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[Killjoy-NL]

Well - no, if it's being bought just by Xbox fans as you suggested, then it being an old game absolutely matters. Not to mention it's on GP - so why would millions of XBox fans bother in the first place?

You assume all those former Xbox fans own an Xbox and/or bought Forza already.
There's a reason why I said 'former'.

There'd probably also be a portion who double-dip, but that would likely be negligible, so moot.

Also beyond that - the first week of sales / front-loaded audience on every game is people who are very familiar with IPs in the particular genre, so I just don't see the 'new to the userbase' play into it until we see the tail sales.

Yes, I said as much.

And lest we forget other 'completely new titles' to PS userbase kind of bombed relative to it, so it's pretty evident FH has a wider reach than many other XBox IPs.

I never said otherwise.

My main argument in this thread was that 1st party output is less relevant to Sony, as the Playstation brand itself has extremely strong brand-recognition and mindshare. Which is more than enough to push sales.

They only need to pull in about 10% of the userbase to outsell GT though

TBH - since we no longer get sales updates from GT, it's a bit harder to tell how well it's doing nowadays. I mean presumably still not quite hitting the 14M (or there abouts) high of GT4 - but how far off is it really.

Sales were ~13M back in december 2023, about 1.5 years ago.

Gran Turismo 7 has established a new record for the storied racing franchise.

Gran Turismo 7 has established a new record for the storied racing franchise.

www.dualshockers.com

You're delusional if you think Forza will outsell GT7 on PS5.

 

[Woopah]

That you edited this from 6 or 7, I think, highlights that even you know you're full of it.

Microsoft and Nintendo have never averaged even 5 to 6 titles a year in recent gens.

Microsoft spent 80 billion dollars to expand their publishing in an entirely unprecedented move and even they won't average that moving forward.

Please tell me the 5-6 games Nintendo has released on a yearly basis the last 3-4 years.

I agree with your point overall, but these are the Nintendo releases in the last 3 years (not including remasters):

2022

Pokémon Legends Arceus
Xenoblade 3
Mario Strikers Battle League
Kirby & The Forgotten Land
Fire Emblem Warriors Three Hopes
Switch Sports
Splatoon 3
Pokémon S/V
Bayonetta 3

2023

Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom
Pikmin 4
Super Mario Party RPG
Mario Wonder
Fire Emblem Engage
Bayonetta Origins
Advance Wars 1+2 Reboot Camp

2024

Mario vs. Donkey Kong
Another Code Recollection
Super Princess Peach
Endless Ocean Luminous
Paper Mario TTYD remake
Emio: The Smiling Man
Zelda: Echoes of Wisdom
Super Mario Party Jamboree
Mario & Luigi Brothership

So they do publish that amount each year.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I agree with your point overall, but these are the Nintendo releases in the last 3 years (not including remasters):

2022

Pokémon Legends Arceus
Xenoblade 3
Mario Strikers Battle League
Kirby & The Forgotten Land
Fire Emblem Warriors Three Hopes
Switch Sports
Splatoon 3
Pokémon S/V
Bayonetta 3

2023

Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom
Pikmin 4
Super Mario Party RPG
Mario Wonder
Fire Emblem Engage
Bayonetta Origins
Advance Wars 1+2 Reboot Camp

2024

Mario vs. Donkey Kong
Another Code Recollection
Super Princess Peach
Endless Ocean Luminous
Paper Mario TTYD remake
Emio: The Smiling Man
Zelda: Echoes of Wisdom
Super Mario Party Jamboree
Mario & Luigi Brothership

So they do publish that amount each year.

Not all of these are 1st party games and you included remakes.

 

[Melfice7]

Meh this gen could have been great instead of just ok if sony didnt had its head up their ass

 

[Woopah]

Not all of these are 1st party games and you included remakes.

All of those games are first party. Which do you think aren't?

I included full remakes as those are significant releases, but you could remove the remakes and still have 5-6 new games each year. That will be the case in 2025 as well.

 

[QLQ]

PS6 is around the corner OP, The PS5 is going to surpass the PS3 and done.

Do you even check some facts before you post some asinine thing like this? The PS5 was at 75 million on Dec 31 2024. Now it should be close to 80 million. PS3 sold 87-88 million...

