Support NeoGAF

[adamsapple]

"However, I have been told by multiple sources that Xbox was entirely hands-off with the project, and that the game doesn't fall under Xbox Game Studios' director Matt Booty's responsibilities — because rightly or wrongly, right now, Arkane is not an Xbox Game Studio by internal definition. "

well well, looks like ol' adam was right again.

The main difference that if a playstaion fansite reviews an Xbox exclusive (which isn't always the case by the way) they don't go out of their way to shit on it and be the outlier.

But remember, this is the playbook that everyone is clearly having to deal with when it comes to these Xbox/Microsoft fan sites.

Exactly. As I pointed out earlier, the highest review for Redfall PC is from DualShockers.

They could easily give it a 4/10, and nobody would bat an eye as multiple other outlets (including Gamespot) also gave it a 4. But they gave it a freakin' 8.5

Wait wait wait, what the heck are you two puffing over here? Since when is Dualshockers a "playstation centric" website? Because they have "Dualshock" in their name ?



As an example, Playstation Lifetyle is a PS centric website, it only covers PS console and VR content, Dualshockers covers all consoles, anime, TV and movies.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

"However, I have been told by multiple sources that Xbox was entirely hands-off with the project, and that the game doesn't fall under Xbox Game Studios' director Matt Booty's responsibilities — because rightly or wrongly, right now, Arkane is not an Xbox Game Studio by internal definition. "

Xbox.....

They are basically buying publishers and letting them run free aren't they? Incredible...

 

[SmokedMeat]

This is gonna be good.

 

[Heisenberg007]

This is gonna be good.

Will give it a watch.

I doubt any review is gonna top Skill Up's though -- best Redfall review and an absolutely hilarious video! 100% recommended in case anyone missed it.

 

[GHG]

Wait wait wait, what the heck are you two puffing over here? Since when is Dualshockers a "playstation centric" website? Because they have "Dualshock" in their name ?

You clearly don't know their history.

Also, well done outing yourself.

 

[Punished Miku]

This is so colossally fucking stupid I don't know where to start. The developer owned outright by Microsoft for three years has nothing to do with Xbox.

...and if Redfall had been a 95% critical darling, I guess no one would be claiming it was Xbox's triumph, would they?

Get the fuck outta here

Hi-Fi Rush director basically said he never once saw anyone from MS. Never met Spencer. Never showed anyone the game from MS.

For better or worse, literally everyone says they're totally hands off.

 

[Topher]

well well, looks like ol' adam was right again.

Again?

This is so colossally fucking stupid I don't know where to start. The developer owned outright by Microsoft for three years has nothing to do with Xbox.

...and if Redfall had been a 95% critical darling, I guess no one would be claiming it was Xbox's triumph, would they?

Get the fuck outta here

And how in the hell anyone thinks this narrative they are pitching puts Xbox in a better light......I have no idea.

 

[FunkMiller]

Hi-Fi Rush director basically said he never once saw anyone from MS. Never met Spencer. Never showed anyone the game from MS.

For better or worse, literally everyone says they're totally hands off.

So, absolutely no one at Xbox saw Redfall before its release? Not a single, solitary senior member of the Xbox division had any interaction with the game? For three years? Not even when it went gold?

 

[adamsapple]

You clearly don't know their history.

Bruh lol

They been hosting XBL play dates for Modern Warfare and Mass Effect 2 reviews for the 360 SKU in 2010.

You seem to be privy to some secret history that goes beyond a decade +

Also, well done outing yourself.

 

[GHG]

Again?

He literally just regurgitates the crap that those influencers/ambassadors spout.

It's just that sometimes we are lucky enough to get exposure to it before everyone else does.

 

[Punished Miku]

So, absolutely no one at Xbox saw Redfall before its release? Not a single, solitary senior member of the Xbox division had any interaction with the game? For three years? Not even when it went gold?

Not at the level of a game director. They may have met with the studio head, or someone at Bethesda or Zenimax I'm sure.

Director of Pentiment described pitching a game to MS and they basically just said, sounds good. Go for it. But MS is the publisher there.

Booty has described multiple inter-studio seminars where they can exchange info and offer resources in various specialties (animation, sound, game engines, etc.). He said they do a few a year and 3-4 people from each studio show up if they want.

