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[Amir0x]

Of course they'll use the extra screen (for menus likely), but I bet the primary input device will still be the motion+ wiimote. I don't see what's so strange about using a controller that's been used extensively in their promotional materials for the Wii U.

LOL

How the fuck would this work. Most awkward set up in history... having to grab for the tablet controller every time you want anything, and then going back to motion+ to do everything else. I'd review that Zelda at a 4.0 if they did something that monumentally retarded. The series is supposed to set standards,.

Dude, it's going to be a tablet Zelda only.

 

[butter_stick]

Of course they'll use the extra screen (for menus likely), but I bet the primary input device will still be the motion+ wiimote. I don't see what's so strange about using a controller that's been used extensively in their promotional materials for the Wii U.

So people are going to have two controllers set out in front of them, with the Wii U controller just used to display a map?

Don't be silly.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

I don't think you know one iota what Nintendo thinks. We've heard a half joking comment from Miyamoto that if this isn't the best Zelda yet it'd be the last one, however, which is the only public comment we've had on the subject. Which tells me that even though he is joking, they DID want the formula shaken up and the response to be overwhelming. It is clearly, demonstrably NOT overwhelming. It is the weakest showing a console Zelda has received in...forever.

So I'm curious if that will lead to further shake ups, shake ups the series has needed since Ocarina of Time but have for whatever reason not come. Skyward Sword IS a very different Zelda game, no doubt, but it is clear now from the people who have played it that it is still clinging to many annoying habits.



Maybe he can't imagine it, but unless you're captain gullible, no real Zelda game on Wii U is going to utilize anything but the primary controller the system comes with - the tablet. So 100% guaranteed this is the last motion+ Zelda game for at least a generation. Back Quote this when the new neoGAF features go up.

Majora's Mask back in 2000 was very controversial. And indeed its Gamerankings score is pretty low for a Zelda game. Lower than Skyward Sword. It acquired the favors of the gaming community only later.

 

[spekkeh]

Of course they'll use the extra screen (for menus likely), but I bet the primary input device will still be the motion+ wiimote. I don't see what's so strange about using a controller that's been used extensively in their promotional materials for the Wii U.

So that means you'll hold your Wii U like a shield or something?

 

[Hot Coldman]

It is pretty hilarious how a lot of Zelda fans fell in line with the Gamespot review of Twilight Princess after launch.

 

[EatChildren]

No motion controls in Zelda Wii U. *sigh* I guess the future wont be as bright and beautiful as I'd have it be.

 

[Amir0x]

Twilight Princess is fucking awesome. Fuck the haters.

Edit: As bright and beautiful as I'd have it be, however, which is what counts!

 

[butter_stick]

The only problem with TP (beyond its opening) is it was a refinement, not a revolution.

But it's still the best 3D Zelda. I enjoyed the hell out of it.

 

[linko9]

So people are going to have two controllers set out in front of them, with the Wii U controller just used to display a map?

Don't be silly.

Look, I don't know what they'll end up doing, but the fact is, Aonuma said he want to continue focus on motion controls for the next Zelda, heavily implying (or just straight up stating) that he much prefers swinging the Wiimote to pressing a botton to operate the sword. I find it highly unlikely that Nintendo is going to have you swinging the Wii U tablet around like a sword. My conclusion is that at this point in time, Aonuma wants to continue using the Wii remote as the primary input for the next Zelda. That conclusion is anything but silly.

 

[EatChildren]

Edit: As bright and beautiful as I'd have it be, however, which is what counts!

You're a monster.

 

[Woffls]

I'm almost glad this has happened. In 5 years time, upon the advent of a new Zelda game, we will look back on Skyward Sword and there will be a large contingent of people eager to proclaim it as their favourite Zelda game. It will join the ranks of Wind Waker, Twilight Princess and Majora's Mask in being the game that couldn't better Ocarina of Time in the eyes of critics but is still unique enough for people to feel strongly about it, and favour it over Ocarina of Time.

And that's what I don't get about Zelda reviews in general, though more notably regarding Twilight Princess: if it's so closely retreading the same formula, why is there such a split among players about which games are the best? There's no way this could happen unless the games were different enough that there's no general consensus.

