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[darrylgorn]

Well that was generic.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

10x different vibe than the gameplay trailer months ago where a couple employees narrated a length video which included running around stabbing spiders.

The trailer is like a superhero or SW tv ad which are usually a lot more serious and gritty than the actual movie.

 

[March Climber]

No offense but this is what I mean by low standards. Bioware is one of EA's top developers alongside Respawn and Dice. A Bioware RPG should have the same level of quality as other big RPGs like Cyberpunk or Baulder Gate 3 at a minimum. Every Bioware RPG should be in the running as one of the Best RPGs of its generation. IMO that's the expectation a Bioware RPG should have and this Dragon Age isn't even close to that. It feels like most gamers expectation these days for a game is to just not be outright terrible.

Are you describing pre-Xbox gen Bioware or post-Xbox Bioware?

Most of their games usually have a set narrative with choices that affect smaller threads within that narrative and how you end up there, but I've never looked any Kotor, Mass Effect, nor any Dragon Age game at the scale of something like BG3. They were ambitious sure, but there are levels to this and also differences in intent.

I have limited experience with pre-Xbox Bioware so I'm not sure if their storytelling scale was much more massive back then.

 

[proandrad]

This is true. As long as your current game is great, your past mistakes won't matter as much to gamers. The problem here though is that Dragon Age 4 doesn't look great. It's crazy to think there was a time I was worried EA would close Bioware but now I wish EA would close the studio and give their IPs to another studio.

No offense but this is what I mean by low standards. Bioware is one of EA's top developers alongside Respawn and Dice. A Bioware RPG should have the same level of quality as other big RPGs like Cyberpunk or Baulder Gate 3 at a minimum. Every Bioware RPG should be in the running as one of the Best RPGs of its generation. IMO that's the expectation a Bioware RPG should have and this Dragon Age isn't even close to that. It feels like most gamers expectation these days for a game is to just not be outright terrible.

Never thought any Bioware game was ever a generational rpg, so it checks out.

 

[SABRE220]

Terrible generic art style and presentation, and underwhelming cheap graphics aside ill give it a chance and wait for reviews. I have such a fond memory of origins and even liked da2 and Inquisition even if they were serious step backwards. Bioware has fallen far from its heights but ill hold hope like a fool.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Will people play if this game was woke AND good?

Director is gendermancer, sure. But what if he made a kickass game?

 

[Mister Wolf]

Will people play if this game was woke AND good?

Director is gendermancer, sure. But what if he made a kickass game?

We are going to find out. When he came out in that IGN vid referring to the character Taash as "they" I knew I was going to skip it. The top scars in the character creator with only the option to make "flat-back" female characters was just icing on the cake.

 

[lmimmfn]

I can't wait to see the Steam figures

 

[WoJ]

That was a great trailer. I'm still skeptical this game won't suck.

 

[Rush2112]

I have a feeling that the story will be a rehash of "current day issues" to make us more "aware."

 

[Kacho]

Will people play if this game was woke AND good?

Director is gendermancer, sure. But what if he made a kickass game?

Depends on how in your face the woke elements are. Fextralife was positive about the game in his preview but said the writing sucked and will likely tolerate it to enjoy the gameplay. Doesn’t bode well for a 50+ hour game. The gameplay will need to do some heavy lifting.

 

[Calico345]

I have no personal investment in the series, but I have always kept up with its news. I'm interested in Veilguard as an action RPG and nothing more in terms of the ongoing franchise, but I do see how longtime series fans are upset at certain elements of the game. I'm waiting for reviews in terms of game performance and length before committing. If I don't care for what I see at launch, I'll wait for a sale of 50% or more.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Depends on how in your face the woke elements are. Fextralife was positive about the game in his preview but said the writing sucked and will likely tolerate it to enjoy the gameplay. Doesn’t bode well for a 50+ hour game. The gameplay will need to do some heavy lifting.

If writing sucks, I don’t think I will sink 50-100 hrs in this.

Gameplay looks serviceable/decent to me. Not good enough.

It needs to have great lore/writing + branching paths / choices to be worth playing.

