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PoliGAF General Election Thread of Conventions (Sarah Palin McCain VP Pick)

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A

Azrael

Member
Smiles and Cries said:
you know that could really deal a death blow to Obama if McCain picked a woman as VP it would really make me very nervous about November

seriously is McCain that smart?

all the Biden lovers are really blind to the Change Agent thing coming back to bite Obama hard
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Plus, it could make it tricky for Biden to go on the attack in the VP debate if he was debating a woman, who could elicit sympathy if it was perceived Biden was beating up on her.
 
B

Byakuya769

Member
esbern said:
congratulations, you know nothing about politics
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2cib2pt.jpg


speaking of knowing nothing....
 
G

giga

Member
People's main arguments against Obama are his experience and foreign policy. Biden solves all of that and more.
 
J

joey_z

Banned
Just saw Barack Obama's Biography on CNN. Good stuff. What I found pretty interesting was how cunning he was as a younger politician. He really needs to show that side more seeing as how people don't think he has what it takes to keep American interests in check concerning National Security. Also, people often associate him with weakness and naivety for some reason and it's about time he destroys that misconception.

Does GAF think he can win this election being on the defensive constantly? Will being 'the good guy' soon catch up to him?
 
A

Azrael

Member
johnsmith said:
Why am I getting the feeling that McCain is going to win?
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I think he probably will too =/. Hillary wants McCain to win so she can run again in 2012, so she will do as little as possible to unify the base that she doesn't appear to be overtly supporting McCain, and the corporate media will slime Obama till November as a fern' elitist who eats babies, cheers when American soldiers die, and wants to raise taxes on families making $40,000 a year. I think Democrats will pick up seats in both houses of Congress but lose the White House.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
"Joe Biden is the right partner for Barack Obama. His many years of distinguished service to America, his seasoned judgment and his vast experience in foreign policy and national security will match up well with the unique challenges of the 21st Century. An Obama-Biden ticket is a very impressive and strong team. Biden's selection is good news for Obama and America."

--Chuck Hagel

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/209929.php
 
V

VistraNorrez

Member
joey_z said:
Does GAF think he can win this election being on the defensive constantly? Will being 'the good guy' soon catch up to him?
Click to expand...

That's part of the reason he chose Biden. Biden will speak his mind and shoot back at McCain and the GOP.
 
S

Skiptastic

Member
VALIS said:
300px-Patellar-knee-reflex.png
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I thought people had femurs. I didn't know we had lemurs in our legs. :lol

Interesting pick. Is this going to be another Bush/Cheney situation where the VP isn't going to be a risk to run for president after 8 years (if Barack won this year and then was re-elected)? He'd be 74 after 8 years of Obama.
 
T

The Librarian

Banned
Azrael said:
I think he probably will too =/. Hillary wants McCain to win so she can run again in 2012, so she will do as little as possible to unify the base that she doesn't appear to be overtly supporting McCain, and the corporate media will slime Obama till November as a fern' elitist who eats babies, cheers when American soldiers die, and wants to raise taxes on families making $40,000 a year. I think Democrats will pick up seats in both houses of Congress but lose the White House.
Click to expand...
avatar.jpg
 
B

Byakuya769

Member
joey_z said:
Just saw Barack Obama's Biography on CNN. Good stuff. What I found pretty interesting was how cunning he was as a younger politician. He really needs to show that side more seeing as how people don't think he has what it takes to keep American interests in check concerning National Security. Also, people often associate him with weakness and naivety for some reason and it's about time he destroys that misconception.

Does GAF think he can win this election being on the defensive constantly? Will being 'the good guy' soon catch up to him?
Click to expand...


Thing is it seems people love to express the sentiment that he does not have what it takes, but in the same breath will say they believe he is purposely charismatic to get what he desires and may be deceitful.

I think he'll have to walk a thin line when it comes to that. He can't devolve into baseless and disingenuous mud slinging, but he will have to throw some gut checks.
 
T

TDG

Banned
johnsmith said:
Why am I getting the feeling that McCain is going to win?
Click to expand...
Why did people think that Obama would win one of the biggest landslides ever after he clinched? Why will people be confident that he's going to win after the DNC? Why will people be confident that McCain is going to win after the RNC? etc...

The answer to all these questions is that people are reactionary, and lack perspective.
 
