BigJonsson
Member
Even quicker, finished the win 5 as a Rogue quest with the deck I put Patches in and bought a pack which had a golden Wickerflame in it!
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Hearthstone |OT8| Elise's Extremely Irresponsible Field Trip To Un'Goro
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
- Status
Even quicker, finished the win 5 as a Rogue quest with the deck I put Patches in and bought a pack which had a golden Wickerflame in it!
SonicXtreme
Member
wickerflame is sick, i haven't gotten good use of him yet but i've had opponents get double digit healing from him which was basically game over
BigJonsson
Member
Yea, but I could dust him for a non-gold legendary, guess I'll see how the meta shakes out
SonicXtreme
Member
i would keep him. the only problem with him right now is that he's a paladin card. if paladin gets any good cards in the next year he will be an amazing mini tirion.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I would keep wickerflame even if paladin doesn't turn out to find a strong spot in the meta. Wickerflame will be standard legal for a long time.
On the other hand, since it's gold... yeah you could dust that for a sure thing.
On the other hand, since it's gold... yeah you could dust that for a sure thing.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Wickerflame is basically mini-tirion with heals instead of a weapon. I've gotten it bigger than tirion too, with don hancho and then it got hexed...
e:
Never noticed how good the card art is til now:
e:
Never noticed how good the card art is til now:
BigJonsson
Member
True that
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Wickerflame is esentially a minibot with taunt heal 4 stapled on it from my experience and that's pretty darn great for a 3 mana card. If you get off a redemption with him it's outright filthy.
SonicXtreme
Member
hmm, redemption/getaway kodo / avenge paladin could be something for me to tinker around with in wild...the main flaw is the hero power redeeming or powering up trash minions, but perhaps something based around sir finley or perhaps a sideshow spelleater, barnes, could perhaps build up a good casual concede meme deck
BananasWithGuns
Member
Okay, so this fucking Shaman is able to play White Eyes, draw and play Storm Guardian, revive White Eyes with N'Zoth then draw and play another Storm Guardian all before he even gets 2/3 the way through his deck.
Seriously, what the fuck. Talk about being gifted a win.
No wonder people just play face decks.
Seriously, what the fuck. Talk about being gifted a win.
No wonder people just play face decks.
I watched my friend play against Control Shaman using Pirate Warrior and the Shaman played coin White Eyes then drew Storm Guardian the very next turn. Not even face is immune to bullshit
SonicXtreme
Member
kinda fun beat 2 priests dicking around in casual lol, gotta work on it, need to craft a second kodo, drop a doom sayer for a pyromancer or somethin
BananasWithGuns
Member
Just died to Leeroy + PO + Ysera Awakens + Hellfire + Soulfire from 22 HP.
Guess I should have played around it.
Guess I should have played around it.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Shadowflame needs a nerf to cost 5 or at least deal the damage to all minions.
yeah fuck that, card already need 2 card combo a
at very least you trhow 7 frigging mana for shadowflame already
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I don't follow.
Shadowflame not just cost 4
its cost card and its mana cost + 4, that already expensive as shit for card that dead in your hand until later turn, its just as expensive as twisting nether if not more
Want better example for overly cheap one sided board control card? flametongue totem
One of the worst nerf suggestions in this thread in a long time.
Last thing we need in this game is to nerf AOE.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
that's not how it works especially not when it includes deathrattles and or battlecries. As it is it can be used after you got some value from minions already easily and it combos naturally with sylvanas w/o even requiring an emperor tick. Being asymmetrical is what pushes it over the top for me.
I wouldn't be against upping flametongue to 3 either.
because the game is so lacking in aoe right now...
BananasWithGuns
Member
Not sure I agree with that anymore.
Renolock has way too much clear now with all the new cards.
Bought 40 packs as an early Christmas Gift for myself and I think I just used all of the luck that I have. Just got Krul, Raza, White Eyes, and a Golden Hobart. Add to that, I disenchanted all dupes and I got 1555 Dust enough for me craft something else and this is without dusting Golden cards yet. I think I'll start saving up Gold for expansion next year lol.
Renolock is dead once reno rotates.
Warlock always had board clears. You could run double Shadowflame, double Hellfire and double Twisting Nether in OG Handlock if you needed to. It's a defining part of the class ESPECIALLY board clears with some down side (notice how ALL of them have some downside to them and in some cases significant ones at that unlike say Priest or Mage).