PS5 is leaving PS3 in the dust in a couple more quarters and then it's PSone next at around 102 million. You think PS5 can't easily outsell PSone in the rest of its lifetime (around 2.5 more years)? That's like 22-24 million only to go for PS5. And consider they're going to be selling more in China. I'd say that's a piece of cake. And done, lol.

 

[tTHANOSs]

I'm not sure why Sony wouldn't do the price increase.

Otherwise, it would crush the competition specifically Microsoft.

They have been stockpiling ps5 consoles in the US in anticipation of the tariffs. They will hold out as long as they can. Also they already did an increase in the US a few years for inflation.

 

[truth411]

"without much competition"

and that's exactly why they will be increasing the price eventually. They have no reason not to. You know what's more profitable than locking gamers into the ecosystem? Locking them in with $80 games.

I agree they will increase the price eventually, that's what I said, the disagreement is "When". With Nintendo being only $50 cheaper than a PS5 with $80 games. Xbox consoles ranging from $600-$730 (More expensive than the Pro) with $80 games. All they have to do is stand pat, keep 1st party games at $70 (can't control 3rd party). Gamers in their ecosystem will dramatically increase where they take a 30% cut from everything. Increasing to $80 is roughly an increase of $3+ in profit, compared to an expanded user base it's not close. It also mean more gamers have an invested digital library that they will carry with them to PS6, then 1st party games will increase to $80.

 

[Little Chicken]

 

[blacktout]

Not all of these are 1st party games and you included remakes.

Even if you remove the five remakes from the list, all but one of which (Another Code) were true remakes and not remasters or ports, each year still meets the five to six game threshold.

And I don't know how rigidly you're defining first party games, but all of these titles were funded and published by Nintendo, and, if you checked the credits, you'd see a lot of Nintendo staffers, even for those developed in collaboration with external teams. Also, with the exception of the two Bayonetta games, Nintendo owns all of the underlying IPs listed in whole or in part. They're not timed exclusives or anything else where the first party status is particularly ambiguous.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

All of those games are first party. Which do you think aren't?

I included full remakes as those are significant releases, but you could remove the remakes and still have 5-6 new games each year. That will be the case in 2025 as well.

The same ones sony wouldn't get credit for...

Sony has

Destiny 2 Edge of Fate
Destiny 2 Renegade

And even if you combined that into Year of Fate, you still have Death Stranding 2, Lost Soul Aside, MLB The Show 25, Midnight Murder Club, Marathon, and Ghost of Yotei...

And that's just the stuff that is announced... That's 7 titles... And it doesn't include the Day's Gone Remaster. It's 8 games if you count Edge of Fate and Renegade separately.

Last year they had

Astro Bot
Concord
Helldivers 2
Lego Horizon Adventures
MLB The Show 24
Rise of the Ronin
Stellar Blade
Destiny 2 Final Shape
1 remake
2 remasters

Even if you remove the five remakes from the list, all but one of which (Another Code) were true remakes and not remasters or ports, each year still meets the five to six game threshold.

And I don't know how rigidly you're defining first party games, but all of these titles were funded and published by Nintendo, and, if you checked the credits, you'd see a lot of Nintendo staffers, even for those developed in collaboration with external teams. Also, with the exception of the two Bayonetta games, Nintendo owns all of the underlying IPs listed in whole or in part. They're not timed exclusives or anything else where the first party status is particularly ambiguous..

See above.

 

[Woopah]

The same ones sony wouldn't get credit for...

Sony has

Destiny 2 Edge of Fate
Destiny 2 Renegade

And even if you combined that into Year of Fate, you still have Death Stranding 2, Lost Soul Aside, MLB The Show 25, Midnight Murder Club, Marathon, and Ghost of Yotei...

And that's just the stuff that is announced... That's 7 titles... And it doesn't include the Day's Gone Remaster. It's 8 games if you count Edge of Fate and Renegade separately.

Last year they had

Astro Bot
Concord
Helldivers 2
Lego Horizon Adventures
MLB The Show 24
Rise of the Ronin
Stellar Blade
Destiny 2 Final Shape
1 remake
2 remasters



See above.

I wasnt counting expansion packs like those for Destiny 2 or the smaller, download-only games

But I would count every other game you listed.