Many recent popular franchises are following the same formula to the extent that it's obvious which ones are better than others. I really do think the Zelda rehash complaints are unjustified, and the only reason they exist is because Zelda has been around for 25 years and some people want to detach themselves from the past and embrace new experiences. That's great, but Zelda has been so good for 25 years for a reason, and it's not because people want to prance around in a green tunic talking to fairies.

 

[AniHawk]

No motion controls in Zelda Wii U. *sigh* I guess the future wont be as bright and beautiful as I'd have it be.

there will be motion controls. just toss the upad to throw the boomerang.

 

[Hot Coldman]

The only problem with TP (beyond its opening) is it was a refinement, not a revolution.

But it's still the best 3D Zelda. I enjoyed the hell out of it.

True. When it stops faffing about, it beats Ocarina at its own game, or at least stands toe-to-toe with it. I just enjoy Wind Waker and Majora's Mask's deviations on the OoT formula more, they offer more variety and exciting game worlds.

 

[butter_stick]

Look, I don't know what they'll end up doing, but the fact is, Aonuma said he want to continue focus on motion controls for the next Zelda, heavily implying (or just straight up stating) that he much prefers swinging the Wiimote to pressing a botton to operate the sword. I find it highly unlikely that Nintendo is going to have you swinging the Wii U tablet around like a sword. My conclusion is that at this point in time, Aonuma wants to continue using the Wii remote as the primary input for the next Zelda. That conclusion is anything but silly.

Again, there is no way the Wii U controller won't be the primary input device for the Wii U Zelda. I'm sure they'll have some motion controls where it'll work, but it's not using MotionPlus. I bet you a Coke.

 

[Amir0x]

You're a monster.

But who created the monster... and who...er... eats children?

there will be motion controls. just toss the upad to throw the boomerang.

LMFAO

 

[spekkeh]

And that's what I don't get about Zelda reviews in general, though more notably regarding Twilight Princess: if it's so closely retreading the same formula, why is there such a split among players about which games are the best? There's no way this could happen unless the games were different enough that there's no general consensus.

Well I would say because there are a lot of young people that played TP before OoT, or older people that don't mind retreading old ground. Especially the latter, if you look at the games industry in general nowadays.

I think that, apart from the pacing (I loved the Gerudo twist in OoT) and the overall world (hated all the endless pits blocking your path in TP), TP is genuinely the better game, I just didn't like it as much because I'd already played that game.

 

[BGBW]

In any event, at this point this is surely to be one of the most polarizing Zelda titles in years. But if Nintendo was basing their shit on review scores, are they going to stop making Zelda games now? Miyamoto was all "don't bother if this isn't the best Zelda yet".

I felt Spirit Tracks was even more polarising with some claiming it to be one of the worst and other saying it's one of the best. Not even 7.5 can compare to being described as even worse than Phantom Hourglass.

As for SS being the last Zelda because Nintendo wants it to be the best Zelda yet, judging from the Iwata Ask segments they put a lot of weight on customer opinions rather than the likes of IGN and Gamespot.

 

[Yoshichan]

I've calmed myself down now... then read the review again, and it keeps blowing my mind.

 

[butter_stick]

People's favourite Zelda usually comes down to what they like in Zelda. While the games all (mostly) have a set formula, there's obvious differences in why one would prefer Majora's Mask to Twilight Princess.

Wind Waker fans apparently only care about nice art styles, because everything else in that game is bettered elsewhere

 

[Amir0x]

I felt Spirit Tracks was even more polarising with some claiming it to be one of the worst and other saying it's one of the best. Not even 7.5 can compare to being described as even worse than Phantom Hourglass.

As for SS being the last Zelda because Nintendo wants it to be the best Zelda yet, judging from the Iwata Ask segments they put a lot of weight on customer opinions rather than the likes of IGN and Gamespot.

To be straight, I wasn't including the handheld titles in the equation. They are always more polarizing seemingly by default, although I am positive that there's no possible way Skyward Sword could be worse than Spirit Tracks and Phantom Hourglass.

Wind Waker fans apparently only care about nice art styles, because everything else in that game is bettered elsewhere

Not true. Will respond in detail later.

 

[milkyjay20]

No motion controls in Zelda Wii U. *sigh* I guess the future wont be as bright and beautiful as I'd have it be.

it kills me. skyward sword seems like the ultimate proof of concept, and instead of improving the technology, they switch to a gargantuan tablet controller that has no room for growth.

