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PoliGAF 2014 |OT| Kay Hagan and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad News
- Thread starter bananas
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did anyone make a good Terrell Davis joke wrt yet
haha yeah. I was watching the game with some friends and as soon as they switched from English the first time (to Spanish I think?) I said "Well Fox News should be interesting tomorrow."
Also, one of the languages was a Native American dialect of the Pueblo, which makes the outrage over not speaking "American" even more hillarious.
PhoenixDark
Banned
I enjoy Coates but I must say I'm disappointed that he has seemingly joined the chorus of black commentators who criticize the president for discussing personal accountability. Obama has never been a Booker T type politician who admonishes blacks for not doing better, however he has used his position as the First Black President to say some things that need to be said, in my opinion. But like everything Obama says, there's an "and" or "however" tied to it. He tends to say things like "black fathers need to raise their children, however we must also recognize the structural obstacles that separate black families, including drug laws that disproportionately effect black and Latino men more." Yet even that type of thoughtful, balanced approach is met with scorn from Tavis Smiley types.
I think part of this has to do with the issue of Obama being relatively new on the scene, and how some civil rights leaders view him as some entitled inexperienced elite who never dealt with "the struggle." That dogged him in his first major election against Bobby Rush, and it was the underlining theme of Jesse Jackson Jr's castration comment back in 2008. Yet even as president, there are many black leaders who demand Obama do things he cannot do - like specific economic programs that mainly help blacks - and because of this, he is attacked as turning his back on blacks.
While I wouldn't equate Coates to Cornell West and others, I was indeed surprised that he fell into a similar vein of criticism with respect to Obama's tone.
Everyone here knows I'm hard on Obama, and in many ways I dislike him. However I will admit I do feel a sense of pride that I've never felt about another president, often focused on little things. The way he debates, his calm, reading his thoughts (that piece in The New Yorker is great, although Obama's comments on NSA/drones definitely gave me pause). A lot of this makes my frustration with him larger than it would be with a President Edwards or Clinton. I feel like he had a great opportunity and blew it.
Although I was probably the most vocal proponent of the establishment's importance during the 2012 cycle, the establishment is not an omnipotent, singular entity. It is not static. It is prone to fracture and indecision under certain circumstances. And if the reports of internecine conflict within the GOP are true, this might be a cycle where the establishment fails to coalesce behind a candidate. At this point, I see no reason to expect the establishment to favor Walker over Rubio or other candidates.
A key distinction often obscured by pseudoscience and hysteria. There are fair questions about the regulation of GMOs, but evidence of adverse health effects is decidedly lacking. And as for original charge that the left also falls prey to pseudoscience, no doubt. Tom Harkin was the champion of the NCCAM. But their anti-scientific sins are typically less egregious than those of conservatives.
No, no, no x infiniti. If you need one example just look at the fat hysteria that swept over every nightly news station years ago or look at the saturated fat wikipedia page. I'm not even saying GMOs are a problem. I don't even eat organic, but you have a rosy picture of how science progresses. Maybe something unrelated (not from me) like cancer research can help you see how wild it can get.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0lMrp_ySg8
The point is that people are in pain and do not have clear answers for it, so when you have someone who has an illness or affliction or is in fear for their health with no way out they have to find their own answer whether it turns out to be illogical or not. There's probably a decent overlap between the vaccine and GMO people but you could skip a vaccine and die from it. Non-GMO food is a relatively low risk choice that amounts to a price hike.
zero shift
Banned
This is confusing. Now you use an example of saturated fats in which many studies claimed was bad for you (some still do) and how that turned out to be false. The problem is that there was always controversy between scientists over how bad saturated fat is, I mean hell look at the debates between healthy eating and weight loss today with the war on calories, carbs, sugar, fat, and really anything as being the main culprit. GMOs never suffered from any sort of contrary claims of it not having long or short term health effects.
In terms of the vaccine debate, the argument is that more people will get sick and die from taking vaccines than if they wouldn't have. So in the mind of an anti-vaccinator it isn't low risk.
The last big anti-science thing the left has done was...nuclear power. And today we all know that has phased out. There is also the whole natural gas argument but I will admit I am not knowledgeable about it at all.
So we agree that there's really no consensus.
Lets revisit something you said here.
zero shift said:
You have much to learn padawan.
Richard Feynman said:
Don't make me bomb the thread with examples of theories "proved" where nobody objected to scientific consensus.
PhoenixDark
Banned
zero shift
Banned
Not familiar with how Michigan is doing. How true is that ad? Has he been helping Michigan at all?