 

[Ebrietas]

I have no idea if comments like these are for real or not.

Most game sales on Playstation platforms have always been multiplatform games. The entire concept of Playstation was always about being a platform for developers. All games releasing in there and that's it. 1st party games are "just" a plus and have always been like that. GTA, COD, Assassin's Creed titles and F2P games have always been the most played and bought games on PS platforms since the PS3 days...it's not first party games even if some of them are also best sellers. That, plus all the 3rd party deals that Sony has always done for games like FFXVI, FFVII Rebirth, Stellar Blade, Rise of the Ronin, etc

This year alone they have Death Stranding 2, Ghost of Yotei, Marathon, another MLB game, at least 2 Destiny 2 releases (i think?), they got a 3rd party deal for Lost Soul Aside which is console exclusive. We're in May and we're still getting all of that. How is that "no new games"?

MS is also releasing all of their games on PS5. No one cares if the games are done by studios MS bought when those IPs were already established. No one looks at Doom, COD, etc and thinks "wow, what a great MS title". In fact COD is now tied to Playstation in such a way that PS5 is about to release a COD bundle...while they are a Microsoft IP, meaning MS themselves know where the money is. You don't see Xbox hardware with a COD title. That says everything you need to know.

If these guys think PS is bad they must really hate Steam. How many games does Valve make? Apple has the biggest gaming platform of all and they have zero first party.

The point of first party is to supplement third party as a value add and differentiator for your console. It's not to become the sole provider of games. That would be Nintendo's dumb strategy which often doesn't work too well for them.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I wasnt counting expansion packs like those for Destiny 2 or the smaller, download-only games

But I would count every other game you listed.

The Final Shape has a 10.5 hour campaign... Can you explain why it wouldn't count?

 

[Killjoy-NL]

The point of first party is to supplement third party as a value add and differentiator for your console. It's not to become the sole provider of games.

Let's be real:

It's just a certain group of people that can't stand the fact that Playstation is crushing Xbox despite their claim that Playstation output is terrible.

(This group also happens to have a dominant presence on Gaf, which leads us back to the echo-chamber Mibu no ookami was talking about)

 

[yurinka]

How does someone checks the Preorder rank ?
As far as I can tell Steam shows Wishlist rank where Destiny 2 is non existent.

I meant the PlayStation Store (Steam maybe only lists in the preorder ranks new games and not DLCs/expansions).

You go to its website in a PC and change the country and language code for each main country. There's a section for preorders, which are ordered from left to right (with exception of Arabic language, there is right to left). I did it two days ago and was like this:

USA:

Germany:

France:

UK:

Spain:

Italy:

Saudi Arabia (this image reads from right to left due to Arabic language, so it's top 1 too):

Canada:

Mexico:

Brazil:

Japan:

Hong Kong:

Thailand:

India

Indonesia:

So it's top 1 basically in EMEA and America. Not in the eastern Asia countries I assume due to regional preferences or lack of enough marketing there.

I agree, PS5 is looking strong as we can actually count third party games to be sorta exclusive to PS5 from now on.
Otherwise its 3-4 games in 12 months since 2023.

2020

• Demon's Souls (Remake)
• Spider-Man: Miles Morales
• Astro's Playroom
• Call of Duty: Black Ops Cold War

2021

• Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart
• Returnal
• Final Fantasy VII Remake Intergrade
• Deathloop

2022

• Horizon Forbidden West
• Elden Ring
• God of War Ragnarök
• Gran Turismo 7
• The Last of Us Part I

2023

• Spider-Man 2
• Final Fantasy XVI
• Resident Evil 4 Remake
• Baldur's Gate 3
• Alan Wake 2
• Lies of P

2024

• Helldivers 2
• Stellar Blade
• Rise of the Ronin
• Dragon's Dogma 2
• Final Fantasy VII Rebirth
• Astro Bot
• Concord

There are several games missing there like Sackboy Adventures, Destruction AllStars, 3rd party exclusives like Guilty Gear Strive, Granblue Fantasy Relink etc. plus PSVR2 games and the Sony remasters and remakes. But more or less yes.

