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[Sephzilla]

Poppycock. Joffrey being dead is Joffrey's fault, although perhaps you could say Cersei was a bad mother who raised a demon. But Joffrey died because he was a miserable shit with power. Tommen... that one's mostly on Cersei, either by letting the Faith Militant come into power and brainwash him in the first place, or by murdering everyone and causing him such grief he felt suicide was the only option. Myrcella... I don't see how you possibly hold Cersei accountable for Myrcella's death. Cersei didn't want her to go to Dorne in the first place, and it turns out she was right to be paranoid about that. Cersei deserves blame for a lot of bad actions on the show, but I wouldn't hold her accountable for her children's deaths.

Cersei had multiple chances to reign in Joffrey and never did, she only started to try after it was too late. And Tommen is 100% Cersei's fault because she let the Sept rise into power and then she also murdered Tommen's wife.

 

[Einchy]

You're talking about the same Jamie that privately went all #Brexit (we need to keep these foreign hordes out of our land) in this episode?

That seems like a really weird insertion of real life politics in a place where they don't apply. We know for a fact that the Dothrakis ARE what people fear them to be, which is why they are so useful in battle.

 

[Ithil]

A little amusing how they perfunctorily kill off two of the Sand Snakes in one scene, but leave the third one alive, which is the only one of the three anyone ever remembers for...reasons (the line, yeah...definitely the line).

Not that anyone captured by Euron is likely to survive long, but it's funny to see that they know the other two were completely interchangeable for the audience so they don't even get any spotlight.

 

[sangreal]

All these people you mention weren't in the throne room when LF turned.

Hence why I bothered to point out their connections to people that were rather than just the fact that the show has told us more than once that people outside know what happened

Cat and Tyrion, neither of which were anywhere near Kings Landing, have talked about it. I am not about to dig through every episode to see if more people have brought it up, but everyone in the show today is in contact with someone who should know

On the other hand what has the show done to suggest people don't know ?

 

[LordKasual]

Thank fucking god for this episode

Missandei, GOOD fucking LORD

GoT doing god's work

 

[Vyse The Legend]

A little amusing how they perfunctorily kill off two of the Sand Snakes in one scene, but leave the third one alive, which is the only one of the three anyone ever remembers for...reasons (the line, yeah...definitely the line).

Not that anyone captured by Euron is likely to survive long, but it's funny to see that they know the other two were completely interchangeable for the audience so they don't even get any spotlight.

She's the more memorable one, and Ellaria killed Cersei's daughter, so Euron wanted to let her return the favor.

The Mountain is probably going to have his fun with her.

 

[Ros8105]

And the unsullied.

I mean, I may have to rewatch but I'm pretty sure it was both.

I mean, yeah.

I mean, that's just from memory.

I mean, this is all for you Valar Morghulis

We saw the Dothraki enslaving people and do worse things.

I mean, Jaime not being a fan of them makes sense to me.

 

[ComputerBlue]

Cersei had multiple chances to reign in Joffrey and never did, she only started to try after it was too late. And Tommen is 100% Cersei's fault because she let the Sept rise into power and then she also murdered Tommen's wife.

If you want to blame Cersei for Joffreys death then Robert is equally accountable as well, as are others who surrounded him, Jaime, The Hound etc. to some degree at least, even if only a little. He was an uncontrollable piece of shit.

If it was their fault then Tommen and Myrcella wouldn't have been the polar opposite of him.

 

[LordKasual]

You're talking about the same Jamie that privately went all #Brexit (we need to keep these foreign hordes out of our land) in this episode?

The fuck does this have to do with Game of Thrones LOL

The Dothraki LITERALLY rape and enslave people

we've fucking watched them do it

 

[LukasTaves]

you would think

everything surrounding LF recently (and by recently I mean the past few seasons) has been dumb as fuck

Yeah, everything surrounding him after leaving with Sansa, specially him delivering Sansa to Ramsey as a way to please Cersei after marrying to a house that rebelled against the lannisters.

