Death Stranding Review Thread
- Thread starter Hideous Snake
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Eiknarf
Banned
I didn't know the game was inspired by Trump and Brexit
www.gamespot.com
Kojima Says Death Stranding Was Inspired By Trump And Brexit
With Death Stranding finally out in the world, Hideo Kojima has opened up about some of the events and situations that inspired the game's story and themes.
www.gamespot.com
Phase
Member
There's already a thread for this, don't bring that nonsense into this one.I didn't know the game was inspired by Trump and Brexit
Kojima Says Death Stranding Was Inspired By Trump And Brexit
With Death Stranding finally out in the world, Hideo Kojima has opened up about some of the events and situations that inspired the game's story and themes.
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Roni
Member
And what is your definition of fun, exactly?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Hideous Snake
Gold Member
Where's the entertainment in a video game if it isn't fun? Don't lie to yourself now. No matter how good of a concept a game is, if it's not engaging, you'll never be able to carry on and finish the experience. Unless you're a boring fuck that's used to it then you're fine I guess. Just don't hit me with bollocks like "the game doesn't need to be fun" let's not forget this is the number 1 reason why we LOVE video games. Nobody wants to snooze and shit because "the concept is good" it also doesn't make it in any way a good experience if it isn't fun to begin with. So here's that.
Hypereides
Member
I wonder how the consensus will fair once the honey moon phase is over. I'm relieved I don't follow the newest releases to get stressed over hype.
Evil Calvin
Afraid of Boobs
Of course they did!
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
My credit card was charged this morning. Friday, cometh!
HotPocket69
Banned
Picking mine up at GS tomorrow at 9PM
The only thing these stores are good for nowadays are these Thursday night releases
The only thing these stores are good for nowadays are these Thursday night releases
GHG
Member
What's funny about this is the fact that when certain other games on certain platforms have released in the last couple of years and have been trashed in reviews as a result of being subpar some of these guys just ran around the Internet deflecting screaming "but it's fun™" while refusing to understand why said games are not products worthy of high praise.
Now that Death Stranding is here and it's received high praise, even from those who say it's not necessary about "fun™", some of those same aforementioned individuals are now in the midst of a confused meltdown, completely baffled by what's unfolding in front of their eyes. Not only that, but in the few moments they have to spare while they are recovering from their brain aneurysm, they are aggressively scouring the Internet suggesting that other people (even if they are interested) should not buy the game as if doing so would signal the end of gaming as we know it. You would think that with these people having so much "fun™" with "fun™" games on their single unfortunate platform of choice they wouldn't have time for such endeavours... But alas.
God knows what these sad individuals will be reduced to should the game go on to sell well. Guess we will find out in the next few weeks.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
What's funny about this is the fact that when certain other games on certain platforms have released in the last couple of years and have been trashed in reviews as a result of being subpar some of these guys just ran around the Internet deflecting screaming "but it's fun™" while refusing to understand why said games are not products worthy of high praise.
Now that Death Stranding is here and it's received high praise even from those who say it's not necessary about "fun™" some of those same aforementioned individuals are now in the midst of a confused meltdown, completely baffled by what's unfolding in front of their eyes. Not only that, but in the few moments they have to spare while they are recovering from their brain aneurysm, they are aggressively scouring the Internet suggesting that other people (even if they are interested) should not buy the game as if doing so would signal the end of gaming as we know it. You would think that with these people having so much "fun™" with "fun™" games on their single unfortunate platform of choice they wouldn't have time for such endeavours... But alas.
God knows what these sad individuals will be reduced to should the game go on to sell well. Guess we will find out in the next few weeks.
You bring up a good point. I think mentioned earlier, TLoU was a great example of this. Fantastic game, from beginning to end. I enjoyed every moment of it, but I can't say it was "fun" akin to the ride that Uncharted is known for. Uncharted was a fun exploration, treasure hunting, tickling the Indy Jones sensations, TLoU however, was a tense almost nervous at times moment to moment gameplay, which gave a different type of adrenaline sensation than what Uncharted does. Yet both released the dopamine we all crave.
Both equally enjoyable experiences for me, with different ways in which I enjoyed them.
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FranXico
Member
The irony is that nobody made that claim.
"Don't need to be" is not the same as "shouldn't be".
ROMhack
Member
Agreed. You could also look at the soulsdemonbloodborne games as part of that, which aren't exactly fun.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Exactly. Even more tense and adrenaline fist pumping when you slay a boss that kept kicking your ass. Nothing fun about dying over and over, but you push on for that eventual dopamine drip of success.
Eiknarf
Banned
Where is that thread?
Wait- is it in the gaming section or is it in politics section?
