ByWatterson
Member
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[Kotaku] Concord Director Steps Down As Studio Behind Historic PlayStation Flop Waits For Sony's Decision
This is the quality shit-posting that keeps me coming back to GAF.
Hawking Radiation
Member
ByWatterson
Member
BlackTron
Member
Saturn Dragon
Neo Member
I can't believe this yet.
-Around 6 years in development.
-About 100 people or something team of supposedly top designers/programmers and many ex-Bungie veterans.
-Budget estimated about 150-250 millions.
-They had top support from SIE.
And all they did was a the most generic and ugly looking 5v5 hero shooter?
It feels like a total waste of money, effort and TIME.
-Around 6 years in development.
-About 100 people or something team of supposedly top designers/programmers and many ex-Bungie veterans.
-Budget estimated about 150-250 millions.
-They had top support from SIE.
And all they did was a the most generic and ugly looking 5v5 hero shooter?
It feels like a total waste of money, effort and TIME.
fart town usa
Member
Imagine the impenetrable echo chamber that led to a 9 figure budget for this abomination. This thing easily cost 200 million.
What a f***ing disaster.
What a f***ing disaster.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Was Destiny good when Ellis was creative director?
Ridiculous. Yeah let's shove all this money at an unproven studio rather than at our other studios that have a proven track record of success. The execs steering the ship during that time were on crazy pills.
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Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
The studio had "less than 12 employees" in 2019.Imagine the impenetrable echo chamber that led to a 9 figure budget for this abomination. This thing easily cost 200 million.
What a f***ing disaster.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
The post-mortem has to be pretty obvious:
1. Noone is going to stick around for your systems and story when the game looks so generic. Destiny from day #1 had a distinctive look and style that sold people on it without ever playing it.
2. Look at the product as a whole; what "hooks" does it have, to whom is it going to appeal? The narrative/conceptual portion was weak. A vague name combined with a knock-off "Guardians Of The Galaxy" cast was never going perform well in any media format from Comic Books to Movies. Its just weak!
3. Manage perceptions, when the first posts started to surface about "The Professor" and such, for fuck's sake counter-market against it so as not to alienate half the audience along "culture war" lines.
4. Returning to point 2. When your concept and gameplay looks so generic and derivative, and you're going into a crowded marketplace with a lot of similar looking titles, what you absolutely must have is something that makes it stand out from the crowd. You want that "cool" factor.
In Sony's case, I'd seriously have to ask who were you listening to as your tastemakers in pursuit of that "cool" impact with Concord? You really need to start looking at who the "modern audience" actually is, and what actually shifts units.
1. Noone is going to stick around for your systems and story when the game looks so generic. Destiny from day #1 had a distinctive look and style that sold people on it without ever playing it.
2. Look at the product as a whole; what "hooks" does it have, to whom is it going to appeal? The narrative/conceptual portion was weak. A vague name combined with a knock-off "Guardians Of The Galaxy" cast was never going perform well in any media format from Comic Books to Movies. Its just weak!
3. Manage perceptions, when the first posts started to surface about "The Professor" and such, for fuck's sake counter-market against it so as not to alienate half the audience along "culture war" lines.
4. Returning to point 2. When your concept and gameplay looks so generic and derivative, and you're going into a crowded marketplace with a lot of similar looking titles, what you absolutely must have is something that makes it stand out from the crowd. You want that "cool" factor.
In Sony's case, I'd seriously have to ask who were you listening to as your tastemakers in pursuit of that "cool" impact with Concord? You really need to start looking at who the "modern audience" actually is, and what actually shifts units.
Hawking Radiation
Member
Hermen is an idiot, all these higher ups are completely out of touch, their reality is completely distorted.
lughnasadh123
Member
Seems like from a tech standpoint the game was pretty good so there's some talented people there worth holding on to. This disaster seems more like upper management fuckups with their inability (unwillingness?) to take a better read on the market and implement better changes to suit it. There needs to be a top to bottom enema with Sony, and I mean right at the fucking top, to have a proper post mortem on this so that it doesn't happen with their other GaaS projects.
What a coincidence when the best selling game of the year and the biggest flop of the industry were released a few days apart from each other.
Concord = Zero copies sold and lost $250-300 million.
Black Myth Wukong = 18 million copies sold and grossed $800-850 million and probably will clear around $1.3 billion by the end of the year.
Concord = Zero copies sold and lost $250-300 million.
Black Myth Wukong = 18 million copies sold and grossed $800-850 million and probably will clear around $1.3 billion by the end of the year.
Hawking Radiation
Member
Studio culture.