I

Imm0rt4l

Member
speculawyer said:
Great foreign policy knowledge
many years of experience
Clean, fresh, and well-spoken :D
white
catholic
Great attack dog
Good relations with 'blue collar' democrats
great debater

And here is one that says something but I'm not sure what . . . Obama picked him despite the silly "fresh/clean" remark which shows Obama isn't bothered by faux-controversies like that.


Bad:
Has been a whore for the banks
Can have diarhea of the mouth
From a solid blue-state so no help in a red state like Bayh, Kaine, Clark, seebelius, etc.
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yea.....something he's working on
 
S

soul creator

Member
TDG said:
How cute that the media was all up in arms about how "Biden is the pick that would make everybody happy," after he said it wasn't him, and now that it is him they're ripping Obama apart.

*SIGH*
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*street fighter music*

A NEW NARRATIVE HAS APPEARED!
 
J

Juice

Member
Azrael said:
Plus, it could make it tricky for Biden to go on the attack in the VP debate if he was debating a woman, who could elicit sympathy if it was perceived Biden was beating up on her.
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:lol:lol:lol:lol

I don't know if it was meant to be a joke, but used as one to spite Hillary, pretty hilarious.
 
C

ColdDeckEd

Member
speculawyer said:
Great foreign policy knowledge
many years of experience
Clean, fresh, and well-spoken :D
white
catholic
Great attack dog
Good relations with 'blue collar' democrats
great debater

And here is one that says something but I'm not sure what . . . Obama picked him despite the silly "fresh/clean" remark which shows Obama isn't bothered by faux-controversies like that.


Bad:
Has been a whore for the banks
Can have diarhea of the mouth
From a solid blue-state so no help in a red state like Bayh, Kaine, Clark, seebelius, etc.
Click to expand...

Thanks for trying to sell me on Biden, but I'm still torn. All i've ever heard about Biden is that he's a shrill for all the credit card companies and banks that use Delaware as a tax shelter. I'm going to have to listen to Obama's upcoming speeches to try and understand his choice. For Obama to lock this presidency down, he needed someone that broadens his appeal to moderates. A "great attack dog" from a "solid blue" state, isn't exactly what I call broadening, in fact I'd call it borderline polarizing.
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
guys, McCain just had a week of Obama on vacation, a week of free reign to do as he saw fit, and is still behind in the polls.

On top og his house thing, and 5 mill thing, he is going to pick Mitt and paint himself as an out of touch ultra wealthy ticket.

Plus Obama is probably going to roll out Luger, Hagel and Powell endorsements.
 
A

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Azrael said:
I think he probably will too =/. Hillary wants McCain to win so she can run again in 2012, so she will do as little as possible to unify the base that she doesn't appear to be overtly supporting McCain, and the corporate media will slime Obama till November as a fern' elitist who eats babies, cheers when American soldiers die, and wants to raise taxes on families making $40,000 a year. I think Democrats will pick up seats in both houses of Congress but lose the White House.
Click to expand...

The Clintons have people in place at the convention to have order. I think that Hillary wants some good to happen.
 
J

Jonm1010

Banned
Farmboy said:
The line of attack I'd love to see the Obama camp explore further is the one Obama recently implied when he said: "The guys that brought you George Bush are now packaging McCain". The implication goes beyond the simple McSame-as-Bush message: in essence it's about McCain delivering himself completely to the Rove set. I'd go so far as to explicitly ask the question "If he's not running his own campaign, why should we let him run the country?" which begs the question "And who would be in charge if we do?" The answer, of course, is the lobbyists, the oil guys, the special interests -- the same old cronies.

This would neatly sidestep the fact that voters seem to personally like McCain and it would be a hard to convince them he's a jackass. Heck, I think most voters still kinda feel Bush, as a person, isn't too unsympathetic, they just feel he let us down and sold us out (it's 'puppetmasters' like Cheney they truly despise). Attacking the surrogates would then suffice; it'd be akin to attacking McCain for not standing up to them, which is actually an extremely harsh character attack on McCain, whilst seeming like an attack directed at others.

There's a lot of stuff that fits into this narrative, among them the meme of the negative ads not really 'sounding like McCain' (so everytime the McCain camp runs one, they would actually reinforce this message), and of course the hilarious story of McCain's curtailed cellphone privileges,.