Famitsu gave the game a full score. Not that it means anything, not to me at least.
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Haven't Famitsu review scores been bought for the last several years?
Hideous Snake
Gold Member
Don't know and honestly don't care mate. It's not like they the only ones anyways
Famitsu is mostly a marketing tool. But that doesn't mean the reviewers didn't actually enjoy the game. From many of the japanese games that are mostly made for their home market I would say that tedium and required patience are not a dealbreaker over there at all. Every JRPG ever is made out of long periods of doing the same crap over and over again. The enjoyment comes from getting into the numbers, unlocking more stuff and whatever story, setting and atmosphere they provide.
MiguelItUp
Member
Yeah, I was going to say I can agree with the entertaining comment. Video games should be entertaining, just like music, movies, etc. Entertaining contains a number of emotions and reactions that one should/would want to feel when experiencing something. If those feelings are completely absent and you're not entertained, well, then push through or give up, lol.
RDR2 was incredibly divisive for a lot of players, but for me it was the most entertaining experience when it launched. It wasn't just "fun", but also emotionally driven and captivating IMO. I felt like RDR2 was sections of fun surrounded by other forms of entertainment, I can't help but feel like DS will share that same vibe. Especially from what I've gathered, heard, and read.
RDR2 was incredibly divisive for a lot of players, but for me it was the most entertaining experience when it launched. It wasn't just "fun", but also emotionally driven and captivating IMO. I felt like RDR2 was sections of fun surrounded by other forms of entertainment, I can't help but feel like DS will share that same vibe. Especially from what I've gathered, heard, and read.
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JCK75
Member
Games should be fun always, a Movie is only 2 hours long and you go to watch a story be it frightening, comedic or dramatic... you can do all of these with games but if the underlying game is not fun, it's a huge problem... if you are not going to have a game that is fun to play, it perhaps should have just been a movie.
ROMhack
Member
Yeah, there's lots of ways people have fun playing games. I'm a bit of a devotee of the idea that 'games are work' which has a negative connotation but just means that people get enjoyment from different kinds of challenges (ie challenge, mastery, intellectual discovery, teamwork, etc). This article outlines the idea in a bit more detail (end of page 2/start of 3 specifically).
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No one has the right to dictate what games should be for another. Everyone has the right to expect a game to fulfill their own expectations though. I don't care if a game is fun every time I boot one up. I care if it's immersive through whatever means to the point where I can relate to whatever feelings the creators are setting out to evoke or not setting out but still evoke. Sometimes that immersion comes from fun gameplay, sometimes from intricate systems and simulation, sometimes from an incredible sense of atmosphere. Trying to limit the definition of games is nonsensical to me.
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GHG
Member
Yep these games are not fun in the slightest but they push all the correct buttons for me (and a lot of others obviously). And that's all it's about, does the game grip you in some way shape or form.
On the other hand some games that are billed as 100% fun bore me to tears.
Different strokes for different folks.
Where's the snore emoji when you need it?
Bore off, you aren't the ruler of the medium. You don't get to decide what types of games get made and what types of experiences people may or may not enjoy.
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Psykodad
Banned
Fun is subjective though. Your idea of fun might not be that of me or the next guy.
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OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Amnesia the Dark Descent wasn't "fun". Games don't have to be fun per se. They do need to be engaging in some way. Whether it be in gameplay or story. I just don't necessarily need to be having fun with a game if the world brings me in. I can see that in the case of Death Stranding
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iconmaster
Banned
My first time through Dark Souls was not fun. But I loved it.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Same with Silent Hill 2. That game was not "traditionally" fun, like at all. It was a psychological tickle that kept you playing, and the total package of atmosphere and story kept sucking you in till the end. It is one of the greatest games of all time. If not the greatest "horror" game ever made, still.
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LuvOfThaGame
Banned
100% bullshit being thrown about. "Fun" means enjoying your experience. If you don't enjoy the game at all and just grind through, you're doing it wrong and probably just playing games you are told to play by the masses. Seeing these responses shines a nice light on why people spend more time hating things than enjoying them.
I had a blast with silent hill 2. I have fun and enjoy horror movies and games. Many, many do.
I have fun with hard difficulty games like cuphead and play all games on hardest difficulty anyways.
If a game isnt made to be enjoyable at all or if you play certain games and dont enjoy them, you're getting played by hype.
Now that's not fun.
I had a blast with silent hill 2. I have fun and enjoy horror movies and games. Many, many do.
I have fun with hard difficulty games like cuphead and play all games on hardest difficulty anyways.
If a game isnt made to be enjoyable at all or if you play certain games and dont enjoy them, you're getting played by hype.
Now that's not fun.
