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[Kildace]

With that background, I would think you might have a good insight as to what the deal is. Because I'm kinda stumped as well. Bush has around a 30% approval rating . . . but McCain seems to be gathering nearly 50% of the votes. Why? I understand the 30% true-believers sticking with the GOP. But what is with that other 20%? How can they disapprove of Bush yet still support McCain? If it was all 'information gap', then they'd still approve of Bush.

You'd have to have lived in a cave for the last 8 years to not know about Bush's disastrous policies. Correct me if I'm wrong but people really truly started turning away from Bush when Irak started turning sour, right?
That's stuff people just know about. Even if they're misinformed they can't have missed the years of coverage on the failures of the Irak war. But these people don't know about McCain, they think that he's still the same McCain who ran in 2000, he's a maverick, he's a rebel, he's not like the rest. And they don't really care enough to learn more about his policies, being fed with negative messages about Obama is enough to keep them happy with their choice.

It's sad but true, and America in 100 years will be seen as the first true failure of Democracy because when the majority of the people are idiots, they really should not be deciding who will run one of the most powerful nation in the world.

 

[Bulla564]

Apparently, some dick-wad let it slip that the GOP's room in Denver is basically 1984's "Ministry of Truth" (a.k.a responsible for spweing false propaganda).

http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/08/whoops_top_republican_admits_t.php

Wow -- a leading Republican appears to have just inadvertently admitted that the GOP's spin machine set up to counter Barack Obama during the convention is a propaganda machine spewing nothing but lies.

The GOPer in question is Colorado GOP chairman Dick Wadhams, who accidentally made the admission when describing the GOP's war room in Denver set up to hammer Obama during convention week.

Wadhams described the GOP's outfit thusly to the Denver Post: "Just consider this the Ministry of Truth."

Um, as anybody who has ever read George Orwell knows, the Ministry of Truth exists to disseminate false propaganda about how great the ruling regime is, continuously rewriting both history and the present-day facts in order to maintain total control over the population.

 

[polyh3dron]

McCain has had a dozen or so slogans so far

yep, he even aped Obamas: "A Leader We Can Believe In" :lol

 

[adamsappel]

Fear mongering? He used an uncut quote from Hillary to make a point about experience in crisis. It's immensely effective, and I expect it to be doubly so amongst experience-oriented former Hillary supporters.

She even said "will bring to the White House" (instead of "could bring"), which gives the impression that she said it AFTER THE PRIMARIES WERE OVER! Make an ad with that quote and Biden's similar comment and I wouldn't be surprised if people thought the Democrats were conceding the election early.

 

[worldrunover]

That's not change you can believe in. *creepy smile*

 

[Kildace]

Apparently, some dick-wad let it slip that the GOP's room in Denver is basically 1984's "Ministry of Truth" (a.k.a responsible for spweing false propaganda).

http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/08/whoops_top_republican_admits_t.php

How damning. Too bad the people who should be swayed by this won't get the reference.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I don't know if it's fair to say that it has little to do with the electoral vote. Sure, there are examples of a candidate winning the popular vote but losing the electoral vote (2000 is fresh in our minds, for instance), but that is rare.

Just check the Pollster.com map for a snapshot of the current situation.

http://pollster.com/

The national average, including today's tracking polls, has Obama ahead by 2.1%. That's a narrow lead, but the electoral landscape is different.

The electoral vote is 260-176, with 102 in toss-up.

Fill in the 102 in the direction they lean right now, and it's 312-226.

 

[speculawyer]

has Michelle Obama had alot of plastic surgery? She has a very strange face, very constructed-looking..

I've noticed something about her skin too. It seems quite a bit darker than mine. Perhaps she spends a lot of time in the sun. :lol

 

[Learn2read]

That's nothing. Fournier actually wrote to Karl Rove, regarding Pat Tillman, "The Lord creates men and women like this all over the world. But only the great and free countries allow them to flourish. Keep up the fight."

Sounds like the AP's Washington Bureau is controlled by an evangelical nutcase to me.

He was close to signing up with the McCain campaign...

 

[Kildace]

Just check the Pollster.com map for a snapshot of the current situation.

http://pollster.com/

The national average, including today's tracking polls, has Obama ahead by 2.1%. That's a narrow lead, but the electoral landscape is different.

The electoral vote is 260-176, with 102 in toss-up.

Fill in the 102 in the direction they lean right now, and it's 312-226.

But the national average is updated much more frequently than most state-by-state polls, right? Which means that the electoral map snapshot is not really up-to-date with the downward trend Obama has been experiencing in the past few weeks and that the situation is not as comfortable as it looks on the map.

 

[The Librarian]

Just check the Pollster.com map for a snapshot of the current situation.

http://pollster.com/

The national average, including today's tracking polls, has Obama ahead by 2.1%. That's a narrow lead, but the electoral landscape is different.

