-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Hearthstone |OT6| C'THUN for President! Why pick the lesser evil?
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
Karsticles
Member
To be fair, that card trades evenly with Boulderfist Ogre. :-O
Totally fair.
Totally fair.
Yeah, I realized that after hitting post. And yeah, I agree he is being too generous.
He even has stuff like Wrath on an empty board being OK. Summoning a 5/1 for 5 is OK? And he has Slam as Good. Is a 5/2 that draws a card Good? It doesn't seem like it.
Acerac
Banned
It'll be wonderful in arena. Not even close to the silly cards shaman received however.
Go back further in the thread and read why you are incorrect.
The card is certainly amazing in arena. In Constructed it is competing against Legendaries and other very strong cards with immediate effects at that mana cost. Would you play this over Thaurissan or Sylvannas? In most cases no. The card is essentially 2 vanilla minions, which is most cases isn't very useful for Mage. It won't work with Flamewaker either, so you don't even get that. I think in most cases this card isn't going to cut it in Constructed. In arena, this card is amazing. Top pick for sure.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I won 2/3 with a silly tempo rogue deck for my daily quest today. I would love them giving rogue a decent 1 and 6 drop. Tomb pillager into a coin+6 drop could be very good.
I only lost to a priest because I forgot to include eviscerate, and really lacked that final punch that eviscerate can enable. But then I solidly beat a malygos rogue (despite his awesome curve and my playing from behind in tempo from very early on). And I beat a face hunter.
I was mostly reminiscing the days when I actually liked playing my tempo rogue decks on ladder. Anub'ar ambusher is such an underrated card. If only they printed a few more better battlecries to bounce back.
I only lost to a priest because I forgot to include eviscerate, and really lacked that final punch that eviscerate can enable. But then I solidly beat a malygos rogue (despite his awesome curve and my playing from behind in tempo from very early on). And I beat a face hunter.
I was mostly reminiscing the days when I actually liked playing my tempo rogue decks on ladder. Anub'ar ambusher is such an underrated card. If only they printed a few more better battlecries to bounce back.
Yeah I don't buy this theory at all, this most likely being the case at the end of the day the insane value trump all the fancy theory
Like the day people argued pilotted shredder or boom not that good or even bad
Emperor is better include sure, but this card will easily made people cut other space for it.
I guess its kinda true this is expensive minion, you can only have so much card in deck.. but Sylvanas? if Mage run it, I'll say it there's decent chance Mage even gonna chose this over Sylvanas if they want 6 drop.
irfaanator
Banned
Man.. by this time i would have thought that they realized that more random isnt what we want
yea same
phoenix296
Member
Shredder is good because a minion stays in play after a board clear. Faceless Summoner gets wiped out after a board clear. There is a big distinction between deathrattle a minion and battlecry a minion. Deathrattles discourage board clears while battlecries make board clears even more appealing.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
The battlecry allows you to attack with both at the same time, so more board presence. It's not strictly worse than deathrattle like you make it sound.
Man.. by this time i would have thought that they realized that more random isnt what we want
I think they do it so tournaments will be more exciting rather than matchups playing out a set number of ways. While that may be true, actually playing with the RNG yourself can be maddening.
The problem is in a tournament setting, specially when money is involved, people want more consistency in their decks not less. Unless a card is really busted like shredder, they would rather know something is going to kill when played than leave an opponent at 1, so they'll reduce it as much as possible with the decks they build and take
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Shredder is played because on average it is better than other 4 drops. Could be the same deal with saron jr. and it could be more disgusting too. Of course people prefer consistency, but they often must choose power.
Funny how both new mage cards are compared to shredder.
Funny how both new mage cards are compared to shredder.
phoenix296
Member
It's a slow 6 mana late game card. If the opponent hasn't played a board clear yet they likely have one in their hand.
The closest comparisons you could draw are Highmane and Silver Hand Knight. Highmane on average has better stat distribution than a Faceless Summoner but the reason Highmane is so hard to deal with is the deathrattle. Silver Hand Knight sees no play. While it's a really strong arena card I don't think faceless summoner will see much play in constructed as it doesn't fit any of the current mage deck archetypes. Of course with the meta changing and freeze mage likely getting nerfed who knows.
I understand RNG as a game design tool but they went a bit too far with GvG... and now they keep adding more RNG to the game.
Agreed. If Midrange mage becomes a thing as a new deck type for mage, I could definitely see this guy going in that deck, but I have no idea what that deck looks like.
Karsticles
Member
The real solution is having enough viable strategies that players don't know each other's decks ahead of time. Not random. That just makes the game a competitive joke.
Shredder does not have a worst case scenario even remotely as bad as Servant. Its worst case is Doomsayer, which is pretty bad but occurs less than 1% of the time and can screw over your opponent just as much as it does you. Servant's worst case scenarios are much worse and have a much higher chance of happening.
toddhunter
Member
That mage card is murloc knight level of insane in arena.
Drop that turn 6, flamestrike turn 7.
And you'll have like four of them in your deck. Sigh.
Drop that turn 6, flamestrike turn 7.
And you'll have like four of them in your deck. Sigh.
Even if the average value out of the Servant is good, I don't think people will want to play that card.
It's going to be a really bad result about a third of the time, and a failure rate that high means that people are going to feel really bad playing it, no matter how good of a swing it has when it works.