It would work mainly because it's probably true: I think most people really do believe that when McCain reshuffled his staff, he told them something akin to "I'm at your mercy, do your thing".
Click to expand...

Skimming through the last few pages, this is definitely the best post ive come across. This is EXACTLY what the Obama camp needs to do!
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
ColdDeckEd said:
Thanks for trying to sell me on Biden, but I'm still torn. All i've ever heard about Biden is that he's a shrill for all the credit card companies and banks that use Delaware as a tax shelter. I'm going to have to listen to Obama's upcoming speeches to try and understand his choice. For Obama to lock this presidency down, he needed someone that broadens his appeal to moderates. A "great attack dog" from a "solid blue" state, isn't exactly what I call broadening, in fact I'd call it borderline polarizing.
Click to expand...

but he plays well in the rust belt, you dont have to be from a state to help win a state.
 
S

syllogism

Member
Biden is easily the best realistic choice and I wouldn't even mind if he was on top of the ticket. Pundits and party insiders agree and it's probably a good sign if many internet left wingers do not. Hell, morning joe has been gushing all morning.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
Plus, anyone bitching about Obama shifting to the center, Biden is a pretty staunch liberal. And my god, so many years in the Senate and he's one of the poorest Senators out there, still takes the train to work every day. You don't get much more blue-collar than that.
 
T

TDG

Banned
ColdDeckEd said:
For Obama to lock this presidency down, he needed someone that broadens his appeal to moderates. A "great attack dog" from a "solid blue" state, isn't exactly what I call broadening, in fact I'd call it borderline polarizing.
Click to expand...
I've got to disagree. Independents/moderates like Obama, but his lack of experience makes them unsure about him. Biden has a lot of experience, and will reassure them that Obama is a safe choice.

And that's why people who are saying "Obama choosing Biden goes against his message of change blahblahblah" are completely full of shit. Barack Obama's number one problem is his lack of experience, picking an inexperienced running mate would've been one of the dumbest choices in the history of politics.
 
J

JohnTinker

Limbaugh Parrot
If any of you have ever watched Joe Biden speak you ought to know by now that he's going to have to use every ounce of restraint he has to not speak longer than Barack today at the rally.

He's earned a loquacious reputation for a reason :lol
 
C

ColdDeckEd

Member
TDG said:
I've got to disagree. Independents/moderates like Obama, but his lack of experience makes them unsure about him. Biden has a lot of experience, and will reassure them that Obama is a safe choice.

And that's why people who are saying "Obama choosing Biden goes against his message of change blahblahblah" are completely full of shit. Barack Obama's number one problem is his lack of experience, picking an inexperienced running mate would've been one of the dumbest choices in the history of politics.
Click to expand...

I guess I'm guilty of looking at this not in the context of who's the best fit with Obama, but more along the lines of who's most going to help Obama win...
 
V

VistraNorrez

Member
TDG said:
I've got to disagree. Independents/moderates like Obama, but his lack of experience makes them unsure about him. Biden has a lot of experience, and will reassure them that Obama is a safe choice.

And that's why people who are saying "Obama choosing Biden goes against his message of change blahblahblah" are completely full of shit. Barack Obama's number one problem is his lack of experience, picking an inexperienced running mate would've been one of the dumbest choices in the history of politics.
Click to expand...

Another good point, and this is something Chuck Todd brought up, is that Biden doesn't spend much time in Washington. In his 30 years serving there he almost always goes back to his home in Delaware. So if Obama wants to push the angle that he doesn't have the Washington politics influence he can still claim that with Biden.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
My Obama text just says "It's time to slay the dragon!"

LOL Schuster : "OBAMA! YOUR TEXTS CANNOT DEFEAT THE MEDIA! WE ARE SMARTER THAN YOU!"
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
grandjedi6 said:
I ended up getting the text at 3:34 AM :lol
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I got mine at 3:14. "Ask yourself: are Barack Obama's supporters ready to follow?"

Still holding out hope that Biden will walk on stage and remove his skin to reveal a different, unimaginably superior candidate.
 
J

joey_z

Banned
Amir0x said:
I got mine at 3:14. "Ask yourself: are Barack Obama's supporters ready to follow?"

Still holding out hope that Biden will walk on stage and remove his skin to reveal a different, unimaginably superior candidate.
Click to expand...

What's wrong with Biden?
 
