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Hearthstone |OT4| The warsong has ended, please patron other decks
- Thread starter ZealousD
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MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Man if you get a fuckin tie on a Joust it should redo it and if its a tie again then you lose.
you're half right. its true that gormok is next to terrible if you're losing, but fulfilling the conditional isn't too difficult in aggressive lists or even midrange lists with cards such as haunted creeper, muster, implosion, etc.
i definitely dont think you should dust it. it's a strong card and I expect it to see (a good amount of) play when the meta game sorts out.
They're very, very different cards. They don't replace each other.
Shredder is a high tempo 4 drop. Threatens high damage and is hard to deal with. It's impact is high and immediate.
Murloc Knight is a slow card that you can sink a lot of mana into to gain a lot of advantage without using cards. You don't want to play it on turn 4 but part of its value is that against aggro decks where you just need 2,3,4 drops you can play it on 4 to have a reasonable body in play.
Servbot #42
Unconfirmed Member
Here it is, i made my own variant using the standard tempo mage deck list. You can switch the legendaries according to what you have since they are not really needed, i mean they are nice to have but don't fret if you don't have antonidas or sylvanas. Also to use effigy effectively you have to think ahead a bit, for example don't play man wyrm when you have a board full of 5+ mana stuff. If you try the deck i hope it works well for you since it has done wonders for me, of course i'm a lucky bastard as well so that helps
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
I get so many ties it's crazy. Since a tie means I take the L it's making me reconsider some of my joust minions.
im pretty confident in saying that joust is a pretty noncompetitive mechanic. inspire is exciting though!
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Like is it really fair that the person enabling the Joust has a disadvantage?
Think I'll just replace the Gadgetzan Jousters with Zombie Chows in my Totem Shaman.
You're valuating the card wrong imho. Small minions boards are extremely easy to clear, so flooding the board early is not at all an indication of "winning". Ihmo Gormokk is bad when you're behind, but it's not just "win more".
Haunted
Member
are you fucking serious
paperboywriter
Member
already stole tirion, doomguards and many more with burgle!
From what I have seen, Jousting cards pretty much are all unreliable/bad except for Healing Wave, King's Elekk, Gadgetan Jouster and Tuskar Jouster. And that's mostly because those cards are at least usable by themselves or don't have such a huge swing in loss and win (like Gadgetan).
Stuff like Master Jouster and Armored Horse lose way too hard if they don't win the Jouster and they are legitimately bad cards if they lose. Plus a card like Armored Horse is counter intuitive in a slow, heavy deck.
Stuff like Master Jouster and Armored Horse lose way too hard if they don't win the Jouster and they are legitimately bad cards if they lose. Plus a card like Armored Horse is counter intuitive in a slow, heavy deck.
BananasWithGuns
Member
I think he fits in really well.
A lot of the stuff in the deck like Tuskarr Totemic, Piloted Shredder, Azure Drake, Thunder Bluff Valiant, etc. have lower stats because of their abilities so Mistcaller can help make up for that if you have to play them in the late game. He's also borderline broken if you play him on turn 6.
that's an interesting take. personally i feel that most of the jousting minions are terrible. the only two that you mentioned i can see playing are king's elekk and tuskar jouster. the only reason being that they still have relatively competitive stats for their mana cost even if they lose the joust.
the gadgetzan isn't worth playing as a 1/2. out of curiousity, why wouldn't you run zombie chow instead?
and i think healing wave is pretty situational. i think most of the time it's a bad card though.
I've been running a version of this deck that foregoes the late-game legendaries and instead has more board-wide buffs in the form of Mukla's Champ and Bloodlust. It's pretty fun.
I think Justicar and Mistcaller in particular will introduce a new type of inconsistency in some decks: these decks using them are notably more powerful if they draw Mistcaller/Justicar by turn 7. Obviously many cards are weaker if they're drawn late, but I'm not sure any card has as significant a swing in value as Mistcaller has. Maybe Thaurissan.
BananasWithGuns
Member
Mind sharing you list? I'd be interested in trying it out.
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
In theory the 1/2 has potential to be 2/3, but it's not reliable. The problem is Zombie Chow played late can fuck you. So it makes you think maybe it's worth playing Gadget.