PhoenixDark
Banned
There's no question the economy is improving, however we're still at 9% unemployment despite a series of tax cuts meant to create jobs. Some parts of the state are booming, economically, thanks to the resurgence of manufacturing in the state. Unfortunately Detroit is still a mess.
Snyder has instituted staggering education cuts and has presided over a siphoning of Detroit taxes being sent to white republican suburbs. He has destroyed teacher and other state employee's pensions. So yea...far from stellar, hence his approval ratings.
Are you kidding? If anything, liberals have been too focused on being above the fray. Look at the shit that went down with that MSNBC tweet. It's time the left started playing dirty as well. Right-wingers have no problem doing this sort of thing, so why should we?
speculawyer
Member
The problem with this view is that it is just not true in the USA. Although there are people on the left who are into organic stuff . . . those are just people.
The left in the USA as it is represented by elected politicians doesn't take such a view. That may be true outside the USA but not here.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Another fascinating article on the ACA in Kentucky, specifically Medicaid in small rural towns.
I'd imagine most of the people mentioned in this article are republicans. They're probably for less government, but it's worth remembering that not long ago the south was the biggest entitlement bloc in the country; they specifically sent their politicians (like a young LBJ) to Washington to secure pork barrel spending projects, which meant jobs. That changed once government spending became equated with helping blacks, of course, but the point remains that the south is not nearly as ideologically opposed to government spending as advertised (historically).
These are people who are probably fiercely pro-life, don't like gay marriage, and don't like immigration. But will a life-or-death issue like healthcare have an impact on their voting decisions this year? I don't know, but I hope so.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...ad1-11e3-916e-e01534b1e132_story.html?hpid=z1
I'd imagine most of the people mentioned in this article are republicans. They're probably for less government, but it's worth remembering that not long ago the south was the biggest entitlement bloc in the country; they specifically sent their politicians (like a young LBJ) to Washington to secure pork barrel spending projects, which meant jobs. That changed once government spending became equated with helping blacks, of course, but the point remains that the south is not nearly as ideologically opposed to government spending as advertised (historically).
These are people who are probably fiercely pro-life, don't like gay marriage, and don't like immigration. But will a life-or-death issue like healthcare have an impact on their voting decisions this year? I don't know, but I hope so.
You misunderstand, though I didn't give you the full context. When I grew up sentiments like that were mainstream. Now, I laugh at them knowing they're becoming more and more irrelevant. Yeah they'll always be there but I love that they're so clearly making fools of themselves.
I read the image and laughed, nothing more. You see quite worked up on the other hand. I suggest relaxing a bit.
Of course it won't "solve" racism, whatever that means. But racists should absolutely be outed and shamed. Putting their disgusting language on blast for millions to read on the internet will make them think twice before they publicly display racism again, and will hopefully make them reconsider their opinions on race. Being a backward, racist shitlord has consequences in the 21st century. Letting that shit slide and ignoring the problem does nothing but enable racists.
Agreed. I can't tell you how much racist that expose their thoughts on twitter or facebook then proceed to delete their online identity. Twitter, facebook, linkedin, etc all get deleted as they don't want their employer to find out their racist thoughts.
It's at least partly my fault, though. Some of what you describe is very much out there, and I didn't exactly give you much context. The full extent of what happened today was: that ad aired and my wife commented that some people were going to go nuts that it wasn't all in English. We had a brief laugh. I hop onto GAF and bam, there it is. It's sad and predictable and at this point kinda hilarious, IMO. But not worth paying attention to any more than youtube comments.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Honestly when I saw the Cheerios commercial it never occurred to me that it would be controversial; if anything I thought certain types of black people might be upset about it.
But the minute I saw that Coke ad with the national anthem being sung in different languages I knew people would explode. I agree some liberals take "glee" in this stuff as validation - like a pat on the back that tells them they're superior to the vast horde. But I don't believe Ghal or most GAFers do that stuff. I think part of the interest in watching the schadenfreude is the satisfaction that the rest of America is watching it too, is getting a good look at ugly, and disagrees with it alongside you. Nothing wrong with that.
#SpeakAmerican is trending on twitter right this moment. A good deal of the tweets are making fun or criticizing the nonsense, but you don't have to dig hard to see very serious tweets from people who aren't using that hashtag ironically. I won't lie, I'm entertained when I see that ignorance in the spotlight because I like to believe most Americans find it to be ignorant as well. So my satisfaction isn't me patting myself on the back in smug self fulfillment, it's me being thankful that most people reject outright bigotry when they get an unfiltered glimpse at it.
"I don't believe in safety nets," he continued. "Obviously, we've got to have some kind of safety nets."