 

[Sinfulgore]

Are you describing pre-Xbox gen Bioware or post-Xbox Bioware?

Most of their games usually have a set narrative with choices that affect smaller threads within that narrative and how you end up there, but I've never looked any Kotor, Mass Effect, nor any Dragon Age game at the scale of something like BG3. They were ambitious sure, but there are levels to this and also differences in intent.

I have limited experience with pre-Xbox Bioware so I'm not sure if their storytelling scale was much more massive back then.

I'm talking about Bioware as a whole and this is about quality not scale. Truthfully I haven't played BG 3 yet but I assume it has the same level of quality as Divinity Original Sin 2. Honestly looking at each of these developers' catalogs of games I'd argue Bioware overall has made better games than both Larian and CD Project Red. If Dragon Age 4 didn't have the Dragon Age name I'd think it was an amateur developer's first game like I believe Kingdoms of Amalur was.

Never thought any Bioware game was ever a generational rpg, so it checks out.

Really? Their console games were incredible. Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic, an original Xbox exclusive was ported to the Switch just like other classic RPGS of that time like FF X.

 

[Topher]

If writing sucks, I don’t think I will sink 50-100 hrs in this.

Gameplay looks serviceable/decent to me. Not good enough.

It needs to have great lore/writing + branching paths / choices to be worth playing.

Well yeah.....if the story and writing sucks then I doubt I'll hang around. If it is just ok-ish then I can usually get by as long as the gameplay shines. I can overlook quite a bit with kickass gameplay.

 

[Kotaro]

Gamers not impressed

yikes!

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Are you describing pre-Xbox gen Bioware or post-Xbox Bioware?

Most of their games usually have a set narrative with choices that affect smaller threads within that narrative and how you end up there, but I've never looked any Kotor, Mass Effect, nor any Dragon Age game at the scale of something like BG3. They were ambitious sure, but there are levels to this and also differences in intent.

I have limited experience with pre-Xbox Bioware so I'm not sure if their storytelling scale was much more massive back then.

BG3 poured a lot of resources in making small interactions feel fleshed out. Tons of cinematic dialogue capture that you won’t see if you choose differently.

Outside of that, bigger threads of choices and consequences I think are similar to what Bioware has done in the past.

 

[Omnipunctual Godot]

Depends on how in your face the woke elements are. Fextralife was positive about the game in his preview but said the writing sucked and will likely tolerate it to enjoy the gameplay. Doesn’t bode well for a 50+ hour game. The gameplay will need to do some heavy lifting.

Yeah, the gameplay can be incredible, but I'm not wasting dozens of hours on a poorly written RPG. The writing should be the best part of an RPG.

 

[March Climber]

I'm talking about Bioware as a whole and this is about quality not scale. Truthfully I haven't played BG 3 yet but I assume it has the same level of quality as Divinity Original Sin 2. Honestly looking at each of these developers' catalogs of games I'd argue Bioware overall has made better games than both Larian and CD Project Red.

Thanks for explaining further. I agree with you on this point, but I just don't agree with the way that you're saying they are better.

Scope was never the reason Bioware was better, it was masterful direction, pacing, and storytelling.

That's why I was confused when you compared them to those other games which are going more for scope. When I mean scope, I mean that you can't change huge narrative turning points in Bioware games like you could in a couple of other games that are larger in scope. You will always fight against the reapers, they will always show up, and there's nothing that can be done in Mass Effect 1 or 2 to stop such an action from happening and end up in a completely different scenario or completely different out-there ending.

This is what I've said previously in a different thread on Mass Effect 2, which resides in my top 10 for good reason.

Counterpoint: I feel that pacing is the big issue in RPGs, and Mass Effect 2 is one of the few games that fully solved this problem.

Mass Effect 2 had some of the best pacing I’ve ever played in an RPG(including JRPGs here too). It gave you just enough lore through environmental storytelling and logs, it put relevant and important information in the forefront during conversational gameplay and cutscenes, it made story moments more cinematic(than most games that use a static dialogue camera), and it had sidequests that were actually their own well written stories to the point where they could have separately been the plot of their own video game entries.