 

[gkryhewy]

I don't think you know one iota what Nintendo thinks. We've heard a half joking comment from Miyamoto that if this isn't the best Zelda yet it'd be the last one, however, which is the only public comment we've had on the subject. Which tells me that even though he is joking, they DID want the formula shaken up and the response to be overwhelming. It is clearly, demonstrably NOT overwhelming. It is the weakest showing a console Zelda has received in...forever. Which is not to say it isn't being reviewed well, IT IS, but by Zelda standards it is clear people have issues.

So I'm curious if that will lead to further shake ups, shake ups the series has needed since Ocarina of Time but have for whatever reason not come. Skyward Sword IS a very different Zelda game, no doubt, but it is clear now from the people who have played it that it is still clinging to many annoying habits.



Maybe he can't imagine it, but unless you're captain gullible, no real Zelda game on Wii U is going to utilize anything but the primary controller the system comes with - the tablet. So 100% guaranteed this is the last motion+ Zelda game for at least a generation. Back Quote this when the new neoGAF features go up.

The weakest showing for a console zelda in forever because of one outlier score on the low side? Okay.

 

[linko9]

Again, there is no way the Wii U controller won't be the primary input device for the Wii U Zelda. I'm sure they'll have some motion controls where it'll work, but it's not using MotionPlus. I bet you a Coke.

Well, I hope you're right. I would really love a Zelda exclusively controlled by the Upad. But I think it's worth reposting this quote:

I don't think we could go back to button control, especially after creating something that's as natural to use as the interface that we have with the Wii Remote Plus in Skyward Sword. I think Nintendo will continue to have that focus on motion control and we'll see that continue to evolve. And the hardware as well, in a way that will let people control things very naturally just using their own motions.

We can't just ignore that quote. Unless Aonuma's mind is changed in a big way (or Miyamoto makes him change it), it looks like Aonuma does not want "button control" (presumably referring to the way you swing the sword), and he does want motion control. I just don't think that works well with the Wii U controller.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

Sprit Tracks more like Shitrit Tracks: The Legend of Boring right guys

at least every Zelda fan agrees that it's worst than Phantom Hourglass

 

[Hot Coldman]

Wind Waker fans apparently only care about nice art styles, because everything else in that game is bettered elsewhere

You say that, but I'm surprised how much I'm enjoying the treasure hunting. It's the closest Zelda to the original since ALttP, dontcha know. Easily the best combat of the 3D games too

Also wow, Rez finally made a bad post

 

[Zerodoppler]

After most other Zelda games, it's not hard to imagine that the other reviews would be closer to the Gamespot one if the game was called 'Elf boy and his red bird'.

 

[butter_stick]

Sprit Tracks more like Shitrit Tracks: The Legend of Boring right guys

at least every Zelda fan agrees that it's worst than Phantom Hourglass

I kinda feel like I should play it just do I can have a valid opinion on it. Then I remember PH.

 

[linko9]

Sprit Tracks more like Shitrit Tracks: The Legend of Boring right guys

at least every Zelda fan agrees that it's worst than Phantom Hourglass

Really? I though ST was better overall. Terrible overworld, but the dungeons and bosses were great.

 

[BGBW]

Sprit Tracks more like Shitrit Tracks: The Legend of Boring right guys

at least every Zelda fan agrees that it's worst than Phantom Hourglass

Well guess I better leave this thread since I'm apparently not a Zelda fan.

 

[butter_stick]

You say that, but I'm surprised how much I'm enjoying the treasure hunting. It's the closest Zelda to the original since ALttP, dontcha know

I like Wind Waker, I just like provoking Wind Waker fans

I still don't really understand how it's became almost cult like in it's following though. To me it'll always be an unfinished game with a Triforce quest. All the beautiful art in the world can't distract from that.

 

[Hot Coldman]

I like Wind Waker, I just like provoking Wind Waker fans

I still don't really understand how it's became almost cult like in it's following though. To me it'll always be an unfinished game with a Triforce quest. All the beautiful art in the world can't distract from that.

That Jabun bit sticks out so much I love how they have an island devoted to letting the player know they didn't finish the game, haha

 

[walking fiend]

Even without the motion controls - there are really no other games on the market right now which are similar to Zelda-genre. The closest thing is Darksiders but that is just a frankenstein out of other games stitched together (Zelda, God of War, Portal and so on). read the reviews: the only game they compare skyward sword to is to its predecessors.