He getting to the vale, marrying and killing Cat's sister in practically one episode was hard to swallow as well.

 

[sangreal]

If you want to blame Cersei for Joffreys death then Robert is equally accountable as well, as are others who surrounded him, Jaime, The Hound etc. to some degree at least, even if only a little.

Robert, not knowing Joffrey was illegitimate, did try to reign him in by making Ned his regent

 

[Psychoward]

Well off topic but why in the hell does everyone on this forum start their sentences with I mean, these are from this page alone, lol.

Sorry it's one of the premade sentence starters for gaf gold, I forget to disable it sometimes.

 

[Lionel Richie]

Tyrion is his fave I believe..

and Cersei underdog? You been drinking too much of that Dornish wine breh?

Danny has dragons, Cersei has a zombie dude and the ability to not wear wigs anymore. In a one on one fight against Danny she has to be the underdog.

I love Cersei as a character but I've never considered her either of those things lol. And Dany may have been blessed with a shit ton of luck, but I don't consider her a perfect person, even though she tries/wants to be a good person. I feel like she's no more a "Mary Sue" than Jon is, at least.

It's debatable which is a more Mary Sue character, at least Jon didn't start the series like that, he eventually became the messiah midway because everyone else who could play that role was dead. Not long after the first few episodes Danny humanized Jason Momoa and made him a corny lovestruck dude who looked like he was dying to spew out some ole poetry on the sheer power of her skills at cowgirling. She felt too OP from day one.

Cersei is likeable? Really?

She's awesome. Her line to LF when he said that "knowledge is power" and then she said "power is power" is to this day the best quote on the series. I'm not an usual GoT fan though, my 3 favorite characters in the series are Cersei, her late dad and Ser Bronn.

 

[LordKasual]

If you want to blame Cersei for Joffreys death then Robert is equally accountable as well, as are others who surrounded him, Jaime, The Hound etc. to some degree at least, even if only a little. He was an uncontrollable piece of shit.

If it was their fault then Tommen and Myrcella wouldn't have been the polar opposite of him.

The moment Joffery became king it was too late. Cersei couldn't have stopped him even if she tried, his disposition would have snowballed him into what he was regardless.

Well off topic but why in the hell does everyone on this forum start their sentences with I mean, these are from this page alone, lol.

I mean....have you ever heard people talk in real life? :V

pretty common

 

[TimeEffect]

i mean, she was a awful persons since little, so i dont think marrying robert has anything to do with it

What did she do when she was young that was so evil?

 

[jett]

Kit's been doing something weird with his voice in the Winterfell hall scenes with all the lords and Sansa.

In this and the last episode. Just those scenes too. Odd.

Maybe he's trying to sound more kingly and regal or something.

 

[The Artisan]

I mean, I don't agree with his xenophobic comments. Not much else to it. He continues his heel turn after raping his sister a few seasons back.

I effectively compared him to Farage spouting #Brexit arguments so naturally I think he's going down an evil path.

you mean what he said about eunuchs and the Dothraki?

 

[Venture]

She's the more memorable one, and Ellaria killed Cersei's daughter, so Euron wanted to let her return the favor.

The Mountain is probably going to have his fun with her.

I think they're setting it up so Bronn will rescue her.

 

[Einchy]

I think they're setting it up so Bronn will rescue her.

That man spent all of the off season thinking about those boobies.

 

[Gattsu25]

you mean what he said about eunuchs and the Dothraki?

Yeah, thanks. I knew he spoke about the Unsullied but the specific wording was escaping me.

 

[TimeEffect]

I didnt realize varys wanted to be king too

Why would he? Im kind of confused as to why so many people want to sit on the throne when being an adviser isnt so bad either

Also, is it assumed targs are all capable of going mad? Feels like dany foreshadows that

 

[talkingood]

Did anyone else find the directing in this episode sort of...different? I don't know if it's a director they haven't used before or what, but something seemed a bit odd to me. Not necessarily bad, but in particular during the action sequences on the ship, it had a different "feel" to it. Not sure how to explain it.

