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PoliGAF 2016 |OT9| The Wrath of Khan!
- Thread starter B-Dubs
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Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
Richard Nixon paving the way for Neocons and trickle-downers happened to the War on Poverty.
Also, isn't making poverty more livable, even if you don't eliminate it, also a laudable goal?
Edit: oh, Kristoffer. You changed avatars. Wouldn't have taken the bait if I'd seen that.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Besides a single department, I can't think of any. I have been fooled by conservatives again. Myths are persistent.
User 463088
Banned
Donald J. Trump ‏@realDonaldTrump 5m5 minutes ago
.@dbongino You were fantastic in defending both the Second Amendment and me last night on @CNN. Don Lemon is a lightweight - dumb as a rock
.@dbongino You were fantastic in defending both the Second Amendment and me last night on @CNN. Don Lemon is a lightweight - dumb as a rock
Barack Lesnar
Banned
I'm sorry I think it's a bunch of bologna. 1500 posts in the thread in OT...taking it out of context. It wasn't part of the script...he was riffing, it had a hint of sarcasm too. You can tell by his voice and mannerisms when he said it. He just doesn't know how to carefully form his sentences.... compare to Obama. Watch an Obama press conference or speech and look how much time he spends between sentences and words....multiple second pauses between words and sentences b/c he knows he has to be extremely careful with what he says since the media will take a sentence out of context and make a headline out of it. It's even worse with DJT b/c doesn't know how to talk like a politician and never will and most of the media has a clear bias IMO.
Tarkus
Member
My dick is out for him
plagiarize
Banned
All I hear is loud sucking.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
You're 100% right...I can't argue against that. Maybe once he's in office he'll learn to speak better after having more experience with politics. That's all i can say.
What do you think he was conveying? You don't really say.
So you are happy supporting someone for the most important job on the planet who, in your own words, isn't actually capable of forming a coherent sentence and conveying meaning?
Doesn't that in any way worry you? That someone who wouldn't manage to pass a low level interview for an administrator job at a normal company is going to be president? Someone who literally cannot speak properly?
I would also argue that his language is inflammatory, and that it does create risk and danger. We've seen these coded sentences and words before, elsewhere, and it never ends well.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
YOU DO NOT JOKE ABOUT ASSASSINATING PEOPLE. EVER. YOU ARE NOT ONLY RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT YOU SAY BUT FOR WHAT PEOPLE HERE. LET ME SHOW YOU A PICTURE OF SOMEONE WHO HEARD SOMETHING.
NO MORE BABY PARTS NO MORE BABY PARTS NO MORE BABY PARTS
balladofwindfishes
Member
That's not a chance any reasonable person should take.
"Maybe he'll get better" isn't a valid reason to elect someone.
Frank the Great
Banned
98% of "poor" households now have refrigerators, which means they have been lifted out of poverty.
darkstar0155
Member
He's in the running for the POTUS. Why you seem to think its ok for him just to "riff it" and not be clear about what he says, and be sarcastic about a thing like that, is crazy imo. That's not acceptable for someone in his position. Yeah, Obama talks like a college professor, and that's a good thing. Being able to just blab and say whatever you want has no place in political discourse, same with his BS about just throwing conspiracy theories out there without any proof.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
I'll reply to all the above shortly...eating breakfast
Spiritreaver
Member
EDIT: Not bothering. You all have this. I have no more patience for arguing with people on that side of the field.
minor effort
Banned
So the defense is that Donald Trump is wildly unstable and impulsive, goes off script and just "accidentally" suggest something that could be interpreted as using Second Amendment Solutions to stop Hillary Clinton from appointing SCOTUS justices?
Either way, this man is totally unfit to be president. Even if he was joking, this is something you don't casually joke about while running for president.
Give me a fucking break. Either you're ready to be president before you even start running, or you don't run. This isn't a "learn on the job" scenario.
He's running for President, not a part time job at KFC. And learning to speak "good" is not about experience in politics.
RustyNails
Member
You're fooling yourself.
Fuck global summit. Imagine him in Cuban Missle Crisis scenario.
User 463088
Banned
You know why Obama and Hillary choose their words carefully? Because, when you decide to enter the world of politics, WORDS HAVE MEANING. You have to be smart and careful and...basically everything Donald Trump is incapable of being.