"I don't believe in safety nets," he continued. "Obviously, we've got to have some kind of safety nets."
"I don't believe in safety nets," he continued. "Obviously, we've got to have some kind of safety nets."
"I don't believe in safety nets," he continued. "Obviously, we've got to have some kind of safety nets."
"I don't believe in safety nets," he continued. "Obviously, we've got to have some kind of safety nets."
Again, it's crazy that it's this close
Did weed get legalized in Florida when no one was looking? The only way that margin makes sense is if 38% of the state is stoned out of their minds. How can 38% of that state support a guy who is 1, not 2 but 1, step away from becoming a Bond villain!
RustyNails
Member
That tweet from hilldabeast is brilliant. Just rile up the mouthbreathers a little bit over a nonscandal. I hope she drives them insane in 2016.
empty vessel
Member
I have a different take on this than others, which is not that xenophobia is getting better, but that it has gotten a lot worse. And that it is incumbent upon those of us who are opposed to this kind of hatred to speak out lest that movement continue to grow until it snowballs into something truly nasty.
Arguably, it is just the spread of social media that makes it appear as though xenophobia and racism are on the rise. Any idiot with hands can now blast his stupid opinion to millions of others. But I don't think that's the case, or rather it's only part of the story. I think the best way to measure this is through what right-wing politicians say to appeal to people, and if you compare how Republicans talk today with how they talked, say, in the 1980s, then I think the increased organization and political power of the xenophobic right is rather apparent. Danger lurks there, and in my opinion it is imperative to be vigilant against it. So I do care what idiots say on the internet. And while that may not include an "official" Fox account (for now), it does include Fox News hosts Todd Starnes and Allen West (former congressman to boot). And no doubt others in high positions who have been cultivated and organizing the rise of this xenophobic movement.
Avon Barksdale
Member
Florida.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
My own take is that xenophobia is hypothetically lower than in the past due to the public being connected to and exposed to a lot more of the world in the social media era. However, racists, the uneducated, and cranks are also a lot more inflamed due to the same exposure and their activities are on the rise in public.
The danger is that the cranks may sway more people who are in the middle and simply never though about such things. Particularly if the otherwise unengaged middle is also uninformed - hate mongers take advantage of ignorance. On the other hand, the fact that xenophobes are far more vocal and visible today does "blow the their cover" for a lot of people who would be against those attitudes but never realized it was such a problem. I have met a lot of Americans who, until the last decade or so, honestly though America was "over" so many of its historical issues. They've been shocked at how many other Americans have played their cards and been revealed as members of the Know Nothing 2000 party. Facebook in particular has been pretty effective at "outing" the hidden racist demagogue in the closet.
LaserBuddha
Member
What would you guys say to someone who claims social security is a Ponzi scheme?
I've talked with someone I know who has the whole conservative "government works like a business" view. The government isn't going to go out of business and have no way of dealing with SS shortfalls, so the threat that would make it a "scheme" isn't there in my view.
I have a hard time making a convincing case though.
I've talked with someone I know who has the whole conservative "government works like a business" view. The government isn't going to go out of business and have no way of dealing with SS shortfalls, so the threat that would make it a "scheme" isn't there in my view.
I have a hard time making a convincing case though.
I was barely paying attention to any of the super bowl ads last night... But, I am not surprised that Coke commercial riled up the idiots on twitter. Give an idiot a public outlet, an idiot will prove themselves to be an idiot.
Edit: OH GOD. Apparently there was GAY couple in the ad, also. Poor Coke. Gonna get shat on for running a decent commercial about the diversity in America.
Edit: OH GOD. Apparently there was GAY couple in the ad, also. Poor Coke. Gonna get shat on for running a decent commercial about the diversity in America.
Avon Barksdale
Member
I saw some white lady on Twitter said that Obama was a "nigger on a power trip" then she went on to say she wasn't racist and never uses the n-word...except when she just said it. LOL.
She's a stay-at-home mother who's a Sunday School teacher at her local church in Southern Ohio
As a black man, I found the whole thing comical.
She's a stay-at-home mother who's a Sunday School teacher at her local church in Southern Ohio
As a black man, I found the whole thing comical.
WayneMorse
Banned
I hope Hilldawg realizes that bipartisanship is just a naive dream when she's back in the White House because if you think the hate for Obama is bad you ain't seen nothing yet.