A lot of very digital looking ashes falling, too, I noticed.

 

[KooopaKid]

Reading this thread you would think the show took a nosedive. Nope, a few shortcuts sure but nothing extremely lame that doesn't make sense at all.
Very entertaining episode as usual. 55 minutes in a snap of a finger.

 

[Conkerkid11]

Nope, a few shortcuts sure but nothing extremely lame that doesn't make sense at all.

Err...

 

[Einchy]

Did anyone else find the directing in this episode sort of...different? I don't know if it's a director they haven't used before or what, but something seemed a bit odd to me. Not necessarily bad, but in particular during the action sequences on the ship, it had a different "feel" to it. Not sure how to explain it.

A lot of very digital looking ashes falling, too, I noticed.

For the actions scenes, they did this editing style that I hadn't seen done before, which I think was a bit clever. A lot of times when someone hit someone and killed them, often you cut to another angle of that person's reaction, but instead, here they would cut to another part of the battle where someone was reacting to them already being hit.

I didn't have any issues following it but I can see how someone might find that a bit confusing.

 

[The Artisan]

Yeah, thanks. I knew he spoke about the Unsullied but the specific wording was escaping me.

I agree with you there. Why is Jaime's character having such a hard time coming around. He has done good things in the past after several bad things, but it seems like he's just firm on being on the bad side.

 

[Ithil]

Did anyone else find the directing in this episode sort of...different? I don't know if it's a director they haven't used before or what, but something seemed a bit odd to me. Not necessarily bad, but in particular during the action sequences on the ship, it had a different "feel" to it. Not sure how to explain it.

A lot of very digital looking ashes falling, too, I noticed.

This director also the the odd episode last scene with the Terminator Waif stalking Arya. I don't think he's suited to the show.

 

[Einchy]

I agree with you there. Why is Jaime's character having such a hard time coming around. He has done good things in the past after several bad things, but it seems like he's just firm on being on the bad side.

'Cause they're trying to murder Cersei and him. There's no coming around here.

 

[Ithil]

I think they're setting it up so Bronn will rescue her.

Bronn is all about self-preservation, I wouldn't count on him for anything.

 

[hemo memo]

What did she do when she was young that was so evil?

 

[LegendofDragoonLives]

Danny has dragons, Cersei has a zombie dude and the ability to not wear wigs anymore. In a one on one fight against Danny she has to be the underdog.



It's debatable which is a more Mary Sue character, at least Jon didn't start the series like that, he eventually became the messiah midway because everyone else who could play that role was dead. Not long after the first few episodes Danny humanized Jason Momoa and made him a corny lovestruck dude who looked like he was dying to spew out some ole poetry on the sheer power of her skills at cowgirling. She felt too OP from day one.



She's awesome. Her line to LF when he said that "knowledge is power" and then she said "power is power" is to this day the best quote on the series. I'm not an usual GoT fan though, my 3 favorite characters in the series are Cersei, her late dad and Ser Bronn.

likeable underdog

She's a piece of shit of epic proportions.

 

[talkingood]

For the actions scenes, they did this editing style that I hadn't seen done before, which I think was a bit clever. A lot of times when someone hit someone and killed them, often you cut to another angle of that person's reaction, but instead, here they would cut to another part of the battle where someone was reacting to them already being hit.

I didn't have any issues following it but I can see how someone might find that a bit confusing.

That might have been part of it, I'd have to see it again to be sure. I think I mostly followed it, though it was a little disorienting. I understand the directorial approach of staging a fight sequence like this, because it's intended to be a disorienting moment for the characters, but yeah.

This director also the the odd episode last scene with the Terminator Waif stalking Arya. I don't think he's suited to the show.

Huh, yeah, I found those scenes a bit strange too. You might be right, he might just not be suited to the show. I almost thought the ship scene looked like a music video in some ways. Something with the movement and cuts.

I thought the episode was fine, but some odd choices here and there did stand out.

 

[Lionel Richie]

likeable underdog

She's a piece of shit of epic proportions.

