgetting and confusing certain elements of the plot, but I'm sure as hell not a "hater" or "trolling."
Skipping past all of the complicated and often inconsistent rules of magic in this world, the core problem with the season is a complete lack of empathetic and compelling characters. This is the area where Asylum excelled and Murder House and Coven have utterly failed. There are no characters in Coven that are even a fraction as interesting and well-developed as Lana, Kit, and Jude were in Asylum.
There was an underlying tragedy to Asylum that made it surprisingly moving, especially toward the end of the season. This season, in contrast, seems quite hollow. The rich emotional core of Asylum managed to keep it grounded even when it got a bit batshit. Coven is totally off the rails.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
I will say I don't enjoy season 2 as much as most people and enjoy season 1 more than more people.
backflip10019
Member
This season is so rife with elephant-sized plot holes that I'm having difficulty enjoying it.
- Why didn't Misty just fix Cordelia's blindness?
- Why does Fiona all of a sudden care so much about the witches in her coven? Isn't it in her best interest for a witch-hunter to kill them so that the next supreme is killed and she regains her powers?
- Why do the witches on the counsel care so much about being on a counsel that's in charge of, what, 5 witches in a house in New Orleans?
- Why are they all of a sudden so worried about witch hunters? Shouldn't this have been higher up on their list of priorities?
- Why the fuck does Marie Laveau still operate a hair salon?
BertramCooper
Banned
I really hope they decide to go back to a historical setting instead of a contemporary one next season. In addition to its other strengths, I found the production design in Asylum far more interesting than in Murder House and Coven. Briarcliff was such a visually rich and foreboding setting. This "school" is so painfully bland and sterile, despite being in New Orleans.
Hell, I wouldn't be opposed to going back a couple of centuries. The Delphine flashbacks have been among the season's best scenes.
Hell, I wouldn't be opposed to going back a couple of centuries. The Delphine flashbacks have been among the season's best scenes.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
So to hell with internal logic because magic amirite?
Ah, the old haters gonna hate trollers gonna troll routine.
Voodoo is extraordinarily weak. Like, mind bogglingly so. If you have a few hours to douse yourself in goat blood or whatever it takes to cast a spell, then sure, you could say that it's powerful - making an army of zombies is no small feat. But if the voodoos are so ridiculously vulnerable, how have they survived all this time? Why would the witches make a truce with them in the first place if they could be so easily stamped out? Why hasn't a witch hunter (an order which has been hunting them for generations) just popped in there and killed them all already? They're antagonistic and talk a big game, yet they're utterly defenseless and, unless given a proper amount of time and preparation, powerless.
So the entire convoluted boring mess was all just a set up for a killer Jesus Freak who wants to kill witches? On a show where death is totally irrelevant and where there are no stakes or repercussions?
...we did?
Asylum had a good ending, but the majority of it was a hot mess that I, personally, didn't find that enjoyable. Coven I'm finding really interesting and I've enjoyed the whole season. I appreciate that they're keeping this storyline fairly simple, instead of throwing in a million and one ideas, like they did in Asylum.
Spectral Glider
Member
Bingo. I find it hilarious that if we don't like something we're accused of not understanding shitty plot lines. None of them are even the least bit interesting and only mildly entertaining. For me, there is no rooting interest. I don't care if the whities win, don't care if the voodoos win, and I certainly don't care if the witch hunters win cause they were just introduced. Show would have been much better if it was focused on either the witches battles among themselves to find the new supreme or their fight with the voodoos. As it is, it's just a bunch of stuff with no emotional core.
No, I care about internal logic concerning what we do know. From what we do know you were wrong about Laurie having the doll in her hand to stop about a surprise attack. I'm shrugging at you spinning unknowns into imaginary plot holes. For all we know Laurie can't be even killed (she's lived longer that any witch) and the truce was called because although the witches may have had overwhelming force they were tired of dealing with a revengeful attacker (just like a more powerful nation might pull out of a conflict against terrorist insurgents).
I really don't care to theorize the untold laws of magic/voodoo in Coven when we're only getting a baker's dozen episodes and the show could be moving on. This ain't Lost, this ain't Harry Potter. I'm just along for the short and wild ride and if the reason for not looking too closely at a plot point is MAGIC then *shrug* so be it.
So I guess that with this, after nine episodes, the season is finally actually starting? I'm going to guess that all the resurrecting and shit is going to stop now and the battle will finally be on now that the pieces are finally in place...but seriously, nine fucking episodes of prologue?! Is this the most filler-filled season of any TV show ever?