Hideous Snake
Gold Member
And how do you get engaged if what you're playing isn't fun? The world alone? That's called fun by the way
Explosive Zombie
Banned
I dunno what reject every criticism means, unless we're talking people who have played it who cares who rejects or accepts any critique? The critics have played it and it's scoring well.
Cult of Kojima sounds like invisible phantoms, I only like 2 MGS games, personally and the rest aren't really my cup of tea, this game looks interesting to me, though.
Also fun is fucking subjective, guys.
BlackOlivesMatter
Banned
Fun is too subjective to apply, I think the correct term should be entertained.
I can be entertained by a good movie, or a really bad movie. I can be entertained by a great game, or a shitty game ( doesn't have to be fun). I can be entertained by mukbang videos, court documentaries, or a girl crying while she's giving you a hand job.
May have said too much
I can be entertained by a good movie, or a really bad movie. I can be entertained by a great game, or a shitty game ( doesn't have to be fun). I can be entertained by mukbang videos, court documentaries, or a girl crying while she's giving you a hand job.
May have said too much
I don't know. Where is the entertainment in serious movies that don't have a good sense of fun?
Surely if you look at something in the context of overall tone then there is a question of how you want to define "fun" when it comes to gaming?
So even in this post you do switch out "fun" for "engaging" in your second point but I would say that something being "fun" and something being "engaging" are different things.
Most games are "fun". I think we probably don't have that many top level games with a super serious "tone". Most games will have a degree of quirkiness or something like that which will make them "fun" to play.
Bloodborne is definitely fun to play but also there is a deeper darker tone and at times the game can be a real challenge.
At some point there we do have a question of whether or not it's actually fun.
Looking at the footage there definitely are quirky elements to this but there is an obvious approach here where the game kind of wants to be taken seriously.
That's a challenge for developers in general if they are looking at movies, music and other forms of art that can be deep and meaningful and just completely mind-blowing without actually being fun at all.
I think it's far better to ask if a game is "engaging" or "interesting" than to ask if it is "fun". Especially with games that are going for a specific tone.
If the game is shit then fair enough. There's probably a valid discussion there about how the medium is assessed in terms of "fun" compared to other forms of entertainment though.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Requiem for a Dream isn't a fun movie but I still enjoyed it. Story and character can do a lot for entertainment. If I enjoy the story and characters of a game but its not fun to play I may still play it.
EDIT: Saruhashi said it better lol
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Psykodad
Banned
No worries, I cry when I give myself handjobs.
JCK75
Member
If your idea of fun is carrying boxes for 40 hours, I'm content to have a different idea of fun
FranXico
Member
This is the truth. Anybody who claims to know which games should or shouldn't be fun is full of shit.
KOMANI
KOMANI
I usually use spit for lubricant, but whatever works for you, I guess.
Hideous Snake
Gold Member
Engaging is because it's fun or maybe to me only I don't know. But whatever aspect you enjoy in a game I believe it goes under fun. But at the end fun is subjective so what's fun for me might not be considered fun for someone else
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Good points as well. "Fun" is subjective. Take EDF games for example. People swear by their "fun", and I don't doubt they have fun with them, but those games bore the snots out of me. Which in turn, is not fun.
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Psykodad
Banned
Well, I haven't played the game yet, so I can't tell if I'll enjoy it.
When I saw Kingdom Hearts for the first time at a friends house, I called him gay and laughed at him.
Turned out to be one of the best games I've ever played.
MOBAs were always games for nerds and incels to me, yet Paragon (despite it's flaws) is my most played game ever with ~2500 hrs played in 1.5 years.
That's why nowadays I'd rather actually play a game first before I make final judgments.
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thelastword
Banned
Fun is subjective..... Games are more than fun. Games are about entertainment in a generalized term, it's not just about fun. Some of my best games or movies, I won't describe them as fun.... The story, the world, the choices I have to make are not necessarily fun.
It's about the quality of the experience in the game, if the game is a horror game, is it a good one? Certainly your word to describe rule of rose or silent hill is not fun, but tense, scared, heart racing, nervous, sweaty.... The best games are those who go beyond just stomping mushrooms and only cater to a younger mindset, but something more involved and less simple.....
I mean people talk of fun fun gun, but for how long will I play wackamole before it stops being both fun and entertaining, I need something diverse and deep to keep me engaged, for much longer....
Which brings me to an issue I see with many gamers these days. A game can't be fun or rather I'd like to use the word engaging, unless it's a hand holding session...... Go to the blinking red point on the map, do an activity like destroy a tower or power an generator, then loop over to the next blinking light and checkpoint..... Anytime you have to think a bit, anytime devs make game mechanics a bit more involved, anytime there's a little challenge involved in the way the game is played, people have a huge problem with that, as if you should just sprint across the world, phase shift across the map in every game.