Each year they normally have 2-3 major 1st party releases, 2-3 minor first party releases, some extras as can be some ports/remasters/remakes, 2-3 major 3rd party AA/AAA exclusives, 2-3 major indie exclusives, 2-3 'major' PSVR2 games, 2-3 minor 3rd party exclusives, 4-5 major multiplatform 3rd party games with marketing deal.

(3rd party exclusives, including indies can be released in PC at the same time, and some time later in other consoles).

 

[QLQ]

The same ones sony wouldn't get credit for...

Sony has

Destiny 2 Edge of Fate
Destiny 2 Renegade

And even if you combined that into Year of Fate, you still have Death Stranding 2, Lost Soul Aside, MLB The Show 25, Midnight Murder Club, Marathon, and Ghost of Yotei...

And that's just the stuff that is announced... That's 7 titles... And it doesn't include the Day's Gone Remaster. It's 8 games if you count Edge of Fate and Renegade separately.

Last year they had

Astro Bot
Concord
Helldivers 2
Lego Horizon Adventures
MLB The Show 24
Rise of the Ronin
Stellar Blade
Destiny 2 Final Shape
1 remake
2 remasters



See above.

They also had FF7 Rebirth. I mean, who cares if the games come from third parties and are timed exclusives. Sony is serving the platform and its users, and the users all they care about is they're getting the goods.

 

[simpatico]

GTA VI launch will be huge for hardware. If there's any spirit left in the Xbox offices, now is the time to throw everything they've got at attaching consoles to GTA VI sales. Do whatever it takes.

 

[onQ123]

This is a really, really bad comparison. You are conflating 2 gens and comparing some stupid overlap to one system. Switch sold more units than PS4 and will have sold more than PS5. The only argument to be made is that the 2 markets themselves aren't a complete overlap. There are much fewer great kid friendly games on PS5 compared to Switch. There are also fewer story dense, AAA Sony style games on Switch. Some gamers prefer one to another. Some just want both because they like good games and don't need to make things into some stupid console war which is basically for people who can't afford more than one platform getting fanatical about the one they chose.

Is PS4 & PS5 not both PlayStation Consoles?

I can go further and count PS5's as PS4's because PS4 software is now playable on close to 200 million consoles.

Is this not how PC & Mobile user-base are tracked?

 

[Woopah]

The Final Shape has a 10.5 hour campaign... Can you explain why it wouldn't count?

Because I didn't include expansions/DLC in the Nintendo list. I was taking the "5-6 games" comment to mean full titles.

If we include DLC, then the number of new games from Nintendo would also be higher. That doesn't mean we can't, it just changes the parameters of what I listed.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Because I didn't include expansions/DLC in the Nintendo list. I was taking the "5-6 games" comment to mean full titles.

If we include DLC, then the number of new games from Nintendo would also be higher. That doesn't mean we can't, it just changes the parameters of what I listed.

The Final Shape is more than just DLC. Destiny 2 is a live service game, this is a major installment in the game with vastly more production than a simple DLC.

But these are the rules we try to make to qualify things.

 

[Woopah]

The Final Shape is more than just DLC. Destiny 2 is a live service game, this is a major installment in the game with vastly more production than a simple DLC.

But these are the rules we try to make to qualify things.

Which is why I think its better to just focus on full titles.

Either way, the point still stands that if we count expansions for Sony then we would have to count expansions for Nintendo as well.

 

[CrimsonTide]

So no matter how many great games Sony releases Playstation is going to be shit if those great games are also released on PC, did I get it right?

I do not consider and extraction shooter and a GAAS marathon to be "great games"

Sony makes good games, just so FAR in 2025... it has been shit. That is not exactly a hot take.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

PS6 is around the corner OP, The PS5 is going to surpass the PS3 and done.

PS5 Pro just released a few months ago and they usually release around half of each generation's time.
PS6 ain't releasing until 2027 at the earliest. 2028 is the most probable year from the rumors so far.

PS3 is getting surpassed literally in a few months so i don't know how it's just that and "done".

 

[QLQ]

I do not consider and extraction shooter and a GAAS marathon to be "great games"

That's a "You" problem. Any genre can have great games even if some are not our thing.

Sony makes good games, just so FAR in 2025... it has been shit. That is not exactly a hot take.