While this sounds decently close to Witcher 3, the biggest factor was that Mass Effect 2 did its best to keep the player moving forward. There was never a moment in ME 2 that I sighed because I had to go and pick some plants for a potion or farm a creature for a material.

The pacing of storytelling is so bad in a lot of modern RPGs(especially the bloated ones), that some people would rather have it all be optional or in the background if the developer is no good at it or just okay at it.

How many times have any of you played the intro in an RPG and then feel overwhelmed and annoyed the minute you reach that first town and they overload you with dialogue and/or side quests? In a movie this would literally be a gigantic exposition dump which is a bad thing, but we forgive it in video games.

Now regarding this point:

If Dragon Age 4 didn't have the Dragon Age name I'd think it was an amateur developer's first game

I cannot comment on how good or bad this upcoming game will be until I play it. I have seen people here eat crow time and time again on here simply because they didn't wait until they actually played the game before jumping out of a window to criticize a game.

What I can comment so far on is what I've seen, and that's a bit of fun gameplay. I'm a sucker for using your shield to throw into an enemy and catch it on the way back for a combo. That was my favorite part of the mediocre Avengers game. I'm also a sucker for the faster pacing of said combat with active blocking and dodging, and the Mass Effect style pausing and commands that they showed off during gamescom. All of it speaks to me when at the same time it doesn't speak to Origins fans. But I won't judge it just yet until I can play it, because while it looks cool, it can secretly feel sluggish in person and I need to know for sure.

BG3 poured a lot of resources in making small interactions feel fleshed out. Tons of cinematic dialogue capture that you won’t see if you choose differently.

This applies to what I have said above regarding scope. I feel that BG3 isn't the right game to make comparisons to post-Xbox Bioware games. The scope in options and scenarios is too vast of a difference. That doesn't make either one better than the other I'm just pointing it out.

 

[Hestar69]

Trailer was meh. I'll sail the seven seas and try it out tho.

 

[Magic Carpet]

Audio people need to do better with Dragon roars.
All games need better Dragon roars.

Quick screechy hisses from large creatures are irritating not intimidating.
I want to slap your dragon to see if it will make a new noise.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

This applies to what I have said above regarding scope. I feel that BG3 isn't the right game to make comparisons to post-Xbox Bioware games. The scope in options and scenarios is too vast of a difference. That doesn't make either one better than the other I'm just pointing it out.

Post Xbox Bioware is where they started incorporating choices and consequences more in their games. Their older rpgs I dont think have much of it.

I think their games have made great use of this due to great writing. Choices are meaningful only if writing is good and you have to think about it.

Compare this, to say BG3, you have a choice of kicking a squirrel and murdering it. Is this really a choice? Most of its choices are kinda, no brainer.

In comparison, say Mass Effect where you are deciding fate of whole species. That I find to be much more compelling.

 

[Jaybe]

 

[March Climber]

Post Xbox Bioware is where they started incorporating choices and consequences more in their games. Their older rpgs I dont think have much of it.

I'm taking your word on it. Like I said above I can't comment on something I've never experienced. I have very low knowledge of pre-Xbox Bioware, so I wasn't sure if their games were even more complex beforehand. I do know that there was a small subsection of gamers who disliked what Bioware became post-Xbox, but I haven't heard much out of them anymore since those times.

I think their games have made great use of this due to great writing. Choices are meaningful only if writing is good and you have to think about it.

In comparison, say Mass Effect where you are deciding fate of whole species. That I find to be much more compelling.

I agree with this and Bioware has done it really, really well.

 

[howitis3]

I don't think this looks good. It looks like generic gen z modern audience trash that we always get

 

[Kacho]

I don't think this looks good. It looks like generic gen z modern audience trash that we always get

Yeah, someone said the trailer looked like a Netflix production and they aren't wrong.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

I'm taking your word on it. Like I said above I can't comment on something I've never experienced. I have very low knowledge of pre-Xbox Bioware, so I wasn't sure if their games were even more complex beforehand. I do know that there was a small subsection of gamers who disliked what Bioware became post-Xbox, but I haven't heard much out of them anymore since those times.