Opinions man. I think she's awesome, she's obviously the evil character but I just her find to be all around fun to watch more than anyone else in the series. It's not like I would vote for her or anything like that lol.

 

[Megalosaro]

Did anyone else notice Grey Worm's head was WAY too high to be eatting out Missandei?

 

[rambis]

Except Sansa is applying those lessons at the worst possible time. She still thinks they're playing the political game when Jon is more focused on stopping the zombie hoard that doesn't give two shits about who your allies and enemies are and hates everyone equally. Everything Sansa has done since they've taken Winterfell would essentially result in them creating more enemies and making no allies.

A very revealing quote from EP1 is that Jon is worried so much about the enemy from the North that he isn't concerned about the enemy from the South, Cercie who we see is gathering forces in this episode. I think the show is writing its way into a trap scenario. I agree overall that there should be no war amongst the 7 kingdoms, but at this point no one outside of the Watch has seen the Army of the Dead, there is nothing to galvanize them to cooperate and an attack from the southern kings is still very possible.

I also disagree with your last sentence. The very situation presented was Jon choosing which ally to make and which enemy to make. Was he going to reward the lesser house that helped him take Winterfell in the Battle of the Bastards and punish the Carstarks, who abandoned Robb or allow the treacherous Carstarks to keep their seats and alienate his newfound allies.

They are very much grey situations and present a duality.

 

[Sephzilla]

A very revealing quote from EP1 is that Jon is worried so much about the enemy from the North that he isn't concerned about the enemy from the South, Cercie who we see is gathering forces in this episode. I think the show is writing its way into a trap scenario. I agree overall that there should be no war amongst the 7 kingdoms, but at this point no one out of the Watch has seen the Army of the Dead, there is nothing to galvanize them to cooperate and an attack from the southern kings is still very possible.

I also disagree with your last sentence. The very situation presented was Jon choosing which ally to make and which enemy to make. Was he going to reward the lesser house that helped him take Winterfell in the Battle of the Bastards and punish the Carstarks, who abandoned Robb or allow the treacherous Carstarks to keep their seats and alienate his newfound allies.

They are very much grey situations and present a duality.

Except Jon did address that. It's not that he's not necessarily concerned with the enemy to the south, it's that the enemy to the south can't really challenge them right now even if they wanted to. Jon straight up tells Sansa that Cersei is irrelevant right now because her army can't march north because of winter. Sansa wanted to punish Carstark children who had no say in the decision to betray Robb, and she was against Jon going south to talk to a leader who is literally sitting on a mountain of anti White Walker weapons.

In my opinion this isn't grey situations. Jon is all about saving and uniting the north while Sansa is all about worrying about stuff that isn't relevant right now and potentially keeping the north divided. Sansa is focusing too much on little things and what she thinks is important instead of focusing on the big picture, which is pretty much exactly what got Robb killed.

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

Did anyone else notice Grey Worm's head was WAY too high to be eatting out Missandei?

listen in the heat of the moment an innie might look like the front door

 

[Patrick Bateman]

Theon sucks so much. I never wish the death upon a character, but his dumb behavior gets pretty annoying.

 

[The Artisan]

'Cause they're trying to murder Cersei and him. There's no coming around here.

Jaime shouldn't be on Cersei's side

She also made a Lannister crony beat the eye out of a girl for stealing her jewelry

 

[Einchy]

Theon sucks so much. I never wish the death upon a character, but his dumb behavior gets pretty annoying.

Theon? Who is that? Oh, I think you mean Reek the worthless piece of shit, Theon hasn't been on the show for a while now.

Jaime shouldn't be on Cersei's side

He loves her. We don't get to choose who we love.

He's not about to just give her up to be murdered, at least not at this point, especially when that would mean his own death.

 

[RustyNails]

Theon sucks so much. I never wish the death upon a character, but his dumb behavior gets pretty annoying.

Theon? Who is that? Oh, I think you mean Reek the worthless piece of shit, Theon hasn't been on the show for a while now.

Pray tell, why was Theon worthless last night again?