They want Zelda to not be Zelda anymore.

I do agree with Amir0x (eh, he finally gave in and visited this thread), that there are some old stuff it's clinging too, like not being to skip text which I don't like; but this is coming from someone who gave U3 a 9.0 some days ago. I guess that's more of the same?

Not to mention CoD, Elder Scrolls, Portal 2, GTA, etc...

 

[mclem]

well, it is the same reason why people prefer a controller over Mouse/Keyboard regarding FPS. I am pretty sure it is a known fact that a mouse is more accurate than an analog stick.

I like to use a DDR analogy. Any player can be *infinitely* better at DDR with a controller rather than a mat, but that's just not the point of the game.

It's not *always* about being as powerful as possible - sometimes it's about being *powerless* in an interesting way.

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

sigh

 

[Sadist]

I have a hard time pushing myself to play Spirit Tracks. I like the toucscreen controls, but man the overworld is boring

 

[sphinx]

at least every Zelda fan agrees that it's worst than Phantom Hourglass

hey! how's life in that alternate dimension you live in?

seriosly, nobody says PH is better than ST, most of the time people have one of two opinions:

.- PH and ST both suck because they have control issues and annoyances
.- PH is o.k but is a bit lifeless and has an annoying boat and ST has an annoying train but everything else is improved from PH.

 

[boiled goose]

it's so weird that they can usually nail about 90% of a game, sometimes with brilliant design decisions, and then just shit the bed the rest of the time.

i have the feeling a lot of these weird design choices are top-down mandates from higher ups that the devs are forced to implement.

what zelda needs is a a fresh new dev team. mario galaxy guy wanted to switch from mario to zelda development. i say give him a shot.

 

[milkyjay20]

Wind Waker fans apparently only care about nice art styles, because everything else in that game is bettered elsewhere

it's more than just art style, it's the atmosphere altogether. the visual streaks of wind, a storm on the seas, the breezy feel of the windmill island and its amusing denizens; it's a world i wouldn't mind living in. best of all, it's consistent. there was a point where you must lead tetra through something, and she sorta glitched out, and the break in the atmosphere was profound, that's how sucked into it i was.

there's also that sense of discovery i was speaking of earlier. when you're riding on the boat, and you see a great towering volcano in the distance, and you get closer and you see a dragon on top. knowing that the great sea has something to see and do in every square on the grid, even if the results could've and should've been better, is almost overwhelming.

 

[marc^o^]

New great review by godisageek: 10/10

Skyward Sword doesn’t just reinvigorate the Zelda series, it proves that with correct game design and implementation, the Wii couple with its Motion Plus controller, can produce results. It is disappointing that it has taken so long for this to be achieved, but that gripe aside – this is the best use of motion controls yet seen in a fully formed adventure videogame, you cannot fail to be impressed with the amazingly accurate swordplay, the subtle ways you can trap an insect in a butterfly net, the elegant way you can soar through the skies.

The game design itself is mind-blowing. The new inclusions feel as natural as breathing. The story is spectacular. Cinematic is an appropriate description – with lashings of romance, a wonderful cast of characters and a truly beautiful world to explore, this is arguably the greatest Zelda adventure yet, transcending even the brilliance of the revered Ocarina of Time. If you own a Wii, then this is the reason it was invented, the game that finally realises the unreal potential of the console. Nintendo are going to have to pull off something approaching a miracle to top this when they bring Link to their next generation console.

A genuine classic.

 

[Yagharek]

Complaining about a 7.5 from GS seems kind of trivial when you see the same game also has an Edge 10. Not to say that GS is irrelevant - but rather what that says about the game itself.

To me it basically says that some consider it to be a fantastic game, one of the best in recent years and that it validates the Wii control scheme (paraphrasing the Edge review somewhat). The GS review (Ive not read it due fear of spoilers) seems to have issues with controls. I'll assume that they are genuine complaints that bothered that particular reviewer.

How does that all influence me? Simple - I'm in the group that has almost universally found wii controls to be generally easy to get to grips with from day 1. So I'm happy to assume that in all likelihood, the game controls will be fine for me.

If I were someone who did have problems with wii controls though, I'd take the GS review as reason to be concerned and maybe try a demo first.

