Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Not as quick as mercy's ult, which is way more deadly in the right hands. It's about on par with Lucio's who is already so ridiculous.
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Overwatch |OT2| A New Low in Unlocking and Microtransaction Systems
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Not as quick as mercy's ult, which is way more deadly in the right hands. It's about on par with Lucio's who is already so ridiculous.
Stiler
Member
Just had an awesome POTG as Bastion.
My team was wiped out all except for me and the enemy team was pushing the cart to the last point, I was hidden in the building near the end and the entire enemy team was still alive and all grouped up on their cart. I ulted and took out 4 people and then took out the last in normal form just in time for my team to win it.
My team was wiped out all except for me and the enemy team was pushing the cart to the last point, I was hidden in the building near the end and the entire enemy team was still alive and all grouped up on their cart. I ulted and took out 4 people and then took out the last in normal form just in time for my team to win it.
Poor Reinhardt, I bet that player was salivating once he popped that ultimate.
I was Junkrat heh
https://youtu.be/iAFtge5nrSE
I was Junkrat heh
https://youtu.be/iAFtge5nrSE
Codeblew
Member
Seriously. Zenyatta can actually kill people unlike Mercy. Not to mention, she can debuff and heal at the same time as she is killing people. Mercy just runs around being somebodies heal bot the whole game.
That's also why you want to constantly lay down your Discord orbs and do damage with Zen, because it directly benefits his healing output.
SDCowboy
Member
Yep. He is a healer first and foremost. He's just very difficult to play, IMO.
He's a defensive healer and good in the backlines. He's also great for flankers provided they know to get in his LoS. He's a great healer, he's just single target. That's his only weakness and Mercy has the same hindrance.
Not to mention Zenyetta can actually defend himself against, well, pretty much anyone. Toss a discord and get a few headshots and pretty much anyone melts.
meanspartan
Member
I agree. I get what everyone is saying, but the game just feels soo good right now and I don't want it to become WoW PVP with its class of the month bullshit.
Please, please wait for ranked play and see what happens at the top level before talking nerfs. I admit my particular experience is contributing to this- I just don't feel like I am dying to McCrees all that much.
But I don't want it to become like WoW where my arena/RBG groups would have to change strategy or even entire class compositions because of yet another nerf creating a new preferred class.
You're not alone with that urge
SDCowboy
Member
She? Zen is a dude. lol
edit: forget it, I thought of the wrong char
and yet Mercy is a much much bigger asset on a team. if I didn't have to play tank or some other needed character I'd switch to a healer np, lucio is my 2nd most played.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Mercy kills very easily. The only downside is needing to switch your equipment out.
But that's just the thing. The top level is already running one or two McCrees every team.
The issue is typically the double fth. A flashbang followed by fth is enough to kill everyone he should be able to easily kill. The problem is that if he fucked up(or it's a beefy character), he can just roll(which reloads), and immediately fth again. Now he's done enough damage to kill any character, assuming they weren't able to do something in the 1 second it took for him to get the second FTH off.
I'd be okay if a few more moves could still be used while stunned. In particular, Tracer recall, Reaper shadow form, and Mei iceblock. This gives a few characters a better chance at countering him. This would only indirectly help the tanks.
I'd also be okay if fth simply had a cool down of some sort after a roll, or even just in general after a reload. Another thought I had was changing fth to not get crits.
When I'm on Zenyatta it's more like you're playing with 7, I'll just be over here getting gold elminations and healing. But I know what I'm doing and only use him in specific situations. I'm not an idiot who picks him on KOTH as the only healer with randoms.
I had someone go off on me when I suggested not picking Zenyatta on KOTH the other day. I mean, I love the character, but you'd only be in for suffering. I picked Lucio just to get him to swap off (we did win).
Admiral Snackbar
Member
BreezyLimbo
Banned
.
yep
Have his orb always on someone ( usually the tank), stay a little bit back, abuse his discord reticle to hit people even when you dont see them.
throw his discord on tanks and see how quick they melt. headshot them with the orb and see them die in 3 secs ( even roadhog)
making his healing reticle have a longer range + a longer duration ( like, 5 secs instead of 3) + at least 25 more shield to resist widow bodyshots and there, zen becomes a really great character.
also, I disagree with the notion that his ult builds faster. I play a lot of him and it seems to build at the same rate as lucio. Mercy's ult is the one that builds up ridiculously fast.
D
Deleted member 325805
Unconfirmed Member
And I personally hate it, I either want to hit and hit, or miss and miss. I don't want to be given a kill because I was close enough.
Mr Fahrenheit
Member
Apparently the hotness once you reach level 60+ is to be attack Torbjorn and be absolutely useless while insisting that he's great on attack and we're all just not supporting him correctly. Had two different guys do this today
Omega Kirby
Member
They should change Zenyattas HP to Armor. so he can survive a full widow body shot with 5 hp or give him a mobility passive.
