Note that we are also comparing quake/TF2 scout to halo. The comparison is highly contrasted on purpose.
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Halo |OT| HaloGAF Evolved
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Note that we are also comparing quake/TF2 scout to halo. The comparison is highly contrasted on purpose.
Why? Why didn't you compare it to, say, 90 FOV, which would be totally reasonable for a console game and simultaneously not feel like someone found the game's variables and took a bat to the keyboard?
Steelyuhas
Member
Yeah I know, and on the contrary, I was just comparing FOV's that were realistic to consoles shooters/Halo.
Computron said:
Read this, people, actually read this. Someone's actually, saying this, sincerely. If the FOV was 90 in Halo 2 & 3, I just would not feel like a tank named Master Chief. Also, if the FOV was raised, there would be noticeably less need for teamwork in the game. These are real things that someone said.
Like it was said earlier, maybe 10-15 people care about fov and those that do are playing on PC. If 60 degree fov makes you sick and feel claustrophobic, that's honestly too bad, everyone deserves to be able to enjoy their game. But I thinks it's fine because it serves it's purpose of setting the games pace and situational awareness and millions play the game with no problem.
Obviously only super hardcore are going to use 250 because they are playing fucking quake. You gotta be taking coke or speed to keep up with pros in that game.
Obviously only super hardcore are going to use 250 because they are playing fucking quake. You gotta be taking coke or speed to keep up with pros in that game.
xxjuicesxx
Member
A BUNCH of people care about FoV. A bunch also care but they don't actually KNOW IT.
Check this out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Se95M2ySzDI
Rickenslacker
Banned
250? In Quake 3 90-110 is used, so I don't get where you're going with that. :X
90 is just better in general, since I don't get that clumsy tunnel vision feeling. If anything this kind of FOV is more important when dealing with control sticks because of their limited turning speeds.
Yeah I forgot there was a whole untapped demographic of players that came out of the woodworks to join in on the fun of the Halo franchise when they found out that Halo 2's FOV was going to be 60 instead of 90, so they could finally identify themselves accurately with an armored spaceman. You're wrong about anyone using 250 FOV by the way, do you have any experience with deathmatch games? Don't answer that, because if the answer is "yes" and you're spouting off these things, then you're crazy.
Are you honestly comparing a PC game that people play on monitors with mice and keyboards to a console game played on HDTVs with controllers that have a fixed speed for turning your camera?
If ou want to sneak up on someone in halo, do you think it would be easier in halo 3 or Reach? Do you honestly think that fov does not effect you situational awareness?
I'm asking why you stated that having a higher FOV decreases the need for teamwork, but nice deflection.
If you don't remember correctly you said this: "You can't have your eye on everything and that leads to interesting situations and the necessity for teamwork."
How does that not apply to other first person shooters? Why didn't you preface it with: this vague idea only functions within the context of my spaceman roleplaying, so please don't compare it with anything else.
How does that not apply to other first person shooters? Why didn't you preface it with: this vague idea only functions within the context of my spaceman roleplaying, so please don't compare it with anything else.
Kibbles
Member
That is not what I said. I ONLY said the opposite of that. Having a smaller FOV limits you situational awareness and because of this you require people to callout more. It's not going to make such a huge difference that your going to end up blind without teammates but a difference nonetheless.
Mock if old
but I just came across this:
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/top-10-gt-countdown/724276
And I just wanted to say; fore-shame, Game Trailers. The BR at #6 (with a clip of the DMR in the mix too), the Pistol at #4 (with a clip of someone failing to kill an afk person with one clip), and Melee as the overall winner (double beat downs ahoy). Your obvious lack of Halo honor disturbs me.
It's only redeeming quality was its lack of AR. On the list that is, it still features prominently.
(it's old 
)
)http://www.gametrailers.com/video/top-10-gt-countdown/724276
And I just wanted to say; fore-shame, Game Trailers. The BR at #6 (with a clip of the DMR in the mix too), the Pistol at #4 (with a clip of someone failing to kill an afk person with one clip), and Melee as the overall winner (double beat downs ahoy). Your obvious lack of Halo honor disturbs me.
It's only redeeming quality was its lack of AR. On the list that is, it still features prominently.
So this is a good way to increase the level of situational awareness and teamwork needed, rather than actually designing a game that's decent on the basic mechanical level, right? Is that what you're saying? Say, for example, if Halo 4 required more situational awareness and teamwork than the previous four games, when comparing everything aside from the FOVs of the games: would you lower the FOV of Halo 4 if it was 90 so as to necessitate even more situational awareness and teamwork?
VivaciousJazzy
Member
StalkerUKCG
Banned
I think 75-80 is the sweet spot, 100 is horrible and under 70 is too restrictive.
50ppp + AutoPager Addon for firefox + NeoGAF ProDark
^ the only real way to browse GAF
50ppp + AutoPager Addon for firefox + NeoGAF ProDark
^ the only real way to browse GAF
Rickenslacker
Banned
They'll never know the glories of page 343. And they seem to love having to scroll down more when they get back into the thread. Insanity.
bolded for clarity
So if i am understanding you right, according to you, it is either you have a wide fov or your game is broken on a mechanical level? That's both a loaded question and a conclusion that doesn't follow the argument.
Haha! Cod is pretty slow, so that doesn't fit it very well, and you would need a pretty wide screen for THAT fov, or the fisheye mod for quake. Theres a big difference between normal fov and fov thats using fisheye. But the 250 in quake is practical wih fisheye.
