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[Mobius and pet octopus]

Medivh is still good vs. weapon hate though because you're a mage. I've never had Atiesh removed on me because if they play ooze, opponents will play it as tempo, never expecting to see Medivh.

Sometimes that happens. Other times they're playing actual threats on curve and acidic ooze sits there. Or they just draw it while you have the staff out. Playing a 3/2 on a board they're doing well with is very minor impact, so they may even wait to see if you run mediev anyway.

I do it when I play against priest. Whats a 3/2 do to help me win the game? Very little.

 

[Levi]

Interesting article on the most over- and under-rated cards of Gadgetzan.

What would you guys add/remove from this list? I know I personally under-rated the Shaman Jade synergy cards and over-rated the Hunter cards.

 

[Dahbomb]

Not sure what the general opinion was but all the pros had Patches as their top 5 card. Same for Madam Goya, don't remember a lot of people thinking that was going to be a godly card.

I think Second Rate Bruiser was underrated and Inkmaster Solia was overrated. A lot of people thought Solia would at least be auto include in Reno Mage. Probably Small Time Bucaneer should be in there too but most people had it at least as a very good card.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

For madam goya, they had playable as the prediction, and dust it as the current rating. Seems to fit. I think it's playable, but not with the standard set atm. I haven't thought about wild but likely unplayable there too. So we'll have to see if they add cards like "on draw" that are really good.

Eternal has a fate mechanic, basically the same thing. Something happens when you draw it. Maybe if a card had like life gain or card draw, something powerful in a long match.

edit:
For example from eternal, there is a minion that has fate draw a 1 damage spell that costs 1 mana. Another one that spawns a 1/1 for you. I think it would be stronger in hearthstone since there are less ways to redraw cards.

 

[Levi]

Not sure what the general opinion was but all the pros had Patches as their top 5 card. Same for Madam Goya, don't remember a lot of people thinking that was going to be a godly card.

Part of it reads like he's basing his list on his own pre-release ratings, and part of it reads like he's comparing this to user ratings on sites such as Hearthpwn.

 

[KuroNeeko]

Hit rank 11 or 12 last night rather easily but am starting to get Ladder anxiety. Highest I've been up until now is like eight or nine.

Mostly playing Jade Shaman and Dragon Priest--the latter doesn't even feel like Priest and is pretty boring. Last mirror match I summoned SIX Operatives...

Saving up dust for Madam Goya or Kazakus. Then I can switch to Reno Priest and lose to Reno Lock for that authentic Priest Experience(tm).

I want Goya for some Yshaarj meme action!

 

[Levi]

Hit rank 11 or 12 last night rather easily but am starting to get Ladder anxiety. Highest I've been up until now is like eight or nine.

What server do you play on, what timezone are you in, and what time of day do you typically play?

 

[SonicXtreme]

So the game offers me inkmaster sofia on my 30th pick of an arena draft with tons of dupes; the logic of how it distributes cards is so effing bad, arena is the highest skill cap in this game but holy hell does it detract new players by doing shit like this and offering weapon buffing minions in non weapon classes, etc. so anti fun. card isn't even good but i'd have a blast drafting around sofia if it was my first pick and the other 2 picks sucked (they are lightbane and wratheon, two more leggys you'd have to build an entire draft around and one that isn't even possible to in this class lol)

for the record nabbing wratheon even though i have a 0 dragon draft...what a joke though. don't have enough high mana spells for sofia, and lightbane is good stats but lol, i'll take a more expensive loot hoarder since that helps my strat more

 

[IceMarker]

Madam Goya is basically a extremely deck specific version of Manic Soulcaster. I can only see it being used in a very specific Reno deck where you want to throw Reno or Kazakus back in your deck if they manage to stay on the board.

I opened her from a pack and she was okay in a specific Resurrection/Y'shaarj deck. Just like Y'shaarj the 'worst' minion you can pull from your deck is a 3/4 with a Battlecry (Onyx Bishop). Best outcomes in that deck are obviously Y'sharrj, Injured Blademaster, any big taunt, etc.

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

Hit rank 11 or 12 last night rather easily but am starting to get Ladder anxiety. Highest I've been up until now is like eight or nine.

Mostly playing Jade Shaman and Dragon Priest--the latter doesn't even feel like Priest and is pretty boring. Last mirror match I summoned SIX Operatives...