At the end of the day though, all that really matters to me is my own enjoyment of it, so I hope I do find it to be closer to the high end of the scale. It's been a while since a game has really taken me.

 

[butter_stick]

it's more than just art style, it's the atmosphere altogether. the visual streaks of wind, a storm on the seas, the breezy feel of the windmill island and its amusing denizens; it's a world i wouldn't mind living in. best of all, it's consistent. there was a point where you must lead tetra through something, and she sorta glitched out, and the break in the atmosphere was profound, that's how sucked into it i was.

there's also that sense of discovery i was speaking of earlier. when you're riding on the boat, and you see a great towering volcano in the distance, and you get closer and you see a dragon on top. knowing that the great sea has something to see and do in every square on the grid, even if the results could've and should've been better, is almost overwhelming.

I agree it does that sort of thing really well, but I have issues with how tedious the sailing could be in WW which clouds my memories of it. Having to play a song to change direction is just a baffling design choice to me.

 

[cacildo]

I just hope nobody at nintendo goes out guns blazing against reviewers like those Dudebro studios do when their games get low scores.

Anyway, i can bet SS is worth more than a 7.5. Famitsu say its perfect - http://andriasang.com/comyyf/

 

[SecretMoblin]

What Majora's Mask and Wind Waker got right (and Twilight Princess got wrong) is that they were weird. There were all these little quirky things that were designed not to advance the game's mechanics or design, but to make you chuckle or scratch your head.

Who remembers Salvatore:

...or Grog:

Yes, Wind Waker has the poorest dungeon design of the 3D Zeldas. Yes, it's obviously an unfinished, rushed product. And yes, there are serious pacing issues. But there's an allure to the game world that goes far beyond the art style. It's unfortunate that the cel-shading is always, without fail, the first item brought up when discussing the game.

Zelda needs to get weird again.

 

[Leonsito]

I love the Zelda cicle, now everyone loves TP, despite being described as awful and boring during the last years.

 

[butter_stick]

I just hope nobody at nintendo goes out guns blazing against reviewers like those Dudebro studios do when their games get low scores.

Anyway, i can bet SS is worth more than a 7.5. Famitsu say its perfect - http://andriasang.com/comyyf/

Oh wow, Famitsu!

 

[walking fiend]

Complaining about a 7.5 from GS seems kind of trivial when you see the same game also has an Edge 10. Not to say that GS is irrelevant - but rather what that says about the game itself.

To me it basically says that some consider it to be a fantastic game, one of the best in recent years and that it validates the Wii control scheme (paraphrasing the Edge review somewhat). The GS review (Ive not read it due fear of spoilers) seems to have issues with controls. I'll assume that they are genuine complaints that bothered that particular reviewer.

How does that all influence me? Simple - I'm in the group that has almost universally found wii controls to be generally easy to get to grips with from day 1. So I'm happy to assume that in all likelihood, the game controls will be fine for me.

If I were someone who did have problems with wii controls though, I'd take the GS review as reason to be concerned and maybe try a demo first.

At the end of the day though, all that really matters to me is my own enjoyment of it, so I hope I do find it to be closer to the high end of the scale. It's been a while since a game has really taken me.

Yes, probably he was trying to control the bow using IR remote.

I legitimately believe anyone that has to 'fight' with SS control, either doesn't know how they function, or that his hardware is not working.

 

[cacildo]

I love the Zelda cicle, now everyone loves TP, despite being described as awful and boring during the last years.

Nope. Still boring. In fact my brother gave me the GameCube version as a gift right at the release, it was expensive and hard to find. I feel guilty about this even after all those years.

 

[Sadist]

I love the Zelda cicle, now everyone loves TP, despite being described as awful and boring during the last years.

I always liked Twilight Princess

Internet hyperbole and perception is just plain sucky

 

[Deleted member 30609]

I love the Zelda cicle, now everyone loves TP, despite being described as awful and boring during the last years.

I challenge you or anyone who agrees with you to find posts from people championing Twilight Princess from two years ago that contradict what they're saying now, because until then posts like this are pointless.

 

[RurouniZel]

I didn't read the full review because I don't want to spoil myself, but from what I read of the first paragraph, I got the impression that the score is because the motion controls weren't a big seller for the reviewer and that they feel Zelda's going through the motions due to a predictable formula.

For those who've read the full review, is this an accurate assessment of the full review, or were their other qualms? I'm curious.