Am talking about story related choices and consequences. In BG2, am not sure if there are any branching paths.

You do get a ton of role playing opportunities. Writing is great and you can act as distinct characters. Gear and stat system is deep and complex etc.

Modern BioWare games have regressed in every other way than story based choices and consequences.

 

[Sharius]

first DA don't even get hype after seeing a trailer, not even DAI manage to do it, great job EA

 

[Sinfulgore]

Thanks for explaining further. I agree with you on this point, but I just don't agree with the way that you're saying they are better.

Scope was never the reason Bioware was better, it was masterful direction, pacing, and storytelling.

That's why I was confused when you compared them to those other games which are going more for scope. When I mean scope, I mean that you can't change huge narrative turning points in Bioware games like you could in a couple of other games that are larger in scope. You will always fight against the reapers, they will always show up, and there's nothing that can be done in Mass Effect 1 or 2 to stop such an action from happening and end up in a completely different scenario or completely different out-there ending.

This is what I've said previously in a different thread on Mass Effect 2, which resides in my top 10 for good reason.



Now regarding this point:

I cannot comment on how good or bad this upcoming game will be until I play it. I have seen people here eat crow time and time again on here simply because they didn't wait until they actually played the game before jumping out of a window to criticize a game.

What I can comment so far on is what I've seen, and that's a bit of fun gameplay. I'm a sucker for using your shield to throw into an enemy and catch it on the way back for a combo. That was my favorite part of the mediocre Avengers game. I'm also a sucker for the faster pacing of said combat with active blocking and dodging, and the Mass Effect style pausing and commands that they showed off during gamescom. All of it speaks to me when at the same time it doesn't speak to Origins fans. But I won't judge it just yet until I can play it, because while it looks cool, it can secretly feel sluggish in person and I need to know for sure.


This applies to what I have said above regarding scope. I feel that BG3 isn't the right game to make comparisons to post-Xbox Bioware games. The scope in options and scenarios is too vast of a difference. That doesn't make either one better than the other I'm just pointing it out.

Yeah, I was referring to more technological and game-design aspects of these games. Even though Cyberpunk is a little old now I still think it holds up with recent games. As for BG 3 and Divinity Original Sin games, I feel like this is the style of game Dragon Age should have become. I wish these big publishers didn't think a game needs to appeal to as many people as possible to be successful. It's like Hollywood who thought a comic book movie needed to be PG 13 or below to be successful then R-rated movies like Deadpool, Logan, and Joker proved that wrong. You can make a game in a niche genre and it can still be very successful if done right like BG 3.

As for Dragon Age 4, I think in all aspects it looks like an early PS4 game at best and for a studio of Bioware caliber I do expect better. I'm a huge Dragon Age fan, I even read most of the novels, and they have shown enough of the game for me to know the game won't be great. It might be serviceable, as good as Star Wars Outlaws, which to some is enough but I think for me and many others we expect better.

 

[Coconutt]

To all my brothers ans sisters who are going to buy this game at full price thinking it will be good only to be disappointed

 

[Krathoon]

The whole way the darkspawn reproduce is pretty messed up.

 

[Kotaro]

Will people play if this game was woke AND good?

Director is gendermancer, sure. But what if he made a kickass game?

NOPE, it's almost impossible for anything woke to be good

 

[nnytk]

After seeing that trailer I feel like I would've loved a more campy approach to everything.

I mean, if you wanna go the queer route, go all the way. Imagine a fantasy RPG with Mugler style outfits and the wildest high fashion inspired dresses and weirdness mixed with metal armor. I would've loved to see that.

This looks quite drab, muted. Curious for reviews.

 

[The Cockatrice]

Will people play if this game was woke AND good?

Director is gendermancer, sure. But what if he made a kickass game?

Cyberpunk 2077 is pretty woke considering everything in it but the left hate it for dumb reasons so the right thinks its not woke. Spiderman 2, GoW Ragnarok, HFW, etc. are other examples. Idiots everywhere are really brainwashed to hate everything. What these ppl dont realize is that theyre doing exactly the same thing the woke ppl do, cancelling a game without a thought. Ironic isnt it? Gaf just like the other forum is not a place for the middle guy.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

in before the mob and the word "woke"

Really excited for this, but need to see reviews first!