But, ya, I totally remember all those people running for President in the past who accidentally said their opponent should maybe be shot. Or if not the candidate, then their appointees. Or if not the appointees then armed insurrection against a legitimately elected President. I totally remember that.
shinra-bansho
Member
Figure may as well cross post.
I'm guessing you're referring to Jo Cox as it's more recent. But this column in the Times is worth a read.
Trumps Ambiguous Wink Wink to Second Amendment People http://nyti.ms/2aTNn3N
Even if one was to be incredibly "generous" and say his intent was "only" to encourage violent uprising... That isn't what some crazy person is going to hear.
They hear she's the devil. Lock her up. Trump that bitch. There's nothing they can do. Oh wait. Guns. Maybe there is, I don't know.
Also, I have no idea why any of you are bothering.
DontBeThatGuy
Member
Why though?
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Trump plays it straight*
*except for every time he says something horrible then it's just joke k?
Trump isn't like the rest of Washington, he's a straight shooter and will say what needs to be said!*
*except when he says something horrible, he's just playing to the base and playing the game
*except for every time he says something horrible then it's just joke k?
Trump isn't like the rest of Washington, he's a straight shooter and will say what needs to be said!*
*except when he says something horrible, he's just playing to the base and playing the game
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Okay I need to ask GAF. Did everyone mishear what he said? Because to me it sounded like "Although, the second amendment, people, maybe there is." Not "Although, the second amendment people, maybe there is."
The first sounds much less ambiguous and there's no hemming about "second amendment people", which is a phrase I totally have never heard before.
The first sounds much less ambiguous and there's no hemming about "second amendment people", which is a phrase I totally have never heard before.
plagiarize
Banned
Yeah, that's the same quote I heard. What he's missing is that none of this is surprising. Yes, if you say outwardly racist and violent stuff that won't turn off GOP primary voters and you will continue to do well.
But that doesn't work in the general election at all, and his poll numbers reflect just that.
No one in the campaign, nor Donald himself, have argued he was saying that.
They have all argued that he meant NRA types when he said second amendment people.
So...
I also heard "second amendment, people" for what it's worth.
balladofwindfishes
Member
His own position on this is that he was talking about second amendment people. As in supporters of the second amendment.
Personalities are pretty well set at 70. People supposed that he'd act more presidential once he secured the nomination officially and that's certainly not come to pass.
plagiarize
Banned
In the full context I don't think that reading makes sense either.
He was saying Clinton is going to put justices into the court that will get rid of the second amendment. So I don't think he's saying that the second amendment can stop this from happening.
I mean, the constitution stops such a thing from happening, and you can't remove an amendment by appointing judges. But 'Hillary is going to get rid of the second amendment unless the second amendment stops her getting rid of the second amendment maybe' just doesn't make any sense to me, even coming from Trump.
Slurpy2k20
Member
And I think you're completely full of it.
I've been reading your posts in this thread, you keep reminding everyone that you're in "independent" (whatever the fuck that means), before shitting on Clinton and apologizing/supporting Trump, every single time. Just stop being a coward about it. What he was conveying was obvious and clear to anyone who watched, you can tell by the reactions behind him- whether he was joking or not is irrelevent, and anyone who is suggesting alternate explanations is doing some extreme mental gymnastics in order to justify them. Oh, and stop playing the confused, "open-minded" independent- you're embarrassing yourself and insulting the intelligence of everyone here. You're still defending and apologizing for Trump even to this moment, everyone knows exactly what you are.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
anyone who tries to dissect Trump's words needs to apply Occam's Razor
If you think he said something horrible and stupid, Occam's Razor dictates he said something horrible and stupid because WE'VE HAD A FULL YEAR OF HIM SAYING SHIT THAT IS HORRIBLE AND STUPID
If you think he said something horrible and stupid, Occam's Razor dictates he said something horrible and stupid because WE'VE HAD A FULL YEAR OF HIM SAYING SHIT THAT IS HORRIBLE AND STUPID
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Don't be mean.
Listen, I don't think that Trump sat and thought about it and was like, yeah, it would be great if some people murder Hillary.
I think what happened here is that he used car salesmen abilities to get a feel that a bunch of his supporters in the crowd and at home would love it, so he went with that, probably without giving it another thought.