That's part of it I suppose, the notion that 60 FOV is bizarre in any game unless you're a weirdo roleplaying a spaceman. You still didn't answer my question though: if Halo 4 came out, and required (measured with some "objective" metric, of course) more situational awareness and teamwork than the previous four games, but had an FOV of 90, would you opt to lower the FOV in order to necessitate even more situational awareness and teamwork?
It's not practical, and virtually no person on the entire planet plays with an FOV that high.
xxjuicesxx
Member
Holy shit just won a doubles match and the second I got the final kill my power goes out. Insane winds here. End of world?
StalkerUKCG
Banned
15 times in that doubles game... he looked like Ram on Countdown.
In a sense, yes. But it would also have to be done with other adjustments to the game, like movement speed and such. Ever change ripples through the game and effects a lot of other things. Do you disagree that a thinner FOV makes you less situationally aware and feel slower?
Harder tracking is precicely what I was getting at when I said that it is easier to aim in halo 3 since with the 60 fov your targets are bigger on screen.
The solution is once again fisheye, but its also very 'unique' solution any non über hardcore gamers would look at and say fuck no.
I edited that post just after submitting it but you quoted me a but fast. If you just look at the cod video with the insane fov, of course everyone would say that is impractical which is why I emphasized the fisheye part. The fisheye lense is what makes it practical. Google quake fisheye, I actually Played it.
xxjuicesxx
Member
How dare you.
Seriously though I sucked today. Never again am I taking a ~17 day Halo break. I felt so out of practice and rusty.
I have too, and I'm telling you you're crazy if you think anyone plays any deathmatch game at a competetive level with fisheye and 250 FOV.
Do you think that if the FOV stayed at 90 in Halo 2, 3 and Reach that the games wouldn't have been slowed down and had mind-boggling changes made to their basic mechanics? I'd think up an answer myself, but I'm roleplaying a spaceman in my blanket fort.
I'll admit that 250 is pretty extreme, and i played with 170 fisheye, this was just an example.
but if, like most people, you can play at halo 3 at 60 without getting sick or claustrophobic, it serves it's purpose. Its not some performance issue, as you can see with ODST which used the same engine and a much wider fov. That was a design decision as well, a very good example in fact considering ODSTs are not tanks and don't have as many team mates to rely on for situational awareness. They are slower and less mobile as well and benefit greatly from the high fov.
I know that feel, except my breaks are at least a month. You seemed like you knew what you were doing in those couple MLG games though, those hosts were terrible though, especially that game where I lagged out with a full green bar for no reason.
Sorry for never getting back on Risen, other things became more important. D:
lmao
You asked a question, and in response I even offered you bungie's answer in the form of ODST. There's your 'mind boggling mechanical tweaks'. All you've done is ask loaded questions, twist words and lmao. I can see its pointless to try and explain this to you.
Where did Bungie explicitly state that the FOV was changed to 60 in Halo 2 & 3 because Master Chief now needed to rely on teamwork more? And for that matter, wouldn't he need to rely on teamwork more as a result of his FOV lowering, and not the other way around? This is so interesting.
Or I guess since I've never been up with the Halo lore that I really shouldn't assume about things like that. I thought Master Chief was upgraded going from CE to Halo 2 though? He can't be harmed by jumping from incredible heights now but they also made his visor give him less vision out on the battlefield? It sounds like someone has been sabotaging Master Chief.
Barrow Roll
Member
But you wouldn't have removed Evade.
Mock if oldbut I just came across this:(it's old
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/top-10-gt-countdown/724276
And I just wanted to say; fore-shame, Game Trailers. The BR at #6 (with a clip of the DMR in the mix too), the Pistol at #4 (with a clip of someone failing to kill an afk person with one clip), and Melee as the overall winner (double beat downs ahoy). Your obvious lack of Halo honor disturbs me.
It's only redeeming quality was its lack of AR. On the list that is, it still features prominently.
"No-one dies accidentally from a sniper shot"
My bad :/
Basic reading comprehension, it does one good. Wtf are even talking about? That's what I said, how did you understand it to be the other way around?
Wtf? First, please don't double post, second since when has cannon ever been considered so highly that gameplay had to fit under it? Guess what, equipment and armor abilities suddenly appeared in halo 3 and then reach, but any cannon for them was, at best, retconned. Maybe he was 'sabotaged' by the fucking illuminati, it doesn't matter, fact is the fov is low in those games. Cannonical reasoning doesn't matter.
You can continue denying that fov is a design decision and it that it gives you your sense of situational awareness and mobility. But, If you really want to know something about fov, here you go:
FZD school of design on FOV
In the second video he explains how most people are not affected by seemingly strange fovs like 60 or wider than 100 (to a certain degree)
This video also explains the objective reasoning behind the difference between console and pc fobs as well as human perception
For the gameplay mechanics of fov design, consider how bungle made halo 3, odst, and reach all for the same audience and the same displays. Even though the are all meant to be played with the same display setup, each game as different playable characters with different mobility and size and because of this each game has different fov.
HiredN00bs
Member
It must be easy to be so pedantically condescending.
As opposed to loaded questions and twisting people's words? Yeah, it's a piece of cake.
Either way the point stands, fov is not just something that is automatically better when it's higher, as a lot of people seem to think.
But I digress, we were talking about milk or something?
Soundtrack does seem like it could be more epic.
Blue Ninja
Member
Fisheyes are nasty, people. All gooey and smelling like fish.
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