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PoliGAF 2013 |OT1| Never mind, Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

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T

The Librarian

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
Because Obama wants a big deal, and extending this "cliff" would give him another shot at it.

I become more convinced everyday that Brooks is right about one thing: Obama doesn't seem to have any idealogical core. He has some principles about how he thinks things should be done, but in terms of domestic policy I see no aim to his actions outside of "pass big bills and talk to historians about my record/placement." Everything is a pragmatic battle to win at nearly any cost. Social security cuts, Medicare eligibility age raised? Sure, give me a victory.

He seems more like he's checking a box off on a sheet of paper here, with this box being his Reagan/Tip O'Neil moment. Get a big bipartisan deal that people wil fawn over for years, even if its a bad deal.
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I think you're better at fantasizing about relationship problems between him and Michelle.
 
mckmas8808

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
codhand said:
Stopping the government subsidy of milk would be nice, though I reckon a few people would be incredulous about six dollar gallons.
Click to expand...

It's one of those things that gov't does for people that is NEVER noticed. But once it goes away, most people will blame the gov't for the price increase yet still say that we need to cut gov't spending.



PhoenixDark said:
Because Obama wants a big deal, and extending this "cliff" would give him another shot at it.

I become more convinced everyday that Brooks is right about one thing: Obama doesn't seem to have any idealogical core. He has some principles about how he thinks things should be done, but in terms of domestic policy I see no aim to his actions outside of "pass big bills and talk to historians about my record/placement." Everything is a pragmatic battle to win at nearly any cost. Social security cuts, Medicare eligibility age raised? Sure, give me a victory.

He seems more like he's checking a box off on a sheet of paper here, with this box being his Reagan/Tip O'Neil moment. Get a big bipartisan deal that people wil fawn over for years, even if its a bad deal.
Click to expand...


I still don't understand why you believe that it's the WH that's pushing this half measure bill the hardest. I guess at the end of the day you could be right, but history says you won't be. It makes all the sense in the world polictically to look like you were working on a deal and then it didn't work at the last hour, than doing nothing at all and chilling in Hawaii as the nation falls off the cliff.

And policy wise it makes sense to wait it out. We all know this. And everybody in Congress knows this too. Along with the WH.
 
G

Gotchaye

Member
codhand said:
Stopping the government subsidy of milk would be nice, though I reckon a few people would be incredulous about six dollar gallons.
Click to expand...

It's not something I've paid much attention to, but my impression from watching Klein standing in for Maddow Wednesday night is that no bill doesn't mean that the government only stops subsidizing milk, but also that the government starts buying up milk at a fairly high price.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Let's make the fiscal cliff be another stupid thing like continuing resolutions where every six months or so congress just kicks it down the alley.
 
mckmas8808

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Gotchaye said:
It's not something I've paid much attention to, but my impression from watching Klein standing in for Maddow Wednesday night is that no bill doesn't mean that the government only stops subsidizing milk, but also that the government starts buying up milk at a fairly high price.
Click to expand...

Why is the gov't buying milk at all?
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
mckmas8808 said:
Why is the gov't buying milk at all?
Click to expand...

- Stabilizes prices and income for farmers/corporations.
- Government also buys milk for school lunch programs, right?
- Subsidy for farmers/corporations.

Most of the milk you drink nowadays comes from large agribusiness, but I think Americans still have a certain image of farmers that makes it difficult to shake these subsidies. At the same time, it does have the effect of stabilizing milk prices for consumers as well.
 
R

RDreamer

Member
Someone posted this on facebook:

0DzCr.jpg
Click to expand...


GAAAAH I just wanna punch things.
 
R

RDreamer

Member
CharlieDigital said:
I want to punch people who think that our federal budget works like their household budget.
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I've wanted to do that for a while, but now adding that other thing to it just pushes it so far over the top that I think I would literally punch someone physically in the neck if they tried to show me this and were sitting near enough to me. It's like the household budget analogy wasn't bad enough that now they had to throw the ceiling thing in there for good measure, just to make people's heads literally explode.
 
mckmas8808

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
CharlieDigital said:
- Stabilizes prices and income for farmers/corporations.
- Government also buys milk for school lunch programs, right?
- Subsidy for farmers/corporations.

Most of the milk you drink nowadays comes from large agribusiness, but I think Americans still have a certain image of farmers that makes it difficult to shake these subsidies. At the same time, it does have the effect of stabilizing milk prices for consumers as well.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the explanation. So why are the real milk prices going up so much now without this subsidy?
 
P

pigeon

Banned
mckmas8808 said:
Thanks for the explanation. So why are the real milk prices going up so much now without this subsidy?
Click to expand...

This is the opposite of the real problem. The government sets a price floor by buying food at a specified price. That price is about to go up sharply.
 
C

ClovingWestbrook

Banned
Obama instead is spelling out again a plan he says can pass the House and Senate, said the source, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was unauthorized to speak publicly about the private meeting.

Obama wants a bill to halt looming tax increases on all families making $250,000 a year or less and would extend unemployment insurance to many people about to lose it. His proposal would also cover other issues as the Jan. 1 deadline nears.

If he does not get a counter proposal that can pass both chambers, Obama will press for a straight up-or-down vote on his idea, the source said.
Click to expand...

###
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
ClovingWestbrook said:
Filibuster reform offer from McCain and Carl Levin.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/PDF/McCain-Levin%20filibuster%20reform.pdf
Click to expand...

I like the no filibustering on motions to proceed, but I don't see anything about reinstating a talking filibuster and that I cannot abide. People deserve to know which asshat is holding up a bill and why.

ClovingWestbrook said:
Meeting over. Boehner not going back to the Capital.
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I for one am shocked. Over the cliff we go.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
ClovingWestbrook said:
Filibuster reform offer from McCain and Carl Levin.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/PDF/McCain-Levin%20filibuster%20reform.pdf
Click to expand...

This is a non-offer. Basically, if you already have sixty votes, it won't take as long to pass stuff with those votes.

Fake edit: okay, the biggest changes are in the comity changes -- no silent holds, and requiring filibusterers to continue debate or allow a vote on the question. I need a parliamentary refresher, but that part might at least accomplish the goal of requiring Senators to get on their hind legs and actively prevent progress.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
pigeon said:
This is a non-offer. Basically, if you already have sixty votes, it won't take as long to pass stuff with those votes.

Fake edit: okay, the biggest changes are in the comity changes -- no silent holds, and requiring filibusterers to continue debate or allow a vote on the question. I need a parliamentary refresher, but that part might at least accomplish the goal of requiring Senators to get on their hind legs and actively prevent progress.
Click to expand...

I think they just can't filibuster the debate of a bill anymore, I'm not sure if they have to get up and actually do it though. It doesn't look like it though.
 
B

Black Mamba

Member
At the end of the day, I wouldn't be surprised if all that happens is a tax cuts for under $250k (or $400k) and nothing else while the spending cuts are simply removed or delayed.

And I mean this next month.

GOP won't vote to allow taxes to increase so we can't get anywhere til January 1st. GOP has no intention to cut spending majorly, so don't expect any grand bargain just bullshit.
 
C

Crisco

Banned
That's exactly what he said he was going to do. I like that he's gone back to the $250k threshold. All the pressure is on the GOP to pass something so they don't look crazy.
 
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