J

JohnTinker

Limbaugh Parrot
America's rave community unhappy at Biden choice because of accompanying story:
Salon.com said:
April 16, 2003 -- Last Thursday, the House and Senate almost unanimously passed the National AMBER Alert Network Act of 2003, a popular bill that will soon create a nationwide kidnapping alert system. Coming in the wake of a year of high-profile child abductions -- from Elizabeth Smart (whose parents supported the bill) to Samantha Runnion -- the bill was a no-brainer, destined to pass quickly and smoothly through Congress.

Surely Sen. Joe Biden (D-Del.) knew this, which explains why he cannily sneaked his own, completely unrelated legislation into the AMBER Act just two days before the vote. Piggybacked onto the act was the Anti-Drug Proliferation Act, a thinly veiled rewrite of legislation that had proved so controversial in 2002 that it failed to pass a single congressional committee. Now, club owners and partyers alike are being subjected to a loosely worded and heavy-handed law that authorities will be able to indiscriminately use to shut down music events at any time they please, assuming they find evidence of drug use. Thanks to Biden's surreptitious efforts, a few glow sticks and a customer or two on Ecstasy could be all it takes to throw a party promoter in jail for 20 years.

The passing of the Anti-Drug Proliferation Act was sudden but not entirely out of the blue. Last year, the Anti-Drug Proliferation Act was known as the RAVE Act (the leadenly acronymed "Reducing Americans' Vulnerability to Ecstasy Act"), a piece of legislation designed by Biden in early 2002 to put rave promoters out of business. An expansion of the crack-house statute of 1986 -- which made crack-den proprietors liable for what took place in their homes, even if they didn't deal drugs themselves -- the RAVE Act threatened those who "knowingly and intentionally rent, lease, profit from, or make available for use, with or without compensation, [a] place for the purpose of unlawfully manufacturing, storing, distributing, or using a controlled substance" with 20 years in jail and $250,000 in fines.

In English, this meant that anyone who intentionally let people do drugs at their events could be held liable. It also expanded the crack-house statute in two significant ways: Now the law could be applied to one-night events -- concerts, raves, parties, festivals -- as well as permanent locales like nightclubs, and it added civil penalties for violations, lowering the burden of proof from "beyond reasonable doubt" to a "preponderance of evidence."
Click to expand...
http://archive.salon.com/mwt/feature/2003/04/16/rave/

Will Obama/Biden be able to sway the rave community and make up for this? Lets see if concessions are made at the rally today.

edit: Amir0x is this legislation what is preventing you from catching the JOEMENTUM?
 
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Rur0ni said:
Obama asks: "It's 3AM... are you ready?"
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Apparently since the thing woke me up :lol

Amir0x said:
I got mine at 3:14. "Ask yourself: are Barack Obama's supporters ready to follow?"

Still holding out hope that Biden will walk on stage and remove his skin to reveal a different, unimaginably superior candidate.
Click to expand...

Obama likes Amir0x more than me :(
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
joey_z said:
What's wrong with Biden?
Click to expand...

Already went over it in this thread.

JohnTinker said:
edit: Amir0x is this legislation what is preventing you from catching the JOEMENTUM?
Click to expand...

There are countless bits of legislation over his career that he has been apart of that I despise. There are endless social issues that we are different on. There are god knows how many fucking mouth vomitations he's had over the years, including many borderline racist remakes and countless insensitive ones. Running with a black candidate does not forgive those indiscretions. He cannot shut his fucking mouth, he was wrong on Iraq, he goes counter to Obama's change message, he brings in no states anyone gives a shit about, he brings in no constituencies that Obama has a shot at (he's never going to bring the Catholic vote in at any measurable level), he's not going to shore up many of Obama's strengths, is only going to weaken many of them and his GREATEST asset - being an ATTACK DOG - is simply a translation for Obama not having the balls to do it himself, as has been the case since post primary season. Being a foreign policy hawk is a weak at best defining point as Democrats are going to lose that argument with the public by simple fact of nature; and Obama's one surefire foreign policy win (his judgment on Iraq) is now undermined by this dude.

Obama himself has flipped on many issues in the general campaign season and has been pissing me off for a minute here, even though I should have expected it. But this is one of the biggest problems for me. This is almost as bad as him going for Hillary in my book. Biden may help Obama win the election, but if he does it won't be a good thing. I don't want that fucker in the White House.
 
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