You made clear you are a PC gamer first (maybe don't own a PS5, I don't know), and also made clear if the games are on PC you don't need a PS5 which to you equals PS5 library is shit. If I'm misrepresenting you in anyway please let me know.

 

[Zathalus]

It seems to be on track to do around PS4 numbers. Maybe a bit better, maybe a bit worse. The much higher price vs last gen might cause some drop off at the end of the generation, it seems unlikely Sony will do a price cut.

 

[CrimsonTide]

That's a "You" problem. Any genre can have great games even if some are not our thing.


You made clear you are a PC gamer first (maybe don't own a PS5, I don't know), and also made clear if the games are on PC you don't need a PS5 which to you equals PS5 library is shit. If I'm misrepresenting you in anyway please let me know.

everything except "PS5 library is shit"

But, in 2025 they have released shit, so I will stand by that one.

But yes, until a game on EITHER console is a true console exclusive, no need for me to buy one. This is the first gen I have yet to pick one up since NES era.

I will however get one in 2026 for GTA 6. Right now, I plan on a PS5 Pro, unless somehow the Next Box is more powerful for GTA 6.

But leaning heavily towards PS5 Pro.

 

[LordOcidax]

PS5 Pro just released a few months ago and they usually release around half of each generation's time.
PS6 ain't releasing until 2027 at the earliest. 2028 is the most probable year from the rumors so far.

PS3 is getting surpassed literally in a few months so i don't know how it's just that and "done".

I really doubt is going to become the 2nd best selling PS console. And i totally forgot about PS1. So yes… Third place is locked.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

I really doubt is going to become the 2nd best selling PS console. And i totally forgot about PS1. So yes… Third place is locked.

I mean, it's surpassing 100M somewhere next year. It's not weird to imagine it selling like 13M in 2027 and another 8M in 2028 right before the PS6 releases. And i'm being conservative with these numbers. PS4 is at what...117M?

Let's not forget PS4's lifespan was cut short due to covid...that won't be happening with the PS5 (i hope lmao).

 

[QLQ]

everything except "PS5 library is shit"

But, in 2025 they have released shit, so I will stand by that one.

But yes, until a game on EITHER console is a true console exclusive, no need for me to buy one. This is the first gen I have yet to pick one up since NES era.

I will however get one in 2026 for GTA 6. Right now, I plan on a PS5 Pro, unless somehow the Next Box is more powerful for GTA 6.

But leaning heavily towards PS5 Pro.

Ok. You don't see the value because you prefer PC, but that doesn't make PS5 library shit in anyway. People on the other end could argue the same and say they don't need a PC because all the games they like come to PS5 and they prefer the console. They could say then the PC library is shit because it doesn't get any exclusive games they consider "good". And they would be wrong.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Switch 2 is getting ready to sell more at launch than PS5 did in almost two months.
With $80 games.



PS6 will have to release in 2028+ for PS5 to achieve the sales you are saying.

The PS5 totally wasn't supply constrained for almost 1.5 to 2 years due to Covid. Totally wasn't.

 

[LordOcidax]

I mean, it's surpassing 100M somewhere next year. It's not weird to imagine it selling like 13M in 2027 and another 8M in 2028 right before the PS6 releases. And i'm being conservative with these numbers. PS4 is at what...117M?

Let's not forget PS4's lifespan was cut short due to covid...that won't be happening with the PS5 (i hope lmao).

PS5 sales are already dropping around 40-50% yearly and with signs of dropping even further, don't think is going to make it, even with the help of GTA6.

 

[CrimsonTide]

Ok. You don't see the value because you prefer PC, but that doesn't make PS5 library shit in anyway. People on the other end could argue the same and say they don't need a PC because all the games they like come to PS5 and they prefer the console. They could say then the PC library is shit because it doesn't get any exclusive games they consider "good". And they would be wrong.

Fair. I am sure console only gamers feel far differently than I do. It's a fair assessment. But I still say, I just feel this entire gen has been "off" all the way around. Extremely long dev cycles, unoptimized games at launch, on all platforms. Maybe I am being too cynical as we all have had some great games to play.

 

[Fake]

IMO PS6 will solve most part of the visual/quality graphical problems this gen have because A.I, but will never solve the software problem.

Again, Sony rellying on games like GTA to sell hardware while previous generations there are great selling point.

