I donated $50 to Sanders when he announced.
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PoliGAF 2015 |OT2| Pls print
- Thread starter ivysaur12
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Sorry for your loss.
I feel like my money went a long way. He broke 10% and Hillary took a lot of his positions.
brainchild
Banned
I don't remember any snarky remarks from anyone here when people felt compelled to donate to Hillary's campaign and share that information with us.
It's fine that you believe that Bernie won't win (most of us would agree with you), but donating to his campaign is still for a good cause and there is nothing pitiable about it.
It's post like yours that make me think that dissenting remarks about comments relating to Bernie have less to do with pragmatism and more to do with seizing yet another opportunity to deride a Bernie supporter. I really wish it would stop.
It doesn't take long before 34 degrees is hot.
I'm not deriding Bernie's supporters, just Bernie.
I respect the man, obviously, but his campaign is just getting on my nerves. I'm not in any way insulting you personally. I just hope you realize when he doesn't win the primary that it isn't a good reason to stay home. When I say "you" I mean Bernie supporters in general.
You have quite a valid point.
brainchild
Banned
It just seemed like a back-handed way to say that he made a bad 'investment'. Again, it's fine if you believe that; I'm just not exactly sure it's an appropriate thing to say to a person who seems content with their decision.
But whatevs, I just think Bernie supporters deserve a little more respect around these parts.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
I thought it was a pretty funny joke. You need to relax and enjoy the humor in politics.
brainchild
Banned
I don't enjoy one-sided humor, sorry. Similarly, I think white comedians should be able to joke about black people just as much as black comedians joke about white people.
We always poke and make fun of the losing candidates both parties. It's part of the fun of the sports like element of politics. Mocking the failure of Bernie and the likes of Jeb. It's all in good fun.
I am sure there will be plenty of jokes pointing to the crazy salty reactions to Bernie supporters online when he concedes.
Many did the same with Romney after the 2012 general.
Unlike sports I've found myself on the winning team the last two times Obama '08 Hillary '16!
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/562a3e3ee4b0ec0a389418ec
Hillary has stopped taking their contributions it seems. Personally very happy about that.
Hillary has stopped taking their contributions it seems. Personally very happy about that.
brainchild
Banned
But this wasn't just a joke about Bernie failing, it was about Bernie's failure resulting in a net loss for his supporter. I could make the same joke about people unnecessarily wasting their money by donating to Hillary's campaign even though she'll have more money than she'll ever need with her enormous super PACs. The point is, I wouldn't make the joke because it's not funny, and kind of a douchey thing to say to the person that donated the money.
Anyway, this isn't really a big deal, but I definitely wasn't a fan of that remark.
FloydtheFathead
Member
But but Corporate shill??
I was a dumb teenager not yet old enough to vote! And he was a NBA player!
I did support actively for Dean though in 2004 and I was old enough to vote then so that hurts my credibility a bit.
I still love Bill Bradley though. Fantastic liberal senator for two decades and two time NBA champ and all-star.
brainchild
Banned
Much respect to Hillary for this. Seriously.
Manmademan
Member
Those things were already on their way out. not much of a stand to make, honestly.
RastaMentality
Banned
Are they really? I've only ever seen that they may be becoming more prevalent. Nothing substantial, though.
brainchild
Banned
I still think it's a step in the right direction for Hillary. The more special interest groups she removes from her sphere of influence, the more I respect her and trust that she will be more earnest in pushing the policies and decisions she claims to support.
He couldn't. Black people are about 13% of the population, and a huge chunk of the majority hates them. Like a couple people have already pointed out, he could only make veiled references. Now women are a bit over half the population, and they are more likely to vote than men. Hillary can appeal to them directly.
Please note that voting for Obama because he is black or Hillary because she is a woman is completely legit. Representative democracy is done by electing people who represent you. As groups who are marginalized through racism and sexism, the push to get members of their groups elected to government offices has always been an important part of their respective movements. So yeah, she's making that case, because it's a damn important one.
Oh shit is Jeb going to drop out?
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/jeb-bush-hunkers-down-with-family-to-assess-where-his-candidacy-stands/
brainchild
Banned
I'm sorry but you're gonna need to do more than having the same skin color or genitalia as me to represent me. A black candidate doesn't inherently have black people's best interests in mind. A female candidate doesn't inherently have women's best interests in mind.
If you want to show me that you represent me, show me what you've done for me or will do for me, then you have my attention.
Not necessary but when it comes to Hillary I don't think anyone can deny she isn't consistently rock solid when it comes to feminist, womens rights, and womens healths issues.
That's the impression that I get.
Manmademan
Member
yep. they've been in decline for a few years now. the population explosion triggered by legislation passed in the 90s is definitively over, and prison populations are trending down, not up.
on top of that, private prisons marketed themselves as cost reduction and its become obvious to everyone that they don't save any money, AND have horrific problems with oversight, standards, etc. CCA and similar have lost several very, very large contracts recently. you'll see them pretty much become extinct in a decade or two no matter what hillary says. And I like hillary.
shinra-bansho
Member
Hmm, it would be a pretty big upset if Jeb! didn't even make it to the primary voting.
