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Canada Poligaf - The Wrath of Harperland
- Thread starter DreamMachine
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BladeWorker
Member
Interactive voice recognition.
Otherwise known as annoying recorded voice lady asking the questions, and you press 1 for yes and 2 for no.
The technology is fairly reliable in the US (they've been using it for nearly 20 years now) but up here, it's in its infancy - and we're not learning quickly.
Zombie James
Banned
First and only time you'll probably see me happy that a Conservative government got elected. Dodged a bullet there, Alberta.
I know right.
Buba Big Guns
Banned
I just read some quotes and read the policies of the WR party....how the fuck can this sort of pile of dump have any backing at all?
Strategic voting is bullshit and isn't the reason. First of all, there was an increase in undecided voters in the last week and then a sharp shift on the last day. The only %s that changed over the campaign were the WRP and the PC's, the Liberals and the NDP polled at their outcome. The WRP *dropped* 10 points in the day since the last poll.
The Liberal vote was already collapsing when the PCs swung left.
Oh really? Do you have a link to that poll??
lunarworks
Member
It's amazing how polling results and actual results can be so vastly different in Canada's electoral system.
King Of Fuh
Member
The hyperbole surrounding the conservatism of Alberta is vastly uninformed, and the outcome of this election showed it. The Wild Rose's momentum was huge, with the PC's reign threatened by a modest financial scandal and a restructure to the royalty system by the PCs, as well as a changing of the old guard with Allison Redford the new leader.
Every analyst thought that the WRP would be the new leading party in the province. That momentum was brought to an utter screeching halt when american-style politicking started coming out of WRP candidate's mouths, about homosexuality and climate change and all these things the rest of the western world (except the southern US) generally agree on. They also talked about all sorts of borderline separatist talk (challenging equalization payments, scrapping the RCMP, etc.) that did not survey well with Albertans. The definitive victory of the PCs was a rejection of the ass-backwardness that some categorize Alberta with, not a confirmation of it. Alberta may be fiscally conservative, but they are quite moderate on social issues.
I linked to all the polls above. It's a wikipedia link. To clarify, though, I mean in the day leading up to the election. See the last two Forum polls (done Saturday and Sunday).
This is true but I'm afraid that Wildrose will just learn to keep it under wraps next go 'round and manage to get themselves elected :l
You can bank on that sadly.
Indeed, very pleased. I think the Liberals lost a few votes to those who wanted to prevent the WR from getting in and voted Conservative. NDP doubled their seats to 4! lol
Well said. This "derp.. Alberta are rednecks' shit is so out of touch with reality.
Ether_Snake
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I bet if someone investigated, they would find out the WR was financed and advised in large part by US groups (conservative think-tanks and others).
I wonder if the good behaviour bonds stick around after the election.
King Of Fuh
Member
you are probably right that strategic liberal voters would be less reluctant to support Redford, but most of the wild rose party flocked over there because of the dismantling of the old boy's club is what I meant.
nevertheless, I think a lot of Albertans are breathing a huge sigh of relief right now.
King Of Fuh
Member
hopefully in the next few years the wild rose puts their foot in their mouth a bunch of times and they become marginalized as a fringe party again.
Could have had a minority government. Make people actually pay attention to politics and their choices.
Good news, then. It shouldn't be that hard to investigate.
Though, given there hasn't been a single mention of this by any group I've seen, I'm doubtful you're correct.
bonesmccoy
Banned
Guys, seriously.
Yes, the economically far-right Wilrose Party was defeated. And thank goodness! But to call this a sign that Alberta isn't as conservative as RoC thinks (we do?) is just plain silly. This province poured about 80 % of its votes to nominally conservative parties. Quebec this is not. Wildrose's outing here smacks of the CA's and eventually CPC emergence on the national scene. I hope that's not the case (I'm very much an economic liberal), but it certainly looks like it could happen.
Yes, the economically far-right Wilrose Party was defeated. And thank goodness! But to call this a sign that Alberta isn't as conservative as RoC thinks (we do?) is just plain silly. This province poured about 80 % of its votes to nominally conservative parties. Quebec this is not. Wildrose's outing here smacks of the CA's and eventually CPC emergence on the national scene. I hope that's not the case (I'm very much an economic liberal), but it certainly looks like it could happen.