There was a very nice video someone posted in another Concord thread where a developer dissected the mess that is Firewalk Studios. Made some very compelling arguments. Will see if I can find it again and link it here.
lughnasadh123
Member
Heard of it going around. While they weren't there it was probably about as close to guessing what went out based on their own experience as well. Just amazing it got this point. Honestly I'm the most shocked at Herman Hulst not stepping in. Too busy sipping drinks on the yacht.
violence
Member
Pro character designer breaks down and fixes Concord character designs
Very interesting watch. There's another video where he compares the designs of the characters in Overwatch with the ones in Concord which is worth a watch as well.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Oh ****...game #2 is on the table?!
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Cyber_hunter026
Member
ChorizoPicozo
Gold Member
violence
Member
Sony has closed studios for less than this.
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ChorizoPicozo
Gold Member
Its the only option. imagine 8 years from now:
"From the creators of Concord..."
yep. that studio is worthless
larrybrady
Neo Member
If that happens,you might as well rename the game to last in sales of us online
Fbh
Member
To me the most unbelievable part is still that towards the end of development Sony saw the game and was like
And they bought the Studio
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
FW will close, but Ryan Ellis is still employed in a support role.
At some point, someone will spill the beans or he'll update his Linkedin resume which studio he works for. Will be hilarious which game he's part of next.
At some point, someone will spill the beans or he'll update his Linkedin resume which studio he works for. Will be hilarious which game he's part of next.
I wouldn't be surprised if all the decision makers were in a massive cope bubble even after launch. Why have a plan-b when plan-a's gonna succeed?
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Given what happened, it made sense to shut it all down, and shut down the studio too any time now.
But oddly, that final tweet was oddly vague like it's coming back for a second try. If it's true it's dead, it was a peculiar message to end it.
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poodaddy
Member
Nah. I lived in Seattle for twelve years, it's very expensive but it's not more expensive than the vast majority of California, which is where several of Sony's other studios are, studios of a much greater pedigree than this one as well, so while it does shed some light on their high salaries, it doesn't completely explain why they're some of the most expensive per head.
Danny22
Neo Member
That would be too much sense for Sony's current leadership. Leadership currently is that out of touch executive who doesn't understand that success in the video game sector is playing to your strengths and not creating generic products in genres that market research indicates would sell well.
Hurst probably wants to look like a 'hard decision' maker and will fire this company's staff as if this isn't all his mess in the first place. I wonder if something will happen to him after Fairgames flops.
This is my main problem with Sony. I LIKE them targeting live service unlike the majority on the internet. But you need to use your existing critically acclaimed gameplay and expand it into an mp ongoing process i.e spiderman mp game, twisted metal, factions, helldivers (that last one didn't get cancelled and look at its success). Instead they're chasing cartoon horizon, and generic products any other company could have made.
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laynelane
Member
Perhaps it's like when they acquired Bungie - they paid extra to retain talent. In this case, from what I understand, Firewalk has several experienced devs that migrated from other studios (Bungie, ABK, etc.). The higher salaries could possibly be explained as a way of retaining that talent since Sony has shown they have no problem paying for that. Just guessing on my part, though.
poodaddy
Member
Yeah that's probably exactly right actually, good thinking there. Man, those guys lucked out on their salary negotiations....they were guaranteed FAR more than they were apparently worth lol. Must have been a kush few years on Sony's ample dime for what were clearly either underachievers or incompetents, very lucky jackasses, like a whole studio of Leslie Neilson's.
laynelane
Member
I suspect the finance guys and top-level execs are having a good, long look at this state of affairs right now - and the gravy train at Firewalk is definitely over. All that investment - time and money - for a game that lasted less than two weeks and had to be refunded. Just amazing, really.
diffusionx
Gold Member
This studio made a multiplayer game nobody wanted to play. I mean that's incredible in its own way. But I don't see how it can continue. It just isn't a functional place. But some executives who helped push it through need to go as well. Total failure up and down the org.
People on here tried to tell me that Concord cost about $37 to develop and Sony is making 4,000 of these GAAS games so when 3,999 fail it does not matter as long as one is successful so it doesn't matter.
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
As crazy as it seems, there was a tweet from Herman Hulst in 2021 or 2022 saying how good the game is from what he saw at Firewalk. He and the rest of the Sony gang must had loved what they saw so much, they didnt even bother partnering with them the traditional way and see how it goes. The bought out the whole studio in 2023.
Same thing with Jade Raymond's Haven studio. A newly built studio with nothing. Bought them out. And people arent liking their anti-rich woke heist game going by the trailer.
And Bungie of course too. At least they got a good track record. Problem is they paid $3.6B and the second they bought them in early 2022, it's been downhill since.
Dirk Benedict
Gold Member
Not NeoGAF's boogeyman, Sony's. The biggest flop in the industry. A GOAT for all the wrong reasons.
kevboard
Member
lol, no one here lost more than 100 million dollars, Sony did.
arguably the worst failure in videogame history. I'd think anyone working with that person should see said person as the boogeyman.
Party McHardy
Member
The logo was badass no sarcasm. I’d hold my head high over that design decision DEi nonsense be damned.