Regarding the potential for a bump from her Benghazi appearance, this post on the TPM editor's blog:
Rubio would probably pass out from dehydration. And Ben Carson can barely string together coherent sentences half the time.
Basically she showed she could actually perform the actual job of POTUS. Something that I don't think any other candidate on either side has really done.
Regarding the potential for a bump from her Benghazi appearance, this post on the TPM editor's blog:
I think sums up well why the sentiment among the GOP is now "I've made a huge mistake" regarding these hearings. They basically gave her an 11-hour ad yesterday to show her competence and poise, she made her Republican questioners look like fools, and showed why she'd be head and shoulders above any of the GOP field when it comes to handling the pressure of the top job.
Rubio would probably pass out from dehydration. And Ben Carson can barely string together coherent sentences half the time.
Basically she showed she could actually perform the actual job of POTUS. Something that I don't think any other candidate on either side has really done.
I doubt it. My money is on the Bush clan coming together to call in any chits they have left to their donors and chart Bush's brute force approach to the primary.
Watch Jeb! Make a liar out of me.
Retromelon
Member
Has there ever been a single time a campaign hunkers down with their family to assess the future of their campaign and didn't drop out?
User 463088
Banned
If you get a chance, try and listen to one of Hillary's stump speeches. She has a great line in there. It's something along the lines of "I don't want people to vote for me because I'm a woman. I want them to vote for me based on my merits. And I think one of my merits is that I'm a woman."
In 2008, she ran so hard from the "First Woman President" narrative. I found it annoying. I'm glad she's embraced it a bit.
Manmademan
Member
Jeb! has a very serious money problem- he has the largest ground operation of anyone running and that shit doesn't come cheap.
unfortunately it's doing jack fucking shit for him. nothing. nada. bupkiss. It's just draining money that's increasingly not coming in. And trying to restart a ground campaign that you were forced to shut down is very difficult.
he might be forced to drop out because he expanded far too wide far too quickly.
brainchild
Banned
I never argued otherwise. I'm just saying, pushing the gender or race cards as exemplary reasons for authentic representation is just silly. It's inconsequential and what really matters is what the candidate stands for.
In the case of Hillary, I believe she'll fight hard for women's rights, but I'm not convinced of that notion because she's a woman, rather, I've seen her voting record and policy agendas and they make the case for her without her ever needing to point out that she's a woman.
I thought they had pills for that. (Da bum tissh)
Manmademan
Member
you realize that the vast majority of voters don't look at voting records, don't look at policy agendas, and need to be beaten over the head with the obvious?
Maybe to you. But you have to realize that not everyone is as engaged as you and there will undoubtably be numerous voters who will vote for her because she is a woman. Most people voting in these elections aren't going to examine past and future policy proposals in detail. You need to take a step back and remember that George W's big appeal was that he was a guy you could have a beer with.
brainchild
Banned
I prefer her 2008 approach, tbh. She shouldn't have much of a problem this time anyway with no one on the Democratic side coming after her.
RustyNails
Member
My thoughts too. There will be all sorts of hacks at that meeting and I'm sure they will give Jeb a million solutions. I highly doubt Jeb drops out. Lot of money still on him, and there's always the talk of Trump about to collapse but so far Trump keeps collapsing upwards.
She would have won with her 2008 campaign without Obama, and could have still won 2012 with it. But this one is way way better.
The public is not going to fall in line behind candidates based on voting records or policy agendas. People don't care about that stuff. Bernie Sanders would do a lot better if that was only what politics was about that. But personality, reliability and the like remain just as important.
You know, the craziest thing about the Benghazi Witch Project was that Gowdy and his idiot colleagues seemed legitimately shocked that they fucked up so bad. I mean, really? You goons had no organization, no coordination, no actual fucking points to any of the shit that you brought up, including the "new" evidence, which in many cases wasn't new at all, but rather re-packaged to appear new. And yet you goobers are shocked that you weren't able to get Hillary to confess that she ordered the hit on Ambassador Stevens?
This reminds of that other wonderful moment in politics where Diamond Joe went up against the golden Boy of the GOP during the debates. After having his balls washed by not just Republicans, but mainstream pundits and commentators as well, for being the premiere "serious thinker" of the Republican party, Paul Ryan really did seem to fool himself into thinking that he was in fact the teenage prodigy that everyone held him up to be. And so the boy genius went into the debates thinking that he would easily make short work of the buffanooish Vice President, only to realize that while speaking in complete sentences might have qualified him to be considered "gifted" among Republicans, it would do him no favors against anyone outside that sphere. He learned that while he could brag about being the tallest midget, at the end of the day, he was still a midget.