 

[nemiroff]

I wouldn't play this solo, so I don't know if it's diferent, but I just had another enjoyable co-op session with my son (we're only a 2-3 hours in, so thinks can still change). It's very easy to get a co-op session going, and most stuff seems to function like it should. We didn't notice a much of any bugs or glitches for some reason. I'm puzzled by how oddly different my experience so far has been from what I expected from reading horror stories about the game. Maybe we're in a different universe playing a different Redfall, IDK.. lol

..Or is this a forbidden story to tell, am I to be an outcast now..?

 

[FunkMiller]

Not at the level of a game director. They may have met with the studio head, or someone at Bethesda or Zenimax I'm sure.

Director of Pentiment described pitching a game to MS and they basically just said, sounds good. Go for it. But MS is the publisher there.

Booty has described multiple inter-studio seminars where they can exchange info and offer resources in various specialties (animation, sound, game engines, etc.). He said they do a few a year and 3-4 people from each studio show up if they want.

There is no way on Earth that Redfall was released without senior Xbox staff knowing what state it is in.

 

[GHG]

Bruh lol

They been hosting XBL play dates for Modern Warfare and Mass Effect 2 reviews for the 360 SKU in 2010.

You seem to be privy to some secret history that goes beyond a decade +

It was founded as a Playstation centric website.

Does Windows Central covering topics and products across the tech industry including those that revolve around Sony/playstation mean they are no longer a Microsoft focused outlet?

Try again.

 

[Punished Miku]

There is no way on Earth that Redfall was released without senior Xbox staff knowing what state it is in.

Obviously.

 

[Pelta88]

• Involved when it comes to canceling the PS5 version.
• Not involved when it comes to improving the game.

They're on record for saying that as soon as the deal was finalized, Redfall's PS5 version was cancelled by XBOX.

But now that the damage control is flowing, they're pushing an alternative narrative like gaf doesn't have all the receipts.

 

[ulantan]

• Involved when it comes to canceling the PS5 version.
• Not involved when it comes to improving the game.

Priorities, you just gotta make sure it's not on PlayStation after that fuck it.

 

[diffusionx]

Hilarious that whenever a company put out a decent game under the MS umbrella, like Wasteland 3, it's all "we're glad MS gave us the resources and time to make the game great", or "we are glad they trusted us", but when a turd game comes out, it's like, "woah, MS had nothing to do with this one, don't blame them"

 

[Jerm411]

Jez knew that giving Redfall a 9/10 would be too overt so instead, and is if on queue, a damage control piece.

TLDR: Microsoft own Bethesda but only slightly so the Redfall debacle isn't really XBOX's fault... kinda... If you think about it somehow.




Pitiful.

Like clockwork lol…Baghdad Bob to the rescue.

 

[FunkMiller]

Hilarious that whenever a company put out a decent game under the MS umbrella, like Wasteland 3, it's all "we're glad MS gave us the resources and time to make the game great", or "we are glad they trusted us", but when a turd game comes out, it's like, "woah, MS had nothing to do with this one, don't blame them"

It's ridiculous. You can't go around trumpeting for years that Bethesda is now a first party Xbox studio, without also taking the lumps when that studio puts out utter shit.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Not gonna lie, I’ve come full circle and want to play this turd for the laughs. To walk up to vampires and do nothing, just to watch them do nothing. To blow up cars by shooting the door glass. To melee kill vampires by smacking them in the ass.

What a treasure. Don’t even fix it.

 

[Krathoon]

It is always interesting when a studio pushes out a janky game. I have seen it with the Dead Island 1 and the Witcher 1. Both of those studios managed to fix the game up.

I hope that happens with Redfall.

A janky game gives you a peek behind the curtain of making games. Just as long as the bugs are not frustrating.

 

[adamsapple]

It was founded as a Playstation centric website.

Bruh the website was founded in 2009 and they have been covering multi-platform content since its launch.

You don't know what 'centric' means.

Does Windows Central covering topics and products across the tech industry including those that revolve around Sony/playstation mean they are no longer a Microsoft focused outlet?

Have you actually seen what kind of PS topics they cover? The occasional news and tech focused articles on PSVR and the like.

They don't review PS games.

Dualshockers is not a PS centric website reviewing an Xbox/PC game either.

Try again.

Im watching his review and im laughing my ass off. MS and arkane should be fucking ashamed for releasing such garbage

Gotdamn this was a beautiful beatdown. They should show this at the next Arkane pitch meeting as "DON'T DO THIS AGAIN" material.

 

[FunkMiller]

Not gonna lie, I’ve come full circle and want to play this turd for the laughs. To walk up to vampires and do nothing, just to watch them do nothing. To blow up cars by shooting the door glass. To melee kill vampires by smacking them in the ass.

