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Hearthstone |OT8| Elise's Extremely Irresponsible Field Trip To Un'Goro

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Aya MVP. Super good against Renolock. I love it when they twisting nether and I still have a 6/6 or higher on board. Straight broken with Brann. Like, a deck uses one of it's precious AOE spells and then I play Brann/Aya and suddenly my board is scarier than it was before the clear.

Thanks Levi. Been wanting to try out a midrange Jade Shaman list for quite some time. I'll give this a spin!

How important is White Eyes btw? I can craft him, but I'm not sure if he's worth it. Going to use a Thunder Bluff in the meantime as a replacement.
 

rahji

Member
what is going on with my arena rng? i picked mage and the only reasonable spell to pick was one firelands portal. the last few runs were really really terrible and it is not stabilizing.
 

wiibomb

Member
Thanks Levi. Been wanting to try out a midrange Jade Shaman list for quite some time. I'll give this a spin!

How important is White Eyes btw? I can craft him, but I'm not sure if he's worth it. Going to use a Thunder Bluff in the meantime as a replacement.

better use another Jade chieftain for the added jade synergy since Thunderbluff doesn't have as much synergy.

I think it isn't a bad option, though
 

wiibomb

Member
I'm honestly intrigued by how everything will change once the new standard year comes...

and finally I won't need to craft more cards from TGT to complete my netdecked lists...
 

patchday

Member
Yeah I love this meta all my favorite decks still in the same spot (even Miracle rogue around tier #2). Havent tried my Hunter this season at all but I wanted a break in anycase. Good to see priests using more aggressive styled decks too.

Love that Warriors are more aggressive now. I used to hate life when I'd see a Warrior cause it was always a Control Warrior. I've gotten past Pirate Warriors if I can get my Reno out and they usually concede quickly after. Granted, I don't play Reno decks too often cause I dont want those long games.

This is most fun I've ever had in Hearthstone. I actually want to hop on the ladder now. Before, I'd quit ladder soon as I hit rank 14/15
 

IceMarker

Member
I'd rather have a Control meta, but that will happen as soon as flying unicorns start pouring out of my ass. Only viable Control deck right now is Renolock and that's it. Even Miracle Rogue has a fucking pirate aggro opener now.

I'm fucking done with this game. Quests are the only thing keeping me.
 

Levi

Banned
Aya feels like a bad craft to me, like Jade stuff won't last long in the meta.

You don't need to run a ton of Jade cards to make Aya good. I can't see playing a Shaman list right now that doesn't run Jade Claws, at least.

do you really need the ooze with all the aoe and feral spirits?

I like the Ooze. Good against aggro and good in the mirror.

Thanks Levi. Been wanting to try out a midrange Jade Shaman list for quite some time. I'll give this a spin!

How important is White Eyes btw? I can craft him, but I'm not sure if he's worth it. Going to use a Thunder Bluff in the meantime as a replacement.

I'd use a second Jade Cheiftain or second Feral Spirits. You want taunt.

I'm very much looking forward to the new year of Standard. Shaman is gonna get so fucked and it is going to be so good.

Shaman isn't going to be in that bad of a spot. Shaman loses their OP early game, which will hurt, but if they print halfway decent replacements midrange won't miss a beat. I'll have to find replacements for, what, 5 cards in my list? We do get another expansion at the time of rotation so I think it'll be okay.

I also don't think Aggro Shaman will go away, either. They only lose Argent Horserider, Totem Golem and Tunnel Trogg, the core of their deck will be unchanged.
 
Still bothers me how someone can argue patches doesn't "swing" games.

Shaman turn 1:
tunnel trogg

My turn 2:
Doomsayer

Shaman turn 3:
spirit claws + coin + southsea deckhand x2

And because of patches he could deal with a turn 2 doomsayer with only a 1/3 on board prior to the turn starting.

I still won that game, but ffs there really is not a whole lot of counter play to a 1/1 charger that you pay zero resources for.
 