Healing Wave has already saved quite a few games. Plus it makes something like Malygos Shaman deck way more usable. It's not even that situational, you are low on health... you play that card and you play some other minion with it. It's like saying Healbot is situational. The situations where using Healing Wave would lose you the game anyway are almost entirely the same as the situations where Healbot would lose the game and arguably Healing Wave has more comeback potential because you can do stuff like Healing Wave and Elemental Destruction in the same turn to turn the game around.
I didn't say Gadgetan was better than Chow, I just said that the card isn't terrible like the other Joust cards. The times where Gadgetan is going to lose you the Joust is against Control and in that instance it doesn't matter much that it's a 1/2 that doesn't give them health which is better in the late game. The times where you really need the stats you are likely to get them which is against aggro.
Playing against it the card is reasonable to use.
shame that justicar and mistcaller are confined to classes. obviously mistcaller is a shaman card, but justicar seems unplayable in most classes. from what i've seen, the card is pretty disgusting in warrior and paladin though.
that's true. but i find that if i play 1/2 in the early game, chances are i won't live to see the late game.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Time to start teching in Blood Knight!
Let me know how it goes. Haven't played it a ton yet, but it feels fairly powerful. The burst potential is insane.
healbot is situational lol. you dont wanna play it unless it can net you close to full value. and whats wrong with playing elemental destruction and then healbot to develop the board? at least you get a 3/3. i personally think cards that are pure healing, no matter how much healing they do, are awful. if something doesn't directly or indirectly affect the board state, i feel as if it's just not worth it. i'm not even considering the fact that the joust value isn't even a guarantee.
edit: actually thinking about it a little more, the only thing i see pure healing as useful is against direct damage from hand, ie: savage roar + FoN , spells.
i know you didn't say gadgetzan was better than chow. I'm saying it's worse than chow. i'm also saying it's suicidal to play a 1/2 on turn 1 than a 2/3. isn't your goal with gadgetzan to control the board anyway? or are you playing an aggressive list? in that case how do you expect to win jousts anyway?
sneakypete
Member
I just got wrecked by a maly shaman. I was at 20+ health and he otk'd me. At work and had to step away from phone for a second and came back to defeated screen. Shiet.
Double Bloodlust gives you insane reach though. You just need two minions to stick and that's +12 damage. Plus 2 copies gives you the flexibility to use one for removal, if need be. I don't know, I like it but YMMV.
Yeah they're different but I am not sure if I can fit in both unless I remove a couple of my tech cards or go down to 1 chow.
I'd rather have a card that's more useful in getting me back in the game
In related news I think astral communion is garbage. Every time a druid has played it against me they got rekt because putting yourself into a topdeck situation against a dude with a full hand isn't great
ancestor's call to bring him out for 4 mana.
So since I got Antonidas yesterday I'm trying to come up with a Tempo Mage. I also nabbed a couple of TGT packs, so that's why Effigy's in there.
What do you guys think?
Mana Wyrm x2
Flamecannon x1
Frostbolt x2
Mad Scientist x2
Sorcerer's Apprentice x2
Arcane Knowledge x1
Effigy x1
Mirror Entity x2
Flamewalker x2
Kirin Tor Mage x1
Fireball x2
Polymorph x1
Piloted Shredder x1
Azure Drake x1
Loatheb
Sludge Belcher x1
Emperor Thaurissan
Flamestrike x1
Archmage Antonidas
Kel'Thuzad
Pyroblast x1
That's 28/30 so far. How would you guys change it? I have 800 dust, but I'd rather not use too much.
What do you guys think?
Mana Wyrm x2
Flamecannon x1
Frostbolt x2
Mad Scientist x2
Sorcerer's Apprentice x2
Arcane Knowledge x1
Effigy x1
Mirror Entity x2
Flamewalker x2
Kirin Tor Mage x1
Fireball x2
Polymorph x1
Piloted Shredder x1
Azure Drake x1
Loatheb
Sludge Belcher x1
Emperor Thaurissan
Flamestrike x1
Archmage Antonidas
Kel'Thuzad
Pyroblast x1
That's 28/30 so far. How would you guys change it? I have 800 dust, but I'd rather not use too much.
Brawndo Addict
Banned
That's what I mean though, if you played four minions and they have survived on board through your opponent's turn you're probably in a good spot. And if they can easily clear your minions then Gormokk isn't going to get any value in the first place.
I'd rather have Storm than flamestrike honestly. destruction is deck dependant, but waiting til turn 7 for your aoe clear? good luck brah.