What a treasure. Don’t even fix it.

Don't bother. All the videos on YouTube do a good job stitching all the terrible hilarious bits together, but if you actually play it, like I did for an hour, you realise how dead, empty, bland and janky the game is. Save yourself the time.

 

[FrankWza]

This is really out of hand. I mean, the $200 an hour resurfacing and now the playbook being exposed. Wow.

 

[Alebrije]

Just imagine a Crowbcat video for this game.

 

[Pelao]

All I know is that if someone working under me were to deliver a mediocre result, the last thing I would say is, "It's his fault, I let him do whatever he wanted and he failed," because then I would be fired not only for being incompetent, but also for being irresponsible.

 

[SmokedMeat]

I doubt any review is gonna top Skill Up's though -- best Redfall review and an absolutely hilarious video! 100% recommended in case anyone missed it.

I didn’t get through the entire video yet, but that part where he runs for over two minutes to an objective - and doesn’t encounter a single enemy. Wow. Just wow.

The more I see the more I’m blown away by just how bad Redfall is. That one team member claims they worked on this for five years?! Either they fucked off a good portion of that time, or this needed another year or two to finish.

 

[Edge Lord]

Im watching his review and im laughing my ass off. MS and arkane should be fucking ashamed for releasing such garbage

So the IGN guy was playing normally all along!

 

[Luipadre]

So the IGN guy was playing normally all along!

yeah that poor guy.

 

[Klosshufvud]

How predictable off Jeff Grub doing the usual damage control. If he knew Redfall was a dud last month, why stay quiet until cat's out of the bag? Most useless insider of all times. Probably just doing MS' PR disguised as "leaks".

 

[GHG]

Bruh the website was founded in 2009 and they have been covering multi-platform content since its launch.

You don't know what 'centric' means.



Have you actually seen what kind of PS topics they cover? The occasional news and tech focused articles on PSVR and the like.

They don't review PS games.

Dualshockers is not a PS centric website reviewing an Xbox/PC game either.

Cut it with the disingenuous crap. Next thing you know you're going to tell me that the sixth axis isn't a Playstation focused website despite their name.

The good thing about being an old fart like me is the fact that I don't need to use the waybackmachine or similar, I can actually remember what the perceptions of that website were like before they've attempted to soften their image in recent times. A quick Google (yes, Google, not Bing) search of "dualshockers playstation bias/biased" will yield you plenty of results for you to chew on.

But who knows, maybe you have a definitive up to date list of sorts from yours truly.

Priorities, you just gotta make sure it's not on PlayStation after that fuck it.

Honestly, it seems like that's their only objective these days.

 

[adamsapple]

Cut it with the disingenuous crap. Next thing you know you're going to tell me that the sixth axis isn't a Playstation focused website despite their name.

The good thing about being an old fart like me is the fact that I don't need to use the waybackmachine or similar, I can actually remember what the perceptions of that website were like before they've attempted to soften their image in recent times. A quick Google (yes, Google, not Bing) search of "dualshockers playstation bias/biased" will yield you plenty of results for you to chew on.

But who knows, maybe you have a definitive up to date list of sorts from yours truly.

Man, relax. I don't know or care what the perception was or how people were labeling the website 13 years ago. Probably labeling it as a PS centric website back then because it had the word dualshock in the name. Wayback is good for seeing what the website actually had. And it looks like it has been a multi-platform content and game review website since inception.

I can't change your perception, so if you want to keep calling it a PS centric website, you're welcome to do that. The whole "look at how generous PS fan websites are for reviewing Redfall so high" conversation is skewed.

 

[SJRB]

Wait, so the current copium narrative is:

- Is the game good? Then thank Microsoft and Xbox
- Is the game not good? It's not strictly a Microsoft game because of mental gymnastics and they're not to blame even though they own the studio

 

[Elios83]

Wait, so the current copium narrative is:

- Is the game good? Then thank Microsoft and Xbox
- Is the game not good? It's not strictly a Microsoft game because of mental gymnastics and they're not to blame even though they own the studio

Damage control by the usual people.

 

[Snowdonhoffen]

Wait, so the current copium narrative is:

- Is the game good? Then thank Microsoft and Xbox
- Is the game not good? It's not strictly a Microsoft game because of mental gymnastics and they're not to blame even though they own the studio

It will be the same story with Starfield.
- If it's good, it's because MS stepped in after what happened with Redfall and made the game better
- If it's not that good, it's because MS has nothing to do with Bethesda

 

[Bo_Hazem]

 

[rofif]

Watched skillup reviews.... how is this game getting forspoken scores??!!!
Forspoken is fully functional, finished game with fantastic gameplay. Say what you want about story but game alone is fine.