For me, there is no much of reason to continue to invest in Playstation. PS5 for me is a downgrade over my PS4, mainly the game library. Nintendo Switch 2 will be the way to go for me and PS5 will be the machine for third parties.

As the future shape, Playstation will take the Xbox previous philosophy, saying will be the best place for third party, while Nintendo will sell Nintendo Games running amazing in their machines. Buying Nintendo console to play Nintendo games is the way foward.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

PS5 sales are already dropping around 40-50% yearly and with signs of dropping even further, don't think is going to make it, even with the help of GTA6.

What? PS5 is selling like 19M this fiscal year that ended after selling 21M the previous fiscal year.

If you think sales are going down 20 to 10 to 5 to 2.5 then...this conversation can end there.

 

[Ebrietas]

What? PS5 is selling like 19M this fiscal year that ended after selling 21M the previous fiscal year.

If you think sales are going down 20 to 10 to 5 to 2.5 then...this conversation can end there.

The level of delusion on display here is off the charts. Especially with GTA coming next year.

 

[Horseganador]

By the end of fiscal year 2026 it will have surpassed PS4 sales and PS5 will be around 120 million or more, they have 75 million at the end of 2024 and have sold more than 20 million annually for the last two years consecutively, it will sell 15-20 million this fiscal year + much more than 20 million the year of GTAVI and you have it, PS5 can end up with 130-140 million at the end of its cycle or maybe more, right now with Xbox dead and releasing its first for it it has it even easier.

 

[Hector Hall]

"Won the true console war"

> Sells considerably fewer consoles than the Nintendo Switch, which also functions as a home console

> Sells fewer copies of games than Nintendo

> Releases fewer games than Nintendo

Yes, it seems so lol

You may be missing the financial reports of both, PS5 has been beating Switch for 4 years in a row, and in software it sells way better.

But yes, Ltd of Switch is difficult to attain by a 500+ dollar machine, and it sells less first party games.

Still, PlayStation does 30/31 billion each year now, and Nintendo is doing 8B, although probably with Switch 2 and all it's greedy politics will be able to jump to 14 or 15.

 

[QLQ]

PS5 sales are already dropping around 40-50% yearly and with signs of dropping even further, don't think is going to make it, even with the help of GTA6.

False.

Again, why don't you get your facts straight before posting? You're embarrassing to read.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

"Won the true console war"

> Sells considerably fewer consoles than the Nintendo Switch, which also functions as a home console

> Sells fewer copies of games than Nintendo

> Releases fewer games than Nintendo

Yes, it seems so lol

Now go and check Playstation's revenue numbers (last quarter: ¥1.682.3 billion vs Nintendo's ¥1.164.9 billion), monthly active user numbers (PS is at 124M), and both of these company's subscription services numbers and tell me what you see.

Also comparing a console that came out in early 2017 with one that came out in late 2020 makes literally no sense. Was PS5 supposed to be ahead of the Switch after releasing 3 years and 9 months later, plus a pandemic where Switch was the only console available in stores where everyone was siting around at home for 2 years, boosting its sales considerably?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

What? PS5 is selling like 19M this fiscal year that ended after selling 21M the previous fiscal year.

If you think sales are going down 20 to 10 to 5 to 2.5 then...this conversation can end there.

LOL, you're trying to have an objective based discussion with someone who is fundamentally unserious..

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

LOL, you're trying to have an objective based discussion with someone who is fundamentally unserious..

I never know who's serious or not on Gaf...but that's on me, lmao.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Which is why I think its better to just focus on full titles.

Either way, the point still stands that if we count expansions for Sony then we would have to count expansions for Nintendo as well.

You seem slave to legacy measurements that don't show the full story...

First is was famitsu/media create charts, now this...

 

[Zacfoldor]

If you think about it, the Pro took the brunt of the price increase discussion, unnecessarily. It came out first. Arguably Nintendo got hit harder but honestly a lot of that wasn't organic. There are just a ton of people who resent and dislike Nintendo. It comes with being on top. Same for Sony. Look at the reaction to Microsoft raising prices heavily. It was strong but gone quickly. Switch 2 and PS5 Pro pricing were monumental social events in the industry. The more people that love you the more people that hate you, because love and hate are two sides of the same coin. MS price increases just amounted to a few taunts from console warriors and a whole lot of apathy. Happy safe little things that satisfy people don't sell. You gotta get all the emotions involved and kick around the hornets nest to get people excited about their purchasing decisions and incentivized to follow thru.