Saving up dust for Madam Goya or Kazakus. Then I can switch to Reno Priest and lose to Reno Lock for that authentic Priest Experience(tm).

I want Goya for some Yshaarj meme action!

Don't craft Goya and waste your dust. Kazakus is extremely top-tier and can be used in several decks. Game-defining if you craft a good spell.

 

[The Wizard]

Thoughts on jeweled scarab vs. kabal courier in Reno Mage? My gut tells me scarab is actually better but people are running courier as it's newer, tough to call though.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Madam Goya is basically a extremely deck specific version of Manic Soulcaster. I can only see it being used in a very specific Reno deck where you want to throw Reno or Kazakus back in your deck if they manage to stay on the board.

I opened her from a pack and she was okay in a specific Resurrection/Y'shaarj deck. Just like Y'shaarj the 'worst' minion you can pull from your deck is a 3/4 with a Battlecry (Onyx Bishop). Best outcomes in that deck are obviously Y'sharrj, Injured Blademaster, any big taunt, etc.

I think brewmaster is often just better in those situations where you want a second use of a specific card.

 

[IceMarker]

I think brewmaster is often just better in those situations where you want a second use of a specific card.

I agree, and I think the situation where she is specifically better than Brewmaster in that regard only relates to cards with negative Battlecries like Injured Blademaster/Kvaldir, cards that discard, etc.

I guess a relatively possible dream scenario is you play Reno/Kazakus, they live, and then you swap them out with a full health Blademaster.

Thoughts on jeweled scarab vs. kabal courier in Reno Mage? My gut tells me scarab is actually better but people are running courier as it's newer, tough to call though.

Kabal Courier can grab you an extra Kazakus, that's enough in my book. Being a 2/2 vs a 1/1 is also a big deal. If anything just discover the Courier from the Scarab lol

 

[Mulgrok]

The Sheogorath arena event in Elder Scrolls Legends is really fun. I played 9 matches and each had different rules. You can only go until 7 wins or 3 losses for an arena run, and I went 7 wins in my first run. It was sort of like tavern brawl, but way more interesting.

I wish Hearthstone arena was as interesting.

 

[Salex_]

I'm going to make every Renolock and Dragon Priest cry with Malygos Rogue. It was so frustrating running into them when I tried to use Control Warrior to counter the ridiculous Aggro Shaman/Pirate Warrior BS. It feels like Small-Time Buccaneer definitely should have been a Rogue class card. It's almost as if they changed their mind right before releasing the expansion.

Btw, did any streamer or tournament player get to legend with a Paladin deck?

 

[Levi]

arena is the highest skill cap in this game

Constructed is harder. Arena is flat out curve stone at its most basic.

 

[patchday]

Not sure what the general opinion was but all the pros had Patches as their top 5 card. Same for Madam Goya, don't remember a lot of people thinking that was going to be a godly card.

I think Second Rate Bruiser was underrated and Inkmaster Solia was overrated. A lot of people thought Solia would at least be auto include in Reno Mage. Probably Small Time Bucaneer should be in there too but most people had it at least as a very good card.

I thought Devolve and Goya might be worth playing til gaf set me straight really early on (like- as soon as I spoke favorably of the cards)

but I was never planning to craft Goya tho. just kazakus and aya

 

[SonicXtreme]

Constructed is harder. Arena is flat out curve stone at its most basic.

nah, i consider deck building to be a huge component of 'skill' in hearthstone, and 95% of 'skilled' players don't do anything but open up hearthpwn in constructed or throw in a harrison jones and consider getting lucky with their matchmaking 'skill'.

sure you might get offered trash in arena sometimes but overall consistently doing well is very difficult; you could throw a noob an account with renolock and they would smash until single digit ranks (and that's given a deck with as high a skill cap as it gets), but getting a noob to draft and win even 3 games in arena would be quite a feat

 

[Salex_]

nah, i consider deck building to be a huge component of 'skill' in hearthstone, and 95% of 'skilled' players don't do anything but open up hearthpwn in constructed or throw in a harrison jones and consider getting lucky with their matchmaking 'skill'.

You can say the same thing about arena with HeartArena.

 

[SonicXtreme]

You can say the same thing about arena with HeartArena.

heartharena is completely unnecessary for a good arena player. and i gurantee if i booted it up i would argue with a good number of the picks based on my hundreds of wins of experience in arena. a good constructed player needs to keep up to date on meta decks that are popular via at least looking up netdecks and studying them.