Eh. While there are definitely similarities between the WR and the Reform party, the PCs never regained their footing from 1992. This is quite a different result from that, and the PCs would be insane to merge given this result.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
If anything, the Wildrose seem like the FDQ. Meteoric rise... but will there be a similar flameout?
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
Catching up on the Albertan election news now. I never considered Alberta to be the crazy kind of conservative (just fiscally conservative, which is fine). I'm relieved to see that's still the case.
I haven't been following the Wildrose or the election very closely but this does sound ominous.
I think Alison Smith's lack of a reprisal to those two party members is the more ominous of issues. Shrugging those kinds of comments off as free speech to make her look more hands off with the party members didn't play out as she hoped.
BladeWorker
Member
Our recent experience with minority governments does not suggest that people would actually pay attention to politics and their choices.
And where would we be right now if Harper had won a majority in 2006? I think it's pretty hard to argue that voters repeatedly rejecting the CPC's for a majority government didn't have a moderating effect on them. I think minority governments did this country a great service.
I agree with your last comment, but I don't think it was merely party platform that resulted in minority governments from Paul Martin until last May.
Perspicacity
Banned
Not really the case, the writing was on the wall no matter who won the leadership because Stelmach was just so poisonous to the province as a whole
Now they get four years to undo all that 'centre' nonsense
BladeWorker
Member
Minority governments gave us healthcare, and so on. I'm not a hater of minority governments.
I take issue with the premise that minority governments make people pay more attention to politics, just on the basis that government is more precariously held in a minority situation.
Over the course of the past decade, I've watched as the proportion of people who have read, seen, or heard anything about what governments have done decline - controlling for season (summer recall is nearly always lower) and other factors.
We've also seen voter turnout hit an all-time low in minority Parliaments.
This fits alongside a general decline in mass civic participation in favour of passive forms of activism, like joining a facebook group that "insisted" Parliament get back to work after the year-over-year prorogations.
So, in minority situations, two key indicators - message recall and retention, and participation in elections - continued a pattern of decline. To be fair, I don't believe that minority situations *caused* the decline - it was already there - but nor did they stem the tide.
Stephen Harper and his advisors knew long ago that radical agendas, left or right, didn't sit well with Canadians as platforms for change. This has been well-recorded in most every book written about the guy. In order to win, they've worked on an incrementalist platform that has, for better or worse, convinced Canadians that the Conservatives are sound economic managers and Nothing Else Matters(TM). So, it's "okay" to disengage. People have busy lives, Parliament is not burning, why should we pay attention?
I had this conversation at the office today, and there's no easy solution to voter apathy and general disengagement; but minority parliaments didn't help the situation (they only left a lot of people thinking that Question Period was a shitshow - I'm paraphrasing - and there's no real consensus as to whether minority Parliaments were more or less effective than majority Parliaments of earlier periods.)
So, where do I think we'd be if Stephen Harper were granted a majority by the electorate in 2006? I can't speculate as to engagement patterns - as disengaged as we are as a populous, it's impossible to tell what will tip us out of our collective political coma for more than a week (see: CAPP, outrage over being called child pornographer supporters/vikileaks, robocalls, etc) -, but if his tendency toward incrementalism is any indication, we'd be about 5 years farther on the incrementalist scale than we are now, politically.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Minority governments provide interesting moments of drama - when Stronach crossed the floor to save the Martin government, the so-called "Coalition", and so forth.
But outside of that, I don't think there's any real reason why someone who doesn't care would suddenly start caring.
But outside of that, I don't think there's any real reason why someone who doesn't care would suddenly start caring.
Looking at what he was testing the waters with in 2006, I have a feeling he wouldn't have been so moderate on social issues as he is now... Social issues that don't involve labour/union busting at least... because he wouldn't have had to. I don't think he'd have to keep reiterating that he won't touch marijuana laws or abortion now because he'd have already overturned them if he got a majority his first shot out of the gate.
This is rather black and white. Are there only people who care and always will and people who don't care and never will? Obviously not.
I'm not saying a minority government in Alberta would make every albertan give a shit about the broken one party state we have going on here, but it'd sure shake things up and get *some* people thinking about their choices. And they'd be faced with opposition parties with actual power to wield, and maybe realize that they're not so terrifying after all.
Zombie James
Banned
I don't understand. There's no way that crap would pass here. It wouldn't even pass in the states.
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