I know the Switch 2 will be a success because they got the hardware right and it is extremely culturally relevant right now. EVERYBODY knows about, is happy and/or mad about Switch 2. When "everybody" does anything, people will make a lot of money. In the states, Christmas is about buying those overpriced toys that you can't otherwise afford. It's a perfect gift. The issue Nintendo will have is stock. Can they keep it on the shelves during this crucial holiday?

Another thing for me is the meta on mario kart. I think it would get, ya know, 9.8/10 if it was offline. Nintendo has obviously created a MKMMO here on the scale of BotW and it's gonna be huge....but if it is laggy and the online sucks it will not get a 9.8/10 metacritic. Online issues could derail the meta here and cause some issues with the hardware since this is the true system seller this time around.

 

[CosmicComet]

Sorry, this is where ps5 starts to plateau yoy.

The Switch annihilated the ps4 despite being years later and the Switch 2 will do the same.

 

[blacktout]

Astro Bot
Concord
Helldivers 2
Lego Horizon Adventures
MLB The Show 24
Rise of the Ronin
Stellar Blade
Destiny 2 Final Shape

Yes, I would count all of these as first party games. I think it would be silly not to.

You didn't give a reason why some of the Switch games listed wouldn't qualify, so I assume the real argument here is about whether some games are "good enough" or "big enough" to count, which is an impossible distinction to objectively parse.

Obviously if exclusivity is part of your criteria, then some of the games you listed wouldn't "count," but if the question is just "Did Sony/Nintendo finance the development of this game and publish it?," then, yes, all of the games both you and Woopah listed are first party games.

Which is why I think its better to just focus on full titles.

Either way, the point still stands that if we count expansions for Sony then we would have to count expansions for Nintendo as well.

I think it's totally reasonable to count The Final Shape if you were going to also count something like Torna: The Golden Country.

 

[Shubh_C63]

So NOT exclusive at all?

If the game is completely unabashedly available on another platform, no one can claim that game to be exclusive to any platform.
Not sorta exclusive, its just NOT exclusive.
Not kinda exclusive, its just NOT exclusive.
Not 80% exclusive, its just NOT exclusive.

Even when games are released on Stream and PS5, the "console" exclusive tag doesnt make the game a PS5 exclusive.
If the game released on Ouya and PS5 it wouldnt be a PS5 exclusive.

Nobody is talking about the "exclusive TAG" at all man, just a practical one.
If the game released on Ouya and PS5 it wouldn't be a PS5 exclusive, yet if you are estimating value proposition of a game as a Sony Analyst you will consider (internally, in your slides) to be 99% in your share and estimate your quarterly earning that way.

The "Exclusive" tag seems very important to you for discussing games. I am merely interested in actual real world impact. The real world impact on PS5 for not having GTA6 as "exclusive tag" because it releases on OUYA also would be close to negligible, yet clearly not exclusive.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

You know the software output for Sony is bad when we're not only counting a Destiny expansion as a game but as two games.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Yes, I would count all of these as first party games. I think it would be silly not to.

You didn't give a reason why some of the Switch games listed wouldn't qualify, so I assume the real argument here is about whether some games are "good enough" or "big enough" to count, which is an impossible distinction to objectively parse.

Obviously if exclusivity is part of your criteria, then some of the games you listed wouldn't "count," but if the question is just "Did Sony/Nintendo finance the development of this game and publish it?," then, yes, all of the games both you and Woopah listed are first party games.

You missed my point. At the end of the day its just console war bs.

Deciding what games count based on "reasons"...

Funded and published? Why not just funded? Why is publishing the key criteria?

Size and scope isn't a criteria but quality could be? Again, random criteria.

If Sony spends 100 million on a game and has to justify a PC release does the lack of exclusivity diminish the game compared to a game that cost 40 million to develop by Nintendo that is exclusive to the Switch?

You can come up with whatever justification to count a game or not.

 

[FoxMcChief]

People honestly believe that if they say it enough, it'll become true.

Like saying the PS5 generation isn't the worst.