 

[ZealousD]

Not sure what the general opinion was but all the pros had Patches as their top 5 card.

The Reddit/VS poll had Patches at an average of 3.4.

4 was the most common rating. There were more 3's than 5's.

 

[patchday]

Hit rank 11 or 12 last night rather easily but am starting to get Ladder anxiety. Highest I've been up until now is like eight or nine.

my issue is slightly similar. I make a hard push but I usually abandon ladder mid month. This is my favorite game by far but I still have other games I want to play on the side (so after getting a decent chest I slack off a lot). but that is nice you found it easy to get to 11/12.

I found it challenging as I experimented at first with a lot of different decks. Finally gave in to temptation and started netdecking again. thats when it got fairly easy to climb. Esp using these aggro decks. I just giggle inside when a dragon priest uses their dragon operative on me. I just love decks with cheap minions that require strong synergy to work

 

[ZealousD]

So I created a Battlecry Zoo deck for the dumb Battlecry quest and I threw in two Blubber Barons. The highest I got him to was an 8/8.

https://hsreplay.net/replay/JidL7EeDrrWoXJYvizustB

However even all of those Battlecries, he was kind of a clunky 5/5 most of the time, which wasn't even that great. I actually think Bolvar Fordragon was kind of better for this kind of mechanic. I haven't tried him out in a Grimy Goons deck but I'm sure he would be pretty clunky there too. Kind of praying for the Doppelgangster synergy there.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

3/3 friend requests sent after winning with a reno deck have been nice people. That's like a 300% increase over other decks.

 

[squidyj]

watching toast try to pilot this priest deck :/

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Reno mage feels real good tbh. I've only really lost to rogue but the rogues I faced have curved out exceedingly well when they've won. I'm talking c-coin pillager turn 3, pillager turn 4, drake, auctioneer with preps and coins... and I've still won some of those. 2-4 overall, but 2 of the losses were with experimental lists so it's a bit better than that picture.

 

[Hycran]

Has anyone tried Goya in a low minion spell deck? Seems like it would work well with a stealth minion into gadgetzan

Also Kripps jade shaman is the truth. Took me from mid teens to 6 in one day.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Has anyone tried Goya in a low minion spell deck? Seems like it would work well with a stealth minion into gadgetzan

Also Kripps jade shaman is the truth. Took me from mid teens to 6 in one day.

Wouldn't barnes be better?

Or just playing gadgetzan since goya and gadgetzan both cost 6? heheh

 

[Dahbomb]

I experienced Secret Mage in Wild today.

Man that was god damn annoying. Played the new 5/5, Duplicate procced and then played 2 0 mana 5/5s. Still managed to win but man it was not fun navigating all the possible secrets. Dude was even running Vaporize.

 

[KuroNeeko]

What server do you play on, what timezone are you in, and what time of day do you typically play?

I play on the US server, but on JST. Usually a bit in the morning, around lunch, and in the evening on my way home or before bed.

Don't craft Goya and waste your dust. Kazakus is extremely top-tier and can be used in several decks. Game-defining if you craft a good spell.

Yeah, but my conundrum is this: I don't like Warlock, though I do like Priest (and Mage to some degree). Reno Priest pretty much loses to Reno Lock, so there's not much incentive to play it right now. The only thing is that when Reno rotates out, I imagine (without having seen any of the cards from the next expansion) that only Priest will be able to field a viable highlander-style deck since they have Raza and their hero power.

Still, Kazakus (along with Finja, Shaku, and Goya) are on my "Want" list.

my issue is slightly similar. I make a hard push but I usually abandon ladder mid month. This is my favorite game by far but I still have other games I want to play on the side (so after getting a decent chest I slack off a lot). but that is nice you found it easy to get to 11/12.

It literally has never been this easy for me. As a Priest "main", the difference between pre-Gadgetzan and post is massive. It's so hard to describe...I guess Shaman players understand since they went through the same thing with TGT, LoE, and WotG.

To be fair though, Dragon Priest is pretty boring for me. Resurrect / Goya / Barnes / Y'shaarj sounds a lot more fun...

Guess I'll see if I can hit Rank 5. Might as well. Once I get my gold Priest, I may switch classes for a while.