The electoral vote is 260-176, with 102 in toss-up.

Fill in the 102 in the direction they lean right now, and it's 312-226.

http://www.electoral-vote.com/ has it at Obama 273 and McCain 252 with one state tied (Virginia).

 

[GhaleonEB]

http://www.electoral-vote.com/ has it at Obama 273 and McCain 252 with one state tied (Virginia).

Different, less holistic methodology.

 

[reilo]

But the national average is updated much more frequently than most state-by-state polls, right? Which means that the electoral map snapshot is not really up-to-date with the downward trend Obama has been experiencing in the past few weeks and that the situation is not as comfortable as it looks on the map.

No, most polling agencies poll a state every few weeks. Add in the fact that multiple agencies poll the same state multiple times a month, and you easily get a week-by-week picture.

 

[schuelma]

I can tell this is a lot of people's first elections :lol :lol

I'll just keep saying it- wait for the debates. Those are what really matter.

 

[Clevinger]

John McCain: The slogan he cannot remember.

John McCain: We didn't have slogans in Hanoi.

 

[GhaleonEB]

But the national average is updated much more frequently than most state-by-state polls, right? Which means that the electoral map snapshot is not really up-to-date with the downward trend Obama has been experiencing in the past few weeks and that the situation is not as comfortable as it looks on the map.

Aside from the daily tracking polls, the national polls are usually done once a month by the major news organizations, spread out through the month.

Likewise, the battleground/swing states polls come in once a month from the pollsters. Some aren't as regular, and they don't move in tandem, but there's not much of a gap.

Edit:

No, most polling agencies poll a state every few weeks. Add in the fact that multiple agencies poll the same state multiple times a month, and you easily get a week-by-week picture.

What he said. For example, Michigan was polled three times last week alone. Florida four times in the past two weeks. Likewise, four Ohio polls in two weeks.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Just check the Pollster.com map for a snapshot of the current situation.

http://pollster.com/

The national average, including today's tracking polls, has Obama ahead by 2.1%. That's a narrow lead, but the electoral landscape is different.

The electoral vote is 260-176, with 102 in toss-up.

Fill in the 102 in the direction they lean right now, and it's 312-226.

Oh, I believe this. Again, I'm not saying that the situation should be interpreted as doom and gloom, and that Obama has lost. I saw how shrewdly his team won delegates in the primaries.

I'm just saying that you can't completely disregard polls as useless by rationalizing that the electoral college, not voters, determines the president. The electoral college does allocate its votes based on how the popular vote in the state turned out (not proportionally, though, obviously). Furthermore, the general election is quite a bit different from the primaries in that yesterday doesn't matter. When the media would idiotically play up the momentum angle, they seemed to wantonly disregard her deficit in elected delegates that Obama already had in the bag. Nothing can be taken for granted here. Today's polling data will be completely negated by tomorrow's, and then those of the day after.

 

[~Devil Trigger~]

John McCain: We didn't have slogans in Hanoi.

John Mccain: Your POW

 

[The Librarian]

Different, less holistic methodology.

If Obama is as close in NC as pollster lists, maybe he does have chance to win my state!

*gets excited*

 

[soul creator]

McCain speaks out against a scourge affecting our nation: Cooperation

wat

(POW reference included as well!)

 

[TDG]

I can tell this is a lot of people's first elections :lol :lol

I'll just keep saying it- wait for the debates. Those are what really matter.

Yeah, no kidding.

Jesus, if it were late October and Obama was floundering in the polls I would be right there getting huffy about how stupid americans are and how awful the media is and whatever, but at this point it is not a surprise at all, and it's so inconsequential it's hardly worth talking about.

 

[reilo]

McCain speaks out against a scourge affecting our nation: Cooperation

wat

(POW reference included as well!)

What the fuck? I swear, McCain's camp is literally placing corn on a typewriter and letting hens pluck at the keystrokes, and whatever bullshit comes out of it is their attack strategy.

 

[bob_arctor]

McCain speaks out against a scourge affecting our nation: Cooperation

wat

(POW reference included as well!)

"[L]ook at Berlin, where a wall came down, a continent came together, and history proved that there is no challenge too great for a world that stands as one."

"My opponent had the chance to express such confidence in America, when he delivered a much anticipated address in Berlin. He was the picture of confidence, in some ways. But confidence in oneself and confidence in one's country are not the same. And in that speech, Senator Obama left an important point unclear. He suggested that the end of the Cold War proved that there was, quote, 'no challenge too great for a world that stands as one.' Now I missed a few years of the Cold War, as the guest of one of our adversaries, but as I recall the world was deeply divided during the Cold War -- between the side of freedom and the side of tyranny. The Cold War ended not because the world stood "as one," but because the great democracies came together, bound together by sustained and decisive American leadership."