AlexMeloche
Member
I know I'm tired and I haven't slept for days but why the fuck did I cried when Queenie shot herself?!
You Know Nothing
Member
The song made me emotional during that part.
I can't say I really felt anything about Queenie's death. She wasn't the easiest character to sympathize with.
BlackNMild2k1
Member
I'm gonna take a crack at this one. correct me where I'm wrong.
Because Cordelia was blind, not dead. Misty can revive the dead. I don't believe there was any indication that she could just heal parts of living person. Also that was like her one trick. She is an untrained witch living in the bayou on her own.
Fiona wanted to preserve herself, not kill off her kind along with her daughter. I believe her powers are fading anyway. Her powers weaken when she is physically weak, and she only cut down the rising the supreme to prolong her stay at the top for a while longer. The rise of a new supreme cuts her life span short, so she was just delaying the inevitable till she can complete whatever business she fells she needs to finish.
I'm sure there are other houses and witches from other regions may go to those other houses. I'm sure there wasn't an incorporated Witch Hunter company to hunt down that one house of witches either. I'm sure they network worldwide.
Hunters have been laying low and instead taking out budding witches instead of blossomed ones. They've kept themselves out of the limelight long enough to not be on the local witch radar until the recent shooting of the coven.
Living in New Orleans ain't free, girl gotta make a living. And what better way to stay rooted in the community and keep an ear low to the ground than the one place that every black woman in the area is likely to visit and chat away. Also makes a nice front for her voodoo shop in the back.
Season 2 is a hot mess. too much stuff going on and I don't think most of it went anywhere... s1 was much more coherent.
I am starting to enjoy this season more, I liked this episode for example.
I understand some of your criticisms though, I think AHS is a show where you just have to ignore the things that make no sense whatsoever. That is easier for me to do when we finally have some badassery going on.
I understand some of your criticisms though, I think AHS is a show where you just have to ignore the things that make no sense whatsoever. That is easier for me to do when we finally have some badassery going on.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
From the other thread:
First Trailer Released for WGN America's 'Salem'
Looks like the show that Coven should have been. We'll see.
Laveau is a character we do know and her reaction to the shooter made no sense at all. The Laveau from episodes 1-8 would have kicked his ass, but in order for Queenie to have her big moment, they chose to make Laveau behave in a manner that was incompatible with what they had previously established.
I never said she had the doll in her hand. I said that it stood to reason that the voodoo doll would have been out (on the floor or shelf or what have you) within reach, seeing as how she had just used it a little while prior and was intending to use it again soon.
If you're not interesting in speculating on things, then don't.
First Trailer Released for WGN America's 'Salem'
Looks like the show that Coven should have been. We'll see.
Laveau is a character we do know and her reaction to the shooter made no sense at all. The Laveau from episodes 1-8 would have kicked his ass, but in order for Queenie to have her big moment, they chose to make Laveau behave in a manner that was incompatible with what they had previously established.
I never said she had the doll in her hand. I said that it stood to reason that the voodoo doll would have been out (on the floor or shelf or what have you) within reach, seeing as how she had just used it a little while prior and was intending to use it again soon.
If you're not interesting in speculating on things, then don't.
Nah, Coven has been great for the wife and I.
So I'm all caught up in the series and wow, that last episode definitely caught me by surprise.
It's weird, it seems that as the series progresses it takes longer for me to enjoy each story. Immediately loved season 1, got into season 2 by episode 5, and now coven at episode 9. I will say that Kathy Bates and Angela Bassett are a HUGE addition to the cast. Bates has especially impressed me with the authenticity of racism she portrays. Like, damn. Kudos to the show for not backing down on racism in the south.
It's weird, it seems that as the series progresses it takes longer for me to enjoy each story. Immediately loved season 1, got into season 2 by episode 5, and now coven at episode 9. I will say that Kathy Bates and Angela Bassett are a HUGE addition to the cast. Bates has especially impressed me with the authenticity of racism she portrays. Like, damn. Kudos to the show for not backing down on racism in the south.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
I didn't mean in terms of quality (such a thing can't be determined at this point) - I meant that it's a period piece that actually takes place in Salem, and instead of dealing with Jessica Lange's dull late life crisis or Taissa's adventures in Kyleland, it seems like it'll actually show more old school witch stuff.
Like every other Big Issue on a Ryan Murphy show, I think it's been handled very poorly and cartoonishly.
Demoncarnotaur
Member
Just felt like saying I never saw Asylum, and as it was recently added to Netflix I decided to give it a try.
So far it's a shit ton better than season 1 and 3 IMO.
So far it's a shit ton better than season 1 and 3 IMO.
- Status