 

[Goodstyle]

I love how Cersei got to keep her S6 finale theme music.

Opinions man. I think she's awesome, she's obviously the evil character but I just her find to be all around fun to watch more than anyone else in the series. It's not like I would vote for her or anything like that lol.

This.

 

[Einchy]

Pray tell, why was Theon worthless last night again?

I dunno, ask Yara's disappointed ass face as he ran away.

 

[RDreamer]

Cersei is at least a much much MUCH better written evil character than Ramsay or Euron.

 

[The Artisan]

He loves her. We don't get to choose who we love.

He's not about to just give her up to be murdered, at least not at this point, especially when that would mean his own death.

He shouldn't fucking be on her side and unfortunately that's all I can say about this from my perspective

 

[Venture]

Bronn is all about self-preservation, I wouldn't count on him for anything.

Well, that's certainly true. But maybe if an opportunity presents itself...

Yeah. She's toast.

 

[rambis]

Except Jon did address that. It's not that he's not necessarily concerned with the enemy to the south, it's that the enemy to the south can't really challenge them right now even if they wanted to. Jon straight up tells Sansa that Cersei is irrelevant right now because her army can't march north because of winter. Sansa wanted to punish Carstark children who had no say in the decision to betray Robb, and she was against Jon going south to talk to a leader who is literally sitting on a mountain of anti White Walker weapons.

In my opinion this isn't grey situations. Jon is all about saving and uniting the north while Sansa is all about worrying about stuff that isn't relevant right now and potentially keeping the north divided. Sansa is focusing too much on little things and what she thinks is important instead of focusing on the big picture, which is pretty much exactly what got Robb killed.

Did I not say the show is writing itself into a trap? I think Jon is largely naive to think they aren't touchable by Cersei. They are shoring up what looks to be powerful allies and by all means there could be a path to Jon in the next two-three episodes. He "addressed" the situation with something that will likely not hold water long.

It doesn't matter that the Carstark lords are children, they represent their whole house who betrayed Robb. It doesn't necessarily punish them as much as it evens the score to strip their lordships. Its not as if they are being exiled, you aren't splitting a thing. This is akin to city rezoning inside a county.

And Jon did nothing to reward his new allies, why would they help him again if he shows favoritism to traitors? The most sensible move would've been to split the lands of the Carstarks with the other houses and call it a day. But Jon is too much of an honorable fool, as was Ned and Robb.

 

[The Artisan]

Did I not say the show is writing itself into a trap? I think Jon is largely naive to think they aren't touchable by Cersei. They are shoring up what looks to be powerful allies and by all means there could be a path to Jon in the next two-three episodes.

It doesn't matter that the Carstark lords are children, they represent their whole house who betrayed Robb. It doesn't necessarily punish them as much as it evens the score to strip their lordships. Its not as if they are being exiled, you aren't splitting a thing. This is akin to city rezoning inside a county.

And Jon did nothing to reward his new allies, why would they help him again if he shows favoritism to traitors? The most sensible move would've been to split the lands of the Carstarks with the other houses and call it a day. But Jon is too much of an honorable fool, as was Ned and Robb.

That's true, Jon owes his lords for coming to him in service

I was thinking he could arrange Robyn Arryn to marry either Sansa or Lyanna? The Knights of the Vale saved him, Jon is probably aware of the fact that he was named after Jon Arryn so he knows that his father loved and respect him too, the Vale might mean something to Jon now

 

[psaman17]

He shouldn't fucking be on her side and unfortunately that's all I can say about this from my perspective

Your perspective is naive is all i gotta say.

It makes sense that hes on her side. Shes the only family he has left, aside from tyrion, and shes the love of his life.

Its the woman that you care about, the homeland that you love, the kingdom that you swore to protect vs daughter of the cruelest king in the history of westero and her army of savages that rapes, kills and enslaves people since the beginning of civilization.

 

[Megalosaro]

I'm sympathetic to Theon. It's pretty obvious he has ptsd. He was in no position mentally to be what his sister needed him to be.