Man. What a fucked up way of looking at things.

 

[GhaleonEB]

What the fuck? I swear, McCain's camp is literally placing corn on a typewriter and letting hens pluck at the keystrokes, and whatever bullshit comes out of it is their attack strategy.

That excerpt is really mind-boggling. He's advocating more American isolationism.

 

[reilo]

That excerpt is really mind-boggling. He's advocating more American isolationism.

It goes in line with his 3AM attack ad: It's America versus the world. It's feeding into the entire notion that America can do no wrong, no harm, and everything that comes out of this country is plated with gold - even if it's a turd. It's what got us into this mess to begin with.

 

[StopMakingSense]

I hate to rain on your article, but it is mostly a bunch of uninformed nonsense.

I am a soon-to-be bankruptcy attorney. I currently work at the Dept. of Justice doing nothing all day but work on individual bankruptcy petitions & cases.

The bankruptcy law really isn't that bad. Out of all the individual bankruptcy cases I have seen, only a tiny % of them were instances where I thought some poor sap was legitimately getting unfairly screwed.

Frankly I think the bankruptcy issue is a non starter. As much as Americans love their credit, they don't really give a shit about people who can't pay their bills.

 

[woeds]

Please, Democrats, Attack
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/08/please_democrats_attack.html

Nothing new there, but I liked this anecdote

I was for Hillary in the primaries, but when she endorsed Sen. Obama, I proudly sent him a check for the legal maximum. On the memo line of the check I wrote, "FOR NEGATIVE CAMPAIGNING ONLY." No matter what minor difference Hillary and Barack had, they pale in comparison to the corruption, incompetence, dishonesty and criminality of the Bush-McCain Republicans.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

That excerpt is really mind-boggling. He's advocating more American isolationism.

As it should be. After all, American is the greatest, best nation that God has ever given us on the face of the earth.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

Wow. Ed Rendell really didn't let McCain and the GOP talking points on raising everyone's taxes slip by.

Respect +1

 

[JayDubya]

That excerpt is really mind-boggling. He's advocating more American isolationism.

As an "isolationist," no, he's not.

 

[reilo]

As it should be. After all, American is the greatest, best nation that God has ever given us on the face of the earth.

:lol

As an "isolationist," no, he's not.

Why don't you buy your own island already?

All kidding aside, how is he not advocating isolation?

 

[mckmas8808]

The point is, he's giving a genuine personal opinion that he only later realized would be interpreted as a jab against Obama. It had nothing to do with Obama per se.

BUUUUULSHIT!!! Guy X was obviously the inexperienced person. And oh who could that person be?

 

[JayDubya]

:lol

Why don't you buy your own island already?

Why don't you Reilo your own year already?

All kidding aside, how is he not advocating isolation?

How IS he advocating isolation?

 

[reilo]

Why don't you Reilo your own year already?

See edit. I didn't mean to incite any harm.

How is he not advocating isolationism?

 

[Xisiqomelir]

See edit. I didn't mean to incite any harm.

How is he not advocating isolationism?

Isolationism would reduce our contact with the heathen outside world.

NeoConism has us inextricably tied up in all their nonsense as the Shining City on the Hill. Forever.

 

[TDG]

There is a difference between wanting to isolate ourselves from the rest of the world, and making America out to be the grand and wonderful policeman of the world who solves all problems and is a beacon of all that is right and just.

 

[bob_arctor]

As an "isolationist," no, he's not.

Yeah. Sounds like he's advocating perpetually slobbin' on America's knob since without us, it all goes to shit. I'd hate to meet us at a party.

 

[Tamanon]

See edit. I didn't mean to incite any harm.

How is he not advocating isolationism?

Yeah he's not advocating isolationism, he's advocating pseudo-imperialism, bringing others into the fold against the non-believers.

 

[JayDubya]

How is he not advocating isolationism?

That's not isolationism.

Isolationism would be "the Cold War was a massive waste of time and money, the other Western nations should have taken care of their own defense, and the domino theory was a steaming crock."

This was "the Soviets didn't stand with us, they were teh bad guys, there is good and evil and America is the leader of team good and Obama doesn't understand that in my day, blah, blah, blah" or whatever the fuck. I'm actually not sure WHAT the point is, I guess he just wants to reinforce a tough guy cold warrior image.

 

[worldrunover]

That excerpt is really mind-boggling. He's advocating more American isolationism.

I'd say the opposite. He's advocating that we be the main (sole?) authorities on world affair and policy since we are far superior to the rest of the globe. It's actually borderline xenophobic.

 

[Kildace]

Yeah. Sounds like he's advocating perpetually slobbin' on America's knob since without us, it all goes to shit. I'd hate to meet us at a party.

