Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
paladin is a bad example because paladin ain't getting shit.
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Hearthstone |OT8| Elise's Extremely Irresponsible Field Trip To Un'Goro
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Karsticles
Member
Off-faction abilities are expected to take a hit.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Yaboosh gets it. Some classes get stronger tools in than others.
Warlock having direct damage removal is not off faction, which means little anyway.
Warlock having direct damage removal is not off faction, which means little anyway.
I swear majority of these Shamans are playing like complete dumbasses. I can't comprehend how they can even come to the conclusion about some of these plays. I just watched a Shaman attack my face nonstop after turn 4 even though I stayed around full hp and kept board advantage...as Priest.
In other news, I'm convinced this is the absolute best counter to Shaman. It's almost as bad as Hunter vs Control Warrior.
In other news, I'm convinced this is the absolute best counter to Shaman. It's almost as bad as Hunter vs Control Warrior.
Dahbomb's definition of Power Creep here is just the more broad version. Not necessarily the strict Frostwolf Grunt into Pompous Thespian type of power creep, where one card is strictly better than the other. But more consequential and broad definition. Introduce enough really strong cards and the ceiling for card quality goes up and deck quality goes up on average.
You want to see power creep like that in this expansion, look no further than Drakonid Operative and Abyssal Enforcerer. These cards aren't necessarily strictly better than any others, but they still have insane value proposition for the cost, to the point that they seem deliberately overpowered.
You want to see power creep like that in this expansion, look no further than Drakonid Operative and Abyssal Enforcerer. These cards aren't necessarily strictly better than any others, but they still have insane value proposition for the cost, to the point that they seem deliberately overpowered.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I think a NZoth Reno paladin is gonna real easy with the next set.
I play all classes. So there aren't any OP cards. Y'all can quit arguing now.
Yeah when people mean power creep they don't mean "X is strictly better than a Y card that is the same"... it means that at that cost the expected power level of a card (whether it be class or neutral has gone up).
Belcher was a power creep card. It doesn't specifically power creep over any specific widely used card (sure it was power creep over Fen Creeper technically speaking) BUT it raised the expected value of the 5 drop in the game. Cards were then compared to it within the same mana class and even through different class cards.
Maelstrom Portal is a power creep card because it raises the expected value of what you can expect from a 2 mana spell. It used to be that 2 mana meant you did 1 damage to all enemy minions vs 1 mana dealt 1 damage to all minions (Whirlwind). Maelstorm Portal comes in says "those other cards were too weak, I am the new standard now."
I would also say that Minibot and Totem Golem are power creep cards because they raised the expected power level of a 2 drop class card. They power crept so hard that they escaped the power of War Axe which was specifically designed to two for 1 2 drops.
Classes do not operate in a vacuum, they fight against each other and one class gets power crept cards compared to other classes it results in a shift in power balance. That's why we are in this place to begin with when it comes to Shaman.
Belcher was a power creep card. It doesn't specifically power creep over any specific widely used card (sure it was power creep over Fen Creeper technically speaking) BUT it raised the expected value of the 5 drop in the game. Cards were then compared to it within the same mana class and even through different class cards.
Maelstrom Portal is a power creep card because it raises the expected value of what you can expect from a 2 mana spell. It used to be that 2 mana meant you did 1 damage to all enemy minions vs 1 mana dealt 1 damage to all minions (Whirlwind). Maelstorm Portal comes in says "those other cards were too weak, I am the new standard now."
I would also say that Minibot and Totem Golem are power creep cards because they raised the expected power level of a 2 drop class card. They power crept so hard that they escaped the power of War Axe which was specifically designed to two for 1 2 drops.
Classes do not operate in a vacuum, they fight against each other and one class gets power crept cards compared to other classes it results in a shift in power balance. That's why we are in this place to begin with when it comes to Shaman.
banana daiquiri
Neo Member
I ran a really similar list last month (had another Holy Nova and two Netherspites instead of Priest of the Feasts) and got to rank 5 quite comfortably.
I started with same amount of weapon removal as you but ran into a patch of Maly Druids and Tempo Mages.
Thhat what made it hard to counter shaman on ladder lul
If you completely focused on board clear and weapon removal (and shaman still can win anyway) you lose to the next best deck that play completely different than Shaman.. Druid deck that not fill the board or play weapon at all
If you completely focused on board clear and weapon removal (and shaman still can win anyway) you lose to the next best deck that play completely different than Shaman.. Druid deck that not fill the board or play weapon at all
Abyssal Enforcer is so strong that it actually has Dr. Boom levels of value packed into it. It's more situational so it isn't quite as OP, but the fact that it's in the wheelhouse of that power level as a common is nutso.
banana daiquiri
Neo Member
Slime, Harrison & Deathwing carried me against Shaman a lot just on their own.
Discovering Twilight Whelps or Midnight Drakes (garbage as it seems) to fill out curves was also pretty good. Often drew out some premature clears/removals.
One thing with the history of HS has been 3/5 drops being pretty weak too. You basically always used to see 3/3 do a thing for three, some class cards were 4/3(like Kirin Tor) but then expansions paved the way for 3/4s. 3/4s that do a think/have an effect(Dark Cultist), a three drop now basically needs those stats or have some other really strong effect to make it.