Now that I think of it, why do only some heroes have passives?
Now that I think of it, why do only some heroes have passives?
SDCowboy
Member
Well they did a pretty darn good job here.
meanspartan
Member
I know, and I conceded earlier that top teams running two McCreed might indeed be indicative of a problem.
But two points to this:
1. It hasn't been THAT long yet. As an extreme example, in the Korean Starcraft scene for pretty much years many thought Terran were not viable until BoxeR's then-wacky medivac focused play wiped the floor with the competition. It could be that pros are soon countering those two McCree teams easily and it falls out of fashion.
2. Overcorrecting might be worse than no correction. If McRees are a bit too powerful, I prefer that to a gimped class no one uses.
Again, my experience in other Blizzard games is influencing my thoughts here.
Eel O'Brian
Member
Maybe a choice with Zenyatta's charge shot? Say, sort of like Lucio's flip between speed and healing, you could flip to healing before charging and it would shoot out all your orbs for a one-time health burst to any nearby teammates? At a lower amount than the normal orb of harmony, of course.
Yep, the hesitation move is the only counter i have against him when I'm playing as a shooter, especially as Bastion
meanspartan
Member
Except Starcraft 1v1 I say, it has it's problems but it is "good enough".
But anyway, ya, this game is also in that good enough range, it feels great, and it makes me nervous when they talk about nerfs lol.
Not as good as Zenyatta, dude probably has one of the highest DPS in the game after McCree and Reaper due to discord.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I remember people praising the original star craft as being one of the best balanced games. Now people never give blizzard a break.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
If people want healbots they should just say so instead of complaining about Zenyatta
I don't think Zen is completely terrible, like you say his offense is great, but he's not nearly as good of a straight healer as mercy or Lucio, that's all. He has amazing damage which is where he shines over them, but hes too frail to constantly be in enemy sights. He can kill flankers sure, but most of them will kill him first unless they're terrible.
He makes a great supplemental healer for sure though, especially if the other team is going for a tanky line up where you can shred them with discord. There's line ups where he works, but solo healer really isn't one of them.
Of course , some matches you hardly need a healer at all and he's fun as fuck there just using the orb to top people off and focusing on damage.
Also, mercy can give a damage boost too, not as good as discord obviously, but saying all she does is heal bot is flat out wrong. Damage boosted pharah, soldier76 and junkrat can be scary plus gimmick setups like with bastion.
1998 was a long time ago.
That's a poor argument, though. Yes, if Zen is in a bad position he will die quickly. That's reliant on player skill and positioning. Zen requires great positioning and awareness.
meanspartan
Member
Zen is one of those characters that seems so esoteric and makes me too intimidated to try him out lol. And yet I know the people who learn him will wreck other with him.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Having a high DPS isn't worth much when you're a gigantic glass canon.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
This cracked me up.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Never is a longer time too. And SC didn't come out balanced. It came about after years of iterations. To expect blizzard to hit a perfectly balanced game at or near release is unrealistic, and yet Overwatch is incredibly balanced already.
SC:BW is now one of the most finely balanced competitive games ever made, though?
This is also where McCree really shines, speaking of him. Zenyatta is by far the most vulnerable hero in the game to flankers, so McCree as stalwart Zenyatta protector is a gem.
How so? Zenyatta has to be in LoS to make use of his abilities and has no mobility options to get to clever positions. There's nothing special you can do with his positioning or skills, if you can use his damage skills, the enemy can damage you, theres no way around it, which brings us back to he has no mobility and is very frail. If he can't survive being in a position to deal the damage, why not just opt for better healing?
Ultimately it's all dependent on team comps. If you have a Reinhardt to hide behind and the other team isnt running flankers that can get around it, sure he's amazing, but the second you open yourself up to being damaged you're going to get dropped.
I guess my own argument would be that it's impossible to have good positioning on Zenyatta without being reliant on your team mates and the other teams picks. If you're in a position to use his abilities, you're in a position to get shot and there's nothing you can do about it because he has no mobility options.
Also, I was supposed to leave work like 20 mins ago, fucking Overwatch. I'm not even playing and I'm losing track of time.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
You could arguably say this about literally any character.
The problem is that Zen requires an inordinate amount of positioning and awareness relative to other healers. As a supplemental support he might be alright, but why would I ever pick him over someone like Mercy or Lucio?
Razzorn34
Member
Even more so when you only have 150 health.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
If you're a low mobility support character that gets dropped by a single sniper body-shot, that's a bad combination.
The Omega Man
Member
Then you should know how bad their nerfing has been sometimes, such a weird comment son
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