Yaboosh

Super Sleuth
You don't need to run a ton of Jade cards to make Aya good. I can't see playing a Shaman list right now that doesn't run Jade Claws, at least.



I like the Ooze. Good against aggro and good in the mirror.



I'd use a second Jade Cheiftain or second Feral Spirits. You want taunt.



Shaman isn't going to be in that bad of a spot. Shaman loses their OP early game, which will hurt, but if they print halfway decent replacements midrange won't miss a beat. I'll have to find replacements for, what, 5 cards in my list? We do get another expansion at the time of rotation so I think it'll be okay.

I also don't think Aggro Shaman will go away, either. They only lose Argent Horserider, Totem Golem and Tunnel Trogg, the core of their deck will be unchanged.


I crafted Aya, made the deck, named him after you, and lost to the first janky hunter I played.

Damn you Levi! I thought this would make me not suck. Turns out I still sick.
 

Levi

Banned
Still bothers me how someone can argue patches doesn't "swing" games.

In case it has been unclear, I don't think that. Patches clearly improves the win rate of the aggressive decks he's been included in.

Just like Kazakus improves the winrate of Highlander decks. ;)

I crafted Aya, made the deck, named him after you, and lost to the first janky hunter I played.

Damn you Levi! I thought this would make me not suck. Turns out I still sick.

Takes a bit of practice. I lost to the first 2 or 3 Renolocks I faced, and now I'm on a 5-0 run against Renolock. I find this list is pretty good at playing for value/board in some match-ups and playing for pure damage in others.

With the Hunter match-up I find you need to deny them the board and they'll run out of cards while you're still pumping out threats. Play around secrets, save a Hex for a Highmane and it should be a win.
 

joelseph

Member
Havent tried my Hunter this season at all but I wanted a break in anycase.

I finally went back to Hunter last night with a MSG buff deck. Not sure I am sold on Hyena but Trogg is underrated. Went positive around rank 13 with games played. Felt good to be SMORCing after playing Renolock for a bit.
 

Levi

Banned
You mean, including good cards improves winrate? What you've said is meaningless.

You said Patches improves the winrate of aggro decks and said you were bothered that people didn't agree with you, and now you're mad at me because I agreed with you and added that Patches isn't the only swing card they released in the MSG set?

Standard has so many options right now that cards need to broken in order to get included in a deck. We're definitely due for rotation.

So is Miracle rogue actually good right now or is it like post-Old Gods were it was good for about a week and then it went to crap?

Miracle Rogue is VERY good against slow decks, such as Reno decks and Jade Druid. It's extremely weak to aggro, though, so if the meta swings more aggro, it'll be worse, and if more people are playing Reno decks, it'll stay good.
 

Q8D3vil

Member
Hearthstone players over-reacting to a perceived slight to their favorite class? Well, I never.
I know, Rogue will always be good because of their free spells (classic set) and insane tempo. Counterfeit coin alone is enough to make vancleef go bonkers from turn 2 and buccaneer + patchs filled the void in turn 1.
 
You said Patches improves the winrate of aggro decks and said you were bothered that people didn't agree with you, and now you're mad at me because I agreed with you and added that Patches isn't the only swing card they released in the MSG set?

Standard has so many options right now that cards need to broken in order to get included in a deck. We're definitely due for rotation.

That isn't what I said... not even close.
 

Dahbomb

Member
The end of next year's rotation is going to have some broken stuff in it. Remember that we still have TGT in this expansion where most of the cards in it aren't even used. In addition instead of having two adventures and an expansion, we will have two expansions and an adventure to replace them.

Next year same time we are going to have even more efficient and degenerate decks. Like it's not even a question of IF Patches get nerfed, it's a matter of when because Pirate Warrior and Miracle Rogue are going to be largely the same start of next year.
 