I'm from Israel, I've seen politicians play that wink wink I didn't mean it like that game for years, and it didn't end well. The least we can do is denounce that bullshit.
You don't have to reply to everyone man, you're going to burn yourself like that.
Or lose your mind like benji
Even if that were what he was saying (and there's little indication it was), it hardly changes the implication. Whether he refers to "second amendment people" or just "the second amendment", it's still offered as a possible method to stop an elected official performing their duties.
minor effort
Banned
That's key. If this were some weird, random one-off "joke" from an otherwise measured, controlled candidate who hasn't spent an entire campaign dividing people, indulging violent rhetoric and at times violent actions - it would still be terrible, but at least the defense of the "joke" would have more merit.
This wasn't a deviation from the candidate Trump has been on the campaign trail thus far. This is who Trump is. How much more do we need to hear before we can finally conclude he's a dangerous lunatic?
RustyNails
Member
I cant seem to find party ID breakdown in the Bloomberg/Selzer poll in the methodology. The best I could find was respondents identifying themselves as 25% R, 27% D and 40% I.
plagiarize
Banned
People who have already made the fatal mistake of endorsing Trump, genuinely have little to no choice but to downplay all of the disastrous stuff he does. So I think it's unfair to ding them for doing it.
But ding them for supporting Trump though. For sure.
Trump has literally goaded his followers into violent acts before, with telling his rally attendees to 'knock around' protestors, warning of riots after the rigged elections, and I'm sure there are countless others.
The delusions really come out when consistently attempting to defend this person.
The delusions really come out when consistently attempting to defend this person.
Dubbedinenglish
Banned
Even IF
IF
IF
What you're saying is believable, words matter. He is running for President of the US. Every word he says matters, joke or not. World markets move on the President's words, allies and foe react to the President's words, people mobilize to the President's words. There is no place for "jokes" like this when the stakes are so high. It just furthers how irresponsible and reckless of a person he is and is not fit to be city dog catcher, much less POTUS.
bangbang i'm a timpani
Banned
she really doesn't need to
balladofwindfishes
Member
She has no chance of losing Virginia. It's basically a blue state at this point.
Recent polls, and whatever internals the Clinton campaign has, are showing that Virginia and Colorado are solidly locked up as of now. Better to spend that money elsewhere.
She's over ten points ahead in both states.
She'll turn them back on if she starts falling back.
plagiarize
Banned
Listen, I don't think that Trump sat and thought about it and was like, yeah, it would be great if some people murder Hillary.
I think what happened here is that he used car salesmen abilities to get a feel that a bunch of his supporters in the crowd and at home would love it, so he went with that, probably without giving it another thought.
I'm from Israel, I've seen politicians play that wink wink I didn't mean it like that game for years, and it didn't end well. The least we can do is denounce that bullshit.
You don't have to reply to everyone man, you're going to burn yourself like that.
Or lose your mind like benji
I think he felt he was painting such a dark picture, that he wanted to present at least a ray of hope in the likelihood that Clinton flips the supreme court. It wasn't calculated at all, naturally. I think it was 'oh crap, maybe I shouldn't tell these people that they are incapable of overcoming President Clinton, because they may not like the sound of that and think I am demeaning them, erm, okay maybe they could form a well armed militia like in the second amendment I just read the other day'.
plagiarize
Banned
Heck maybe she'll turn them on if Trump starts spending money in those states. And lets not forget she's been airing national adverts during the Olympics which are likely to get the largest share of most anything other than the debates between now and November. Maybe after the Olympics she'll turn the regional adverts back on.
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
Listen, I don't think that Trump sat and thought about it and was like, yeah, it would be great if some people murder Hillary.
I think what happened here is that he used car salesmen abilities to get a feel that a bunch of his supporters in the crowd and at home would love it, so he went with that, probably without giving it another thought.
I'm from Israel, I've seen politicians play that wink wink I didn't mean it like that game for years, and it didn't end well. The least we can do is denounce that bullshit.
You don't have to reply to everyone man, you're going to burn yourself like that.
Or lose your mind like benji
How sad is it that politics have descended to a state where you have to parse whether somebody was sincerely suggesting or merely joking about assassination?
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