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PoliGAF 2012 Community Thread
- Thread starter AlteredBeast
- Start date
- Status
disappear for 6 months?
Manmademan
Member
Santorum, obviously. The typical GOP complaint after a loss is that their candidate simply wasn't conservative enough.
So, have them go balls out. nominate santorum. whip up the base, hold nothing back and THEN watch their candidate get annihilated by historic margins. MAYBE then the GOP will get the hint that embracing the craziness just might not be a great idea.
If it's romney, and he loses? they learn nothing.
Invisible_Insane
Member
I think we've got a little tunnel vision going here towards the top of the ticket--we should all be far more concerned about who ends up in control of the Senate. And the House, though I haven't seen much that would suggest it's likely to flip.
Aaron Strife
Banned
He could get his job at Bain Capital back and fire more workers.
Invisible_Insane
Member
You don't think the inevitable slide back to the center will win some of them back?
RustyNails
Member
Update Rombot firmware to 3.0?
Narpas Sword0
Member
Ban contraceptives?
the worse the top of the ticket is, and the better Obama performs, the better the down ticket candidates will perform.
The Librarian
Banned
What will Mitt change to slide back to the center?
PhoenixDark
Banned
But the far right doesn't even like Santorum, they just like him more than Romney. The people hate government, it shouldn't be surprising that they can't figure out who they want to run government. Whoever wins is going to have to deal with an activist base that will not support any compromise and thinks a president can magically wave a wand to get things done.
I think Romney could be a decent president in part because he has executive experience dealing with the opposing party. He's not an ideologue and will do whatever is politically expedient; if he became president, he'd have no choice but to work with democrats. The tea party wouldn't be happy about that at all, but what are they going to do?
If Romney loses we'll see an explosion of crazy on the right, but I'm not sure that automatically means the party will lurch further right. After Goldwater lost the party learned its lesson and nominated the best establishment person for the job (Nixon), who happened to appeal to both the establishment and the base. I think 2014 could be the end of the tea party if the economy is doing well, and 2016 will be about the GOP's impressive crop of governors. It'll be Christie's race to lose, both in the primary and the general election.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
I heard ICS is pretty amazing.
I think we're looking at this almost the same way, just one or two elections separate. I almost think if Romney loses they double down and get even crazier for the next elections and then lose in absolute landslides in everything, and then are forced to rethink everything. You think that that will happen already with a Santorum nom and loss in the GE. I'm not sure the collapse will be big enough, since they're only kind of half hearted with Santorum so far.
Basically I think if Romney loses they'll collapse and have to rethink things one or two elections down the road. If Santorum loses then I see them just going back to the party lines and to the establishment GOP. I suppose they'd still lose a ton after that if the crazies get disheartened at not getting listened to as much anymore. Either way, I think if the GOP loses they've got to change quickly.
It's half accurate, it just has nothing specifically to do with Pres. Obama.
I once drove down a freeway that was directly adjacent to a business that Pres. Bush visited. Traffic was snarled to a crawl, SS positioned on roofs on all adjacent buildings, bomb sniffing dogs, local swat eyc. and marine one with two other escort copters to bring him in and out.
All presidents cause logistics problems when they visit public places
Invisible_Insane
Member
I don't know that that's true in all cases. You've got a lot of retiree seats up in places where Democrats don't have much hope of winning (Baucus, someone else whose name escapes me), and some seats where I think think the Democrats might not have much of a shot even with a solid economy (McCaskill, Tester).
Do you doubt that he's capable of finding something?
I know that part's accurate. I was just laughing at the aside "(he thinks he is)" and the stuff about doing a speech about how great he is. That and it just sounds like the normal bullshit would get amplified because this specific president thinks of himself as more of a king ... or something.
They also want to further isolate UI so that they can attach onerous and stigmatizing qualifications and trim the maximum length by up to a third.
The payroll cut and UI benifits will have to be phased out at some point, but I would rather it happen in phases and so that people who lost their jobs prior to the changes still qualified for the established extensions.
Extend it through 2013, with automatic phase outs for the latter stage extensions as states meet specific unemployment thresholds.
It will be devestating if extended UI expires at the end of this month.
Byakuya769
Member
I don't believe the "slide to the center" actually exists in recent Presidential races.
And if it did, with the GOP the way it is now Mitt have to be pretty careful. The tea partiers are pretty loud and will call him out on any sliding he does.
The Librarian
Banned
I personally can't think of anything, which is why I asked you. What would he change?
Invisible_Insane
Member
Substantively? Probably nothing. But I think we can expect some moderation in tone, particularly with respect to foreign policy, because it's the one place where Obama is nearly unassailable from the right.
speculawyer
Member
I guess they realized how amazingly hypocritical it was. They never ask for tax-cuts to the rich to be offset . . . but when it came to tax-cuts for the poor, they suddenly had to be paid for.
Learn2read
Member
Mitt will find it extra hard (more so than any recent candidate) just by having to continually throw out read meat to the base just to keep them from openly revolting against him, let alone being his ground soldiers.
Mitt's most frequent talking point is that Obama went on an "apology tour" to other countries as soon as he was elected. Completely disprovable, but expect Mitt to debate his invented characterture of Obama.
speculawyer
Member
I wonder how big view will be though? There are certainly those on the left that think if they ran Ralph Nader instead of Gore or Kerry, that Nader would win . . . but that is a pretty tiny extremist view. I suspect the purest view on the right would be bigger.