As far as board clears go, Warlock got three if you include Kazakus. Felfire Potion and Abyssal Enforcer. Felfire Potion doesn't see that much play, mostly tech option and Abyssal Enforcer is usually played as a tempo card or as a second Hellfire. Abyssal Enforcer is a power card but as a board clear it's worse than Hellfire because at that stage of the game the 3 damage means less, the big body + tempo is why that card sees play (it's like the Warlock version of Fire Elemental in many cases).
It's really Kazakus that has pushed the decks and others. More importantly, Warlock got buffed because stuff like Blastcrystal Potion, Kazakus, Mistress of Mixtress, Dirty Rat, Bruiser etc. that kinda filled in the big holes they had in the deck before.
Complaining about Warlock board clears is like complaining about Priest having heals, Druid having ramp, Warriors having weapons (though I guess we have been doing that a lot lately too) and Paladin having buff cards. Having tons of board clears is not going to make Warlock good... it's having single target removal, early/mid game game heals, ways to transform minions and make tempo plays. This expansion did all of that on top of giving them board clears which is why Renolock is good right now.
Good thing for you guys is that if there aren't big heals in the post rotation set, Control Warlock isn't going to be a thing. Reno Jackson is really vital to playing Control Warlock, without healing Warlock really struggles. Going to be losing Refreshment Vendor too. And also losing Demonwrath, Dark Peddler, Imp Gang Boss, Emperor Thaurissan for the combo.
As far as board clears go, Warlock got three if you include Kazakus. Felfire Potion and Abyssal Enforcer. Felfire Potion doesn't see that much play, mostly tech option and Abyssal Enforcer is usually played as a tempo card or as a second Hellfire. Abyssal Enforcer is a power card but as a board clear it's worse than Hellfire because at that stage of the game the 3 damage means less, the big body + tempo is why that card sees play (it's like the Warlock version of Fire Elemental in many cases).
It's really Kazakus that has pushed the decks and others. More importantly, Warlock got buffed because stuff like Blastcrystal Potion, Kazakus, Mistress of Mixtress, Dirty Rat, Bruiser etc. that kinda filled in the big holes they had in the deck before.
Complaining about Warlock board clears is like complaining about Priest having heals, Druid having ramp, Warriors having weapons (though I guess we have been doing that a lot lately too) and Paladin having buff cards. Having tons of board clears is not going to make Warlock good... it's having single target removal, early/mid game game heals, ways to transform minions and make tempo plays. This expansion did all of that on top of giving them board clears which is why Renolock is good right now.
Good thing for you guys is that if there aren't big heals in the post rotation set, Control Warlock isn't going to be a thing. Reno Jackson is really vital to playing Control Warlock, without healing Warlock really struggles. Going to be losing Refreshment Vendor too. And also losing Demonwrath, Dark Peddler, Imp Gang Boss, Emperor Thaurissan for the combo.
And that not a bad thing as long these board flood deck keep spawning up
mage and priest should've as good in clearing board too
only renolock n quite ironically mid shaman that keep aggro deck in check
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
That they are not feeling compelled to run blastfire potion is a sign they have an overabundance of clears already and don't require the redundancy
Enforcer + Brann is a 6 damage clear as well.
The issue isn't for Warlock having access to clears but they have enough redundancy making the highlander downside close to negligible.
It's also not just Patches that pushes low to ground decks, Renolock is just as culpable. You just can't play fair with Warlock right now.
Shadowflame stands out as being asymmetrical, every other AoE in Locks' arsenal hits everything equally.
Enforcer + Brann is a 6 damage clear as well.
The issue isn't for Warlock having access to clears but they have enough redundancy making the highlander downside close to negligible.
It's also not just Patches that pushes low to ground decks, Renolock is just as culpable. You just can't play fair with Warlock right now.
Shadowflame stands out as being asymmetrical, every other AoE in Locks' arsenal hits everything equally.
6 cards counting the ysera, with at least 3 discounts to make the damn thing playable on 10 mana, with enough hp for the lock to not kill himself. Either your opponent just had the nuts and the game was unwinnable or you're doing something wrong.
Imagine another game, like say eternal, sometimes you just don't draw mana and you're left holding your dick all game, you just straight up lose. It's the nature of these games. Some of them you just lose and that's not because burst or damage from hand is bullshit, it's just something that happens.