AndersK

Member
agreed
small time buc is crazy good. it should have been a rouge card. instead of that meme rager

I feel like removing charge from Patches would be fine, and the soul of the card Is intact. Thins your deck, you never want to play it from hand anyways, so overall you lose 1 damage and it's unique effect remains.
The small time buccaneer can get to be a 2/2 with a weapon equipped and still be plenty viable. But tinkering with one of the two should be enough.

I don't understand why people feel control isn't good in this meta. Had more luck with it than in many recent metas. Really having fun. (And winning a lot, so that would explain it)
 

Levi

Banned
Still bothers me how someone can argue patches doesn't "swing" games.

That isn't what I said... not even close.

It was at least close. It bothers you that people unnamed people don't agree with you that Patches swings games. I phrased "swing games" as "improves win-rate", which I think is a distinction without a difference, but if you think those are totally different things, fine.

Regardless, I'm tired of being a convenient scape-goat for people's rustled jimmies about aggro getting a good card, so I'm done discussing it. I think Patches is OP and I won't be surprised if, in a year, it's nerfed. I also won't be shocked if they leave it untouched, because it's nowhere near as broken as some people like to make it out. Blizzard has the numbers and I'm confident that, eventually, they'll do the right thing one way or the other.
 

QFNS

Unconfirmed Member
I honesty wouldn't change Patches. STB or Deckhand are the ones to nerf if you want to take down the aggressive decks. You can make STB into a 2/2 with weapon without much fuss at all. Deckhand can change to get +1 atk instead of charge and its fine too.

We know Blizzard has an eye on charge mechanics as being problematic, so if they don't like stuff like Pirate warrior or Patches & co going into every deck, they know where to look. I honestly think the whole thing is a bit annoying (like face hunter was), but Aggro in the meta isn't bad. It's a sign of a healthy game, unfortunately ladder still rewards Aggro/fast games more than control/combo games so ladder will always be disporportionally aggro based.
 

Levi

Banned
The end of next year's rotation is going to have some broken stuff in it.

I think this game is *always* going to have some broken stuff in it. There are too many cards /classes / synergies / etc. to ever have a perfectly balanced game. I feel like the game is in a decent spot right now, though. We have viable, tier 1/2 decks that include combo, control, midrange, and aggro.
 

Levi

Banned
unfortunately ladder still rewards Aggro/fast games more than control/combo games so ladder will always be disporportionally aggro based.

Yes, I absolutely think that fixing the ladder would make a much better and more positive effect on the game than nerfing a few cards.
 

QFNS

Unconfirmed Member
I think this game is *always* going to have some broken stuff in it. There are too many cards /classes / synergies / etc. to ever have a perfectly balanced game. I feel like the game is in a decent spot right now, though. We have viable, tier 1/2 decks that include combo, control, midrange, and aggro.

I would even argue that it's *GOOD* to have SOME broken stuff in it. If there wasn't something at least percieved as broken, then no one would be excited to play the game. You gotta give people the perception that the thing they are doing is broken in some way in order for them to feel good about what plays they're making. The designer can give the illusion of breaking the rules while knowing that what is happening is entirely within the plan. I have no idea if that's what is happening here in hearthstone or not, but I think they are at least thinking about stuff like this. I would hope that someone on the playtest or balancing team at least thought about this priate deck with Patches, STB, Deckhand, etc.
And they deemed it ok compared to the other decks in the meta. Hard to know what goes on behind the scenes, since they don't tell us.

I think MSoG has at the very least been the most exiciting expansion in a long time and seeing a lot of good new decks (aggro, combo and control) is great for me and the game overall.
 
It was at least close. It bothers you that people unnamed people don't agree with you that Patches swings games. I phrased "swing games" as "improves win-rate", which I think is a distinction without a difference, but if you think those are totally different things, fine.

Regardless, I'm tired of being a convenient scape-goat for people's rustled jimmies about aggro getting a good card, so I'm done discussing it. I think Patches is OP and I won't be surprised if, in a year, it's nerfed. I also won't be shocked if they leave it untouched, because it's nowhere near as broken as some people like to make it out. Blizzard has the numbers and I'm confident that, eventually, they'll do the right thing one way or the other.