Shut up? ;-)
I still think he can make a comeback if the economy craters and can somehow project an image of business guy that will take the reigns and make the USA successful. But it will require a bit of a economic melt-down. He won't be able to do it on campaign ads alone in the current economic situation. Right now, Mitt has been forced off his moderate message and has been pushed over to the right to fend off Newt & Santorum. He'll tack back to being a moderate once he clinches the nomination but that make take a while and it may end up with him spewing a lot of hard-right sound-bites that will eventually appear in general election ads. All the hard-right stuff also makes him into a super-flip-flopper since there is a lot of moderate/progressive Mitt tape from his campaigns in MA.
Tax cuts for the rich don't need to be offset, because the rich are job creators and their tax cuts will drive so much economic growth that tax revenues will go up and the cuts will pay for themselves. We should raise taxes on the poor so they have skin in the game and understand the consequences of the liberal policies they vote for. Tax cuts to the poor keeps them dependent on the government, raising it promotes self sufficiency!
The sad thing is that we are so far beyond the event horizon that this actually represents genuine positions held by some of those on the right and cannot even be satirized
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
I feel the same way and because of it I feel the democrats are in a good position for the next decade. The GOP seems to be at a major tipping point right now.
However, if you think about it, it may be the best time for them to re-format the party anyway. The Hispanic vote is going to be a HUGE portion of the vote over the next twenty years and the GOP is terrible at drawing in the Hispanic vote, aren't they? Keeping a major hardline position like they currently do is almost political suicide for the future.
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
holy crap i just found this damn thread thanks to the Obama OT. What happened? Why the move?
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Something about how the State of the Union took over the regular thread.
RustyNails
Member
Our punishment for eating up the SOTU in the regular poligaf discussion
AlteredBeast
Fork 'em, Sparky!
Check the florida debate/primary thread listed in the OT.
The funny thing is that I think a lot of Hispanics that currently trend with the dems would like a good deal of the GOP party platform if the base didn't try its damnedest to ostracize them. Even with all his stupidity even Perry knew it was a bad idea to keep attacking immigrants as a party message. If they don't get out of this rut soon they are doomed (eventually) to be the party of obscurity. It may not happen for 10-12 years, but its coming.
Frank the Great
Banned
mods don't like mega-threads anymore, apparently. would rather people make a new thread for every news item.
unless it's a sports thread, of course. then mega-threads are totally cool.
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
Well I haven't been following, but I wouldn't be shocked if the move hurts the community. But shame on you guys for not starting a SOTU thread.
Invisible_Insane
Member
Yeah, I'm mostly over being moved but the one thing I don't really understand is the arbitrariness of what goes where. It seems like a lot of threads that are always on the front page of the OT would make more sense on this side? WP7, Wrestling, Black Culture, Motorsports... and I think this thread would be a bit more live if all the threads were moved at once.
Oh, well.
1) As TA pointed out in the ad hoc SOTU thread, there apparently hadn't been one for several years.
2) SOTU quite reasonably falls under US Politics, no?
gutter_trash
Banned
Romney leads in Arizona
Santrorum leads in Michigan
Newt leads in Georgia
just wow! wow! wow!
Santrorum leads in Michigan
Newt leads in Georgia
just wow! wow! wow!
anything sports or technology, music, location based, hobby based, etc.
but just about everyone made it over, so no biggie.
I agree all around. I would like to see UI structured so that the extensions are automatic and not dependent on Congressional action, and the extended benefits phase out as unemployment nears 6% or so on a state by state basis.
GAF is a big place. If PoliGAF is such an insular group, it shouldn't fall on us to make every political thread. I'm fine with the current arrangement, but during an election cycle the benefits have been small, I think.
Invisible_Insane
Member
You some kinda technocrat or somethin'?
i think the phase out is a pretty good idea, although beginning a phase out of benefits at 6% is a little low? We are talking the extended benefits correct?
3. It's not incumbent on us to be sole creators of all political threads, anyone could have made one ahead of time.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Yeah, I like the idea but 6% does seem low. 7% seems the lowest I would go. With phasing starting at 8%.
maximum360
Member
What wouldn't be hypocritical is then placing all those sports threads in the community forum.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
I agree, but I'd set the phase out around 7.5%. I can't look at anything with an 8 for some reason and think it's okay. It's psychological I guess.
cooljeanius
Member
Yeah, I've been wondering when they're going to get around to that...
Mortrialus
Banned
What an asshole.
I read that they have until *2014* to override the veto, so there's still some slight glimmer of hope.
The Chosen One
Member
I definitely think presidential candidates can't easily tack back to the middle in today's modern political environment compared to the past.
In the past, there wasn't Youtube clips and bloggers that recorded every single statement a candidate made on the campaign trail. So a candidate could easily get away with telling a South Carolina crowd one thing and telling a Colorado crowd another. Also they didn't have a 24 hours news media micro-analyzing every single statement and inflection.
But now people aren't going to easily forget all the pandering Romney did for the far right because all those statements he made can easily be regurgitated by the media, opposing campaigns, and now Super Pacs. To make matters worse for Mittens, he already has a reputation has a serial flip-flopper, so a hard shift back to the middle will just re-enforce that image.
In the past, there wasn't Youtube clips and bloggers that recorded every single statement a candidate made on the campaign trail. So a candidate could easily get away with telling a South Carolina crowd one thing and telling a Colorado crowd another. Also they didn't have a 24 hours news media micro-analyzing every single statement and inflection.
But now people aren't going to easily forget all the pandering Romney did for the far right because all those statements he made can easily be regurgitated by the media, opposing campaigns, and now Super Pacs. To make matters worse for Mittens, he already has a reputation has a serial flip-flopper, so a hard shift back to the middle will just re-enforce that image.
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