 

[Papercuts]

Madam Goya is unplayable garbage and it always will be. The design will always be a contradiction and her stats are terrible. If you want to go fishing for a card Barnes is just better, if you want to reuse battlecries you hand bounce. Her idea of bouncing a battlecry for a strong minion like rag won't work because you have to have battlecries to bounce in the first place, which means they're bad cards to pull with her...which means she is not consistent. Not to mention you need something on board for her to do anything.

I've always thought it was one of the worst cards in the entire set, if you don't count the obviously bad vanilla stuff like Worgen Greaser or whatever. She has dumb fun applications like trying to make some super meme deck work but it'll take many games to pull off for one youtube highlight, then get tossed away again.

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

It's a shame that Madam Goya is a bad card because her lore in WoW as the curator of the Black Market Auction House is pretty cool. Surely they could've come up with something better/more interesting.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Madam goya is secretly the best card, because she combos with patches. You can get patches twice for free... so broken.

 

[Dahbomb]

Madam goya is secretly the best card, because she combos with patches. You can get patches twice for free... so broken.

Damn man Gang Up must be the most broken card ever printed then.

 

[Papercuts]

It's a shame that Madam Goya is a bad card because her lore in WoW as the curator of the Black Market Auction House is pretty cool. Surely they could've come up with something better/more interesting.

She has one of my favorite gold animations in the set too.

RIP.

 

[KuroNeeko]

You guys are all talking like winning is the only reason to play this game. lol

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Starting to get the hang of reno mage vs reno lock https://hsreplay.net/replay/BhL77PaXZYPoPr9Fs6HVhj

You guys are all talking like winning is the only reason to play this game. lol

The only reason for life kappa

To be fair, the most engagement I think a lot of people find with the game is competing and figuring out the best plays each turn. And playing a card like goya isn't rewarding that way.

 

[slightconfuse]

Goya seems like it's built for meme decks and trolden videos

 

[Yaboosh]

Starting to get the hang of reno mage vs reno lock https://hsreplay.net/replay/BhL77PaXZYPoPr9Fs6HVhj




The only reason for life kappa

To be fair, the most engagement I think a lot of people find with the game is competing and figuring out the best plays each turn. And playing a card like goya isn't rewarding that way.

That frost Nova doomsayer spellbender turn was useful.

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

Yeah reno mage vs. reno lock I've gotten better at. Can still lose, a lot depends on Cabalist's Tome pick ups, but I've won the past few games in that matchup. They usually end up fatiguing out from tapping, or underestimate my burst potential if I pick up some juicy spells from Kazakus, Tome, Babbling Book, or Conjurer.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

That frost Nova doomsayer spellbender turn was useful.

It made spellbender feel like a card I should include in the deck.

 

[KuroNeeko]

Yep. Priest vs. Renolock matchup is still stupid.

Just took one with some sweet, sweet Velen burst.
Time to take a break. lol

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

Lost to a Dragon Priest as Reno Mage feelsbadman.

He OPed a tome, into another tome. And finished me off with Brann/Corruptor

I don't think I ever got block, even though I managed to Reno I think twice.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I think anyfin paladin is gonna be a deck that becomes a bit more popular down the line. Maybe not tier 1 but in the dirty rat meta it's pretty good. You can't disrupt the combo with dirty rat alone, you need polymorphs as well. Kazakus has polymorphs so there is a bit more counterplay than prior though.

I just had a game against control shaman, where dirty rat hit their n'zoth. Must've been pretty painful for him.

 

[KuroNeeko]

I think anyfin paladin is gonna be a deck that becomes a bit more popular down the line. Maybe not tier 1 but in the dirty rat meta it's pretty good. You can't disrupt the combo with dirty rat alone, you need polymorphs as well. Kazakus has polymorphs so there is a bit more counterplay than prior though.

I just had a game against control shaman, where dirty rat hit their n'zoth. Must've been pretty painful for him.

The Anyfin / Reno match is going to be an interesting one. I've been interested in its evolution with the release of Finja. Seems like it would basically come down to whether Reno can Kazakus for the polymorph spell or not. Then Anyfin will need to concentrate on Equality / Pyro-ing their own board just to guarantee that stuff goes into the graveyard (which you did against Priest anyway).