The funny thing being that under a McCain presidency after 8 years of Bush, America would pretty much be reduced to a pile of rubble economicaly and would not be able to assume the role of ever-benevolent superpower he fantasizes about. Especially when meanwhile Russia and China are both enjoying amazing economic growth.

 

[schuelma]

This was "the Soviets didn't stand with us, they were teh bad guys, there is good and evil and America is the leader of team good and Obama doesn't understand that in my day, blah, blah, blah" or whatever the fuck. I'm actually not sure WHAT the point is, I guess he just wants to reinforce a tough guy cold warrior image.

You said it better than I was going to try to do. I don't think there was much of a point beyond tweaking Obama as not "getting it", etc. It was a pretty weak jab but nothing more.

 

[schuelma]

I'd say the opposite. He's advocating that we be the main (sole?) authorities on world affair and policy since we are far superior to the rest of the globe. It's actually borderline xenophobic.

I think you're reading waayyy too much into this.

 

[JayDubya]

The funny thing being that under a McCain presidency after 8 years of Bush, America would pretty much be reduced to a pile of rubble economicaly and would not be able to assume the role of ever-benevolent superpower he fantasizes about. Especially when meanwhile Russia and China are both enjoying amazing economic growth.

The president doesn't run the economy.

 

[reilo]

That's not isolationism.

Isolationism would be "the Cold War was a massive waste of time and money, the other Western nations should have taken care of their own defense, and the domino theory was a steaming crock."

This was "the Soviets didn't stand with us, they were teh bad guys, there is good and evil and America is the leader of team good and Obama doesn't understand that in my day, blah, blah, blah" or whatever the fuck. I'm actually not sure WHAT the point is, I guess he just wants to reinforce a tough guy cold warrior image.

So basically what McCain is advocating is for the US to be the #1 power. Unlike in previous years, where leading by example was the mantra, he is advocating getting our hands dirty in every aspect of the modern world and enforcing our will onto societies at large.

I guess where I got confused at was when he attacked Obama for asking other nations to come together and help out with the troubles the world faces today.

The president doesn't run the economy.

But policies can directly influence the economy. The wrong policies - such as deregulating the housing market - has played a huge role to the current mess we are in.

 

[schuelma]

The funny thing being that under a McCain presidency after 8 years of Bush, America would pretty much be reduced to a pile of rubble economicaly

Oh come on. We can argue economics all day if you want, but this is absolutely ridiculous.

 

[Price Dalton]

Slight derail.

Coming back from the Magic fashion trade show in Vegas today, I was driven by a cabbie listening to Sean Hannity's AM show, super loud. She kept nodding in agreement, even as I sighed and shook my head (in retrospect, my reactions may have been the impetus for her driving).

It woulda been tolerable if she had been a decent, honest driver - but she took a roundabout route back to Monte Carlo, and then opted to get stuck in traffic on Vegas Blvd. Slowly approaching yellow lights, driving a bit under the speed limit, that sorta thing. This is all behavior that cab drivers are notorious for, I suppose, and for which we're mostly prepared, but Hannity made it all different.

I stiffed her - the first time I've ever done that - and she made some smart comment as I exited the vehicle. I told her to "go suck Hannity's dick."

Childish and possibly counterproductive? Fuck yes, but damn satisfying. I like to think I won some small victory today.

 

[Barrett2]

The president doesn't run the economy.

He writes & submits the budget, and appoints the guy who controls monetary policy.

Lets not go down the; "the prez doesn't affect the economy, lulz" road... He has enough to do with it that we should care.

 

[Kildace]

The president doesn't run the economy.

He decides on the nation's energy policy though, and I doubt that "Drill here and drill NOW" will solve america's dependance on foreign oil that is hurting your economy.

Oh come on. We can argue economics all day if you want, but this is absolutely ridiculous.

So you don't think that doing pretty much nothing to solve the collapse of the housing market and doing nothing to solve your dependance on foreign oil could have a disastrous, lasting impact on your economy?

 

[reilo]

Slight derail.

Coming back from the Magic fashion trade show in Vegas today, I was driven by a cabbie listening to Sean Hannity's AM show, super loud. She kept nodding in agreement, even as I sighed and shook my head (in retrospect, my reactions may have been the impetus for her driving).

It woulda been tolerable if she had been a decent, honest driver - but she took a roundabout route back to Monte Carlo, and then opted to get stuck in traffic on Vegas Blvd. Slowly approaching yellow lights, driving a bit under the speed limit, that sorta thing. This is all behavior that cab drivers are notorious for, I suppose, and for which we're mostly prepared, but Hannity made it all different.

I stiffed her - the first time I've ever done that - and she made some smart comment as I exited the vehicle. I told her to "go suck Hannity's dick."

Childish and possibly counterproductive? Fuck yes, but damn satisfying. I like to think I won some small victory today.

You go girl!