Well, they will keep insisting on using it in modern games so not really sure why it's surprising to keep seeing it brought up on a gaming forum

Par the course to be honest.

It's akin to moaning about 'These bloody engines, why do we keep seeing it brought up, I can't stand it!!' On the Auto trader forum at this point.

As for Dragon Age, well it's not a Dragon Age for me personally. I have a feeling I wasn't it's target audience to begin with and I'm fine with that. I could do without spending more money on a backlog.

Looking more forward to the inevitable meltdowns honestly.

 

[nowhat]

Compare this, to say BG3, you have a choice of kicking a squirrel and murdering it. Is this really a choice? Most of its choices are kinda, no brainer.

In comparison, say Mass Effect where you are deciding fate of whole species. That I find to be much more compelling.

Oh fuck off. Mass Effect, or any BioWare game, has nothing compared to BG3 when it comes to player choice. "Hey, you get to choose what color the explosion is at the end!"

 

[KiteGr]

From looking generic, to woke disaster, and back to looking generic again (while still being a woke disaster).

 

[Peroroncino]

this is sad, I wanna go back to the year of DA:O release when we were mostly free from this rampant infestation :/

 

[PeteBull]

Will people play if this game was woke AND good?

Director is gendermancer, sure. But what if he made a kickass game?

Show me one such a game, so we can establish a precedent, first.
There are lvls to it, bodytype A/B is timid af since u forget about it 5secs after creating ur character and never think about it again, uglyfying female characters in game, especially including protag isnt so easily forgetable, adding some woke story elements(strong independed boss babes who dont need no man, hating on law enforcement etc) is one more step into destruction, but some games go far even beyond that.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Oh fuck off. Mass Effect, or any BioWare game, has nothing compared to BG3 when it comes to player choice. "Hey, you get to choose what color the explosion is at the end!"

BG3 has a lot of choices.

But tell me, outside of choice that would unravel Githyanki empire, which one made you think twice?

Compare this to, say Wasteland 3. Your first major choice is between a corrupt police force or a good hearted mafia don who is fair and good for economy.

There is nothing in BG3 that made me think even twice. Choices there make themselves.

 

[nowhat]

There is nothing in BG3 that made me think even twice. Choices there make themselves.

Obviously you haven't played "the dark urge" origin story. That alone raises the game above the competition. It's rare that you can be a truly evil character.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Obviously you haven't played "the dark urge" origin story. That alone raises the game above the competition. It's rare that you can be a truly evil character.

Most games offer evil playthroughs that are more nuanced than what dark urge offers.

That does dilute kill everyone mentality. But I do prefer, say BG2 evil playthrough. All role playing is done via dialogue and some actions. Writing is good there is it feels compelling.

 

[Aguero9320]

Might break my ‘no full price’ rule for this if it reviews well. I’m close to finishing Outlaws, and this would be a nice one to move on to.

 

[Von Hugh]

This looks like Call of Duty of RPGs. Absolutely heinous.

 

[PeteBull]

first DA don't even get hype after seeing a trailer, not even DAI manage to do it, great job EA

Even by today's standards 10yo DA:I doesnt look bad at all, if u play it maxed on pc(no mods)

It actually looks better from DA:V in terms of characters/setting/colour pallete and most importantly doesnt look offputing :>

 

[EverydayBeast]

Purple is a problem?

 

[captainnapalm]

Is this supposed to be the trailer that convinced people lol. Holy shit people.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic, an original Xbox exclusive

For 4 months only.

 

[Polelock]

They should have went with this trailer first. I'm very cautiously optimistic. Lets see how it reviews.

 

[PeteBull]

They should have went with this trailer first. I'm very cautiously optimistic. Lets see how it reviews.

This trailer is like those comedy movie trailers where they put all good jokes into the trailer and nothing is left for actual movie, it looks like they took every scene from the game that didnt look terrible and put them into short trailer, anything thats left didnt make the cut to be presentable enough coz it was too offputing =D