I don't know what your opinion of patches is and I frankly don't give a shit. I don't understand what you're ranting about, being the scape goat for people's rustled jimmies or how you can take a random post and conclude it's all about you. I don't understand how you get "improves win-rate" from "swings games", because it's irrational.

Believe it or not, not everyone is talking about you or your opinion of patches.
 

sibarraz

Banned
I recently had one of my best mirror matches ever, specially after reading that "is hearthstone the most rage inducing game ever"

I queued on ranked with reno kazakus mage, it was THIS same deck from Hearthstone Top Decks.

My opponent had exactly the same deck (I knew because we reached fatigue) and the match was very slow since this deck is from the most part reactive.

I did the combo of Kazakus and Brann, so I got 2 spells, from the moment I was fine, but then my opponent did a brann + kabal courier combo which thanks to RNG granted him another Kazakus, which he played on this same turn so he got 2 spells too with the chance of a third one from the kazakus that was still in the deck.

Even though he had the card advantage I won this match up because I used kazakus and other cards better

I picked a 5 and 10 cost card, the 5 cost card was deal 4 damage to all minions and summon a 5/5 demon. The 10 cost card was deal 8 damage and get 3 demons cards.

My opponent picked the deal 4 damage to all minions and summon a 5/5 demon, deal 8 damage and summon a 6/6, and convert all minions in sheep and revive 3 characters that died. this last card was his doom, since he revived an acolyte of pain which I already pinged and dealed damage before so he would steal 3 cards (didn't burned anything with it, but I knew that this match will end in fatigue at a proper time) so with me 2 sheeps he stole another 3 cards.

Also, I used my removals better, and had answers to his alexstrasa that he played and the other one that revived. Also, I knew that it was a bad idea to revive minions since I could get a doomsayer and screw my turn

In the end this match was obviously influenced by RNG, but since I knew the game better than him, I still won, even though we had the exact same decks (and he have 1 more spell)
 

fertygo

Member
STB is great, but what if you not draw it at starting hand

Patches is the one that made these aggro almost every game had fucking same t1, that fucking crazy

almost every game at least 2/2 stat in turn 1, and some of you think its not busted? lmao

and incase of aggro shaman, incase they miss pirate opener, its mean its big % they hit shaman opener instead

PPP gave these aggro deck disgusting consistency
 

Levi

Banned
I think MSoG has at the very least been the most exiciting expansion in a long time and seeing a lot of good new decks (aggro, combo and control) is great for me and the game overall.

100% agreed.

Willing to bet that Patches gets nerfed before the new rotation next year.

Do you mean a week before? Because I think right before the next rotation is the earliest we'll see more nerfs. And while I'm not confident Patches will get nerfed, I'm also not willing to take that bet, because the rotation might make aggro even stronger than it is now and warrant some balance changes.
 

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
New minion leaked from the new expansion:

Totally a Counter Guy
4 mana 4/4 Paladin minion
Battlecry: Deal 2 damage to a Pirate
 
Aggro priate shamna seems to be the best aggro deck.

mid range loosing thunder bluff isnt a big deal now that jade golems exist.

The mid-range jade shaman i have been running(similar to the deck levi posted) has been serving me pretty good so far.
 
The end of next year's rotation is going to have some broken stuff in it. Remember that we still have TGT in this expansion where most of the cards in it aren't even used. In addition instead of having two adventures and an expansion, we will have two expansions and an adventure to replace them.

Next year same time we are going to have even more efficient and degenerate decks. Like it's not even a question of IF Patches get nerfed, it's a matter of when because Pirate Warrior and Miracle Rogue are going to be largely the same start of next year.

So between now and rotation there's another adventure AND expansion planned? 0_0
 

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
Sadly this isn't even that good.

You need something to at least hit two Pirates.

The fact that it's not good is kind of the point. It is exactly the kind of shitty "counter" that Blizzard would print.
 
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