 

[Giallo Corsa]

I wouldn't play this solo, so I don't know if it's diferent, but I just had another enjoyable co-op session with my son (we're only a 2-3 hours in, so thinks can still change). It's very easy to get a co-op session going, and most stuff seems to function like it should. We didn't notice a much of any bugs or glitches for some reason. I'm puzzled by how oddly different my experience so far has been from what I expected from reading horror stories about the game. Maybe we're in a different universe playing a different Redfall, IDK.. lol

..Or is this a forbidden story to tell, am I to be an outcast now..?

You're a good dad, you're playing it with your kid, of course you're gonna have a good time brother (and future memories from it), that doesn't change the fact that this games is - not only undercooked - but, to put it simply, shit - and there's the evidence to back that up, it's not just some "hate" crusade or hate boner against the game.
Personally, You'd have to pay me to play it since you can't put a price on my free/spare time.

I mean, I don't have kids but...I'd have no problem whatsoever playing this with a pornstar sitting on top of me for a co-op session.and a barrel filled with Cynar/Campari spritz.and a couple of cigars.and a Panigale V4S on its side stand waiting for me after finishing said co-op session (all paid by Papa Phil obviously).
What I'm trying to say is...it's a matter of perspective my good man

Cheers

 

[mckmas8808]

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/microsoft-activision-deal-approval-watch-ot.1641775/post-267880876

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/ms-h...one-whatculture-gaming.1656112/post-267897467

This is VERY concerning to read.

Makes me wonder if this is why the phrase "Best Deal in Gaming" is stated multiple times per week on video game podcasts that I listen to weekly.

 

[Captain Toad]

If Microsoft are happy to release the garbage fire that is Redfall, then you have to worry about their quality control for Starfield, or any other release they have planned.

I'm sure they weren't happy about it. But, they already delayed it from last year. They haven't released a AAA game in 18 months.

Hardware sales are taking a nose dive. They stopped announcing GamePass numbers, which doesn't bode well. I'm guessing they reached a point where they felt they HAD to put out one of their "big AAA" games.

 

[Jaybe]

 

[scydrex]

I voted for 50 too.

 

[Crispy Gamer]

Amazing... listening to interviews of Arkane leading up to Deathloop giving Sony effusive praise about the Support they received and we are supposed to believe Microsoft gave little to no input/support for Redfall? They don't look good either way it just makes the situation worse

 

[GHG]

Watched skillup reviews.... how is this game getting forspoken scores??!!!
Forspoken is fully functional, finished game with fantastic gameplay. Say what you want about story but game alone is fine.

I wouldn't say it has "fantastic gameplay", far from it, but having watched the worth a buy and skill up reviews it's nowhere near as bad as what's on show here.

This is flat out broken in most key metrics.

Man, relax.

 

[Haint]

63 is way too high. Use the full fucking scale. This should be at around 30.

WOW at the SkillUp review. The portion where he shows how barren and empty the world is. shockingly bad.

Entire missions with just 1 enemy.

Buggy, glitchy and unpolished.

Only 3 enemy types.

Fetch quest side missions.

Endless "find a key" puzzles straight out of 2006.

A.I is the dubmest I've seen in a AAA game.

Looks like a fucking late gen 360 game.

Microsoft saw this and said, "looks great. release it."

Should have been delayed into oblivion, or straight up cancelled.

The enemy density is clearly a bug. I've experienced the exact opposite problem where enemies will perpetually respawn as you cross the invisible load lines/zones in double or triple their intended numbers.

 

[solidus12]

 

[Punished Miku]

Amazing... listening to interviews of Arkane leading up to Deathloop giving Sony effusive praise about the Support they received and we are supposed to believe Microsoft gave little to no input/support for Redfall? They don't look good either way it just makes the situation worse

Thats an example of a question I'd like to see answered. I always assumed support was available but maybe it isn't. We know Coalition helps the State of Decay devs a bit. Not sure specifically what help Arkane would get and from who. I vaguely remember hearing about id helping them with gunplay.

 

[Krathoon]

Yeah. There is something weird with how this game transitions from low poly models to high poly models.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Where's the IGN review? They're normally quick to put out their reviews, but this time they are conveniently late to the party. By accident or by design? I wonder.

Still negotiating with Microsoft