Psychologically speaking, people are going to remember the times that the card lost them the game more than the times it won them the game, so they're going to form a negative opinion about the card and their experiences with it. So it'll get cut in Constructed.
At least with Crackle and Implosion you can kind of manage your expectations. You can't do that here.
It's going to be a really bad result about a third of the time, and a failure rate that high means that people are going to feel really bad playing it, no matter how good of a swing it has when it works.
Psychologically speaking, people are going to remember the times that the card lost them the game more than the times it won them the game, so they're going to form a negative opinion about the card and their experiences with it. So it'll get cut in Constructed.
At least with Crackle and Implosion you can kind of manage your expectations. You can't do that here.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
Could you not say the same exact thing about Shredder/Golem? I'm not saying it's as good but still.
Acerac
Banned
I minimize my use of shredder for this exact reason.
For example with mage I'll use water elemental instead. It is surprisingly good in a lot of matchups, and while it doesn't have the upsides of shredder, it never pulls doomsayer to wipe out my own board.
No, you couldn't. Shredder/Golem rarely "backfire". They don't throw a fireball in your face, kill themselves, kill your other minions, or anything else like that. At least, not like this card can. Sometimes Shredder will drop a Doomsayer. Sometimes Golem will drop Jeeves while your opponent is playing an aggro deck. But that kind of explicit backfiring is very rare. Servant will backfire and backfire often.
The card is less like Shredder and more like Madder Bomber.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
Oh whoops, I thought you were talking about Faceless Summoner, my bad.
Fucking confusing names.
toddhunter
Member
The huge difference is the extra mana.
Think of it like unstable portal. It sucks quite often too, but for two mana it isn't game losing and the upside is huge.
4 mana is about as high as you can invest and potentially get fucked over.
Higher cost? You need to be pretty darn sure you will get a good outcome. So it is just a fun card only.
Think of it like unstable portal. It sucks quite often too, but for two mana it isn't game losing and the upside is huge.
4 mana is about as high as you can invest and potentially get fucked over.
Higher cost? You need to be pretty darn sure you will get a good outcome. So it is just a fun card only.
Oh, well I already said earlier in the thread that I think Faceless Summoner is one of the most underrated cards in the set. I don't consider the tempo loss argument to be very compelling since you will regain that loss almost immediately on your next turn and you'll be able to do so without an activator like Nerubian Egg has needed.
Vunerability to silence and priest counters are a more effective counterargument, in my mind.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
While true, I think shredder is played because his on average strength. He is a despised because of his range of variance, but played because on average he is better than almost every other 4 drop.
This new card seems to excell when your opponent has at least one minion on board. Giving you a chance to swing the board state off a single card could make it worth playing.
I kinda side on it being not played, but I think it could be played. And I mean in a good deck, despite the RNG. Trump did the math and his numbers show a heavy favor toward the user.
Harknesss2245
Neo Member
Hi everyone, I have a question regarding buying packs.
I want to get back in the game after not playing it for a few months. I consider myself a rookie and even though I really liked the game what caused me to stop playing originally was that I kept getting matched with players that had cards that felt too OP while I was using the starter cards more or less. Now I'm looking into buying a bunch of packs and trying to strengthen my decks. My question is, should I buy the pack that will be discontinued sometime soon and try and get some of those cards or should I not even bother and focus on the other two (or three) packs?
Thanks, sorry if this gets asked a lot.
I want to get back in the game after not playing it for a few months. I consider myself a rookie and even though I really liked the game what caused me to stop playing originally was that I kept getting matched with players that had cards that felt too OP while I was using the starter cards more or less. Now I'm looking into buying a bunch of packs and trying to strengthen my decks. My question is, should I buy the pack that will be discontinued sometime soon and try and get some of those cards or should I not even bother and focus on the other two (or three) packs?
Thanks, sorry if this gets asked a lot.
Stay strong, 2 weeks is my guess.
rukland
Member
I'm trying I just want to open things and as normal my brawl pack sucked. Yeah 2 more weeks is going to be long
I know exactly how you feel. I've never had so much gold.
play more arena, open those packs lol
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
But you could get tgt or gvg packs there =(
rukland
Member
That would require me to spend the gold as well. And I am only a 4 to 5 win average arena player so I get to wait I guess.
one will still be useful for a year lol, silver linings
at 5 you almost always get enough got back to cover it (win gold + bonus gold). I find it rarely that I will get dust or a card instead of the gold
slightconfuse
Banned
Both of these seems bad compared to ethereal conjuror
Random 3 drop might be ok? Idk
Random 3 drop might be ok? Idk
Dr.Horrible
Member
Did I somehow miss the new Priest card in here? Embrace the Shadow.
I just saw it in FB, I'm sure it must've been covered in here.
I just saw it in FB, I'm sure it must've been covered in here.
Hey_Blinkin
Member
Well that sucks, was winning a match and then I got a message saying I've been disconnected. Then a message saying I was reconnecting. Went back and forth and now it's just stuck at "You were reconnected to your game. Resuming...". Been stuck there for 15 minutes.
Yeah, discussion starts around Post #4046.
You on NA? I had same issue. Just thought it was my shitty Internet.
Dr.Horrible
Member
Hey_Blinkin
Member
Yes, NA. I just started playing this again. Thought it might be a known issue or something.
+1. Very annoying, has lost me a couple of winnable games.
The Lamonster
Member
I can't even log in. Says it's closed.
NA
NA