And wtf wrong with that, its special card that need sacrifice setup
not like warlock has lightning storm
the point being made is that because of the cards available to warlock the supposed sacrifice has consistently become less and less of a sacrifce to the point where it's difficult to call it a sacrifice because even running 1 copy of each they have enough tools to fill their slots.
Wouldn't surprise me if the next expansion had a successor of sorts for Reno. They clearly like the highlander style, but I doubt it's strong enough to survive on Kazakus and the current class legendaries.
I think they might let it die.
After Gadgetzan brought it back strong? They like these decks. But I think they're possibly shifting it toward having a few highlander cards with strong effects per deck rather than just the one make or break card like Reno can be. A bit more consistent, less huge swings.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
In a game where warriors shield slam their own cthun it's pretty clear that sacrifice isn't always a cost.
Even when it is a cost. Reno decks don't play many vanilla minions the worst target for shadowflame is prob an imp gang boss. By the time you play shadowflame you've already gotten some if not most of the value already.
If shadowflame were symmetrical I'd agree with you that it's card disadvantage, as it is right now it's rarely so.
if you use minion for shadowflame its just super expensive version of existing clear
ooze sf, 6 mana 3 damage clear with 2 card, so good
SonicXtreme
Member
i hope blizzard learned from their mistake of making this tavern brawl standard only. i'd love to see their data on the fact that decks with barnes won 98% of the matches with dumb meme decks.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
that also destroys a weapon and only clears the opponent's board. That's better, and considerably so, than hellfire already if ooze got to attack face once.
Renolock is one of the most fun and challenging decks to play (and imo to play against) in a long time. To nerf it when its one of the few decks with any sort of depth is madness. Instead of calling to nerf reno/ kazakus/ leeroy / emperor / shadow flame / whatever else card happens to get up your nose at the time and turn this game back into the boring curve fiesta it was at karazan, you should be hoping for new cards to come into the game to make it even more interesting.
that's very ideal scenario that actually not happened often... what more likely happened is you just use combo for just casting lightning storm
SonicXtreme
Member
god , if there's anything more satisfying than dropping humility or eye for an eye on turn 5 'the ancient one', i don't know what it is. so satisfying farming these idiots with my own turn the tables y'saarj deck
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
It's not like Renolock can't curve out, perfectly. Going turn 4 Kazakus into turn 5 Potion isn't particularly skill intensive either as an example of the curve out.
To me renolock just screams embarrassment of riches currently.
and you described a pretty bad scenario.
Lightning storm 3 overload 2 not sure how overload is calculated right now in effective costs but that's ~2 mana more, and you have a guaranteed highroll on a lightning storm across the board as well.
What is your point? That renolock is an autopilot curve deck because a turn 4 minion can make a turn 5 spell?
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
that current Renolock isn't this one of a kind deck that puts all other decks in HS history to shame.
Come back to ranked two weeks later and I'm still playing against nothing but pirate decks at rank 4. Played against 6 Pirate Warriors in a row so far. Not even exaggerating.
Such a fun and interactive game. Only turn I skipped was turn 1 and I had a taunt on turn 4. Still lost on turn 5. Yay.
Unlike this Pirate BS you can actually play around that most of the time. Assume every Renolock is using Leeroy and keep track of which damage spells they use. Using a control deck? Save taunts until Emperor and/or AOE removal is gone, put up ice block, or make sure you have enough armor. Every other deck can probably kill them before a combo like that even becomes a factor.
Who is saying that? I'm saying more decks should be interesting like renolock, instead of having interesting decks like it nerfed.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
You pretty implicitly said that if we leave my hyperbole aside.
I'm not just for nerfing shadowflame, there's a whole slew of cards that could see some cost or slight functionality changes.
I'm singling out shadowflame right now because I see it as a particular culprit against fair decks, which have been pushed out twofold.
I didn't imply anything. I was quite literal and clear with my words. It is _one_of the most interesting decks in a long time. I did not say it is _the_ most interesting deck "in the history of hearthstone".
I do agree shadowflame is very strong, though. It's possibly the best aoe in the game. But unlike you I do not believe it is oppressive.
Shadowflame is the best versus dragon warrior n mid shaman.. two deck that not gonna hold back vomiting minion on board.
Is those the definition of fair deck? Lmao
No good AoE should've nèrfed period its only benefit boring curve deck in the end.. never repeat the blade flurry mistake
Is those the definition of fair deck? Lmao
No good AoE should've nèrfed period its only benefit boring curve deck in the end.. never repeat the blade flurry mistake
- Status