And I feel that that's what happened during the lead up to the hearing yesterday. Republicans (once again) fooled themselves into thinking that the reason they hadn't caught Hillary was not because they didn't have squat on her, but because Darrel Issa was doing an incompetent job investigating her. So this Trey Gowdy jackass comes onto the scene and Republicans and the mainstream media start praising him as the "serious" and "competent" prosecutor with years of experience who would be able to succeed where Issa failed. Just like with Ryan, Gowdy probably let this newfound laudation go to his head, and probably figured he'd have Hillary in handcuffs before lunchtime.
Of course, also like Ryan, Gowdy failed to realize that a flat earther with a PhD in geology, is still, in fact a flat-earther.
This reminds of that other wonderful moment in politics where Diamond Joe went up against the golden Boy of the GOP during the debates. After having his balls washed by not just Republicans, but mainstream pundits and commentators as well, for being the premiere "serious thinker" of the Republican party, Paul Ryan really did seem to fool himself into thinking that he was in fact the teenage prodigy that everyone held him up to be. And so the boy genius went into the debates thinking that he would easily make short work of the buffanooish Vice President, only to realize that while speaking in complete sentences might have qualified him to be considered "gifted" among Republicans, it would do him no favors against anyone outside that sphere. He learned that while he could brag about being the tallest midget, at the end of the day, he was still a midget.
And I feel that that's what happened during the lead up to the hearing yesterday. Republicans (once again) fooled themselves into thinking that the reason they hadn't caught Hillary was not because they didn't have squat on her, but because Darrel Issa was doing an incompetent job investigating her. So this Trey Gowdy jackass comes onto the scene and Republicans and the mainstream media start praising him as the "serious" and "competent" prosecutor with years of experience who would be able to succeed where Issa failed. Just like with Ryan, Gowdy probably let this newfound laudation go to his head, and probably figured he'd have Hillary in handcuffs before lunchtime.
Of course, also like Ryan, Gowdy failed to realize that a flat earther with a PhD in geology, is still, in fact a flat-earther.
I was saying after the debate that Clinton was strategically calling attention to her gender in this way that you're sort of objecting to. I mean, obviously Clinton isn't saying that women should just vote for the woman. Everyone who would be at all receptive to the idea that her gender matters understands that a female candidate could be a poor representative for women - just look at Carly Fiorina! You don't see black people getting nearly as excited about Ben Carson as they were about Obama, but Obama being black was certainly a big part of why they were excited about him.
It's Hillary Clinton, after all. Yeah, in the general case you want to stress that a candidate should have a record of doing the right thing or should at least be talking about doing the right thing, but everyone knows she's done all that. It's not remotely plausible that Hillary Clinton isn't primarily running on her record and her plans.
This is a trap. Aimed at Fox more than Sanders, sure, but you're sort of falling for it. It is obvious to basically everyone who might be persuaded to support Clinton that she doesn't mean this surface-level interpretation of what she said, but it's a really tempting interpretation for people who don't like Clinton because it fits neatly into this liberal identity politics narrative.
brainchild
Banned
I agree with you guys, but with people operating from such ignorance, you don't even need to tell them to vote for her because she's a woman. If that's important to them, they'll do it anyway. My argument isn't that being a woman or being black has no effect, it's that telling people what they can so very obviously see has very little effect compared to if it was never mentioned at all.
And personally, I think we need to rectify this kind of ignorance in our country. More people need to be politically engaged. We shouldn't be complacent when that kind of ignorance has such a strong influence on the future of our country.
I vote for mandatory politic courses and certification before you're allowed to vote.
The Bush clan is just staging an intervention.
George W.: "You know you fucked up, right Jeb?"
There's more to it than that. My mother-in-law grew up in Jim Crow Mississippi, joined in the protests and sit-ins and registered people to vote. She had to hide from the Klan in the cotton fields. And in 2008 she finally got a chance to vote for a black President. That was the attainment of a long awaited goal. Representation is very important, and for white dudes who have always had it, it's easy to overlook how it must feel for those who never have.
And we still haven't elected a woman President yet, when so many other developed nations (and quite a few less developed ones) have. Women deserve to know that yes, that office can be attained, and it's a critical benchmark. Until that step is taken, the importance of taking that step can't be dismissed.
George W.: "You know you fucked up, right Jeb?"
There's more to it than that. My mother-in-law grew up in Jim Crow Mississippi, joined in the protests and sit-ins and registered people to vote. She had to hide from the Klan in the cotton fields. And in 2008 she finally got a chance to vote for a black President. That was the attainment of a long awaited goal. Representation is very important, and for white dudes who have always had it, it's easy to overlook how it must feel for those who never have.
And we still haven't elected a woman President yet, when so many other developed nations (and quite a few less developed ones) have. Women deserve to know that yes, that office can be attained, and it's a critical benchmark. Until that step is taken, the importance of taking that step can't be dismissed.
Bad plan. You're giving test writers (e.g. the ruling party) the power to choose successor governments.
brainchild
Banned
I'm sure we could find a way to ensure that the tests would be unbiased and fair. This is a non-issue.
There's no way Jeb¡ drops out until after the SEC primary at the earliest.
The thing to watch is if Cruz's organization in the southern states translates into wins.
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