http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/07/16/dispatch-israeli-strike-kills-four-children-at-a-gaza-beach/?tid=pm_pop
Washington Post now a Palestinian propaganda outfit, you are despicable Pilgor.
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Breaking: Israel launches Operation Protective Edge against Hamas in Gaza
- Thread starter RustyNails
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/07/16/dispatch-israeli-strike-kills-four-children-at-a-gaza-beach/?tid=pm_pop
Washington Post now a Palestinian propaganda outfit, you are despicable Pilgor.
He was responding to the grieving mother video.
RustyNails
Member
Dude with a twitter handle spreading misinformation is Palestinian media. Got it. Do you have any other evidence to prove the mother grieving in the video is fake, or are you going to lump all Muslims as secret propagandists. Pick your poison.
sindbadthesailor
Member
Of course, since Palestinians aren't human.
The deaths of those kids just prove how anti-semitic they, their families and the rest of Palestine are because it makes Israel look bad.
I know. The question is still the same. It makes no sense for Hamas to find a fake grieving mother for real dead children when they could just find the real one. More importantly are the pictures above. Why would you post faked pictures of dead kids in response to real pictures of dead kids unless you're implying that the newer photos are also faked?
I don't doubt the children died on the beach. It's very sad.
I am posting this now, because I just saw it now. Should other posters be able to pass off photos of dead Syrian children as victims in Gaza?
I did not say that. I said the photos bigboss370 posted are a hoax. I said Palestinian media is known to show pictures and video that are not contextually accurate.
Q
qizah
Unconfirmed Member
hukasmokincaterpillar
Member
@Phan_N
This is how Israel is able to execute its policy of collective punishment, literally right in front of the world press, without being called on it. When international eyes are on it- "Mistakes are made". "We're not perfect", "Fog of war". The rest of the time- "human shields", "collateral damage", "Dahiya Doctrine? Never heard of it". It's almost as if unconditional support of the world's hegemon warps the capacity for sober analysis.
RustyNails
Member
You responded to the video of grieving mother with "PALLYWOOD":
Bigboss' pics came later.
Yes. To the video of the woman crying, from Facebook, with absolutely no context. It was not in response to any news, photos, or videos of the children on the beach.
Yep, the usual cycle of media management has already begun. There will be an investigation started which will either just fade away or no blame will be attached and 'new' protocols will be put in place. This only ever happens when footage or independent international eyewitnesses are there, when they're not it's just business as usual. If the IDF are really feeling international pressure you might, just might get some administrative punishment for some low level IDF soldier
phalestine
aka iby.h
Yup, not worth my time to reply to that poster. Best just to ignore.
The uploader of that video is a correspondent for nbc.
theignoramus
Member
if they were attacked again after the initial strike that's absolutely not a "mistake", the second strikes are intended to kill survivors of the first blast.
RustyNails
Member
One of the boys' father was blind, just saw on CNN. Also
RustyNails
Member
Update: Hamas open to UN Cease Fire Agreement, pending few more details
theignoramus
Member
One of the boys' father was blind, just saw on CNN. Also
so...it wasnt a mistake. The blasts were meant to kill those kids. We can quibble about the alleged "misidentification" but the blasts hit the target they were meant for.
I said earlier i didn't think it was fake and this confirms it. thanks.
That's very good. According to IDF tweet, Israel agrees to the five-hour cease fire.
"As a result of dialogue between the IDF and the UN, we will enable a humanitarian window in Gaza tomorrow between 10:00 and 15:00. During this time, we will hold our fire in Gaza. This humanitarian window is meant to allow civilians to resupply needed goods."
Hopefully the conflict will end shortly.
One of the boys' father was blind, just saw on CNN. Also
Do you mind posting links to the news article and twitter, so I and others, may click through to read.
EDIT: I think the article it is referring to in the image is: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/16/witness-gaza-shelling-first-hand-account
You can still see smoke lifting in the first picture. According to foreign journalists that were staying in the hotel next to it, the kids ran away from the first blast and were shot a secod time after running to the spot in the second picture.
Here is the source off the video on the website of NBC.
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mi...raeli-strike-gaza-kills-four-children-n157301
Here is a picture of her taken today
Is this also part of your Pallywood?
You should be ashamed of yourself, truly
Gemüsepizza
Member
The uploader is Ayman Mohyeldin from NBC. It's from an article.
It at least shows that the IDF doesn't care who they are targeting and/or that their reconnaissance tools are shit. Yet they are still attacking.
NullPointer
Member
If anybody who runs from an explosion is considered a fleeing fighter than I'd say they don't really care enough one way or another.
Here is the source off the video on the website of NBC.
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mi...raeli-strike-gaza-kills-four-children-n157301
Here is a picture of her taken today
Is this also part of your Pallywood?
You should be ashamed of yourself, truly
Yet you don't address the other photos, which are clearly fake. I see the source is NBC, and agree that it is genuine.
Saying that Israel doesn't do enough to avoid harming innocents is one thing, accusing it off knowingly and purposely killing children is another.
Gemüsepizza
Member
How are random pictures from random fb/twitter users relevant? You were talking about "Palestine media". You were talking about a "Palestine conspiracy". Random fb/twitter users are not "Palestine media".
Not a big difference to those kids. They are dead.
sindbadthesailor
Member
Intentionally? Who knows; you'll assume no because that's you're bias whilst others will assume otherwise.