The problem is that Anyfin was always pretty weak against Aggro and strong against Control, but Control decks are better now (with the exception of Control Warrior), so their strongest matchup actually gets weaker without their hardest matchup getting any easier. Unless you think Dirty Rat is strong enough to push the archtype? I don't have any DRs or Finja to test myself.

 

[thepotatoman]

I want to put Aya in my N'Zoth deck, but I'm not sure I want to go full Jade Golem. I'm trying it out with only Jade Claws and Jade Lightning, and I guess it's ok?

The thing is, Aya really doesn't take much to be way above curve, and Aya alone makes every other jade golem good.

Maybe it's just never right to leave out any jade golem cards if you're runnng any of them, but it's annoying being forced to spend so many slots on those cards.

Here's the Decklist i'm working on for that

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

The Anyfin / Reno match is going to be an interesting one. I've been interested in its evolution with the release of Finja. Seems like it would basically come down to whether Reno can Kazakus for the polymorph spell or not. Then Anyfin will need to concentrate on Equality / Pyro-ing their own board just to guarantee that stuff goes into the graveyard (which you did against Priest anyway).

The problem is that Anyfin was always pretty weak against Aggro and strong against Control, but Control decks are better now (with the exception of Control Warrior), so their strongest matchup actually gets weaker without their hardest matchup getting any easier. Unless you think Dirty Rat is strong enough to push the archtype? I don't have any DRs or Finja to test myself.

I don't think anyfin is weak to aggro. You have enough leeway with the list such that you can build it several different ways. And it always runs double doomsayer and wild pyros, so you don't really have to tweak that much imo. Against aggro lightlord and tirion carry. You can also fit in curator and acidic ooze. Forbidden healing is like running a reno in the deck.

Depending on how far you want to counter aggro, I think you can be heavily favored. But I take more of a middle stance, because I want to beat other decks too. I am running a list taken after a deck developed after karazhan to be more favored against aggressive midrange lists like midrange shaman. Curator specifically. And I have dirty rat to help defeat other combo decks and it's also pretty good against aggro.

Probably not great vs rogue though. Miracle rogue is perhaps the strongest it's ever been.

 

[KuroNeeko]

I don't think anyfin is weak to aggro. You have enough leeway with the list such that you can build it several different ways. And it always runs double doomsayer and wild pyros, so you don't really have to tweak that much imo. Against aggro lightlord and tirion carry. You can also fit in curator and acidic ooze. Forbidden healing is like running a reno in the deck.

Depending on how far you want to counter aggro, I think you can be heavily favored. But I take more of a middle stance, because I want to beat other decks too. I am running a list taken after a deck developed after karazhan to be more favored against aggressive midrange lists like midrange shaman. Curator specifically. And I have dirty rat to help defeat other combo decks and it's also pretty good against aggro.

Probably not great vs rogue though. Miracle rogue is perhaps the strongest it's ever been.

I mean, what do you have against Miracle--Equality → clear? Probably even fewer options against Maly Rogue, right? I guess it's true you could tailor your deck to deal with aggro...

Anyway, Anyfin, Murloc, and N'zoth paladin are the only archtypes I've ever liked in Paladin. Hope you can get something to stick. I'm looking for a new class to take up once I finish Priest.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I mean, what do you have against Miracle--Equality → clear? Probably even fewer options against Maly Rogue, right? I guess it's true you could tailor your deck to deal with aggro...

Anyway, Anyfin, Murloc, and N'zoth paladin are the only archtypes I've ever liked in Paladin. Hope you can get something to stick. I'm looking for a new class to take up once I finish Priest.

Vs miracle rogue, it's doable although not favored. In some ways worse but in one way better than before, dirty rat can kill their leeroy combo.

Anyfin is somewhat one of the better paladin decks for beating rogue because of the burst potential. Rogue also still can't deal with ragnaros very well.

I haven't seen any maly rogue and for good reason. They can't really cope with aggro decks. Miracle rogue can because of patches. But running patches in maly rogue seems simply worse than miracle rogue. Maly rogue also has less room for options since you really want to run all the burn spells you can... on the other hand since control warrior isn't around, you could probably get away with cutting some. Miracle rogue seems better suited for patches still. I might have to test around with that once I craft patches.

 

[Shinypogs]

Twitch chat has an uncanny ability to spot lethal faster than streamers. I don't just mean the fake shouts either.