I mean, if her husband sold out to the right on the majority of issues and the GOP still hated him with such a passion that they would impeach him for nothing, I can't even comprehend what would happen if Hillary attempts to pass progressive policy.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
I too agree that its getting worse. I just spoke to someone today who went on an epic rant about white people 'losing the country' which is what I think is driving the reaction today. There is a palpable fear that 'white people' won't have exclusive control of the country. They now have to listen to Latino voices, Black Voices, Asian voices, Middle Eastern Voices, etc. Before they were just background noise but now they have power.
Before immigration was someone controllable and manageable for the xenophobic (I don't think racism is the right word)
I think a lot of it is also because of horrible economic policy has come down hard on rural and disaffected poor whites who are justifiably angry though they direct their anger at a minority which isn't the cause of their problem and this scapegoating is used cynically by politicians to enact policies which are even worse for them, only further strengthening their disdain for others.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Edit. ****Ban talk deleted*****
Aaron Strife
Banned
Rasmussen has Kentucky Senate tied 42-42
hahahahahahhahahhahhahah
hahahahahahhahahhahhahah
WayneMorse
Banned
It isn't a uniquely American issue either, fascist parties are gaining prominence in Europe as well. People in Europe are terrified of Muslims and it's really pathetic because issues like mass immigration and welfare fraud are used by the bourgeoisie to distract people from the real problems in their lives.
platypotamus
Member
To be fair, regardless of their reasons for doing so, the more people boycotting that awful company, the better.
I can think of more well thought out, logical reasons for boycotting Coke than to say "OMG THERE WERE NON WHITE PEOPLE IN OUR AMERICAN COMPANY COMMERCIAL. PANIC, PANIC, PANIC, DANGER, DANGER, DANGER."
platypotamus
Member
100% agreed, I've been boycotting them for years now.
I am suddenly experiencing deja vu...
GOP Takes Debt Limit Hostage But Struggles To Come Up With A Ransom
GOP Takes Debt Limit Hostage But Struggles To Come Up With A Ransom
Senators: Kerry Admits Obama's Syria Policy Is Failing (Josh Rogin, Daily Beast)
Two of the hawkiest senators are jumping straight to the shipping of armaments, but Kerry is apparently thankfully being more prudent in his tact. The policy may be failing to end the Syrian War, but it's nonetheless spared the US from wading into the morass, bled AQ mightily, and (in part) driven Tehran to negotiation over sanctions and the scope of its nuclear program. Not only may an altered Syrian stance affect the US at the primary point of contact, it could embitter Iranian elements still wedded to Syria. Delicate balancing act, and the correct move may be a tough one to swallow: continue to bide time.
Two of the hawkiest senators are jumping straight to the shipping of armaments, but Kerry is apparently thankfully being more prudent in his tact. The policy may be failing to end the Syrian War, but it's nonetheless spared the US from wading into the morass, bled AQ mightily, and (in part) driven Tehran to negotiation over sanctions and the scope of its nuclear program. Not only may an altered Syrian stance affect the US at the primary point of contact, it could embitter Iranian elements still wedded to Syria. Delicate balancing act, and the correct move may be a tough one to swallow: continue to bide time.
Avon Barksdale
Member
At 1:30 in the afternoon?
It officially opens the legislative session.
Also, fewer people pay attention to the crazy things she'll propose, which is politically advantageous.
Highlights (really, lowlights) of the speech:
.25% tax cut that would reduce the state's funds by $100 million/year
Doubled down on rejection of state funds to expand Medicare (200,000 Oklahomans would be covered if it was expanded)
The reason our state's revenue is down is because of sequestration, government shutdown, and Obamacare (not the tax cuts she's passed the last couple of years)
$50 million increase in general education funding, offset by 5% cuts in funding to other agencies (and this is in addition to the huge cuts in funding most agencies have seen since 2008)
$49 million cut to higher education funding, resulting in a total $482k cut to education. Our education has already been cut by more than 20% since 2008.
Elimination of Oklahoma public employee pension fund in favor of 401(k) style system.
Bond issues funded by increased property taxes to renovate schools for tornado shelters
They have to do it when the wind comes sweeping down the plain, as per the state constitution.
Does the wind smell of shit because I am sure a lot will be spewing.
Always blows my mind in this FB group I hang out in on FB and all the crazy batshit conservatives like to make a big deal about mass immigration using intellectual language.. and I'm like how fucking privileged do you have to be if "refugees coming by boat" are a big issue to you.
And it's always justified under "But look what's happening to Sweden! we can't let too many immigrants in" argh.
Climate cover up, collusion and conflict of interest alleged in Keystone XL report release (Matthew Millar, Jenny Uechi, Vancouver Observer)
Mud everywhere with a side of "didn't read lol".
Mud everywhere with a side of "didn't read lol".
platypotamus
Member
Oh well done
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