Ancestral knowledge does work, it's a perfectly fine card that gets you what you need. you think I give a shit about 2 overload when I'm topdecking or I need to draw a particular card? Or hell, when my hand is small enough that I'm unlikely to saturate my mana anyways.
Going back to my face paly deck. Replaced wolf riders and deckhands with Argent Horserider, I added just one Horsetrainer. It's a situational card imo, it's more of a faster quartermaster, I don't think I need two in a fast deck.
I have added two murloc knights because they are fun xD and can fill the gaps when I run out of cards with no divine favor and gotta hero power anyway. It's pretty good. When you have board advantage which happens often with this deck, it's amazing to play it behind taunts and everything. You don't need a murloc deck for this card to be good imo. I was thinking of silverhand regent, but I like this better since I don't play quartermaster and horsetrainer alone isn't enough.
One competitive spirit, I might add another one but it's hard to find a room. Just one has done good work.
I'm quite pleased with Argent Horserider, you use 3 mana remove a 2 drop and leaves a 1 drop body on board? I'm fine with that. If it's used for face damage, buffing it makes a lot of sense when it has divine shield unlike wolf rider or arcane golems. The card is rally good against all kind of hunters as you can save divine shield on your minibots and trade with this instead.
I replaced one abusive sergeant with Lance Bearer, but man I never draw him in like over 10 games now. I don't think I played it even once, it's just bad luck.
I have added two murloc knights because they are fun xD and can fill the gaps when I run out of cards with no divine favor and gotta hero power anyway. It's pretty good. When you have board advantage which happens often with this deck, it's amazing to play it behind taunts and everything. You don't need a murloc deck for this card to be good imo. I was thinking of silverhand regent, but I like this better since I don't play quartermaster and horsetrainer alone isn't enough.
One competitive spirit, I might add another one but it's hard to find a room. Just one has done good work.
I'm quite pleased with Argent Horserider, you use 3 mana remove a 2 drop and leaves a 1 drop body on board? I'm fine with that. If it's used for face damage, buffing it makes a lot of sense when it has divine shield unlike wolf rider or arcane golems. The card is rally good against all kind of hunters as you can save divine shield on your minibots and trade with this instead.
I replaced one abusive sergeant with Lance Bearer, but man I never draw him in like over 10 games now. I don't think I played it even once, it's just bad luck.
and then think what happens when he doesn't draw card draw immediately after turn 1 communion. he just gets fucking rekt. especially against more aggresive decks.
Because Healbot is 5 mana and Healing Wave is 3 mana. If you are turn 6-7 where you most need the comeback play especially against a Hunter, you can wipe the board AND heal with Elemental Destruction and Healing Wave. Not to mention later on in the game you can clear board, heal AND play 4 mana worth of stats on the board with 5 stats later on.
In any case pretty much every Shaman who used to play Healbot in their deck have replaced it with Healing Wave. At the current situation, it seems to be working out for people It has worked for me so speaking from experience the card delivers. Whether that remains to be the case down the line we'll see.
Haven't seen anyone use it yet online.
i feel as if you're focusing too much on a specific list. that's what i mean by situational. healing wave is playable against aggro, sure. but so is healbot. the difference that i see is that healbot is more flexible. i don't feel bad when i have to play healbot in a midrange or control match up, as it represents a body (albeit weak for its cost).
again, for the sake of the argument, i'm even giving healing wave the benefit of being a full value heal. sometimes (rarely, against aggressive lists, but the possibility remains) it won't get that.
i also don't play too much shaman, so i concede that you know the ins and outs of the class better than i do. but from the perspective of the aggro hunter, i can't see it. you're right though, we'll see how it turns out down the line.
Healing Wave actually is the best counter to Face Hunter in the game. Like that card alone makes the match up much, much better for Shaman (before they used to lose this fairly regularly).
When you are in that situation then you will know (Shaman vs Face Hunter).
Also I am not saying I am some expert on the class either. I am just giving my opinion on the card.
When you are in that situation then you will know (Shaman vs Face Hunter).
Also I am not saying I am some expert on the class either. I am just giving my opinion on the card.
Super Nothing
Member
I was playing Face Hunter last night and went up against a Shaman that got off both Healing Waves and won the joust both times. I basically had to kill him twice. Still got it done.
healing wave isn't the counter. it's healing wave and elemental destruction that you're advocating for. by itself, the card does very little against face hunter.
(i also don't value elemental destruction very highly, either, but that's beside the point)
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