I still remember how much noise gamers made about not having rewind in a racing Sim some years ago, or not having a big colorful driving line or not allowing them all assists in a motorsports race.... We are so used to games which are built for dummies, which is the only way we qualify fun in our games these days..... In essence fun games are actually simple and uncomplicated, but with simple games they also lack depth and can become quite monotonous.
So, in the last year, you had people saying..... certain games were fun, but they were panned..... "I'm having fun though, but for how will you be engaged if the experience is not that memorable, challenging or if it does not evoke a wider span of emotions from you.....
When gamers say" is it fun" , they mean, can you blow stuff up or some buildings, let's kill lots of zombies or pirates, let's stomp on some mushrooms over and over.... It may be fun for a while, but these are not the best experiences you will get in gaming, if such simple repetitive actions are their only hook. Games which engage the player on a wider range of emotions are almost always the best games.....
In essence, games are much more than fun, games are about the experience and moreso how much engagement you can get out of a player, how much you can stimulate and tittilate their faculties, reflexes etc.....
It's about the quality of the experience in the game, if the game is a horror game, is it a good one? Certainly your word to describe rule of rose or silent hill is not fun, but tense, scared, heart racing, nervous, sweaty.... The best games are those who go beyond just stomping mushrooms and only cater to a younger mindset, but something more involved and less simple.....
I mean people talk of fun fun gun, but for how long will I play wackamole before it stops being both fun and entertaining, I need something diverse and deep to keep me engaged, for much longer....
Which brings me to an issue I see with many gamers these days. A game can't be fun or rather I'd like to use the word engaging, unless it's a hand holding session...... Go to the blinking red point on the map, do an activity like destroy a tower or power an generator, then loop over to the next blinking light and checkpoint..... Anytime you have to think a bit, anytime devs make game mechanics a bit more involved, anytime there's a little challenge involved in the way the game is played, people have a huge problem with that, as if you should just sprint across the world, phase shift across the map in every game.
I still remember how much noise gamers made about not having rewind in a racing Sim some years ago, or not having a big colorful driving line or not allowing them all assists in a motorsports race.... We are so used to games which are built for dummies, which is the only way we qualify fun in our games these days..... In essence fun games are actually simple and uncomplicated, but with simple games they also lack depth and can become quite monotonous.
So, in the last year, you had people saying..... certain games were fun, but they were panned..... "I'm having fun though, but for how will you be engaged if the experience is not that memorable, challenging or if it does not evoke a wider span of emotions from you.....
When gamers say" is it fun" , they mean, can you blow stuff up or some buildings, let's kill lots of zombies or pirates, let's stomp on some mushrooms over and over.... It may be fun for a while, but these are not the best experiences you will get in gaming, if such simple repetitive actions are their only hook. Games which engage the player on a wider range of emotions are almost always the best games.....
In essence, games are much more than fun, games are about the experience and moreso how much engagement you can get out of a player, how much you can stimulate and tittilate their faculties, reflexes etc.....
Hmm. I'm hesitant to say some stuff because honestly I do think Kojima is a bit over-hyped and also I don't want to make inappropriate comparisons to very serious and top tier movie.
The Shining is a movie that I would never really describe as "fun" but by fuck is it a damn good movie.
Trying to look at it from this angle of "is it fun" I'd struggle to find myself saying "yes it is fun" but on the other hand I would tell you it's one of the best movies ever made. Yet, if someone came to me and said "I just watch movies to have fun" then I don't really have a rebuttal. While they may find The Shining to be boring old shite, for me it is still one of the greatest. See also Blade Runner (which might be a better comparison for Death Stranding, I dunno).
When it comes to games I love 2D platform games above all else. The are fun, engaging. Good soundtracks can go a long way. Fun mechanics. Very busy. Lots going on. Lots of engaging fun. That's the games I grew up on. Fun. Fun. Fun. Right?
I think most games do have that fundamental "fun" aspect. Even when they try to be serious there is usually still some whacky or crazy element that just makes it fun.
The question that follows then is what would a developer need to do to create a game that is like The Shining or Blade Runner where there isn't "fun" as such and the medium is being used to create immersion or to really make this game that has a slow, slow burn?
Is that even possible in this medium at all?
People are really fixated on this with Death Stranding. Is it "fun". Is it "boring". Can the story carry the less intensive, less action focused, gameplay?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Nope, of course not. But we should also be able to articulate our points instead of trolling, baiting, and driveby's.
LuvOfThaGame
Banned
Since when?
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