But what this does sadly show is that the IDF's claim of being able to precisely target 'enemy fighters' and separating them from civilians is a load of crock.
And even more sadly, all that's going to happen with this is a lot of pretentious false sympathy, claims of 'we'll look into it,' human error and of course, a whole lot of blaming the victims for having the misfortune of being born Palestinian.
I don't think anyone here is accusing them of purposefully killing children. It's still a pretty big mistake.
I don't care about your other pictures. The video you posted was in response to the video of this mother, that video is named Pallywood which can only mean you accuse this video of being part of Pallywood to.
You are wrong, I am accusing them of purposefully killing these children. Either that or they just shoot on a hunch and don't bother investigating what they are shooting at.
The big mistake is to think the IDF is so goodhearted that it does everything in its power to save and avoid palestinian civilians.
Considering this occurred in broad day light I would say yes. Are you telling me that they fired without bothering identifying what they were firing at, twice? I'd probably believe that considering the weight of civilian casualties.
Seems to me like they just don't bother identifying what they fire at if that's the case.
freakzilla149
Banned
If they do care at all, it is about what kind of media blow back it might cause.
Saying that the IDF doesn't purposely targeting children isn't bias, it's just plain fact. If it was all children in Gaza would be dead by now.
The killing of these poor kids is a grave mistake and a tragedy. I would like to hear any alternatives Israel has to airstrikes at this point though.
As is most of the people in this thread? lol..
Come on guys, use your head, most of you already have a conclusion on this and already biased. Don't know why any bothers to debate it anymore, especially when some here are so biased they dismiss anything the other side post to prove their arguments.
At any rate, I don't care for pictures and stories that leave out too much context. So showing pictures of dead civilians as if that alone shows everything that is happening to me attempts to drive sentiment, which I won't accept. Call me harsh if you like, I prefer logical arguments not based too much off of emotional tug of war.
RustyNails
Member
You agree that it's genuine, so do you take back your despicable PALLYWOOD comment, and next time do not pull insensitive crap like that?
Let's not talk about bigboss pics. That is a separate discussion.
Baki
Member
You calling it a fact does not make it a fact, now that is a fact for you. Do you think Israel would maintain getting support from the western world leaders if they would bomb every building they see? War is not just a battle that is fought by improvising in situations, it's something that has years of planning and tactics behind it.
So you are suggesting that the IDF knew it was children and thought "why not" and fired on them?
WayneMorse
Banned
Yes
Let me ask you something
Do you believe IDF fired without identifying and verifying their targets in broad daylight?
jakonovski
Member
Yeah, such an outlandish thing that has never happened before.
Ok, so let's talk about this in a less "IDF IS ALL ABOUT KILLING THE CHILDREN" vs. "IDF IS WONDERFUL DEFENDERS OF FREEDOM" kind of way. It still looks bad for Israel. So they believed there was a weapon placement there. Let's take that as a given, even though presumably if there were, the press who were filming this happening would have noticed it. Let's also take as a given that Hamas is using civilians as shields. Basically, full credit to the Israeli side of the dispute.
So they shelled it, presumably hit dead on what they thought was a launcher of some sort. They saw people scrambling away. They turned their guns on the people fleeing, who they know full well might be civilians trying to get away from the shelling and not operators of the launcher. But still, they turn the guns and fire at them.
This seems completely unnecessary, even if they *weren't* kids. The civilians in Gaza are Israel's responsibility, whether they like it or not, because they are an occupying force. That they've removed themselves from securing the lives of those they occupy does not remove this responsibility.
According to several Dutch journalists on Twitter, this picture will be on the frontpage on the NYT tomorrow. The picture was made by Tyles Hicks , Staff photographer of the NYT, he witnesse the bombing as the children ran off the beach. If it actually gets the frontpage, it's going to bring forward some shocking reactions.
So you think the IDF has a mission to hunt down Palestinian children despite the fact that they have nothing to gain from that, because everyone in it is a heartless monster. However they can't kill children all the time as that would be bad press, so what they do is give warnings, drop pamphlets and cancel airstrikes some of the time, and then intentionally order strikes on children other times, just to keep it interesting. This is clearly much easier to believe than it being an operational mistake.
RustyNails
Member
How can such an advanced military organization "misidentify" children playing football as resistance fighters. Riddle me.
Gemüsepizza
Member
Does it even matter?
Firing on children = evil
Firing on unidentified people = evil
So your argument to defend the IDF is, that one thing could be interpreted as "less evil" than the other? Who the fuck cares. Both scenarios are evil.
Nothing is going to appease those that say yes to this question, even if Israeli government shown their side. Only thing is a 3rd party investigation, which many on both sides will either approve or deny based on what they believe and what side the investigation supports.
Can't use any pro-Israel sources because a lot of them come from Israel news and government as people claim it is not a source that can be trusted and same goes for Palestinians.
How do you all propose Israel prove that it tries to avoid civilian deaths? Because there is only 2 ways, an independent investigation and Israeli government. I guess this is why in the now present and future cops and soldiers always have to carry a cam to prove their case to others. Yet people will deny these proofs anyways if they don't agree with it lol.
According to several Dutch journalists on Twitter, this picture will be on the frontpage on the NYT tomorrow. The picture was made by Tyles Hicks , Staff photographer of the NYT, he witnesse the bombing as the children ran off the beach. If it actually gets the frontpage, it's going to bring forward some shocking reactions.
This is very heartbreaking.
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