5 drops are even weirder. IIRC it wasn't until TGT where we got Pit Fighter, a 5/6 for 5 which was actually a new statline for that mana. Now we have a damn 5/6 dragon that discovers a card for Priest.
5 drops are even weirder. IIRC it wasn't until TGT where we got Pit Fighter, a 5/6 for 5 which was actually a new statline for that mana. Now we have a damn 5/6 dragon that discovers a card for Priest.
The problem with making a deck to counter Shaman is that you will guarantee yourself to never see Shaman again once you queue with it.
Well we did have DotC at 4/6 with taunt and Tiger at 5/5 with stealth, both much better than pit fighter. Oh and Loatheb.
What did you replace them with? I'm thinking maybe Darkshire Alchemist because you need to keep minions on the board and it can't be late game because you'll die to Malygos by then.
That always happened to me when I rage switched to Freeze Mage. Nothing but Hunter and Warrior.
EDIT: Just had a Shaman conclude on turn 4 after I controlled the board from turn 2-4 and used Acidic on a 1/3 weapon lol.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Power creep over flamewaker!
1 mana brann + coin + c'thun
(not shown is I coin'd, there is a delay on card history)
1 mana brann + coin + c'thun
(not shown is I coin'd, there is a delay on card history)
Give the AI some slack, bro. It probably just misclicked.
I think having purposely weak 3 and 5 drops is a conscious design choice to make sure that you can't just win by curving out from 1-7. The weaker turn 3 and turn 5 allow the other person to catch up.
At least that was the case with classic, then they started filling the holes and we got curve decks after that.
At least that was the case with classic, then they started filling the holes and we got curve decks after that.
banana daiquiri
Neo Member
Salex said:
Try Brann. Good with Netherspites - pick midgame/tempo dragons instead of the big ones to pile on the pressure.
Plus sometimes you can just go face for 6 with Blackwing Corruptor for finisher.
Or even play him on curve for extra battlecry buffs and start to snowball from there.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Made a reno paladin deck in the current standard, it's awful. Playing 3 secrets, draw all of them ahead of MC...
Selfish request, but I wonder if any US peeps here still have their Twitch Prime from Tyrande and have a Watch Dogs 2 code they don't need? Seems mine glitched out on me.
Yeah I keep seeing Tuskarr, it's odd. I run Rockbiter in my aggro though.
Yeah I keep seeing Tuskarr, it's odd. I run Rockbiter in my aggro though.
bronkonagurski
Member
Sure. PM me.
There is very little more satisfying in this game than outlasting a midrange Shaman on my crappy Priest deck and getting them so angry they start spamming emotes and then rope me the rest of the game.
Bruh, you may be playing the 2nd most OP deck in the history of the game, but that doesn't mean you get to win -every- match.
Bruh, you may be playing the 2nd most OP deck in the history of the game, but that doesn't mean you get to win -every- match.
Got it, thanks!
You know, I thought of an idea Blizard could do to promote the expansion at launch (Which they likely won't)
They could let you pick one of the three factions when the expansion goes live, and give you that faction's Legendary plus the other two tri-class cards for it. Sort of like with C'Thun. It looks like the three Legendaries will all be somewhat build around.
They could let you pick one of the three factions when the expansion goes live, and give you that faction's Legendary plus the other two tri-class cards for it. Sort of like with C'Thun. It looks like the three Legendaries will all be somewhat build around.
Karsticles
Member
Then they might have to make more than one good class legendary this expansion.
In all seriousness, 3/9 Old Gods legendaries seeing play is pathetic. I don't even know why Malkorok disappeared from the meta.
I think malkorak is too slow for face and too unreliable for control.
We already know that isn't going to happen.
At least Old Gods did better with legendaries than TGT...
Even GvG was pretty bad. Mal'Ganis is the only clear cut good legendary, then there was Vol'jin and Neptulon which were decent.
Because Tempo Warrior disappeared from the meta thanks to Execute nerf.
Malkorok fits into Tempo Warrior and that deck isn't that widely used at the moment. It's either Pirate Warrior or Control Warrior, sometimes Dragon Warrior.
Welp, was planning on playing until I lost, but I'm 12-0 now on a Clocked Huntress deck, and I gotta get to sleep. It may be ranks 19 through 14, but still that's pretty damn impressive. It's not a total autopilot deck, but I think it has a low skill cap.
http://hss.io/d/15645593
The deck is basically a slightly slower face hunter. My version is basically the popular netdeck version I found, except I subbed Leeroy for Dart Trap.
http://hss.io/d/15645593
The deck is basically a slightly slower face hunter. My version is basically the popular netdeck version I found, except I subbed Leeroy for Dart Trap.
It's like they remembered control lock is still a thing.
With all of those busted card you expect priest will be tier 3? nahhhhhh
they will discover jaraxus and you'll cry
I also expect some the unrevealed priest card also busted tier
The cards so far only improve the Priest matchup against aggro, token, maybe midrange. Combo and control is unchanged.
Control is a good matchup for priest anyways. Combo is another story, but that's an issue shared by most decks.
Point is that if everyone plays Renolock, especially with Leeroy Faceless PO combo, Priest isn't going to be meta. Frankly they might because Renlock might have enough board clears now to contest Shaman, and Shaman might drop out in meta if there are a lot of Control/Dragon Priests.
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